Simon: Okay, hello everyone. We’re live once again this evening with European Freedom livestream 22. I didn’t know whether to call it 21b, or 22. I’ll call it 22.

 

And we’ve got Gavin Boby here. And it’s really great to have Gavin back. Gavin, you and I spoke for the first time in September, October, 2017, I think it was. And then we had another stream a little while after. And in many respects what we could do today is we could run over some of that background.

 

But I think, as I was saying to Chris Dangerfield just a few minutes ago, what interests us particularly at the moment is not just the mosque-busting, it’s really the strategy for facing the future we’ve got at the moment. Anyway.

 

Gavin Boby: Yeah.

 

Simon: How are you my friend?

 

Gavin Boby: Very well, thank you! Very well. What’s great is suddenly I don’t know if when I was on your stream last I was complaining and moaning in you about how I wasn’t getting much, people weren’t being as supportive as they should be about what I was doing. That has changed! People suddenly have an interest and they’re keen to do something. They came to support it. And that it’s just fantastic! It’s so much better, makes everything so much easier, morale, and just the ability to take on the cases. To go after these places and yeah it’s not just about moss busting it’s not just about disliking Muslims, Muslims are bad, it’s we are good. We want to survive.

 

Simon: Yeah I mean, Chris said that as a result of your stream with him and then later the one with Jake’s and I hope this continues, that you’ve heard an increase in the very necessary funding. Unfortunately folks Gavin I have put this together, or partly mainly through a fault of mine. I’ve just got to switch that stream off. So I haven’t had a chance to put the links in. Obviously when we finish this stream I’ll put all the necessary links to Gavin’s contact in the description box, and spread around social media. You really ought to be contributing to the stellar work that Gavin does. Can you give us a little bit of an outline of what you do in case people don’t already know?

 

Gavin Boby: Well yes. And I’m very flattered that people refer to me as the “mosque buster”! That’s a very flattering nickname that people give me. I stopped, I help local neighborhoods stop planning permissions for mosques getting planning permission. So if there’s a planning application for a mosque in your area and you want to resist it then I’ll help you resist it. And it’s probably necessary probably going to suffer if you don’t. Even if you resisting you lose, you’ll get up better if you’ve put up a bit of a fight. That’s what I do. So that’s, I think, how you knew me initially. I have views about what’s going to happen to Western society. How we reverse the problems that we’re in. We’re in pretty deep problems, and they’ve got to be reversed! And that’s not going to be easy. But. I think it will be easy, but it could go wrong.

 

Simon: Okay. Before we continue I know we’ve talked about this on email. There’s a slight elephant in the room that we need to discuss. So I’m completely willing to, I’m happy to discuss. I think that I have great respect for you. I think the feeling is mutual and yeah, so if we can have a gentlemen disagreements, or meeting of minds, I don’t know. But can you can you introduce the slight disagreement that we had a couple of years ago?

 

Gavin Boby: Yes. The disagreement is over the perception of the influence that jewish people have. In general. I don’t think, my view, if I set up my view and we can talk to and fro about it. And my view is that I think it is, at best, a blind alley for us. At worst actually a dead rabbit hole! I think you’ve referred to as being a bit of a rabbit hole. I think that’s probably a good a good image for it.

 

But also think it’s some unjust, again at best unjust, and potentially very cruel! I think it can be jew hating and jew bashing as I’ll call it, ends up, it has a very low flash point. It quickly ends up in a pile of dead jewish bodies. And. I don’t think there is any upside to it. I think it is in general a way to avoid looking at where the problems come from, which is from ourselves.

 

[05:02]

 

That’s where our current problems, our current problems don’t come from jews, don’t come from jewish influence! They come from ourselves! But I think it’s possible to pick this apart in detail at the things that jews, jewish people are blamed for.z Things like either the Frankfurt School and such. I just don’t think it is the influence that the people say is. Personally I think the jewish people are a beneficial influence. A good influence. If anything a slightly reinforcing influence on Western civilization. Which I realize might provoke some people to hear.

 

Simon: I mean, I do have a slightly different view, as we were saying before the stream. And as I’ve said to many other people. When you’ve been on the receiving end of an attack it’s very, very difficult. And when my relationship was Brian of London broke down, this did happen. And I also said on the previous stream that I suffered briefly from what I often refused it refer to as the “JQ derangement syndrome”!

 

Because what tends to happen, is that you, because you’ve often when you come to what appears to be a great revelation then all of a sudden for a very short period of time until you’ve integrated it into your general worldview it seems to be the explanation for everything. I want to state very clearly and I think probably we do have a difference of opinion.

 

I do think that jewish people are over represented in positions of power, both on the Left and right, and they do tend to be have an ethnocentric view of jewish people. They tend to stick together in a way to a much greater extent than we Gentiles do. And this is why I think you’re right to say in part the problem is with us. What I would like us to do is to develop a sense of community, of collectivization, quite similar to what the jewish people are capable of doing. I also think that communism, historical events that occurred at the start of the century such as the Bolshevik Revolution and the Frankfurt School they did have an over-representation of jews. But the current problems we’re facing, I also concur with you that primarily our own decadence, our own degradation, to a certain extent. What we need to do is recuperate our own moral values and our sense of ourselves. I think we probably do differ on to a certain extent in certain aspects.

 

Gavin Boby: Yes. Yes. I think I would agree with you. I would say the jewish people are disproportionately represented in senior positions. I would say that’s, because jewish people I would say are, in general, disproportionately successful, or able. I would go along with the view that European jews, Ashkenazi jews have in general higher IQs. The figure that I’ve heard is about one standard deviation higher than a Western European. A Western European would have an IQ of about a 100 and the European jew, an Ashkenazi jewish guy, would have an IQ of about 114, 115. And on top of that I would see a tendency towards things like stable family structures, and education effort, work ethic, probably a self-confident morality. Not a moral tradition, I’m not jewish, it’s not my moral tradition, but it’s a self-confident, an ethical base.

 

All of those things I think are very useful if you want to achieve something, if you want to accomplish something. Now I think that probably I would say, in general, that probably means that those things, I mean, the jewish people will be successful at what they do. So for instance if I had to have an operation I found out I had a jewish surgeon operating on me, I’d be really relieved, I’ll breathe a sigh of relief.

 

But maybe that’s a racist prejudice, or pro-semitic prejudice. And I think that is, if I’m right on that, I think that explains how people can get a crossed-wire about jewish people and jewish influence. Because if people are successful and accomplish things, you notice them, they become noticeable. And that then makes it very easy for people to do what I think some people in Patriotic Alternative will do, which is to make the mistake, a historic mistake that is made in respect of jews. And that is to say:

 

“This person is jewish! Look at that person! That person that person jewish! They’re prominent in this and this, therefore there is something jewish about this. Because jewish individuals get noticed.

 

[10:38]

 

And is that people fall for, I think the two mistakes that people make which are first of all. what I call the:

 

“Is he? Isn’t he?”

 

Game. That is, is this person jewish, isn’t he? Therefore he’s representative of other jews, which is not the case.

 

And secondly, singling out jewish people for criticism for doing what non-jews do just as much of so if I give two examples. The first example I’d give of this happening of that process. In World War One, in think in 2016 [1916] German politicians, they were convinced, because they saw jewish businessman perhaps running munitions factories, or uniform factories, or supply companies, not going to the front. And they were convinced jewish men we’re not pulling their weight at the battlefront.

 

And to prove it they said we’re gonna get a jewish census done to prove this. When that census came back it showed that jewish people were volunteering, or going to war at about twice the rate of non-jewish Germans. And eighty percent were in battlefront roles with bullets flying past. Which I think was nearly twice as much as was true for the German army in general. And these German politicians, they were so convinced that the survey must be wrong, they suppressed it, but allowed some massage, or false data to get leaked to the press.

 

And that was, you could say that these were raging anti-semites. My guess is they probably saw well this “he’s a jew! He’s a jew! He’s a jew!” and said that means jews are doing this. And not take into account that maybe jewish people will tend to be disproportionately successful, clearly is that a problem? I don’t think that’s a problem.

 

That’s the first example. It was wrong, it was just flat wrong then. And the tragedy of it was that is often seen as the source of this the split between Germany and German jews. It sort of started, some historians say, that’s where when it started.

 

The other example I give you is the Frankfurt School. From what I’ve researched, that the little research that I’ve done on Wikipedia and tooled around on Google. I would say there were lots of jewish academics and thinkers in the Frankfurt School. But the Frankfurt School was one of many slow-motion socialists organizations it was trivial! It was pathetic, if you compare it to the Fabian’s.

 

The Fabian’s are massively successful, very English. It appears pretty much, from what I can tell, to have been a “jew free zone”! I think the only guy who appears of any correspondence with them was a fellow called Harold Laski. I suspect, I speculate he might have just got frozen out. Really, the Fabians were incredibly English! I think, I probably would have loved it, would have fit right in! I would have loved to gone to one of their country house weekends, with all these tough, clipped, sort of humorous, slightly Bohemian individuals. It would have been great! I’d have loved it! But there were no jews involved!

 

And just you know, that the Fabian School, … Fabian was a [Roman] general. He said:

 

“I achieve victory through slow motion methods. Slow marches. That’s how I achieve victory.”

 

Fabians saw revolution hadn’t come, we will achieve socialism slowly. Their logo was a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Every leader of the Labour Party has been a member of the Fabian Society. Tory cabinet ministers have been members of the Fabian society. There are probably not many Labour MPs are not members of the Fabian Society. It there ever were an organization that whispers in Prime Minister’s ears, it is the Fabian Society.

 

Now, if that was made up of jewish people, it would, I can just hear what people would say. But it’s not! It’s so English, incredibly English!

 

[15:02]

 

You know, the Italian Marxist again they sought revolution come we want to go for cultural Marxism cultural Marxism that phrase came from grounding the Italian Marx’s appear to have consisted of Italians from the provinces and, rather than from very Catholic backgrounds from what I can tell again no jewish people involved in them, or you look at that phrase the long march through the institutions that came from the German students movement in the late sixties. The German students movement is pretty much defined as being made up of German students who were born between 1940 and 1945. Now there weren’t many German students born in nineteen between 40 and 45 for obvious reasons and in rudi dutschke the leader he came up with that phrase the long march through the institution’s you look at the postmodernist there were jewish post modernist I think Derrida was one of the leading lights but most of them appear to have been French perhaps Rhenish, or Eastern Germans again it took on its own ethnic characteristics Fabian the Fabian Society was very English the ground is the Italian Marx is from Italian and the postmodern is very French Precog feel very elegant looking at culture sticking ray-ban sunglasses on the Statue of David as a that is cultural Marxism undermining again much more influential than the Frankfurt School I would guess if you stop people in the streets and said who are the post modernists they’ll know if you say who are the Franklin school probably as an economics called something to do with Frankfurt banks, or you might assume if something to do with sausages okay they were if you say whose grandsheikh people will know, or the Fabian’s people might know the Frankfurt school I had to look it up I’m not aware of having ever been influenced in any way by the Frankfurt School. And I think that is again that’s an example I’m not trying to say the Frankfurt School didn’t contain a lot of it seems to me that it did contain hot jewish thinkers in it what I’m saying is it is unfair it is unjust and potentially really cruel to single out jews for doing what non jews do moral and in those times in terms of culture and slow motion Marxism non-jews do far more of it and far more effectively it’s just unfair it’s a blind alley to say okay you get rid of the Frankfurt School you won’t stop all those other schools you won’t stop the fading society dominating the Labour party the Labour politicians so know what those are the examples are given figure me I’m not getting air rated at you I dislike the I find it unfair I find unjust that’s why I’m if I’m getting a bit Sun I under the collar about.

 

Simon: Yes I take the points the frankly. And I think it’s an important point to make that it’s not only jews the Frankfurt School definitely what and some of the big names of the Frankfurt School is its definitely jewish thinking Adorno hoc I’m mark Uzi Eric from Reich Villa is it vill hammerite Reich and it’s the combination of two jewish ideologies Marxism and you we can argue tweet with Chris we just argued a little bit about the jewishness of Marxism I don’t really want to go there and Freudianism. But I think you are correct in pointing out and as I said, earlier once you get out of the JQ derangement syndrome you begin to look at the world and see it see it a little bit more broadly as we are talking about before the stream increasingly coming to think that some of the important roles in society are a result of the system often they’re often I think four out of the last five presidents the Federal Reserve have been jews. But the current one isn’t it is a Gentile and well any person that occupies that role has to occupy that role irrespective of their ethnicity.

 

Gavin Boby: Yes what you could sell the other side is named the head of any central bank right now it was jewish Jerome Powell in the States I began his Carney still head of the Bank of England, I think he’s just about to leave you have the guard head of the IMF it was and the Pollack walk the policies have got worse I mean, all of the mmm massive money printing has happened you haven’t needed jews too to get that going it just it strikes me as a little unfair I think [20:01] the one the other one this were the other two arrays Dharam the Bolshevik Revolution from again from my reading of history they were quite a few jewish people revolutionaries.

 

Simon: Four out of seven of the original the first Politburo.

 

Gavin Boby: Yeah involved originally, but they quickly seem to have got really sick of it so by the end of Lenin’s rule a lot of them were drawing back and by the time styling got into power very few but by the end of starlings rule Starling was saying the reverse he was saying to himself he was very really outright anti-semitic I think Golda Meir visited Moscow and fifty thousand jewish people turned out to welcome her and he said these damn jews I can’t swallow them I can’t spit them out and he created what looks suspiciously like a southern Siberian ghetto to ship all the jews to and killed off and killed off all his jewish doctors and his issue seems to be these jews will not fit in with Bolshevism they will not fit in. So I’m gonna give it to them and luckily he died just before you got on with her so it’s I think I can understand I think I can I think Trotsky was a nasty real nasty son of a bitch probably the only guy I think you could have been worse than Starling, which is a bit like saying there’s a temperature worth lower than absolute zero ri why can I think it’s forgivable that a lot of jewish thinkers a lot of jewish activists coming out of the pogroms and the discrimination of Czarist Russia we use just as a rather big for the right to breathe some of the time but they would be attracted to Marxism and see. This is a way of solving anti-semitism and it’s also where the way of solving through that lens we can see so that will benefit the whole of humankind by getting rid of the class war and create creating a utopia for everyone I can see how people would think that I can see how intelligent people would have the means to dismiss contrary evidence so, or maybe we’ll be able to say as a meta crap no rubbish but smart intelligent educated thinkers could rationalize away all the country evidence so I think there’s. I don’t think it’s quite the way say I think Mark Collett I think he talks about that quite a bit and I think that’s unfair given the way history panned out there, the thing with Freud and why when I could talk about the supposed jewish influence on Freudianism we’re queer either jewish Freud was conscious of that which is why he took on young as a prototype partly, because you young wasn’t jewish but how much harm has been done by that I remember when my mum died I went he spoke to someone and we were when I was talking to this person wasn’t jewish, or not jewish but the model was the psychotherapeutic model where you go you said Danny you talk to someone in and you talk to some that apparently was the psychotherapeutic model established by Freud I’m not aware I was undermining Western civilization by doing that quite the reverse.

 

Simon: I mean, and I mean, my degrees I’m not a fan of I think the Oedipus complex and that there are various things about Freud that I find very, very subversive. But to a certain extent I’ll be honest with you I accept many of your points I think the standard version of what is known as the JQ is over simplistic I agree with you that the Fabian’s many, many non-jews, or non jews are as involved in the destruction of the West as jews Oh I think we’re gonna have to agree to disagree on certain aspects I kind of really don’t want to get back there was 13th century, because. I don’t think it. I don’t think it’s gonna gonna lead the conversation was it positively I-Iing I accept that that people tend to over simplify the jewish Question but one of the reasons why it’s interesting to talk about is, because it is a question I would prefer to consider it a question, rather than a problem there was a jewish that there’s a German Texas there’s often translated as the jewish [25:00] problem if you actually look at the original translation in German it should be the jewish Question. I think the question is its acceptable to ask the question tarring people with the same brush always is probably an over simplistic idea.

 

Gavin Boby: Well that will let will that is that acceptable together yeah you don’t have to agree with me but the reason the reason I’m raising I think as, you know, and some of your viewers listeners, you know, I think we’re heading for some pretty tough chaotic violent times in tough chaotic violent times very often the first people yet I’m done over in personal persecuted, or caught in the crossfire are jews and that’s why I want to be mindful of it in what’s coming which might be a nice way for us to lead into what’s coming it’s.

 

Simon: Okay that’s great. But let’s introduce Horus who’s just had his tea, because we had a short break between this stream of the last stream you’re right Horus how’s it going mate?

 

Horus: Oh yeah good to me given and thanks for comin off bit of confusion that.

 

Gavin Boby: No thank you for embody your chat.

 

Horus: Yeah I’ll try it was hard to I’ve tried to represent you but I couldn’t fully, you know, I for my part demand that we spend the next hour resolving fully and finally the jewish Question and the basically the entire relationship between jews and Western civilization he’s blowing the last two thousand years no I’m sorry I know that there’s the topic of many days of conversation even then you’re probably still wouldn’t resolve it. But yeah, are we moving on, or they do you don’t me together a take on that yeah, sorry cut out Margaret Kevin sir tell.

 

Gavin Boby: You a few consignment on the home comfortable giving you one if you wanted.

 

Simon: I think we can let’s move on to the question in hand and what has brought Gavin here really.

 

Horus: Well just one thing Gavin just them until last summer I was sort broadly in the Counter Jihad what sympathetic to the Counter Jihad movement. But there was a video that that well I won’t go through all the history of it but basically I started making videos last summer and this with one called against Brian avi at some point maybe if you want to watch that and let me know what you think just I’d be interested to know your thoughts that’s all. But I saw what I’ll say.

 

Gavin Boby: Yes yeah that’s Brian of London and I don’t know a V an O’Brien in London. I think Brian and I would say we’re just not friends in any in any sense of what the horus: Simon’s not friends of you mean for anymore the video is not the video is not actually about them except for a few minutes at the star in the end there were just sort of a title to give it. But it’s about other things related to Islam and the relationship between jews and Islam in Britain. Sorry if you’re interested but no worries if you’re not.

 

Gavin Boby: Yeah I’ll watch T

 

Simon: Okay okay as this isn’t a completely prepared stream but fortunately we know each other so it’s oh I know what you want to talk about. Um okay we were gonna move on to the question of the troubled times ahead. I know you and I have spoken this about this in the past about how society is likely to break down. Can you give us a quick overview of your thinking on this? It’s a long in.

 

Gavin Boby: Hmm yeah big cavity I think that our society is likely to break down. I think that people will think that means we’ve lost I think that’s the point at which we will have won if we want to win. Which is just a question it’s in ourselves do we want to deal with these problems I’ve got the motivation to do so if we do we can do and we can do it easily. What I would say is if we look at the current problems the problems are, because the politicians are doing it and we are letting the politicians do it. I think the politicians are doing it, because it creates it gives them more power by making us more manageable, easy to rule, grinding us down, denying us a sense of identity. I think we let the politicians do that, because we think they’re going to take care of us. Think of the manage the economy, manage the welfare state. Actually, you’ve seen Simon you’ve commented on them I’m perfectly people out in the streets clapping like seals for the NHS! Yes banging this I think it is embarrassing it and people that is what I think that [30:01] is born of anxiety people can feel it slipping away. Now I think that the economics are likely to break down go into quite some depression. I thought that for I don’t decade 15 years and as a result of that the welfare state will cease to function you won’t get the freebies. Suddenly the dole check won’t land on your mat, the housing office won’t send you the rent checks you’ll go into the council to give them out full of abuse to the housing officer and you’ll find there are no employees in the council offices. And they’re not going to tell you that I’m going to tell you it’s broken that we can’t pay you a welfare check, or you’ll find you can’t get on an operating table in the NHS. Again they won’t tell you about that you just turn up where your operation will be cancelled. And at that point I think people will get angry! People will riot. They will say the deal’s off we’ve put up with you politician for you’d be able to give us food for your promise to look after us you’ve stopped looking after us the deal’s off you just get a chaotic society that will break down! In those circumstances I think this has already happening I can go through thatism in those circumstances I think Society will settle out along ethnic lines. As it did very briefly during the rites the London riots of 2011. And you will see de facto Muslim immigrant third-world ghettos in our country becoming official Islamic immigrants further world enclaves. Declaring independence. Basically saying we’re no longer part of England anymore we got our own door get out you need our permission to come in. And those places will become wretched fast. I don’t mean a simply a question of them being denied welfare I needs a question of being high every service under the Sun the question I pose is how long do you live in an area like that that produces nothing! And once it’s drainage is cut off and vaster. I don’t think it will work simply to walk up to a Muslim Enclave and offer 15,000 pounds to go. I think that will fail I’d like to talk about that, but that that already that does fail there’s abundant evidence for that. I think it is not working it is not going to work. But I think when societies separated out and you have a loss of the what i’ma call invaders invaders in self segregated in on the unsurvivable helble’s of their own making. And when they have to stew in their own juice they will be amenable to taking an airplane ticket. And that is not genocide that is not ethnic cleansing that is not the Warsaw Ghetto. The jews of the Warsaw Ghetto didn’t wall themselves up in it. If you’d offer the jews of the Warsaw Ghetto and had plane ticket up they would have taken it! It was not that was not self segregation. That was not jews stewing in their own juice! That was mass murder this is people self segregating and then they will be amenable I think we would accomplish it and it would be quite easy to accomplish it. I think this is likely to happen whatever I do. If I got run of like bus tomorrow I think this scenario is like likely to play out. The reason I do what I did the ultimate motivation is I want to preserve our moral authority! I want us to do this without massacre! Without the kind of eye watering massacre that I would expect to see in France, or the multicultural heaven of Belgium and Brussels. So where you just need to wear wellies to wade through it. And I want us to achieve it so that the towering moral authority that we possess and having had inherited and continued to have, higher than any other country in the world, that that continues that that goes down to future generations. And it’s difficult to do that if you’ve got a lot of massacre on your hands. So that’s why I think it’s going to.

 

Simon: Do you think there’s a difference between the Muslim community, obviously there’s a difference in the communities and their ethics, but the Muslim communities and the black communities, do you think they’ll they will break down in similar ways, or, … There are other ethnic communities that do tend to separate to a certain certain extent already. Are we just talking about Muslims, or are we talking about immigrants in a broader sense?

 

Gavin Boby: I think it will work out in a broader sense. And I think for two reasons I think people want and will want the [35:01] sense of belonging that comes from having people around you who look and think and speak like you do. I think there’s a very strong evolved an ethnic element to that. So I suspect quite a lot of this would apply to sub-saharan Africa as well. Whatever indeed so what I think is likely to happen what I would predict on here it could be wrong. I suspect that the state systems are going to break down I don’t see how that can be avoided. I think it’s probably just starting now in those circumstances the question is how do people then satisfy their fundamental need for law and order, or insecurity. I think people will say to themselves the states no longer here to provide for, nor for me so I will provide for it. People will provide for it to privately. It’s almost like a club. You join a club where you each agree to observe laws in your dealings with each other. So that you can live safely with each other so you can continue to trade. Now if I’m right on that the question that I had asked perhaps the question I think it’s an interesting little sort of conundrum off and after-dinner gain but in those situations would you join a system and an area that allowed Islam and the followers of Islam in it I think you’re I think most English people will say no, of course, not no way there’s no reason there’s no incentive so what Islam me. And people know everything they need to know about Islam and people with young children would record in horror. No wait no wait I don’t want any Islam, or the practition of the followers of Islam anywhere in this area why would there is it the right games the parasitism the hatred what is it and then okay. And then the next question. What about some sub-saharan Africans you look at the stab fest in London you look at the crime rates tendency for lower economic achievement. What will people say then I suspect what people’s what English in English people like a little bit of a little bit of difference almost like spice in the society where the Scandinavians don’t. So an English people might say well maybe, you know, a few maybe a few like many Henry that kind of I’m trivializing. But in journal I think people will say you look at the massive numbers of sub-saharan Africans arriving starting to right now I suspect was the authorities to started to rotate out of Islam into sub-saharan Africa this is recruit recruiting ground. What will people say they I wonder I suspect is well you can tell me what are people going to same what is I suspect given it is simply when eventually start saying to themselves I don’t hate you don’t had any one but we have the right to continue we have the right to our own sense of home and a right to a sense of belonging that’s what we want, you know, don’t take offense of this but we want our land we wanna have no it’s the only one we’ve got you have one in Afghanistan you have one in Gambia, or Nigeria Oman, or Iraq we want out here and I think people have every right to do that and I suspect that will apply to a lot of different groups. Again the interesting question is, if you apply that to jewish people I suspect most people would say not uncomfortable with having an English jewish guy as a next-door neighbor into Deer Island I would say that. I said so I suspect that practically speaking when the divine will come.

 

Simon: Like in many respect going I think it’s probably simpler than that I think if this scenario scenario that you’re suggesting plays out the world would become the society would become a lot more hostile place. And a White guy walking in what would quickly develop into a mainly black area, or a mainly Muslim area is going to be a target. Simple as that. And what will happen there will be and there are nice Muslims in the Muslims at area areas your friendly Larry Henry for your to repeat your example your the nice black guy that we go further down the pub with. But when at once things break down on ethnic lines the only key you’ve got is color. And quite simply a White guy won’t want to be in a mainly black area. And equally once this sense of hostility Rises once that once [40:00] though tension increases black guys and Muslims well what’s it going into why stick White areas, because there might be a number. And this to a certain extent is that would be the way to nullify the effect of the Left there may be plenty of lefties within the White areas who would want to be sympathetic but they won’t be allowed to be simply, because they’re the same color of skin as everyone else and they won’t anybody who stubbornly insists on multiculturalism will be wiped out pretty damn quickly I think. So people will run away and escape to these homogeneous areas. That’s what occurs to me immediately. Have you got any thoughts on this Horus?

 

Horus: Yeah quite a few. It’s no wish to mention first just what my I would like to believe this, because it suggests that the problems will essentially sort themselves out right I mean, albeit with some pain and some, you know, some losses on all sides. But what my big doubt is that the state, or the ruling class will allow this to happen. Say if it’s, you know, the loss of welfare and others notice a sewerage provisions, and so on, that would ultimately make these different enclaves or, you know, not get those but your enclaves say begin to re migrate themselves away from Britain and away from the West. And if that’s what it will take for them to leave of their own accord I suspect that our rulers will prioritize keeping those things going, because I see it I guess in a more conspiratorial, or malevolent at least a malevolent sense that our rulers have done this quite deliberately. Have brought these people here oh well you’ve said that yourself actually haven’t you, you know, that it helps them to control us — yeah — divided and fractures in terms against each other, and so on, yeah and so make us and so alienate us from other parts of our land, and so on, and I was putting on my words there. But I think I doubt that they’re gonna lose control to that extent. And I think that they’ll exactly, because they want these people here they will put keeping those services going so they’re almost the highest priority other than their own personal security. What do you think about that?

 

Gavin Boby: I think you’re exactly right, except for one point. Well the question I asked why do you think the politicians can’t lose control?

 

Horus: And well I mean, I’m all right in thinking that you’re saying that the currency that this will ultimately the debt problems will be what drives this?

 

Gavin Boby: I think the Western society will break down either, because of the debt problems if the debt problems don’t do it then the growth of mass immigration particularly Islamic immigration will break down the system. That breakdown of the system is unavoidable. My view is that it will be the debt burden that does it. And I think at the moment that is being borne out by events happening at the moment. The reason the reason I think politicians won’t be able to continue to enforce it is, because politicians are I think will be hightailing in hightailing it out on the last pokin out of the airport [to Tel Aviv?]

 

Horus: But as long as we mention it’s genes I hope that’s true. But I expected in 2008 I had a half it, because I was already into Austrian economics and the idea that the ultimately monetary reality will reassert itself. I was very disappointed 2009, 2010 to find out that there appeared to be almost no price at all for the people who’d caused that crisis. And I came to think it’s more that they will basically go to any length and they may be capable of just in one way, or another just keeping this off candyfloss of money just whipping up more and more in some way. Like it might be that in the next great credit panic they all which could be this year goodness language but they might just sort of force us all into a new currency. Like, because that did happen in with the rentenmark in 1924 I think in Germany. They just but the currency bra got so bad they just created a new currency and everyone did lose their savings but they still did it. So I wouldn’t be surprised if that happens. And then it might just be sustainable for so many more decades to say that by that point we are actually destroy it as a people. That’s sort of my [45:02] expectation at the moment. I’d like to be persuaded otherwise.

 

Gavin Boby: Do you mind if I jump.

 

Horus: Yeah of course.

 

Gavin Boby: Well if you look at the moment the theme what governments are on do you look at thee I’ve done a couple of videos on this if you look at the economic problems particularly in the States I think last week 26 million Americans have been made unemployed in the last four, five weeks. The amounts it’s I find it impossible to keep track of the trillions that are getting printed and just spent. I think in America it’s 5.2 I think in the EU is three from three that’s trillion I don’t know how much money that is actually three one three trillion now it sounds a lot to me. And from 5.2 in the States. That’s different from 2008 2008 you printed money you made it available to banks to lend to business people and it was leant against an asset so there was a corresponding asset. This time most of that money is just getting printed handed out to businesses just given away you’re a business you’ve got a debt you can’t meet your bills here’s some money spend it. This is some what this does is to undermine Ida and that lining that’s happened just over the process of about three weeks I mean, the lines incredibly steep if you look at the grass those graphs look like you’re dad’s viagra chart! I mean, it’s just going right up to the ceiling huh it’s absurd he said like something out of carry on me Karen carry on printing ridicule. But if that goes on people will these confidence in the Gaussian in the government. What I think is different from Vermont Germany 1923 Germany today is where we have what is different today from any time since we crawled out of a puddle is we have this belief and this expectation and you see it’s right when people are clapping the NHS people believe that the state can should and will take care of them. People believe it’s like oxygen. I mean, that is denied to people are going to go nuts people are gonna get really quite angry and violent. I think I don’t see how society fails to break down at that point. But I suspect we are living at the beginning of the end of the age of the state. That’s a different conversation but uh. I don’t think I’d be open to politicians to say don’t worry that’s alright we’re gonna institute a new currency now and everything we find will wipe the slate clean people will say well great where’s my operation where’s my doll check man oh no we haven’t got that we’re only printing have a new currency, or print up some more of it and you get the same problems. I don’t see getting revolt resolved as easily as that, but nothing is news as they could turn 23 1923 Germany whether the state has collapsed anyway it’s really Germany wasn’t providing things.

 

Simon: I suspect that what’s happening with coronavirus at the moment is I’m not optimistic, or let me give you a different take anyway but possibly what they’re doing with coronavirus is transit transitioning into a new crypto credit card the abolition of physical money. So we’re moving into a new system that probably will mean everybody getting poorer. I’m not all whether I agree with you that the system will break down completely, because it’s happening globally I think that the powers that be the elites for want of a better word are interns is enough to realize that things can’t get fall apart completely. So there’s got to be basic education there’s got to be a basic health service it might be much worse than it was before. But there’s got to be basic a basic very, very basic basic welfare state people will get increasingly impoverished and just where we’re moving into a neo feudalism, rather than the complete breakdown Society. And I’m not hard and fast on this that this is going to happen, but I’m just putting it forward as an alternative view.

 

Gavin Boby: Well perhaps if I give accounts of you that there appears that the rule the law from the rule from history case from the Soviet Union the collapse of the Soviet Union I would say if what you were saying applied to us would have applied to the Soviet Union in 1991. The rule varies for the Soviet Union and for the dictatorships and military codes of Latin America during the 1980s. Also from the hyperinflations of central and eastern Germany the Eastern Europe in the middle of the 20th century the rule is when a state’s annual deficit so the annual credit card debt is 20% of GDP that the rule is that’s when society just becomes uncover noble. And the way I put it you might have seen me say is that’s when the window cleaner he won’t clean the government offices windows without money up front. And then govern his living hand-to-mouth. And then it can’t you just can’t afford to pay for services that people think people today you think the purpose of government is not the maintenance of order they think it’s the provision of welfare. And I don’t see I think that will reinforce that law of history about annual deficits collapsing Society III don’t see how we are going to escape what appears to be a law of history, because politicians are ruthless but, of course, that ruthless they have no scruples whatever I mean, the semi psychopaths that’s how you succeed as a politician sorry okay.

 

Horus: That we definitely agree on they are undoubtedly undoubtedly attracts almost inhuman people in some in some cases. I’ll just come say oh we go we nearly at that debt to GDP ratio already for 20 percent you mention? In well I don’t know how much has been I can’t find out how much has been printed in the UK. Where I inferred the stains they would be that debt 2gb GDP level except they haven’t taken it on as debt they’ve simply printed the money and handed it out, or so they gonna print the money and having dinner I serve American GDP and what is it that 22 trillion. And I think 5.2 that’s more than 20% they’ve said they’re going to print up that much currency if I point to so it’s about a quarter but the thing is they’re not take most of that I think only 700 billion which is not very much money 700 billion US a tiny’mon only 700 billion he’s being taken on his government debt. The read the rest is just printing and giving it out so my guess is they but they must know you must know well if we take this on as debt always if we sell this as bonds out in the market will collapse there’s no way we can be painted so we just got a pretty tough they have no option. That’s their completely their favorite athlete but like most Psychopaths completely without strategy.

 

Simon: But this is my questions as you said, they must know. This the response to the coronavirus I’m not going completely down the conspiracy rabbit hole! Yes the I think some kind of disease does exist but it’s pretty clear that the response to it has been completely exaggerated. And it looks like I suspect that this some kind of controlled demolition! Perhaps perhaps they know what they’re doing. And if they do know what they’re doing that the aim is to make us all a lot poorer and, you know, turn everything into Brazil. Where the politicians the psychopathic politicians and the leaders of society would live in gated communities and the rest of us would be rioting and killing each other outside the gated communities plebs like us! I don’t know what you think about that getting.

 

Gavin Boby: I think there’s a lot of evidence to add color and credulity to that. Particular bathing house of businesses that have no right to expect a bailer that’s not bailing up the businesses the employees giving the employees employed that’s just bailing out the shareholders he might take a loss.

 

Simon: Yes.

 

Gavin Boby: That’s transferring money from the poor to the rich which has been a debt as a decade so what’s been going on for a long time. Loosen loose monetary policy feminism mass immigration it transfers money from the poor to the rich. It’s a war on the poor. And I come I don’t know enough to say if there’s a conspiracy if they’re not they’re giving you a good impression of it.

 

Simon: Yeah can I can I just do some Superchats, because there was some super chance at the end of the last show and we’ve got a superchat now which is a question directly for Gavin. I felt a bit guilty when I switched off the last stream and saw that people had given us some very generous donations and I had not mention their names. So a big thanks to Joe are who it for that seems stream sent three [55:02] US dollars and said:

 

“Great stream guys I think Chris and Horus are right about what could happen vision might appear in a less extreme form perhaps.”

 

Yeah we were talking a little bit about the breakdown of society and kind water loss vision of what was going to happen in the future.

 

Strip stripey White sent five u5gb pounds and says:

 

“Brilliant brilliant discussion gents!”

 

And Mark Hooper sent a very generous fifty pounds and said:

 

“Keep doing what you do guys you’re all brilliant!”

 

Thank you well so are you mark and thanks very much for the generous donation.

 

And finally a question for you Gavin which comes from White is the new green who sends five pounds and he says:

 

“Assuming Gavin is a barrister he mentioned his pupil master a few days ago. Why is he allowed to still practice with his anti-Muslim stance, while Ian Millard was expelled from the bar in 2016 for a pro-Hitler tweet?”

 

Gavin Boby: I don’t practice as a pastor. I secure planning permissions for people. That’s what I do. I don’t practice I don’t work as a barrister. I don’t wanna sell houses I mean, it’s a little bit it goes around people saying I’m a barrister. Would be shy about it, because he sounds like I’m holding myself out. I don’t work as a barrister. I just assume people just drop that one. But I mean, it’s a qualification I’m a little bit proud of that I don’t work as a barrister when I’m taking down moss what most applications I’m not doing it as a barrister. I’m doing it as a private citizen. Doing a job that you could do.

 

Horus: You’re not a Queen’s Counsel then?

 

Gavin Boby: No no!

 

Horus: I was just joking! But I’ve noticed quite a lot of the scumbags I’ve noticed over the last few years have been Queen’s Counsel! A lot of people who were most vehemently in favor of keeping us in the EU regardless of what people wanted so many of them were Queen’s Counsel! It was horrible! Like Joanna cherry and loads of terrible it seems like a lot I meet sorry but our culture not only clearing out but I’m sure not as a class though, you know, not as a whole category of people. I’ll just go mention to everyone watching as well if you’re not aware that Gavin has a Patreon where you can donate to help him his prevention of mosques activities. Which is like saving thousands of people from the scourge of having a mosque built near their home. So check out Kevin on Patreon.

 

Simon: This was the subject I wanted to move on. And move on to I know that people are quite familiar with your musk busking busting work but it’s important to remind people that apart from our predictions of what’s going to happen in the future you are you’re practically engaged in stopping mosques from being built in small towns and in particular areas. I remember when we spoke a while ago giving a graphic description you giving your graphic description of what happens when people get a mosque. So perhaps you could go through that again in order to remind people. And anyone who’s feeling slightly multicultural and thinking Oh husbands shouldn’t they have a right to religious freedom and have their nice place to pray um it’s not really about that is it going?

 

Gavin Boby: No I love the lefty liberal people who say just that they’re my best customers, because when there’s a mosque proposed in their neighborhood they know exactly how to write strongly worded letters to their local authority. They do extremely courtesy impolitely as if they’re writing to the guard. It’s fantastic more of them please! And then afterwards they go back to their multicultural PC drivel! It’s is this it’s very funny it’s very amusing I mean, forms of themselves but they work hard for me unbidden unpaid fuel by the power of one of their own self-image meet Amy. But what goes on if there’s a mosque in your area what I talk about is the four the four stages, or visit okay that the first stage is refer to as the parking jihad you will notice oh my goodness there’s a lot of parking here very inconsiderate parking these people I thought they were religious so I thought they park a bit more considerately than this that means people parking across your driveway parking inside your driveway and I’m just not. And when you’re gonna say can you move your car please no not on me what should I move my car No not going and that leads onto the second stage which is what I call the of off this is our area now stage, because Housewives guys excuse me I’m going to collect the children in a minute I’m going to do some [60:00] shopping could you please if you’ll come out of my driveway please F what missus this is our area now we usually it’ll be it’s only for a couple of hours in our air for and it’s the women who get gifts Warner it is not they’re not many White nice within Islam I think we can say the third stage is the plastic particle the plastic bag stage which is where you go to knock on the door and you get a couple of nice nice Muslim gentlemen saying wouldn’t you like to sell your house we have a plastic bag with some money in it, or a briefcase with some money and from what people have told me the figure is usually about a third of its market value, or maybe a bit less and that’s what you’ll get offered and when you say this it’s just not for so can you stop coming around doing this you will get to the reply you will get is no White person is going to buy this place off you’re going to have to sell some time and the impression I have is that’s done as it is a subtle, or not so subtle intimidation campaign you’ll get it and one of the tactic is the taxi driver takes you back from the airport will if this has started he’ll start doing it as well maybe you can’t afford to buy a house but he’s just a way of saying we’re gonna be taking over this so you’d better move and the fourth stage is that when it’s really advanced is the we have no reason to believe there’s any racial element to this crime Madame stage, because again when say they’ll have a housewife, or someone goes to the police saying I’ve had something nasty come through my letterbox, or my front windows been broken, or my gate post has been smashed into reversed into that’s all the police will say they’ll say oh I was a lot more trouble going on around here these days madam we have no reason to believe there’s any racial element this crime and your life will be miserable the value of your property will go down simply, because the BC multicultural person you even the PC multicultural person that we were talking about will not buy your house from you, or if he does he’ll say I’m not going to offer so much money, because I won’t be able to sell it on to so many people support them on will reduce the value of it and you will have to move I get people saying emailing me constantly saying this has happened it’s a problem for me I can’t go shopping I get sworn in my life is unpleasant what do I do and all I can say is move that’s all I can say until we are able to go back and retake those areas in future years future decades it’s not nice I’m having a mosque in your area which is why the people who advocate for it they’re very keen to have enough money to live away from the mosques and to leave it to them but lucky poor people to sit and celebrate.

 

Horus: You have any experience in olden Govan?

 

Gavin Boby: Little I have one for Tomas me I musta fought and lost in all around all them I’ve done 62 may be 63 and it, or Mulvaney Oldham his son is just sad that’s really he’s horrible horrible people that people are ground down they’re bitter, or in depressed and demotivated this depression I had.

 

Simon: Going going back to the topic of the breakdown of society, because it is relevant to the mosque I think um don’t the mosques again aren’t we under estimating the power of the Muslims and the organizational power of the Muslims. Mosques I don’t know if I spoke to you before, or after I’d been back to London I think there’s possibly after um but I, because I’ve got into the Counter Jihad and I didn’t really know have very much first-hand experience, because there are still relatively few mosques here in Spain there are four small prayer rooms and the Left are trying to push for them for more mosques to be opened people will start campaigning here if this starts to happen well I’ve had very little direct experience of a mosque in my area. So I went back to finish early part where it’s spent for three, or four years in the 80s and it had just that the state of what had once been a beautiful neighborhood a happy neighborhood with great pubs music have great memories of my time in frensley Park, you know, it’s an. Hole it’s the only it’s turned into a dreadful place. And walking past them the mosque I felt pretty intimidated. I began walking past on the same side of the [65:00] road and felt our hands across the road, because I didn’t feel comfortable and then I went to another one mine I was staying with a friend in Chizik and I was just taking some photos outside the mosque and all of a sudden a car came up with four heavies inside it and told me to quite simply told me to get out of the area. It was very, very clear that they felt that they owned the area around the mosque. So the point I’m getting to is that the mosque don’t serve a religious purpose there, the Muslims are obviously organized wouldn’t they have weapons wouldn’t they have provisions with which to stage a battle against the White community communities around them aren’t they a little bit more dangerous than your weight you’re giving them credit for.

 

Gavin Boby: So dangerous only very hostile very, very violent but bad a war not competent organizing I think probably well there are two things first if you just Google why Arabs, or why Muslims use Wars half a million hits will come back I mean, that and it’s generally put-downs the fact that there are all these jealousies and hey within the Islamic community paragraphs you don’t get coordination you don’t get discipline military formation, the other thing the second thing is, if you imagine an Islamic law yeah an Islamic self ghettoized and clave to walk around one of those places walk around there is no wealth production in there’s no self starting infrastructure no civil infrastructure legal system on government system no financial structure there’s no way of growing food there’s no way of developing getting the material to make way, because there’s no way to train in those weapons it’s youth I just don’t think. I don’t think that had the slightest hope even if we have no army if suddenly the British Army just disbanded then there would be no way they could take us on their beard a huge massive disadvantage probably made worse by their own viciousness that they would provoke the United opposition of the rest of the English people. I don’t see I certainly see they have the will and the hive mind to gather together but not the competence and ability. It’s a one I was surprised to find one of the basic and elements have gained theory one of the basic conclusions appears to be that the good has in people who can go tell the truth and keep to their word and I’ll not malevolent will tend to drive out the bat and it’s, because the good can trust each other but the bad come and that I think applies to apply to Muslim arizim as we get it I seen no way I think the wounded seal are taking on a killer whale on some tropical beach has more of a chance of killing that killer whale than some Muslim ghetto would we have of overtaking us. How many soldiers with not even the sniper rifles wouldn’t would be needed to contain an Islamic enclaves how many probably not many I don’t 50 maybe just perched on rooftops? Don’t based and then how do you train when you don’t have drainage how do you train me you’ve got no food coming in you’ve got no your electricity mobile phone is switched off it’s I know I just can’t see it happening.

 

Horus: What about the threat of a lot of British leftists joining them?

 

Gavin Boby: This is what I find so delicious is one of fun funny when let’s suppose half the British public are convinced liberal lefty Bourbons okay just community multiculturalism diversity diversity is our strength I’m good and I will live, or die by that okay it’s certainly, rather than half of the population are singing that then well let’s suppose behalf of the population like us with any brain half the population it’ll be more than half the population, because there’s no incentive to have anything to do with Islam. But let’s suppose only half the population can see them half of operations say we want nothing to do with Islam and Muslims and let’s say the other half the population these liberal lefties say no no lovely is what I want to go I want to live Oh Muslims are [70:01] welcome here immigrants welcome here and then what you find is suddenly in that area the concentration of Muslims has doubled. So you no longer living in an area that’s 10, or 20 percent Muslim in a living it’s 20, or 40 percent Muslim and as we know Muslim of confidence and aggression increases exponentially with numbers and so I think what you probably find is a few of those liberal lefty baboons would start to say well I was okay when it was 10, or 20 percent now it’s 20, or 40 percent I think I’m going to change the White area from with its young I’m decamp into the White area I’m still a multicultural baboon but I’m going to be a multi ultra-beam amongst any White people, because that’s where I can do the most good and the votive and then what you might find so half of them decamp then that that area goes from 20 to 40 percent so forty to eighty percent Islamic good luck to you if you’re living in an 80 percent of Islamic area you’ll be lucky to get up with your skin intact! So third well I think what you’d see what I think we’re what we will see is these historic feedback loops and this idea of segregating out will it will go into an accelerating feedback loop even if you don’t even if you discount the reality which I think is coming of European people in general including White English people saying we want this sense of belonging we like a sense of belonging we like a sense of neighborhood a sense of home and discovering that basic human need that the modern Puritans have tried to burn out of the Western culture and psychology this is something people babies need this babies need to know leave it on they die if they don’t adults contemplate suicide if they don’t have that feeling of a sense of belonging it’s a basic human II and but even if people don’t discover that I don’t know how you stop people discovering even if people don’t you’ll still get that that net that feedback to me hardening the separation I think the separation will be every bit as hard as an assignment is saying it will be and then these people are going to have to steer in their own juice and good luck to you if you do that you do not.

 

Simon: Do you really think I mean, you said we were gonna you wanted to talk about the plans that we’ve been discussing about of repatriation you really think yeah I mean, I think it’s an interesting topic in that and one of the things we like to do here is that the reason why these conversations are good is you’ve got a knock that knock around the ideas um I think that the main stumbling block at the moment is as we all agree we have completely disloyal traitorous politicians so the initial problem and when we were speaking to Nick Griffin to a certain extent he’s right about the difficulty of gaining power how many barriers would be put in the way of any kind of party that was proposing repatriation we’re kind of all aware of those difficulties but do you really think that the policies that we’ve been discussing are a non-starter?

 

Gavin Boby: Yeah. I don’t think there’s any chance of a sensible policy gaining power point for the reasons I’ve said if it did I think it. I don’t think it will benefit from the kind of feedback loop I’ve talked about in that supposing it managed to deport a number of people I think Apollo the more people it Deportes the less strongly people are going to feel about it whereas I’m if you don’t think it was just play out the way I think they’ve got to play out more people separates out the more they will separate out you get increasing separation but I’d like to talk specifically about the proposal whose Patriotic Alternative and have put forward a repatriation proposal which I think will fail I think it had already fails and maybe I should talk to their face about this maybe I’ll talk to him what might one day but they’re a political movement so I feel comfortable discussing them even though they’re not here to defend themselves and what I look at is well there are two things firstly there’s the platform that the Donora towner has outlined 15k per person to go and also the chart that Horus and you salmon and found and put up if I deal with your Atanas Rotel is 15,000 to go dent Denmark already has [75:02] that Denmark in 1997 I’ve put together a policy that says we’ll give you 1, 200 quid to go I know in the 12 year is until 2009 about 200 people per year let’s turn off our left over that 12 year period in 2009 they said we’ve got to get more to go more people to leave and so they increased in tenfold to 12,000 pounds okay not dollars not euros path toward the equivalent of 12,000 pounds and then I think in 2000 I think it’s 2011 they put it up to 15,000 nots and 16,000 pounds and in addition you get help buying a home you get health insurance I don’t if you get the full panoply of deli initial offer benefits in the foreign country then you offered payments but I understand you get health insurance and you get help buying a house I only get 16 grand now in I think in 2011 I think my little hazy I think the number was a hundred and no 260 and the last figures that I’ve read will lower 150 in 2015 what appears to be happening again similar to the table of all is posted the more it goes on and the more you pay the less they leave now this is done lock system I think it’s mainly oguns people around over 55, or over 60 I would say those are the people more light it, because I don’t have a life they’re not selling a life of welfare ahead of them like 50 years of welfare receipts please lovely it’s just a few years and you’re getting those the health care benefits abroad and they just it has felt though I’m not taking it up I mean, you’d have to work God know like I could work a hundred thousand years you had after two hundred thousand years to defer for that to work the so that is feigning that is not working I wonder if, nor at our Mark Collett know that it won’t work I’d like to put that question to them they must have done their homework on this, because they’ve put this forward in on a public platform I’d like to know I wonder if it’s a soft introduction to harder policies I don’t know the other one is the table I think you’re at the town are tweeted announcing repatriation voluntary repatriation is already working and you might want to bring up some table that table I looked at it took me 30 seconds to Google voluntary repatriation scheme UK okay and toppling I found it couple of minutes to read the first few paragraphs what that is for that is for people who are illegal immigrants and they’ve come to the end of the road you come in as an illegal immigrant you apply for asylum you apply for a passport I’m gonna leave it to remain you’re told them though your appeal against its hold now every Avenue is closed and eventually the immigration photo comes to you and says listen we’re now going to forcibly deport you if we do you will go into detention 91% going to detention will put you into detention why don’t you leave under your own steam save yourself the humiliation just go, because you are you’ve come to the end of the line and then sometimes you get someone will say oh well you can’t do that to me I can’t afford to go so you’re stuck with me I can’t afford to buy a ticket and then the government will say we’ll buy you a ticket and then they’ll stay oh. But if you do that I’ll be homeless on the streets of Karachi, or Kabul and then I’ll die and that’ll be on your conscience when that beat oh so nice Mr immigration is able to say we have a grant for that it’s called reintegration support and that is its one and a half grand for an individual to act for a family I think but it’s this is not what is being portrayed with this table what has been pierced immediately being put forward is this is some Home Office guy walking up to a an immigrant with a passport someone who might be third generation and saying here’s to Germar why don’t you go and he says all, you know, okay okay no no it’s not this is simply people who have come to the end of the road and are agreeing to go quietly I think and the numbers there are going down and a thank you I don’t Oris a keeper though thank you and you see the numbers there since 2015 going down and down and down I think in I read that in 2018 the numbers were for compulsory forced repatriation and volunteer in corner repatriation a quarter turn the forced and volunteer appreciation zone I think was ten thousand forced 15,000 voluntary. And this is not evidence of our being able to take our country back [80:00] simply by paying people to go it’s.z I don’t think there’s no evidence I think that is not going to work there’s no evident with the evidence from other schemes is that it 1-1 why would it if you’ve got a life of the wealth of the English welfare state a house English rates pay even if you’re not on welfare state health care systems education of your children rose policing UK rates of pay compared to Afghan intensive pay what is an Afghan rate of $1 a day I don’t there’s don’t know where you’re gonna do it for 15 grand I don’t I see it I only see evidence that that will fail I saw adjusted. I don’t think that will work I think what will happen is it’ll fail and then the people putting that in place we’ll see right no we’re gonna get serious we’re going to use we are going with that the hard measures now and then what you will get is the on is war that’s when you get massacred coming I think that approach will be taken in places like France and I think you learned a lot of blood now that’s again why I’m getting a sigh from getting a rate of my getting a bit aerated about it is I don’t want to see us the English having that blood on our hands the blood of Massacre on our hands I think European countries will have that are going to have them on their hands Brussels Paris parts of maybe parts of Spain parts of Italy maybe parts of Germany as well I don’t want us to do that and I think if we go down this note that status route is likely to lead to that and besides I just don’t think the government system will be there for a political party to gain control so.

 

Simon: We were talking earlier about I mean, making, you know, with Wells remaining as moderate as possible making the environments in Britain as hostile as possible, or as non conducive as possible so making it less stiff it difficult to get benefits to once you make a the plank field more level at the moment immigrants and Muslims in particular are upsetting favourable treatments but once they’re not getting favorable treatment for housing for welfare for jobs once you can a Muslim man can only have one wife kosher food is illegal any kind of mutilation gentlemen means like is illegal Sharyl Sharia law is illegal it’s a question of reimposing the English system once that is imposed and the environment is left less comfortable for them surely there would be more inclined to accept a an offer your muta that Gavin.

 

Gavin Boby: Forgive me. I don’t think that is likely to be. I don’t think that I need to be anywhere near enough if I go through that in a second the other issue of kosher and genital mutilation I think brings us back to the issue the question we were having about jews and jewish people. Personally I think I would allow kosher slaughter it might seem illogical I think I would I’d allow I’m jewish circumcision I’ve never met a jewish guy who regrets having been servant sized although non-jews I’ve read accounts of them regretting it I think it probably is in some ways beneficial for jewish people circumcision, because it’s a way to create that sense of belonging which for a persecuted people is probably necessary so I wouldn’t I just wanted to sort of flag up my that if we’re talking about if we talk about some immigration here mass immigration in general let’s say I think you’re taught you might be talking about here is let’s say a Muslim man who has four wives and a lot of children he gets welfare for all of his wives and that’s a disgrace we can agree that it’s so it’s dismal watching civil servants and politicians pander to that it’s just disgusting but let me put it this way supposing that was in man has one wife one recognized wife then suppose he thinks he has three others but they’re not registered as his wives they’re just single mums who as far as the state is concerned they’re single moms who he has impregnated and so they claim single mothers benefit and honey he goes around and hits around the head [85:02] until they give him the money every week I mean, how does how does that decrease it probably isn’t going to decrease the money that is available to them by very much might increase I thought it would increase it actually, but I remember. And if you ban halal slaughter my guess is Muslims, or would how about that I don’t even cause them to go I think they’d say we’re on a jihad here where we’re taking over probably you’d you would probably get a lot of from halal slaughter in people’s back gardens too much for the police to deal with is my guess how would you stamp it out but I suppose you could start the stamp it out it would take a lot of police resource I don’t. I can’t see it being enough to get them to go III don’t think Muslims are that principled I think they would say world KarenT will take up they’ll give gifts some dispensation from the earmark from some bloke with it’s, or no Santa hat, you know, from Cairo University to say that’s okay you can disobey Islamic law whilst you’re at war, or she’s taking over and then they’ll say well star Islamic sorcerer as we’ve taken over and I just don’t see that being enough when you can serve with a slew of money and the religious command to take over through war and genocide a bit of cheering on non-compliant meat isn’t I think that’s gonna be enough.

 

Horus: Do you think any scenario that leads to deportations on a scale of tens, or hundreds of thousands of years like forcible, you know, using force if necessary so you think that any scenario that leads to that is a bad idea should be avoided?

 

Gavin Boby: Well let’s play it out let’s say we go to let’s say half of his Birmingham is we want to deport half the population of Birmingham say half a million people and you go up and you say you’ve got to go now what if those Muslims say no we’re not going this is our area we’re not going. What do you do so presumably your and snatch rates, or you move the army in and you circle off a part of that area that contains enough people to fit on a budget okay so let’s say you can get [10,000 people on a cruise liner, or a destroyer belowdecks want to destroy it so you cordon off an area of Birmingham that has well it, or Bradford let’s say that has, or less than that has 10,000 people in it. And then you go house to house dragging people out now just how are you gonna and how you gonna do that supposing that they say no we’re not going out of our house and the women are weeping and wailing and the men are fighting and throwing god knows what improvised item that is going to be a situation of war people are going to you’re gonna get a lot of III see that breaking down I don’t know how you do that first a house and then supposing where does that go to do you take Iraqis and Moroccans to Bangladesh do you shoot them there okay what if Bangladesh, or if you’re taking them to a port in Karachi what if the Pakistani government says no you can’t dock your shoot here no way when allowing you, or do you can’t do it by open an aeroplane is too delicate a mechanism too many ways to bring you time and again Karachi Islamabad Airport could simply say you’re not allowed to land how do you do it how do you get ten thousand people out of their houses onto a boat how do you get ten thousand people out of their houses into a holding camp next to the harbour particularly with a suicidal religion that doesn’t have the same concept of the value of its own life I would see it as a religious duty to perish resisting that I don’t know how that works without what I would call massacre well am I wrong and we explained it me.

 

Horus: Know I’ve always assumed that if you did that I mean, if I was seeing government this yeah this would be one of the hardest considerations, because I both acknowledge two difficulties that you sped up by also literally can’t stand the thought of not deporting. But yeah, I mean, it’s gotta be done in such a way that it obviously improves things, rather than causes, you know, an even worse situation one way you might find huge numbers of your own [90:01] people trying to overthrow your [90:02] government, because it’s causing such, you know, evils so yeah, I don’t necessarily have a clear idea of how that work but I always assumed that you could section off you could use sufficient force and inducements to the foreign governments like, you know, by either by leveraging them with the foreign aid that’s given to them and stuff, or deportations in combination with payments to those governments in some way I always assumed it can be done if piece by piece I always thought suppose. This is a bit off topic but the first most difficult like pressing task every government wants to deport hundreds of thousands of people is for us to fight as for us to defeat your internal enemies to defeat much of a civil service and to replace many, or most of the chief constables of police parts of the intelligence services close the BBC, or suspended various things are that and a defeat massive Left-Right oddity you get to government by the time you’ve got into government they know that you’re what they call Nazi is right they’re determined to what bring you down and hang you if you can if I can but so by, you know, after having been in government for six months he wouldn’t even have stayed on a program people say she probably spent that whole time fighting your internal enemies but by the time you’ve done that you may have demonstrated such will and frankly terror to the at least for some external you may have begun to reverse the process that’s likely, you know, just a the show of will that you’d have to show anyway in order to get that far might actually I mean, you have to consider the geopolitical situation there, because you put out the US like threatening you with God knows what as well and the UN and other countries so it’s really hard to map out.

 

Gavin Boby: It is its important to do this and have this kind of conversation, because of the biggest one of the biggest inhibitors we have is that enemies can say you can’t do this without unthinkable methods there for you can’t think about it’s unthinkable don’t think about it and I saw a an interview, or Nigel Farage getting asked about the Prophet of Islam there’s immediate response was well then you have to kill any you’ll have to kill everyone when you so you can’t dig like no now what’re you gonna do kill everyone that’s it and walked away now and that is the card they’re going to play that is what it’s necessary to think this through to think this through realistically and to see are there ways that we can take back our own home without having to dirty our hands and to commit Massacre atrocity yeah that is worth thinking true I think I was I found myself thinking about this 15 years ago how is this how does this going to happen and moralism I think actually this is it seems to me will play itself out just a human nature that the main problem is our governments once they’ve gone Society segregate us out Islamic areas become hard form in Islamic areas unlivable and they might come to us saying please give us an airplane ticket at least the weather’s nice back there and there’s a people like us though and I think it’d be a lot easier those regards the BBC enemies like the BBC tell me if the politicians are clinging on by their craws how important priority is the BBC licence fee games it’d be like the porgy DC’s hi I’m your BBC’s panicking the BBC is not reporting any what hardly at all the current economic problems become an economic situation, the money printing you won’t find it anyone the BBC I suspect they want to report on people clapping the NHS that’s wonderful the reason for the reason for that they can see that the gravy train where they have a nice front row one of the stiffs and the front carriage the gravy train is going to hit the buffers and they don’t know what to do about since I think a lot of the enemies will just melt away I like it I look forward to the delicious excuses that the lefty liberal the beings are going to come up with when they think I’m.

 

Simon: Okay one of the expressions odd from our previous conversations that I’ve always has always stayed in my mind I’ve said [95:01] I’ve already told you about this previously Gavin was well it slowed the tide stop the tide turn the tide now it seems to me that. This is a lot more consistent with the repatriation product policy then I mean, we’re all talking about the same thing all of us want to avoid bloodshed and atrocities so all of us are knocking around the suit all of us want our countries back but we don’t want to do it violently so wait so all it was a thinking of a way thinking of ways in which this can possibly come about I’m very, very uncomfortable about reaching this kind of Mad Max post-apocalyptic world where, you know, society is completely broke broken down and we’ve kind of laughed about this, because yep I also think that the indigenous population will tend to have an advantage, because if you’re in rural areas at least you’ve got a chance to sustain yourself you’ve got farmlands you’ve got, you know, you can produce your own food food what on earth can you do in hansworth not a great deal what on earth can you do in the East End of London not a great deal but at the same time the idea of society completely breaking down I’m sure you understand that I’m not very happy about it about this.

 

Gavin Boby: Well there’s another side to which it could it could lead to something better quite quickly I actually wrote a little it’s on my website a little book a little guide to this what to do when the state the state breaks down the key thing is people need law so I wrote a legal code that people can use just take it away and use if they want just so people can have laws and agree to abide by the laws I suspect what you will get is the breakdown of the state that doesn’t mean the loss, or law I think you’ll move from state imposed law to self-government state and post government to self government I think that will be a lot freer and a lot nicer a lot more prosperous and a lot more run a lot more humane a lot more communal, because people will be achieved choose legal systems for themselves and so you get a greater sense of pride it’s not something that’s just forced on you I suspect I think people will do that pretty quickly what people will need to acclimatize themselves to is the loss of the welfare state that’s the thing that I think is unthinkable to people but my I would guess if this if this happens although it’s without the state imposing mass immigration feminism which declined dumps wage rates and the loose monetary policy which again increases the cost of living by enriching your already rich I would expect your average workers only raped pay rate to treble probably quadrupling massively increase and I think people rather support themselves they’ll have to accept freebies from the man with the upper-class accent so yeah the difficult thing for be able to contemplate with people are not going to contemplate and in essence porcelain it’s a lot of the welfare state. But I think the idea of a form of self-government would actually be create a much nicer society I actually think it would create probably a new form of British Empire where in those circumstances I can see let’s say you live in Nigeria who and you’re just a trader who do you want administering your private legal code do you want Nigerians administering it, or do you want English people administering it you’ll probably go the way of the Hong Kong Chinese they love the fact that the English their laws they were quite happy with they’re very comfortable with it and they did a fabulously wealthy I think you’re probably in those circumstances getting a lot of other countries saying we want you to come in and basically governor will form create and run the forms of law and security in place, because you did a better job than us so. I don’t think it’s necessarily a horrible prospect I think the transition, the dislocation will be absolutely eye-watering the example I gave is let’s suppose you’re a single mum on the seventh floor for each doing you don’t know who the fathers were different three fathers you don’t know who they [100:00] were the lifts don’t work it starts working in the stairway fills up with rubbish you’re me might be a bit it’s too old to prostitute yourself in any way if, you know, you’ve got three children what would you live on how do you I presume you try to find it a man you can be nice to, I don’t know, matter so I mean, it will be I think they’ll be appalling an appalling transition as a result of the way society has been so damaged by blood first order our politicians making rougher promises for power in order to get gather more and more power and control I think it rude will be for the best.

 

Simon: That’s good anything more to add horrors before I do we’ve got one super Chet and we’ve got a few questions that seemed quite interesting so any points to make?

 

Horus: Well that scenario has occurred to me as well that at some point in the future you might find Third World countries kind of contracting rulership from the West from countries like Britain who they’ve just found through experience they don’t want to be colonized as such, or ruled by force but they will like contract our rulership to some extent that occurred smooth for as well that you may actually find a sword will re not recolonization some sort of new westernization in term year in terms of life yeah look, or codes and legal administrations though. But yeah, I’m just sort of adding my agreements there, but by us I only plan to be on till nine some. So I’m gonna drop off in five minutes of us alright bulb I don’t is with questions.

 

Simon: Alright yeah the first question is I knew this is gonna come back and bite you Gavin but Joe are says since five pounds and says Gavin he’s given you a some information here Gavin the reason the USSR killed religious jews is, because the Soviet jews were savety and Franky’s they believed and practiced the Torah in Reverse basically Satanism you should research saboteurs every quick guides on those, or not at all.

 

Gavin Boby: I will like I knew nothing about this I will yes.

 

Simon: Yes a besides every is quite an interesting character 1666 okay questions do Matthias asks how does Gavin individually NPC armed forces and their silently mega-wealthy globalist Empress acting in a time of collapse?

 

Gavin Boby: What are the NPC armed forces.

 

Simon: Okay the NPC NPC was and what was MPC Horus?

 

Horus: Non-player non-American answering.

 

Simon: The non-player character and, nor the, nor me the pro-pro globalist armed forces how will they react.

 

Gavin Boby: I would expect normies once if the world fair driven fee is torn out of people’s arms I mean, people are going to wake up in a bad mood and suddenly take responsibility and my experience is when people have to make individual decisions for themselves they make very, very sensible decisions I would expect suddenly the question will be like appeasement in nineteen forty who wasn’t at peace who was a multiculturalist I would expect that to happen then what will happen with the armed forces I friend of mine told me that he was at a demo where the there were some what some semi why they were some armed forces there, but he walked up to him and said if you were ordered to shoot us to maintain order would you shoot us the soldier said no no way no way ice what would the army do I would have thought they’ll side with people, rather than with the man with the upper-class accent.

 

Simon: Yeah, I think so too if once the command structure is removed to a certain extent pega Mead asks do you agree that the real enemy is the traitor White liberal happily ignoring mosque building, because they live far away, rather than a visible mental case jihad Warriors destroying our culture?

 

Gavin Boby: Yeah that’s right.

 

Simon: I think we I think we all agree on that don’t we it’s that it’s not so much the well we don’t like the people being here, but the people that open the gates for them they’re definitely the traitors and we’ve got this one from Marty morosely there’s I’m gonna skip this Angela, because I think it’s a bit too incendiary sorry Marty morosely would go and consider working with Patrick pashyati alternative, or at least maintaining friendly relations [105:00] despite his take on the JQ and not aligning with Mark Collett.

 

Gavin Boby: Yes I don’t know about not aligned with Mark Collett, because I haven’t done the courtesy of talking to him face to face that’s I haven’t had the opportunity I would certainly maintain friendly relationships despite any we can differ like a couple of gentlemen seems to me.

 

Simon: Okay well we’ve gone on foodon to — is it two hours and 20 minutes I think.

 

Horus: Nearly an hour and fifty.

 

Simon: An hour I know okay yeah now I’m 50 so we got 10 minutes to go any summing up to do, or 10 minutes maximum to go.

 

Horus: I’m gonna have I’m gonna have to drop off if you don’t want so long as you’ve got a bit of work to do.

 

Simon: Okay all right see you Horus thing thanks for being here.

 

Horus: Good to meet you having welcome.

 

Gavin Boby: Nice to meet you thank you.

 

Simon: Okay I think clothed that closing and we don’t have to do a whole ten minutes if we run out I think the important thinks of stress is can you give us information about the current work that you’re doing current and future mas busking projects if you’ve got any and how people are speaking to think in particular how people can help you and support your Patreon and give us some contact details?

 

Gavin Boby: That’s very nicely thank you yes what if I deal with that last one first and people can help me by going to these Patreon if you go Gavin going to be patron owners Patreon the/up junk on four slash Gavin Toby and that’s the one thing I need I’m afraid is money it’s not money for me none of that money goes to me it goes on most goes on the costs of fighting individual mosque campaigns it costs money you have to pay for publicity just to let people know that it’s happening that cost money not tends to need to be come in hard copy form so and I’ve heard a little bit of money to power who does the horrible job of researching council website to find these applications so I can get onto the burning so I don’t find out about them after they’ve been granted planning permission that’s basically the, or the horrible awful truth is, if you want to help it’s about funding supplying the funding so I can go after these places as regards since I went on Dangerfield’s stream he was so good about it people what as followers is scrubs so these subscribers given me enough to go after one mosque a month so it’s great suddenly I can I get previously people were just expecting me to pay for it they wouldn’t contribute themselves it was really bizarre you’ve got a mosque to know two doors down ah can’t be bothered no it’s not worth it to me and well your house will go down by ten percent overnight and but now people are people feeling engage and I can go after one I’ve to campaign I don’t like to name the campaigns and doing at the time so I’d like refer to name them in retrospect after they’ve been dealt with preferably after they fit once it.

 

Simon: Makes perfect sense.

 

Gavin Boby: Brag but I am going through I’ve had about a list of four pin three to me yesterday and another two comes I think the two I saw today I’m gonna try to go after both of those and they’re not expecting this.

 

Simon: Okay well that’s I mean, that’s great music it’s been a real pleasure seeing you again after all these years Gavin I think all of us think and believe as, you know how Horus is a massive fan of yours we’ve been we’ve been speaking highly of you this is I want to stress to everybody this is important work this is practical work me and Horus do history and we have our ideas and we’re entertainers really what Gavin’s doing is he’s down on the ground fighting the battle and, you know, fighting to stop Islam gaining more power in this country so please please support him I will put out our gets his Patreon link and I’ll put it in the district description of the video once it’s finished I also tweet it out and do a little bit of publicity for him but it’s been fantastic having him on and a pleasure to see you thanks very much for coming.

 

Gavin Boby: Likewise thank you very much Simon has been a great pleasure and thank you to all US as well.

 

Simon: Yeah so look after yourself Gavin and we’ll speak soon good eye everybody bit bit a long night tonight.

 

[109:52]

 

 

 

 

END

 

 

============================================

 

 

See Also

 

Simon Harris – My Speech to the Patriotic Alternative Conference – Mar 16, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 19 – A Conversation with Nick Griffin – Apr 14, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 21 – Keeping A Political Project On Point with Dangerfield – Apr 28, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 23 – Is Populism and Patriotism Enough? with Paul Rimmer – May 5, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 22 – Gavin Boby on Mosque-busting and the Breakdown of Society – Apr 28, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 25 – The State of the Art with Jeff Winston & Nick Cotton – May 19, 2020 — Transcript

 

============================================

 

PDF Notes

* Total words = 17,193

* Total images = 2

* Total A4 pages = xx

Click to download a PDF of this post (x.x MB):

 

Version History

 

Version 7:

Version 6:

Version 5:

Version 4:

Version 3: May 24, 2020 — Added See Also links.

 

Version 2: May 16, 2020 — Proofed 10 more minutes. Transcript fully proofed = 15/110 mins.

 

Version 1: May 15, 2020 — Published post. Transcript fully proofed = 5/110 mins.

 

 

Simon: Okay hello everyone and welcome to European Freedom livestream number 21! What is called now? It’s called “Keeping a Political Project on Point”! And this week we’ve got the fantastic Chris Dangerfield. So it’s really great to have him here and as but as usual before introducing him we’re gonna talk to my mate Horus. How’s it going Horus? Any new news on your latest video.

 

Horus: I still still editing it I keep on failing to get around other work but all right well I’ll be doing this over like an hour here an hour there and I was just got well I’ve got a rerecord a bit, or I’ll go record another section to it so. But I think I’ll get it on this week okay there now I just I had loads of work, you know, my job work last week. So I’m getting on sweat and then I’ve got loads more ideas after that as well but I’ve read two books in between, because it’s about the right gangs fing and a read Maggie Oliver’s book and Jane’s seniors book and that gave me new things to discuss so that’s the bits I’ve got the one add to it as well.

 

Simon: Good I’ve heard very good things about Maggie Senior particularly.

 

Horus: You’ve mixed the two together Maggie joins me yes yeah she’s the one she’s lady works in brother room and yeah she was a yeah real whistleblower and making olive as one was better than I expected as well, because it I’ve been led to believe that she was sort of like a self-promoter Sophie but actually in her book he’s really hot hitting I recommend back to them yeah and they’re quite easy reading who they well we’re in it off so I’ve got some stuff to take out in I’m putting more videos.

 

Simon: Okay well be looking forward to that and okay and finally onto the guest Chris it’s really great to finally speak to you after quite a long time really.

 

Chris: Mmm certainly I don’t usually like doing streams with people I’ll be honest with you but I like your stuff Simon. So I’m actually looking forward to this and nice to be not on camera I mean, there’s that ridiculous to have me there, but I am actually sort of reclining at the moment and it’s nice not to show my face.

 

Simon: Yeah it is a relief actually I always used to show my face I still often show my face but just the idea of be able to sit here and pick your nose if you liked this kind he’s kind of relief really it takes a lot of pressure off you and yeah I prefer working with avatars really.

 

Okay, so let’s get into the I-team I don’t know the best way to introduce you I suppose everybody knows Chris and just be doing a bit of research on you I’ve been watching some of your videos over the last few days and I don’t is it out of order to bring the one that you broadcast the other day about your when you appeared on Channel four TV

 

Chris: They’re all public so I mean, they’re all public feel free.

 

Simon: I mean, look what in many respects I mean, I think my background from pretty much stat well reasonably far left as a young man. But then standard left up my I suppose my strange story as I played in reggae bands and African bands for a long time. I was the White guy in a kind of very, very black community and now I’m an ethnos so is it kind of a bit bit odd really, but your background is even heavier going from kind of radical communist through drug addict to Nazi really! Yeah it’s kind of how did you get here?

 

Chris: You know what I went to I had a seven, or eight years in higher education. I just want it well originally I wanted to be I was a child of the eighties and graphic design was a big thing in the 80s and there’s loads of money in it and my dad was a bricklayer but he was always drawing he was done oil paintings that all wrapped round my mother’s house quite a weird bloke in many ways especially in that working-class community, you know, he stuck out as a bit of an eccentric. And so I was always drawing and he taught me to draw a young age and paint and so with the sort of it was a red Ferraris and funny sort of glasses in the eighties so I wanted to be a graphic designer.

 

So I went to art college to study that. But then as it’s quite typical with art schools I started taking a lot of drugs and LSD come along. And it affected me quite heavily and I soon sort of rejected earning money basically that’s the simple way of putting it I could dress it up as rejecting capitalism and [05:02] the exploitation and alienation of labor. But just the idea of earning money and working was sort of frowned upon in art schools and my work changed I wasn’t, you know, I my portfolio when I arrived there was lots of nice watercolors of the sort of things you’d expect on chocolate boxes and leaflets at the bank.

 

After about six months of LSD they would just a mess just throwing paint at the canvas and cutting it and, you know, usual kind of stuff. And so they said to me you’re not really an illustrator we think you should lead this course and gonna study fine art. So when I done that I ended up on a degree doing performance art which is, you know, that’s right out there this is contemporary performance art.

 

My final piece at that university sorry that art school was a piece named after the Foucault book discipline and punish. Where me and a friend were dressed up in sort body armor and ice hockey hats and gum shields and we had these wooden clubs and anyone who came in the room at to follow rules. And we had lawyers outside we had security guards and people had to sign contracts legal contracts not to involve the law, or the police layer. They probably weren’t binding but they may have been we did have real lawyers excuse me. And so anyone who entered that room and they ain’t had to enter one at a time and the rules were things like you had to pigeon step around the black line without deviating you had to leave the room with one mitt in one minute and not establish eye contact with anyone in the room and everyone did that was the first thing they do they walk in they survey the room and see they broke a rule we kick the shit out of them! And that was my final piece. So I got first for a violent piece of art.

 

But while I was as soon as I left studying graphic design and illustration I ended up in fine arts alongside that comes the politics and they were all Marxists! There was not a whiff of anything else! They are all hardcore Orthodox to the mainly sort of Rosa Luxemburg Marxists. And I was taught that and after that first degree I went on done a master’s degree in cultural studies. And this is about 94. And cultural studies for anyone who doesn’t know he’s kind of like the birthplace of social justice, you know, I will study in post-colonial theory. I was studied gay and gender theory it was studying feminism.

 

And we were it was a Marxist indoctrination camp. And as much as I thought I was making my own decisions I look back now and it’s horrifying really they’re sort of a young bright young, a young bright lad full of the joie de vivre, you know, a loved life my father had died when I was quite young. But I was still sort of coping and I was put through this horrible indoctrination process where I came out a Marxist.

 

And when you’re about it you can’t enjoy life! You’re not allowed to you, because anything anything you achieve, or do someone else is suffering that’s the kind of basics, or maths they work on. And without doubt it cost me the next 30 years of my life! Because that sort of ended up, you know, I became a heroin addict for the majority of my adult life.

 

Simon: Before we get onto that can we just talk about a bit about the kind of Marxism. I mean, because I really got into radical left politics just for a couple of years. But when you were reading it didn’t you think there was something wrong with it?

 

Because I kind of loved the term I’ve come to use is once I moved there were out of the far left I just became a default leftist, you know, I was nothing really, but I’ve had this imprinted on my mind. But yeah, I read quite a few I didn’t actually read and read much omit original work but I read synopses and essays and I had lots of mates who were the International Marxist group was based in Notting was founded in Natyam. And I knew lots of people in the IMG some of them were okay some of them were right our souls actually, but to a certain extent I think even in a couple of years I’ve kind of worked out for myself that there was something wrong with this.

 

And also being we kind of we all joined the Labour Party in the kind of entries in period and I it was very lucky, because I joined the Labour Party where my granddad who was a trade unionist had been a member. And some of his old mates took me under their wing they used to call me Young Harris. And I had to go and sit with them at its party meetings and I think what they were doing subtly they were telling me keep away from these wankers.

 

Effectively that’s what they did and, because they ‘d obviously been mates with my granddad and lots of mud known since I was a [10:01] little kid. I couldn’t really get out of it but I kind of woke myself up and my stupidness only lasted for what two, three years probably.

 

But then the unfortunate thing was the rest of my life I was just kind of left with this default leftism where I thought left that the lefties must be the good guys. And I never actually bothered looking at any other alternative theories sorry for going on about too much about myself. But I was just kind of interested to explore how you perceive some of this ideology.

 

Chris: Well it was a bit strange, because I was a little bit of an outlier anyway I think, because I was studying from an arts background my I was worried I was more into the sort of French scene Foucault Derrida Chris diver who it was all based in Marxism. So I sort of knew there was a, you know, they sort of doff their cap to Marxism and even among the Marxists that was seen as a little bit dodgy, you know, they were a bit more sort of straight-laced.

 

However, they did the thing that really attracted me to them at Leeds University when I was in my masters was there practical stuff. The Islamic fundamentalist group his Buddha here they got banned from Leeds University. And that was carried all over the country his butter here were not allowed to speak on University campuses, because they were homophobic and sexist and all this. And the Marxists of which I was one then and I was selling liberal Marxism, you know, Brendon O’Neill’s new magazine LM I think it was called by then it didn’t last long I think IT had sowed them out of existence in the end. But the Edition that we were selling was a free speech Edition and it was about free speech absolutism and we actually got the his butter here reinstated on universities we said this is crazy you can’t just silence people.

 

And that that appealed to me and no one else was doing it, you know, there was a lot of sort of the SWP were very prominent of every university I’ve been to and they didn’t strike me as anything. I wasn’t interested in anything and when they were shutting people up I was totally repelled by them. But the Marxists that was a good thing. Fired in for free speech on universities and doing speeches and do presentations organizing workshops where students would come along and they were talking about free speech absolutism. The next edition of the magazine believed in Marxism it’s funny actually thinking of it now I was like 23 with these magazines on my chests, or at university to celebrate such a cliche.

 

But and the next edition was what’s wrong with masculinity. And he had a picture of Tyson on the cover. And it was a pro-masculinity thing I mean, you got to put it in context going back to the early nineties the sort of the university left was a very different beast. So I was quite impressed with that kind of stuff.

 

My actual reading of Marx I thought if I felt this song wrong with it was quite boring. Especially when you’re used to Derrida, or on Foucault which is, you know, for lack of a better word it’s quite sexy theory really. And Das Kapital German ideology you just have to read it.

 

Simon: Yeah, it was pretty tiresome but it held me I on my own I suppose it was a combination of the people that were involved who I just didn’t like. And that kind of that kind of made, you know, I could smell something fishy, because and it’s interesting that like many, many years later when I finally started my more recent red pill journey it happened much more quickly, because I immediately as I was trying to waking up to what’s wrong with the world I first I went far left and explored the far left again.

 

And I was kind of reasonably involved with a far left party here in Catalonia. Just for two meetings actually, because we worked out very, very quickly that I thought they were wankers. And they thought I was a dangerous source, because I was asking too many sensible questions. But the fact that I’d gone that I knew already knew what lefties were like when I came back and found a few more of these radical people I realized I didn’t like them 35 years ago. I still don’t like them now.

 

What about you Horus? Your I don’t think you’ve been involved quite so radically have, you.

 

Horus: Know, the communism was the first idea that ever excited me though when I was about 15. And I sort of held on to at least remnants of that until early 20s. So yeah, I did have a sympathy for it. I wanted to ask something what’s the I am Ginny the crypt for the Hitchens prophets were.

 

Simon: No [15:00] it wasn’t it was it might have been not in Nottingham it was I think it was who was it? Was it Talia Callie? And then there was a there was a couple of not seen guys. I didn’t know the bigwigs. But the guy that ran the socialist society at University. I’m not going to name his name. But he was a member and he was a drinking mates. And I was in the social associate Society. So I kind of met these people and occasionally I found them rather obnoxious. But, you know, it’s what when I when you’re that age I was just LARPing as a radical. Mm-hmm, you know, it’s all revolution and, you know, donkey jackets and Doc Martin Lucy boots.

 

Horus: Did they write articles that cool things like drinking as a revolution reacts and things on that.

 

Simon: I mean, everything was revolutionary! And there is no.

 

Chris: And also usually the wrong way around. You’ve hit that now really Horus look then find way but behavior they were doing and then defend it as revolutionary. In they didn’t identify revolutionary act and then do it so if one of them was an alcoholic yeah his next paper would be drinking as a revolutionary act so sure.

 

Horus: And it wasn’t revolution as a drunken act.

 

Chris: Well Simon I was just saying about that LARPing thing. I’ve talked on my channel before. Without a doubt I was caught up in the Romance of the Marxist revolution. Which has a huge cultural kind of oath behind it. I can remember we went to seal and Ken Loach’s land and freedom which is incredibly good Marxist propaganda. In some ways is there’s some questionable politics during the movie.

 

But, you know, we went to lead picture house which sits about hundred people it’s got, it’s lit by little gas lights. And the RCP went along to watch land and freedom. And the there’s like 20 odd movies about Che Guevara and, you know, just the history of it the image is the stories. You don’t really get so much of that on the right. And as a lost kind of someone spiraling into addiction it was certainly something Romantic and kind of wholesome to get hold of but as I got older it became almost just an identity, you know, it become scientist, or single me out of parties, because I was going to talk about communism.

 

And but I never got the impression any of that lot that I met then any of those lot from the RCP at Leeds University I never actually believed this was gonna affect any change. Not once! And I only realized about six, seven months ago I’m involved in something now which feels like if things are actually happening. And I didn’t have that once in the RCP.

 

One of the boys it was right at the top of the tree. And again I won’t mention him. We went out one night and I gave him some speed. And it was one of those real mistakes go after about 10 minutes he looked like his head was gonna explode. And he turned to me and he grabbed me by the lapels of my sort of Rik Mayall student sort of cherry shops. He looked me in the eyes and he went he went you’ve got the means of production! You’ve got the means! And I really looked up to him, because man could he talk Marx! And I remember the engine singing are no he’s a bloody idiot!

 

Horus: But if he is so much so much like you can be wasted on it the dead end theory. But maybe it was just that he was like I mean, he might have been a very smart guy at, but lost in this maze of a sense of the idiocy way, because Marxism. But I don’t know if you guys would agree. But I think a wholly disagree with that statement that so many ordinary people have the it’s a nice idea. But it working in real world it’s. My artistic spirit is that it’s a terrible idea and I obviously won’t work in the real world as well.

 

But I mean, it does work it functions too great a castle of skulls and bones right. But it the problem is there’s a bad idea in the first place as well. It’s the idea is to destroy it, or private property which is a war against reality. And to destroy everything that can make one person have power over another. Which is everything about this. I mean, taller people are advantaged overfish, or ones where it’s oh except for airplanes.

 

Chris: Oh I think the thing about, you know, I obsolete Marxism as opposed to communism I understand you’re talking about communism as a sort of economic and social system. But what’s kind of appealing about Marxism to young men I think is there’s a lot more there, you know, there’s a the there is an analysis of capitalism. There is things that stand out that as a young man you almost can’t argue with really alienation from labor, you know, that I think that still goes on today.

 

Horus: I recognize that concept.

 

Chris: Yeah, of course, if girls gave them to talk the ears of [20:02] it and me they, but also things like the historical material principle analyzing history, you know, these things stand up. So it’s not just communism and, you know, Marxist of analysis of art and literature is there’s a huge body of work that comes under the umbrella of Marxism. And a huge body of work there’s that it’s influenced. I mentioned it for the likes of Foucault and Derrida that horse, or French thing. So, you know, to say that it’s a bad idea, you know, I understand that communism is a bad idea. But there’s so much more there. And I think it’s a bit more complicated than that.

 

Horus: And now what we encounter is more mark so Freudianism, or something like that I mean, Marxism that what people call cultural Marxism right it Marx combined with especially sake of psychology and other things like social anthropology as well. But I what, you know, it once it combined with so many other fields it became infinitely more influential. And also you mentioned the cultural studies before, right? If I’m not mistaken is that the field with Stuart Hall was one of the big yeah.

 

Chris: For sure Stuart Hall from Birmingham he was kinda like the brainchild behind it. Who wrote that ridiculous book Orientalism which is just Sayid sorry no. But yeah, you’re right Hall is behind that yes yes that’s true.

 

Horus: Hall is a major favorite of Ash Sarkar.

 

Chris: Yeah.

 

Horus: She absolutely loved him! But I see a straw I mean, I know this is perhaps of a point of principle the grander sweep of Marxism but why the fuck was that man and that’s who work in a British university? Like it says, you know, I don’t know why a single him at particular this is like a Jim might like Bob Baden, or something like he’s from the Caribbean he’s a Marxist he’s trying overthrow our society. And he’s employed in a British University and made famous, you know,

 

Chris: It’s full of them! It’s full of them Wars.

 

Horus: The ranks of them.

 

Chris: My master’s degree tutors three jews, three Marxists, three people who hate Western society! You’re sure for sure and they never taught me anything critical! They never they never encouraged me to critique Marx, or any others it’s no they paid me information.

 

Horus: Yeah it’s not what critical theory is its a critical theory is a weapon what was its a way of making people doubt their own society. Well making Western people doubt their own society.

 

Chris: But about however, you know, oh I also, you know, also the Frankfurt School, you know, they the Frankfurt School we talk about cultural Marxism for the Frankfurt School they looked at the failures of Marxism they tried to work out why. They realize that Marx a totally underestimated the growth of an explosion of pop culture and mass media. They also took on Freud like you said and so they created this, or new Marxism that took into account pop culture and mass media. And the divide itself of the sort 20th century.

 

However, much like when I talk about the body of work of Marx, some on the Frankfurt School stuff is still relevant and I think brilliant. I think Adorno and Horkheimer analysis of the culture industry which in inner as they called the culture industry is absolutely on point!

 

And I get in so much trouble for this like it’s so much backlash for daring to say that something the Frankfurt School said was relevant. And yet I study these texts regularly I pop out essays about them and I think to throw the baby out of the bath walk with some of this stuff is a really big mistake. I would encourage everyone to read the culture industry, if you want to get an understanding of how pop culture has got us in the mess. The pop culture’s role in the kind of demoralization and alienation and atomization of our people. I think it’s essential to look at that stuff.

 

Horus: Who does criticize you for reading and discussing those things?

 

Chris: Do any avatars in the chat I mean, I don’t get a sustained argument emailed to me. I just get people calling me all sorts of stupid names. But it rarely goes down well.

 

Horus: There’s no reason oh sorry I was cancer is loads of valuing in reading stuff from the Left is by no means the fact that there’s something wrong about roofing it’s what they’re trying to do is evil. What they’ve identified as the problem is they’ve got half the thing, or a few things right and I’m wrong, you know, by no means a waste of time to read this though.

 

Chris: But Horus do you think Marx and I asked you this as well Simon. Do you think marks set out to make a better world?

 

Simon: No I can’t go down a very conspiracy-theory path. I don’t really go down the conspiracy theory the fact that he was Rothschild cousin and he was in London at the same time as what I can’t remember which Rothschild it was [25:01] was MP for the city. I just think it’s yeah it when we talk about this particular tribe of people they crop up so frequently. This is very difficult not to go down the conspiracy theory route. And I don’t really want to get into it.

 

But yeah, I don’t know I think it’s cynical. I think one of the things about this tribe is they’re capable of producing very intelligent stuff, very intellectually stimulating stuff, for purely cynical reasons! And you spend your whole life doing something that’s gonna bring mmm bring evil to mankind. I think ultimately that’s what Marx does. No I don’t think he was to bring goodness to Manson mankind.

 

Chris: That conspiracy route you didn’t want to go down!

 

Horus: No I’ll tell you like a little more sophisticated most what hardly anyone on earth has purely good, or purely evil intentions but I’d say is more towards evil end. But like I do think Marx probably had a genuine belief in communism, because communism was is actually an old idea, right?

 

It goes back way before the 19th century. Like the story of the guys in Munster, you know, the Anabaptist take over in Munster offing is another example of the idea of communist suddenly making thing with you crazy things. And this thing’s way back in like biblical times as well. But I just think the libertarian theorist Murray rough, but also jewish Missy but a good cheer in my opinion. He put it well when he just said the key thing to understand about Marx is that Marx was a commie, which sounds like a joke and when he says this you’re on tape you can hear the audience laughing but he means it, right? What he said is Marx was a commie when he was like in his early 20s, then he became a theorist those theories were to justify the idea of communism.

 

So this whole analysis of capital has eventually taken over the world destroying aristocracy and then ultimately destroying itself and then communism what will be the necessary result, was all bullshit! I don’t believe it, right? It may become some sort of self-fulfilling prophecy maybe I mean, obviously capitalism does have its problems right. But I think that all that he wrote was to justify his pre-existing belief in communism. And so I don’t I do you think he probably thought that was socially just in a way. So I don’t Ralph is simply evil but no I do think communism is an evil idea so not going to credit in which one of your good evil.

 

Simon: But don’t you think to a certain extent it’s a lot of that early communism is the result of being a lapsed jew? Like this, you know, there’s some kind of ticking tikkun olam in it and yes it’s so tell Malik and it’s so hateful.

 

And I’ve been fiddling around with an idea I was wanting to that’s all I’ll publish it at some point. But I fiddle about with the Communist Manifesto over and over again and it’s full of bile! When you start to look at it I was thinking of just replacing I’ve been going through the text and replacing the word “bourgeois” with White, or some kind of version of “White“. And once I’ve done the text I want to kind of update it for the modern world and call it a “Globalist Manifesto“. I’m giving away an idea!

 

But a lot of it kind of stands up and it just when you suddenly apply it to yourself this could be me! It comes across is really nasty and it’s kind of yeah the boys were the bourgeoisie it is a reasonable synonym for what Whites have become today. And it seems that it seems to be full of racial hatred to me.

 

Horus: And like I don’t think anyone should write, because he was Chris marks was kind of raised Christian, right? Like his father was a convert to Christianity so he was thought nominally raised Christian by simon: His — of his grandfather’s were rabbis and his brother became a rabbi.

 

Horus: You then further back further up from his grandfather’s as well it’s quite a long line of rabbis I think. Plus there was that Moses Hess who was a big time in search of inspiration on him as well, who was very self-consciously a jewish think her, right? jewish.

 

Simon: He’s the founder of Georgia nation political zionism what I can do I can’t man what it’s exactly cool but is that a precursor to zionism.

 

Chris: There’s a fair amount of anti-semitism in Marx. I’m struggling to know.

 

Horus: That’s true that’s true like he’s not I don’t think Marx was trying to serve jewish ethnic interests [30:00]. It’s not that he’s of another kind. These are the kind of like that you see in my Trotsky and Barris people like it’s only cliff like yo your Gluckstein. Another other jew that legit then they don’t see themselves as working for, you know, jewish interests.

 

But they are of another strain of the way that jews are kind of corrode, or undermine Western societies like. But they yeah they having the mind I think the genuine idea, they’re pursuing some kind of social justice. But also of a devilish edge to it! Restrained but destruction matters, you know,

 

Chris: A devilish edge!

 

Horus: I think so I think so I might be wrong I might be wrong, but that’s how it seems to me.

 

Simon: There’s an interesting member who by but it is a book called Marx and Satan which is a well worth a read? Okay, so we can eat we kind of got on to the post-modernism and that the whole promotion of degeneracy through culture. Which is kind of a story of your life isn’t it Chris?

 

Chris: Yeah, for sure.

 

Simon: There’s your is that is it through the politics was it the politics that got you into the degeneracy really.

 

Chris: I think, you know, I won’t blame I’m not gonna blame anything on its own. I did make decisions as well and other people went through what I went through and didn’t end up like me. So I was also I have to take some responsibility, of course. But I’m just come at the end of finishing a novel which is its an autobiographical novel. And having now written nearly 200,000 words, when I step back from it and try and work out what it’s about.

 

The sort of major theme is what happens to people who were wrenched from responsibilities, were encouraged to pursue pleasure, we’re told marriage is a bad idea, we’re told families are a bad idea, we’re told to just get out there and have pleasure and accumulate wealth. That’s the story of my life, the failures of that. Without responsibility you have no meaning and my life has been cursed with barbaric meaninglessness!

 

And that I think that will take people to things like drugs, or certainly to things like addiction, whether that’s drugs, or is manifest in whatever way. And I think it’s one of the real failures of the White culture of the last twenty, thirty years. I think the eighties and nineties really screwed a generation, or two, with that kind of emphasis. Emphasis yeah!

 

Simon: I also kind of noticed but in the in that clip that you played is going to some parts of that clip but you were it in who was it Rupert Everett’s who you have an interview with? Um but he introduced use of having, or you say yourself that you’d made him you are a businessman who’d made a million in, …

 

How on earth given given that you’re a commie, a commie drug addict, how does a commie drug this was my question if how does it commie drug-addict become a businessman who makes a million?

 

Chris: It was weird actually obviously, you know, actually it was weird obviously, but I sold drugs for most of my life, because you justify it, because you’re a communist. And this is all black market. And I don’t I’m dealing in a different market place where everyone’s cool and revolutionary. I’d say I’ve told this story a few times. I used to live in a flat above this Irish man. And in my window I had the communist flag from Vietnam. And an Irish paramilitary flag with the bloke with the AK 47 in the balaclava. And I come out one morning and he went to me — I can’t do the accent — he said:

 

“Why did you have those flags in your window?”

 

And in all seriousness I’m so deluded I said to him:

 

“I’m a revolutionary!”

 

And he went:

 

“No, you’re a junkie!”

 

It’s just like, yeah!

 

But I got I so I was selling drugs to pay for my own habits and just to add some money obviously. And then I washed up back at my mother’s house when I was about thirty 31 I think maybe. And, you know, every few years I’d end up back at my mother’s house with, you know, no pot to piss in and nothing going on.

 

And a friend come around my house who I’d known since we were kids. And he just said to me look at this day if you said your yellow you glow in the dark you’re a bright bloke and you’re doing nothing. And he gave me a computer. And I went on and he got me online.

 

And this was dial-up it was really early days no one it was in the industry so I was quite sort of privy to I didn’t have that sort of technological block to get online. And so I got online and started messing around and found a forum and the idea have been out of talk to people all around the world online was just incredible!

 

I never forget the first [35:00] bloke I spoke to who was a steelworker in Illinois and it got me I was crying, because I’d spent the weekend on ecstasy and I was all vulnerable and delicate and he sort of drove a truck to this steel mill and made metal, or something, and yeah this will wholesome life. His childhood sweetheart was pregnant.

 

And I was just sort of disappearing like nine stone Mayor Marva zoth. I found so that forum really struck me. And then may come around the next day and he said what you’ve been doing on the internet. I said well I found a forum and he said well you can have your own forum and I was like alright then let’s do it. And he said what do you want the forum to be about? And I’ve been messing around with a very old lock-picking tool called a bump key. And I said well let’s call it UK Bump Keys. And he said all right and so he’s certainly silly for him up and I put up a few posts about the bump keys I put a few photos of him up. And the next morning I had about 500 members and half of them wanted to buy a bump key off me. And so I was like yeah send a tenner to my mum’s and I’ll send you one.

 

Simon: Wow!

 

Chris: And about six months later I had an online business it was turning over between three and five grand a day!

 

Horus: We can we do another stream where we where we run through the details of that?

 

Chris: I missed a big chunk out there didn’t know my secrets of online entrepreneurship Noble that book that I released soon.

 

Horus: I mean, what the fuck is a bump key? But they will go from there.

 

Chris: Well a bump keys all right. So there’s let’s assume there’s 20 plus 20 brand I’ve always been into lock picking so that’s kind of been in the background all my life. We do helpful for chemists if when the chemist is close you need to help yourself.

 

Horus: Oh I see right,

 

Chris: Let’s assume there’s 20 brands of locks in England yeah always the one most people know. But there’s GG there’s ledge there’s vir oh there’s Chavo. I could give you 20 off the top me it. But let’s us use 20. They all have a blank key that will fit most of the ones in that brand, unless lights, or variations so a 1A Yale key is gonna fit probably about a million 1A Yale locks yeah. The blank key will go in it won’t open it but it will go in it, because it’s the same profile that’s a Yale 1A.

 

Now there’s a pattern called a bump pattern that you can cut onto that key and then, if you put that into any of those million Yale locks, space it correctly, get the right spacing, give it a little tap on the back with — originally it used to be a top in the handle of a screwdriver, but now you can get bump hammers. Give it a little tap it’s gonna open that lock. So one bump key will now open 500,000 locks. So for locksmiths this is a an absolute boon!

 

Horus: Right.

 

Simon: No I got it cheap at ten pounds oh so, you know, oh yeah I can see the potential in purchasing that,

 

Chris: Yeah, I mean, the thing is, I mean, the business is now nearly twenty years old and now there’s loads of stuff. I still work there. I’m not the sole owner anymore, because my head dick jinkin can come back and screw everything up from time to time. But, you know, there’s we have a good relationship with the police and the police I don’t have an issue with lock-picking tools, because they kind of the wrong the wrong tools for the job.

 

If you’re gonna rob a property you’re not worried about non-destructive entry, which is what lock-picking provides. But there’s a payoff, you know, a set of lock picks you might be down in front of that door for a for now, or trying to individually pick those pins even with a bump key you’ve got to know the lock, you’ve got to know what variation it is. And you if you’re not prepared that you could be hittin that key for 30-40 minutes.

 

Whereas if you’re a thief a brick through the windows, or foot through the doors far far, you know, you don’t, you know, you’re not looking to not destroy the lock. You’re not looking for non-destructive entry. And you don’t wanna sacrifice time. So they’re not the police we have a good relationship with the police. But we also sell to the police, we sell to fire stations, we sell the Ministry of Defense, we sell to private investigators, and all sorts.

 

Simon: So okay I’m Nick this is getting really interesting. I was going to talk about politics thing, but this is momentum. So you did all this and then you got into I mean, one of the things that impresses me about your stream is, I mean, I need to prepare my stuff I. You just sit there and talk confidently about any old thing is its amazing.

 

Chris: So I meant that the trick is not to prepare anything! That’s the I never prepare anything! I might occasionally get a little video if someone sends me something interesting throughout the day. But I’ve met but I [40:00] used to do stand-up I was a stand-up comment for 10 years. I never prepared anything for that either well this is.

 

Simon: How do you get into stand-up? You it’s communism drugs, a lock picking business, and stand-up! It seems an odd collection of, …

 

Chris: Well I’ve got to say the lock-picking business did not stay at that, sort of money, because what happen was it was very early days of the internet. So there was a lot of things working for me no one else was really online. And I mean, that mimei and me I knew no one else who was online. Not even libraries were online this is our fireback ongoing so I was in a very I mean, there were people online. But it wasn’t like yesterday and so I was in a very lucky position where you could capitalize on things no one else had. But then you suddenly five years later everyone’s online there’s another 20 lock-picking shop so I didn’t have to deal with when I started. Then ebay. Then Amazon

 

And so, you know, and then, of course, in those early days it was just me now there’s like I say I don’t own the company outright anymore there’s half a dozen full-time staff half a dozen part-time staff consultants marking consultants SEO agents bookkeepers account and it goes on. So the glory days didn’t last for long but, you know, it’s still a healthy business it employs a lot of people and that’s their jobs.

 

But what happened was, because of that business I mean, I’ve been to about ten rehab centers before that business and none of them weren’t even touch the size of that. I don’t think I was ready to stop to be honest with you I had nothing going on in my life. I was living over mums. For someone with two degrees to never have worked and to be just doing nothing was quite sad. And so when I turned up at a rehab center I am answering your question, by the way, it’s just a bit of a weird way again. So turn up a rehab center and then say to you right we’re gonna get you clean and then when you leave here you’re gonna be living at your mum’s signing on to the dole. It’s not that appealing. If you think well hang on it sounds to me the only thing I’m doing is taking the something out of my life that gives me any pleasure.

 

So when I set the business up and the business started doing well, I started, you know, my bank account was going ridiculous and throughout my using in my 20s I always said as most junkies do if only I had access to the drugs I need I could just get on with my life it’s all this running around the Estates all the police hassle that’s what that’s what’s ruining my life! Never the drugs! Is never the drugs! When you’re an addict it’s always outside forces that’s how you recognize it. So suddenly I add like half a kilo of heroin I can remember I used to hold the door open with it. I add about a kilo of skunks in there. I have 50,000 valium that we were bringing in from Thailand so I had all the drugs I could want! Literally all the drugs like one.

 

And, of course, my life went down hill, or I’d wake up in the chair I fell asleep in there was about two litre bottles of urine surrounding the chair. I just didn’t do anything. I just sat there. I only ate if someone brought me something. I was just disappearing.

 

And the girlfriend at the time said look you’ve got money now you don’t have to go to one of these shocking NHS detox facilities why don’t you spend a bit of money and go somewhere off this and then come out and you’ve got a job! You’ve got a business you could go on holiday you could live your life. And for the first time in sort of 15 years using I thought well hang on she’s got a very good point there.

 

So I went to rehab. I thought I really fall and really fall I sort of I don’t do well being told what to do. But at some point during that rehab center. I just put me hands up when all right go on I’m gonna do whatever you say. And I got clean! I got clean for the first time ever! And they told me to hang around for about another six weeks, because they don’t, you know, it’s not a good idea to be turfed out on the street as soon as you’re clean. So I was desperate to leave. I hated the place I hate institutions.

 

But, you know, like I said I’d put me hands up and said I’ll do I’m told. And during that six weeks a they put me through a lot of therapy group therapy about what you’re gonna do when you get out. Because when you’ve been out you’re nut twenty-four seven, suddenly 24 hours a day is a lot of time! And when you’ve spent your time out of your mind you’re not gonna be sleeping properly for about another year, you know, you’re gonna be getting about two, or three hours a night.

 

And so you’ll be waking up before the sun comes up, just sitting there going out of you’re nut with boredom and frustration. So they do a lot of work on you about how you’re gonna feel your day. And one of the things they talked about was what sort of skills you’ve got and how you might be able to use those to fill up some of your time.

 

 

And so they get you in a group and they ask the group they go around the groups and walk what’s Chris good at? Was what’s Chrissy strongpoints? And everyone was saying telling jokes. Telling stories. Public speaking, all that sort of stuff. And so when they come back to me I said [45:00] well I’ve always quite fancied being a comedian. And they all just went that this is it this is the one obviously! This is perfect for you!

 

And then it was quite funny actually one of the therapists if all alright let’s assume we get you a gig next week. Wash your washer first joke? And I said to him, I said well it’s not really jokes my stuff, it’s stories. But I did once have sex with a disabled girl on acid, and I think there’s a few laughs there! And, of course, they all laughed, for the wrong reasons!

 

But weirdly enough that was the first story I told as a stand-up comic, and it was the last story I told as a stand-up comic! So it was actually a good story, but that’s how I got into stand-up it was a question of getting clean and needed to fill time.

 

Horus: It was the first and last story told by pure coincidence?

 

Chris: Yeah well obviously I didn’t start on think I know ten years later. Sorry but I made yeah. Just by coming to this and I only realised myself a couple of months after I finished.

 

Horus: Beautifully executed plan up movie!

 

Chris: Palin joint career.

 

Simon: Okay, so from there how did you get to nationalism, because Paul Rimmer’s in the chat oh I need to email Paul probably. Rimmel is saying um nationalism is getting very avant-garde today, which I suppose it is. So oK you’ve got all this background, so how did you get it you’re one of us now.

 

Chris: Well I think historically most radically political movements require weirdos, outliers, and freaks to form. I mean, it’s I think I’m kind of perhaps clear more clearly a weirdo in a freak but, you know, even Mark [Collett] even yourselves, even Laura [Towler], On the Offensive, Dan, you know, we’re almost the people that haven’t fitted in other groups, or got turfed out of other groups. I think political movements do they, I think the core of a political movement is comprised of outliers, and people who aren’t satisfied with what’s previously been on offer.

 

But to answer your question, because that’s a slightly different point. To answer your question so I the communism was just like an identity thing after that I had the flags Ram of Rome. I’d the little Soviet submarine on the lapel. But I wasn’t in any way politically active! And of course, at this point, now I’m running an online business. I’m studying online marketing, because I want to do a bit more of that in the business. So I’m not a communist! I’ve not anywhere near a communist! I am out-and-out capitalist! And then so it wasn’t I still said I was a good way getting a bit of attention occasionally the girls like it, you know, they think it’s Romantic and it’s sexy. And that I can I prove that many times!

 

But um a friend come so I wasn’t really politically active at all. But I was finding a lot of my previous ideas to do the French thinkers wasn’t really holding up it started feeling a little bit sort of airy-fairy. Sort poetic and not really anything to do the real world. And there was a kind of catastrophe going on there with me, because look what is this stuff for? Is this just for sitting around going oh you’re right language is terribly contradictory Tarquin! But not actually doing anything with it.

 

And then a friend turned up very good friend of comedian Trevor Locke. And he said to me one day when do you know what an Social Justice Warrior is? And this was about 2015. And I was like no I don’t. And he said I’ll send you some links. And so he sent me some links usual suspects, Gamergate kind of stuff that what was that what did they call them at the time? They’re the cynic what was it called gripstic. Yeah we talked about this the other men armored skeptics chew on it, or listen to these people they’re out there but, you know, yes but an entry point of Sargon obviously. Which I think has been an entry point for plenty of people.

 

Got into that and it was lovely, because I had feminism rammed down my throat! And I went I walked round one of my art colleges with potential rapists written on my forehead on the back of being talked old about. I mean, no big deal but I was only 22 it seemed quite cool at the time.

 

But to actually hear other people having massive problems of feminism, then multiculturalism, then diversity, inclusion. So I just followed that followed that followed that and, you know, five years later Here I am! In a pursuit for truth as well! I didn’t see coming on the horizon for how do I get there I just followed followed the honestly.

 

Horus: And I know Simon I know we’re coming towards, or the trial point of a thing, but I just wanted to [50:00] ask briefly danger killed what how company on pen is that was that an accident, or is that you particularly like on pen?

 

Chris: I was living in Soho. I was paying a fortune for rent for a tiny little place. I realized I have got no family and no children. It was quite weird actually it was one Christmas I remember looking around my bed sit and thinking he you’re 44 where’s where’s your family? What is this Christmas? What you hear on YouTube again?

 

And I just saw I need to make some changes I’ve got to get out I’ve got to get out Soho. I didn’t want to live somewhere in England that wasn’t going to keep me interested, because if I’m not if I haven’t got things to engage me I know what happens to me. And it’s not good. And so really I mean, it was financial mainly, because my money were four times as much out here, but I’m also old, you know, I’m also I’m also nearly 50. And I just thought I can’t be doing with these winters. I’m gonna go I’m gonna move out to Asia.

 

Horus: I got arthritis in my foot and I’ve spent a bit of time in Southeast Asia and my arthritis doesn’t bother me.

 

Chris: Out there no I am completely a different person physically it’s this is just a fact isn’t it.

 

Horus: Oh just got crimes one more question as well Simon just.

 

Simon: Okay go on then.

 

Horus: We mentioned living Marxism earlier and obviously that was a product of what grew out of the RCP?

 

Chris: Yeah.

 

Horus: And which was Brendan O’Neal’s group Frank Brady Claire Fox another is right. Just about them, you know, because they hated bother though I think I was left is from they are hated by the left, because they’re like super contrary leftists.

 

Do you think that the point in doing that is that they believe that the rest of the radical left has forgotten about the importance of class war, or neglected class? And they were actually trying to get everyone to stop focusing on gender, and all these other things that they see as distractions and just refocus on being a class movement? Or do you think that spiders are actually not leftists anymore?

 

Chris: I don’t think they left us anymore.

 

Horus: What do you feel they are?

 

Chris: I think that they still have a lot of time for a lot of the stuff they used to read. Something strange is what you do fed me that and I’m gonna throw it back to you sewing strange. But I don’t think I don’t they’re certainly not Marxist Leninist which they somewhere once. I don’t know I read I know a lot of people don’t like Brendan O’Neill but he’s kind of it kind of gets accepted into the media and he called does call some problems there,

 

Horus: But he’s right.

 

Chris: And he must know he must know that he’s keeping his mouth shut he must, or is that just a delusion of what you think is that just what you think, because when you think something.

 

Horus: I don’t know all right maybe we can’t answer that.

 

Simon: You see I suspect that he’s a bad actor, you know, I don’t.

 

Horus: They take money from the Koch brothers.

 

Simon: Yeah the name spiked, what happens what happens when you spike a drink.

 

Chris: You’re so suspicious!

 

Simon: I mean, I published books on the conspiracy theory.

 

Chris: There you go, there you go!

 

Simon: So I try I try not to go too far down! I try to maintain some kind of sensibleness. But yeah, um I’m cases of them as well. Yeah I’m very, very, very suspicious.

 

Chris: I think the likes of Brandon O’Neil would struggle where he took money from I’ll just tell you that mark the Soviet Revolution was funded by JP Morgan, or something. And this is standard service for him. Yeah.

 

Simon: Okay well this has been a kind of longer introduction to work kind of where I wanted to get to really. Which was we’re talking about what was the title again I can’t remember yeah keeping them keeping your political projects on point with Dangerfield! Keep keeping a keeping a livestream on point with age if they do you feel should be the title really.

 

But the other day, or we’ve been recently talking about things like optics. It’s kind of very interesting that somebody with your past would have problems with optics. And I suppose that Horus can lay out his position. And this is you’ve I’ve hinted at my slyly suspicious conspiratorial views of not really trusting anybody. But I think that I think there are bad actors moving society and they’ve got to be rooted out. I think we’ve got a false version of a great deal of the history [55:01] which provides which unless we speak about it honestly is always going to be a handicap to people realizing who they are.

 

I don’t really think the Germans are the enemy. We’ll get onto that later and the picture that I put up on the street is the screen now the picture up on the screen of this bulldog spitfire nationalism with our patriotism and nationalism is trapped in something that’s taking us nowhere. And is built on a lie. I don’t know if you’ve got anything else to add to that Horus?

 

Horus: Well I think that’s true. Although I think we and other forces are diminishing that facts. Like I mean, bulldog patriotism is not what it was 20, or 30 years ago. I think most people even on the right would have a bit of a smirk if they speak about it, you know. So I think and like ya thought in my I’m over the last since that summer has been to were to try and a sort of tunnel under it or, you know, put a bomb in the middle of it.

 

Because I think it’s in the way, and it’s a problem. But yeah, I mean, it does it well the idea of the war anyway. And the idea of church it was the greatest Britain ever on that still has quite a significant hold on people.

 

And as I pointed out to someone else the other day, or was even this show last week, that the person who, you know, the BBC poll with where Churchill was voted Great Britain ever. That was argue for his advocate was my moment who was obviously part of Blair’s government. So it has a hold on the center and center-left as well. And it works for them, it doesn’t work for us.

 

Simon: Yeah and okay Dangerfield this involves people like Horus and I sometimes appearing to speak favorably of a certain Austrian painter. And I think in many respects this was the point where you were upset about this for a moment and came back. I don’t know. This is not a coherent question.

 

But can I have your thoughts on why that happened? What do you think about Horrors at horses in my position? And where this might fit into PA and the optics that we’re trying to get together?

 

Chris: Okay!

 

Simon: I was gonna get to this.

 

Chris: Talking about being suspicious. When you mention bad actors who need weeding out. I thought to expose me! This is sure this is gonna be my downfall! What a Monday night! Well.

 

Horus: I’ll just say one thing that thanks for I would have been dismayed if we lost you that would have been terrible I think you’re yeah I mean,

 

Simon: We were quite surprised strongly in favor and what one of the reasons why Horus and I said immediately let’s invite him on as soon as possible. That would this was our solution.

 

Chris: So that’s very kind! The honest with you I was shocked about how many people gave a shit and the depth of their shit giving! I really was I didn’t, you know, I know that a lot of people don’t like me anywhere near this movement.

 

When Morgoth called me out on his stream I was inundated with abuse from nationalists, telling me that lot of things saying things like don’t know how you ended up in our circles anyway you bleep bleep bleep, you know, wave upon wave of abuse.

 

So it did it I was good, you know, it was a nice surprise actually for people to consider me relevant. But so there’s two questions that you kind of put two questions to me. The first one is how I if I forgot you right how would someone with my past be able to question optics in such a movement? But I actually think that my past is one of the strengths of my channel.

 

Because when I are, you know, I grew up in a working-class town and everyone took drugs from about age fourteen! Everyone just took drugs! I’ve lost so many friends to drugs! And it that includes alcohol. Most to alcohol. The ones I haven’t lost to alcohol by dying you in prison for domestic violence, car crashes, whatever, you know, the sort of 30, or 40 people I could probably think of the top my head. And, you know, that the last 30 years in the UK working-class people have been promoted to take drugs! It’s part of the youth culture, probably like never before. I certainly think more than the 60s.

 

My mom says my mom’s got like a Baudrillard comment about the 60 she says it never happened, you know, she said there’s probably about 20 hippies somewhere that happened to turn up where the film crews were but no one else knew them. But my experience of growing up in working-class communities and what I’ve heard from and seen of them as I’ve got older is this carries on. So many [60:02] people on my channel we email me I’m currently getting about 30 a day. Every stream I sail so if you’re gonna email me keep it short. I just been it. But I’d say I get about five a day at the moment from people saying I’m so glad you talked about drugs. I’m so glad that you haven’t hidden this, because I feel that I can’t be a nationalist, because I smoke weed, or I can’t be in nationalist, because occasionally I do got appeals with the missus.

 

And all this sort of thing and I think so many people have put off by I think the phrase is “purity spiralling” before I forgot the meaning of that right. That you can’t have done anything ever in your life you kind of made any mistakes. And if you go near an eighth of skunk you’re not allowed in this club. And I think lots of people find it quite refreshing that actually this person is humor and he’s made mistakes he’s got a past. But he still can look at collectivizing and red pill in White working-class communities.

 

Which is how where I see my role in this. Motivating the collective eyes and the people I’ve been talking about neighborhood watch teams. I’ve been talking about having local barbecues, using scare halls, you know, very basic quite boring on the ground level stuff. So that’s the easy part of the question is the answer.

 

The Austrian painter business. This is Furcal Ave this isn’t just me, you know,

 

Simon: I know we know this is kind of widespread.

 

Chris: Well it’s a probably nearly nearly five hundred, six hundred thousand subscribers worth of YouTube content creators. Big ones that you all know who don’t want to put their head above the parapet, because you get swooped down on like I did. It was like leaving Scientology. But they don’t want to mention it.

 

But you all know them. Most of you probably watch these people. They don’t know how to approach it. They don’t know how to talk about it. But the main point is very little is gained by these things! Very little is gained by Mark [Collett] saying his favorite three books. Very little is gained from any of this stuff. But we sacrifice a hell of a lot.

 

Again going back to the emails. I know it’s kind of anecdotal but it’s daily. Every day a handful of emails I’m desperate to get on board I’m disgusted what’s happening in our country, but I cannot sign up to Nazism. I cannot sign up so the Austrian painter! I don’t want anything to do with it!

 

The British his video the other day. Absolute nonsense! Madness from start to finish. But there was a 10-second bit where I couldn’t argue with him. And it was that stuff. So I my bottom line is I don’t think anything is gained from it, and I think loads is sacrificed. And once this movement becomes big enough to start engaging the media, that is gonna drag us down, and potentially cause the movement to fail.

 

Simon: I think both Horus and I take your points completely onboard. I think that the I think what is to be gained about my tell you my view is if I couldn’t study research what I research, I’m not a Nazi, I don’t think I don’t think it’s I don’t think it’s feasible in 2020, to relive the politics of the 1930s. I think they’re very time specific but trying to break down the web of lies that have been built around you okay let’s I mean, if the channel gets into trouble for saying hitless then so be it.

 

But there’s a whole whole web of lies about the causes of the Second World War. Churchill is our greatest hero. Hitler is the most evil man in history. And then a particular event that took place in prison camps in concentration camps is the thing that White people have to be guilty of for the rest of the rest of history! Somehow picking away at that myth, at parts of that myth I think is incredibly important.

 

Because as long as it remains, we will never be able to be free, because Churchill will be rammed in our faces! And the historical event will be rammed in our faces! And will be forced to be guilty again and we won’t be allowed to collectivize. And that will be the reason behind it.

 

Chris: Well I it’s reassuring to see a hell of a hell of a lot of your chat agree with me. See it as they’re probably your viewers. I don’t recognize those names. But I agree with what you just said. I’m aware of what happened down in those times mainly from what I’ve learned from Horus, and gone off and looked into afterwards.

 

But that [65:01] trying to try to involve that retelling of that story at the moment, I just think is crazy! That that can come a long way down the line. At the moment it’s I just think it makes us vulnerable. I just I to try and make that part of the same project of collectivizing, I think his is a terrible strategy! I just think it’s we can do this once you’ve got people collectivizing, once we become powerful, once we’ve got people going to regular meetings, this stuff can be aired, this stuff can be discussed! This stuff can be debated, no problem!

 

But it doesn’t it pretty much defines us at the moment. When anyone outside of this movement refers to Patriotic Alternative, the next word is Nazis! And we didn’t need to do that. It isn’t helping us and we did not need to do that!

 

Simon: Horus?

 

Horus: Yeah, I think so too. It can only make things more difficult. What it’s a way of tried to sort of I don’t know about connects all things up in my mind it’s just that what see a lot of people who are on the more fascist end they’re likely in their own beliefs are saying we’re going to be called Nazis wherever we do. That is absolutely true. On the other end I’m not sure that those people are accounting for the many of us who just aren’t fascists. Like we just we know there’s not the system which want to create. And also black we’re not I mean, a lot of us I mean, in my case. I’ve made this series of revisionist videos.

 

My aim is to what there’s several things coming once when my aim said the war was a disaster for Britain, you know, for Europe in general. For the West. It’s not to say in my case the Hitler did nothing wrong, because that, because I don’t believe that. And I don’t believe and mine is not to make people believe that and to convince people that actually we should’ve I don’t know exactly what people on the Nazi sort of fascist tender saying are they actually say that we should have National Socialism in Britain? I don’t think we should have anything from the 30s, because that’s the past, right? What we should have is a system that broadly in my opinion that broadly continued our way of life, other than what the traitors and Marxists and leftists have done to us.

 

Well I like Britain fundamentally. I just think it’s been taken over by awful people. So I don’t have any sort of particularly admiring ideas about the NSDAP, or anything like that. They were sort of just what came in Germany. They said they would saw, you know, cometh the hour cometh the man in Germany and that time. It’s not really that relevant. What I do like the swastika! I will always say that! [chuckling] both what I think we’ve got to sort of address.

 

I don’t really have the answers this week, or address why well I guess this is a question for people like the fascist end of a movement why are you so admiring of it? But maybe this will begin to help the rest of us deal with it, you know? What I will say though is to those on the outside who and not nationalists that’s all and who come at us with the Nazi angle. I would just say some look right. I said this last week when Dan was on. What I don’t want and I’m not looking to create a National Socialist system. I don’t know whether Mark is, right?

 

I haven’t at least poked him that, but mark is right on the question that matters most. Should our people be destroyed? Should we become subjugated by foreigners in our land? And he’s, in fact, correct on that! And that’s why I share with him. And that’s why I’m in the same movement as him! And I guess this might sound a bit traitorous to say, but a lot if there was an if 50% of the country was already nationalists, as who may implicitly be, but obviously not overtly. Maybe I wouldn’t be in the same way but. Maybe I’ll be in the same movement as people we were just nationalists but more liberal, or more traditionally British, you know, I don’t know!

 

But as it stands right we’re fighting to get people to care about the existence of the nation. And I’m very happy to be on the same side as the fascists, and the Nazis, in that sense, right? Because what, because this is the question of this is the number one pressing question.

 

I’m sorry I’m not really saying if you’re very clear. It’s such a complicated thing to try and deal with. But I just think as it stands I’m absolutely on the same side as Mark, because, you know, and all the people we were sort of admirers of Hitler, and so on, because our very existence is the pressing question!

 

Simon: My position is slightly different from Horus’s I think. Horus looks at the historical events. What I do is I kind of read what the thinkers of the various I [70:02] call them various kinds of nationalism. And okay let’s have the obligatory mention of Jose Antonio primo de Rivera, for this stream! Chris, in case you don’t know this, this is something we do every week!

 

Chris: I know!

 

Simon: Yeah okay you do know. Okay he’s been mentioned now. But like I’ve read reason about a moseley now a reason about of Jose Antonio. I mentioned yesterday in a video made I made that I tweeted outs the NSDAP. 25 points.

 

Well if you look at all these nationalisms you find how milquetoast and how relatively moderate a lot of the proposals are. And the reason why I think they’re useful to read and obviously not for everyone. Not everybody is like me. But the fact that I’m interested in reading these texts is very much like the Left. The Left can quote marks can quote Trotsky can quote Lenin despite the terrible things they’ve done. And although the modern left bears very little relation to the people that wrote those formative texts. The last example of nationalisms really is 1920s, and 1930s.

 

And reading them and understanding what people say said at the time and realizing that there were various, very similar, but quite different movements in lots of different countries I’ve actually not got round to look looking at Hitler yet. But it’s all along a similar lines along similar lines. In order to understand the world we’re living in now and formulate a modern a modern point of view, because obviously since 1945 the world has changed a great deal we’ve got immigration to face with now the whole sexual revolution women’s liberation. There’s lots and lots of things that make it completely different.

 

But a lot of those ticks are relevant. They help youth, or certainly help me focus on the points at hand. And look at the look at the modern situation in a new light. I think that’s what they’re for they’re obviously not for the whole public. I don’t know.

 

Chris: Well look the thing is I agree with you! Look how could I weave all my railing against the mainstream media, say don’t read those books, because the mainstream media said they’re evil! What why would I suddenly trust them now?

 

Of course, give those books who read mine can’t give it a read! David Dukes biography give it read! It, of course, I get that! However, this isn’t just about truth. This is has to involve marketing. And we have to play by their rules. And if I was marketing a movement like PA and I was sending out an email 100,000 people, front and foremost, wouldn’t be the interest in Nazism! Because it does it’s terrible! It doesn’t look good!

 

Those debates that that interest that nolley can come later. It puts people off and when you talk about the Left and they can where they’re Che Guevara T-shirt some wave their hammer and sickles I think luckily that turns a majority of people off them too. They look at them and think I don’t anything to do all that comment nonsense. In much the same way as it does us.

 

And I’ll tell you now if a movement formed tomorrow that was identical to PA in terms of policy in terms of wishes and requirements but didn’t have any of that stuff. I reckon three-quarters if not more people would migrate over that day.

 

Horus: Yeah it does seem to go against marketing sense to show admiration for the NSDAP, and so on, right? And yeah it doesn’t really gain us anything. I mean, it shows fidelity among a small section of the movement for their own ideas.

 

Chris: And those people they’re not going to come to us sorry to interrupt you but they’re not going to come to us and say well I like everything you say, but I’m a bit dubious about this. Can we sit down for two hours and you can explain it all to me? They’re not going to give you that chance. They just in think all fuck that I’ve got a job and I’ve got a family if this gets out that I’m fraternizing with these I’m in big trouble!

 

You know, when I spoke to Mark. When I sort of rather flippantly said I’ll be separating my tenuous link. I didn’t think I was that significant. I wasn’t trying to be blase. But I honestly didn’t. But he explained it to him it took about 80, 90 minutes. And this is someone talking to someone like me who’s very open, who doesn’t trust the media, who’s very up for understanding. And we haven’t got the luxury of that 90 minute talk with everyone we’re trying to recruit recruit.

 

If the media wanted to put a five-minute montage together to crush us, they could [75:02] probably put five minutes of pro narts ISM just from start to finish, and it would look awful. Whereas if you took all that stuff out they couldn’t. It would be people saying things about loving their people respecting nations the world over one in one in National Agency for All Nations they’d struggled to find negativity. But at the moment that there they’ll have to chop 90 minutes down to five.

 

Horus: Well old ass didn’t know you’d like that well that makes me think of his then say right how do how do you take PA forward, because what’s I mean, Mark is the leader right. Say the king this sounds horrible but like say if you carry on and at some point Mark ceases to be the leader, you know, for the sake of some sort of what marketing successful electoral success right. But you’re not going to expel him from the movement, right?

 

And so they’re just gonna say prominent PA member, or prominent PA activist, Mark Collett, or other people. They’re going to be able to name them. So I mean, and we’re not gonna do that we’re not going to exclude all the people who are sympathetic to fascism from the movement. So how’d it so well so we have to go forward in a quite a combative way anyway as far as I can see.

 

Chris: I think political movements. I think PA is very, very early days, you know, it said what’s who two conferences. It’s barely germinated from the seed. It might just be the seed even. Not even a plant yet let alone a tree. So it’s very early days. And I think movements move forward, dialectically I think the debates are ongoing their continual and as they get resolved so the movement moves forward.

 

And I think look as I said, at the beginning this the amount of people and prominent people we’ve got major issues with this stuff, who are starting to say, you know, I’m thinking of pulling back, or I’m gonna say something, or this, or whatever. I think this is important. I think that everyone involved should be humble enough to take it on and put the movement first. And I think it’s actually through that natural kind of dialectic movement it will get sorted out.

 

Simon: Well I mean, this is it really about this I’m very much welcomed. I didn’t welcome when you said you were leavings but I welcome the fact that you brought the subject out into the open, because it’s definitely something that needs to be talked talked about.

 

And I’ll repeat once again I have third position. I think I suppose I’m not on a conventional left and what left and right continuum. And strangely some of my old socialist beliefs fit into that third position quite well. But that doesn’t mean all of the stuff surrounding the Second World War that doesn’t mean it applies to me. It’s purely political theory. But the fact that we’re talking about this and recognizing that there are this is a broad church.

 

And there are many, many different points of view points of view within this group that is foreign forming at the moment. And what unites us is principally the demographic challenge on Western Europe! That’s the uniting point and that’s the point we really need to get behind. But at the same time we need to knock out some of these ideological points, even if any kind of power any kind of real political success is a long way away, because we need to sort out a standard line to take.

 

Chris: You know, I didn’t actually say at the time I don’t think but the reason I made that was going to make that video we’re in the description I said I will be explaining why I am cutting my tenuous links with PA, was, because I sat down and I thought, you know, first of all I thought about the reality of being a nationalist, you know, Woes made an interest in video I think it went up yesterday. Where he was saying, you know, he was just considering the likelihood of being assassinated. And he’s putting it right out there, but who knows what happens? Worse things have happened and less bad things have happened to political groups in the past.

 

And I was thinking those sorts of things. I was thinking what are my actual responsibilities? What am I taking, or moving forward in the twilight of my life now that might affect me? And I spent a good few days really trying to think of that and reading stuff that was relevant. And I thought, you know what the meaning, the meaning this movement has given to me through the responsibility is worth that. And in how would me and it made me feel like a man. And it made me feel mature and I was alright with that. But then the next bit [80:00] was what happens if let’s say for instance next week this community gets a media sort of expose, and then I’m associated with Nazism for the rest of my days?

 

And what am I going to have to make a video ago I didn’t know! I didn’t know that there was about Nazism! I didn’t know that the leader was into Hitler! I didn’t know! And that wouldn’t be believed! And so I wanted to make that point clear, before the event, because you can’t disavow afterwards, because it’s weak. It’s always obviously you’re just when you’ve been caught out you saw like oh I’m sorry I didn’t know.

 

So that’s why I wanted to make that point and I’m, you know, I’m kind of glad we’ve talked about this now again, because hopefully I’ve made that point clear. I don’t want anything to do with it. I don’t think it helps at the moment.

 

Simon: Horus?

 

Horus: I don’t know I’m just I’m thinking as we go along. This is so odd to actually know what’s right, because we’re not just talking about an optics debate are we? Like, because that that seems to tear apart the American alright. If we if it is just an optics debate, I think if both sides are right. As in we can’t join the Left and the centre and the traitor right in saying we’re gonna disavow all fascists, or anyone who’s sympathetic with Nazism, whatever.

 

On the other end obviously everyone who does work with fascists and Nazis at all just has a much harder task than what they’d have otherwise right. So obviously both sides are writing that and it is irresolvable as far as I can tell. But we’re also talking about well the thing is right in terms of what we actually believe it’s just I don’t give a crap that that Mark likes Hitler! Because I’m convinced that he likes he thinks it’s good for our people, right?

 

And the core thing there is that he cares what’s good for our people, right? So that doesn’t bother me. So for me I guess I am just talking about, you know how we can win how we can succeed. And that, of course, the thing that we’re all very concerned about if I understand correctly is that we’re just going to struggle to convince people like our families our friends their families their friends, and so on, so join us in this movement, because they’re going to be so alarmed at who we’re working with, right?

 

Is that what is that mainly what we try to resolve here? That we’re not gonna be able to convert, you know, more than a small percentage of people would you would, you know, that’s the main problem?

 

Chris: Horus for years always part of Narcotics Anonymous right. And why don’t it not quite yet Anonymous is an offshoot of Alcoholics Anonymous where all the literature was written in 1950s, Bible Belt America. And it’s riddled with God, you know, it’s a 12-step program. And twelve of seven of the 12 steps mentioned God.

 

And the problem I had with that when I was in NA was when you bring newcomers to NA people who are desperate for help and they’re all that they run a mile! And even according to Narcotics Anonymous is own research and something like 90% of people leave, because they’re not interested in that.

 

I used to go into Wormwood Scrubs and do NA meetings with the convicts, wherever you want to call them. And the prisoners. And, you know, that stuff they just laughter they laughed that. And at the end of a meet in every one holds hands you say a prayer. And they just laugh it I used to have to pick people up from probation centers and walk them to meetings.

 

And on the way I’d be like listen you can get clean it without a doubt, but they’re gonna mention God a lot. And these kids who’ve grown up in broken homes, or the mud will give them their first error in injection when they were 10 they just like what, you know, they don’t want to know. Now what I used to say was I get that you need a higher power I get that it doesn’t have to be a Christian God. But that should be saved for a lot later, you know, once people get used to trusting humans which is the first problem that we can start talking to them later about them having faith in something bigger than them.

 

And it’s much the same with all of this. You know, when I’m talking to people who have shown an interest people who know my channel from the stories and they say to me I mean, like all this nationalism stuff and I just they say what videos can you recommend? And I’m thinking right what ones aren’t gonna mention any of that stuff, because much like the god stuff in NA it will repel them they don’t want to be associated with that. They can’t defend it amongst their friends. Five, or six years down the line they might be able to when they’ve at the time and they’ve been around people and they’ve read the books, or whatever.

 

I’m not saying that anyone’s wrong about this stuff. I’m just saying in terms of the basics such as how we appear in the media, how the media will represent us, and how newcomers will be repelled, it’s a massive negative. And at this and at this stage I can’t see what we [85:00] benefit from it.

 

Horus: I do agree. I do agree.

 

Simon: Yeah yes very marketing isn’t it?

 

Horus: Um what I would say is that oh well I mean, say saying you’ve had you had gone ahead with what you were gonna say last week and you did, you know, cut your losses hires whatever it was the plan. You would still have a broader nationalist movement?

 

Chris: Yeah for sure. For sure. I mean, I’ve kind of shaped moved anyway I’m focusing on collectivization, that’s where I’m going at the moment that’s what I think, you know, considered quite boring street-level stuff. I’m really into what Gavin boab is doing as well I think I all.

 

Horus: Hail Gavin Boby!

 

Simon: He’ll go in moment going Boby Boby Boby Gavin Boby he was gonna be on this week but Gavin Boby is also concerned about some of the things that I’ve spoken about in the past, you know, because, you know, doesn’t want to come on the show.

 

Chris: There you go, you know, you know what I’ll have a word of him. But, you know what based on the patron he got off the back of the stream with me he can now boss one bust one mosque a month! And he has an 80% success rate.

 

Simon: Yes I know I’ve interviewed Gavin twice. I’d yeah really like Gavin. But yeah, he’s concerned about certain certain things.

 

Chris: What could it be? What are you talking about?

 

Simon: No it was actually the it was actually my when I came out on the JQ. I don’t know if I’ll go over this again. But when you break through this, or certainly in my case as a result of my conversation with Brian of London. Yeah I did suffer from JQ derangement syndrome for a short! While so you can find some rather unfortunate, unmeasured, not very well thought out comments, from me around that time. That doesn’t mean that’s what I believe, I think.

 

Once you as you as there as you go through the process the your opinions become a lot more moderate and a lot more balanced. It simply isn’t the fact, it’s not the jews everywhere! It’s much it’s much more complex than that, I can say this openly. But he was worried about what I might have said a couple of years ago.

 

Chris: Sorry go on Horus.

 

Horus: I’m just gonna say that the fact that Kevin’s not keen to come on with us that says something about what we’re doing. Because we are like, you know, we’re the Nazis to some people. And I don’t, you know, know I know that I’m not, you know, but I we’re still over the line, you know, I mean, over the line, you know, there’s a line for affirmation for a lot of people. We’re over it we were unacceptable even to Gavin who’s against Islam.

 

Simon: Yeah.

 

Chris: And Gavin Gavin is quite amazing he has some very interesting thoughts on the breakdown of the welfare state the NHS dole money and the ghettoization of immigrant communities. He’s got some really interesting and very White pilling stuff to talk about actually. I’ve got a lot of time for Gabby.

 

Simon: Yeah.

 

Horus: Everyone listening sugar should watch Chris’s recent chat with Katherine and take some that a chatroom.

 

Chris: Yeah I’d actually say Jake sees one’s better, because we kind of focus on the most busted stuff which I think has been, you know, he’s got been through the mill a few times out there, but when he talks to Jake’s and lot i.e., that he really goes into that stuff.

 

And I mean, I don’t want to go to off topic but I’m interest no saw there’s mud there’s multiple things going on. There’s a sort of political cultural changes of things up PA, but also social kind of change is going on. And, you know, many different things happening which actually look quite promising for us.

 

Simon: You know, one of the reasons why I want to speak to him again is you were you have heard the Nick Griffin interview? But it seems to me that I could have I could have taken advantage of Gavin Boby’s theories, because in the second of my interviews with him what in 2017 he was just beginning to formulate some of those ideas.

 

And I think they’re a great counter-argument to make Griffin’s kind of hopeless message about when society starts breaking down, all White people are lost. Because I think the ethnic groups aren’t a homogenous homogeneous group and society will break down in very unpredictable ways which won’t necessarily always be that disadvantageous to the indigenous population.

 

Chris: Yeah.

 

Horus: If we do speak together and one question I wanted to put to him it’s not sort of those that is quite a [90:00] complicated man but was just he says when welfare begins to become unavailable. Whereas all right my thinking is that’s one of the last things that our governments would allow to happen, because they haven’t imported these people by accident, or by drift by is there’s some element of that. But also I think that they want more and more Muslims flown in. Maybe up to only a point. But we haven’t reached that point.

 

And they and that they maybe even see them as sort of their moat around their castle that protects our rulers, traitorous rulers, from us. I thought I doubt that they will allow that to happen. Although nobody can foresee exactly, because I mean, in a situation of real chaos icy roads.

 

Chris: I think the NHS is really looking at imploding and I think that’s on its last legs. And there’s only so much money they can chuck in it and there’s only so many work in White people they can keep taxing for that. And you why you just want to get into this story. Well yeah if.

 

Horus: We can talk together now I bring these things up with him, or maybe if we talk again Chris.

 

Chris: I think someone’s giving him a heads up I think he’s here, but maybe not now.

 

Simon: Okay sorry here Gavin, you know, I’d love to speak to you. And I didn’t you don’t need writing about me then.

 

Horus: We can stay away from all the topic too doesn’t that’s fine.

 

Chris: Yeah is it isn’t it funny how this network works someone’s got through to someone who’s emailed someone who’s waiting on someone else’s Telegram and bogeys phone’s gone Horus and Simon are talking about you well through his wife out the bed run to the computer!

 

Horus: Just if you’ve only just started listening Kevin I think you’re a hero. And I very much admire what you’re doing. And if you would like to be on the show, because we can steer away from any topic you don’t want to talk about.

 

Chris: Hang on he’s saying he in capitals unless it’s not him he says he’s due on your show tonight at seven? Maybe it’s not him. Maybe it’s not him I mean, he’s already gone seven and it oh.

 

Simon: Well okay then this will be we’ve had a misunderstanding of emails, because we never.

 

Horus: Is this a four hour show?

 

Chris: Well maybe it’s not him but he’s also saying he hasn’t refused to come on. But if you got his email haven’t you?

 

Simon: I mean, email him after this show.

 

Chris: Yeah have a quick dinner and then we can through another.

 

Simon: We heard a complete misunderstanding of emails then.

 

Chris: It might not be him.

 

Horus: He’s put in capitals THIS IS GAVIN Boby.

 

Simon: Perhaps we could have another stream well I’ll set up I’ll set it all up again.

 

Horus: I just say one more thing about what we were talking about just before and the boba question. Just in terms of my stance on how we relate to the leader of our movement and by people who, you know, sympathetic to fascism, and so on, my stance is that that I have didn’t no question of me stopping working with him, or with them, you know, with that that part of the movement.

 

And I will argue what, you know, obviously not the whole of the up he’s gonna come to me asking me what I think about it. The more the role of appointed myself is a to break down that taboo. About it which is what my videos waned at. And B to just to anyone who sits why are you working with these people is to say why are you not working for our people?

 

You don’t have to work with PA specifically, but just why are you not trying to save the country from this disaster visitors that were in the middle? Of so that’s my stance for the moment maybe I can’t was something better, but that’s my approach for now.

 

Simon: Okay let’s move on to the next topic, because this is another topic that will kind of get as cold all the nasty names. But this was a kind of blue peeling, a White pilling thing that came out the other day. I think Laura posted it originally, but this is a graphic of recent let me look at it more closely. This is a graphic of voluntary enforced and voluntary returns from the UK from 2014 to 2018. And you can see that people will return to their countries of origin of their of their own accord.

 

So consequently a lot lot of the things that people have been saying on the internet about PA recently is one they’ve got no policies to solve the demographics problem. And anyway, repatriation even suggesting repatriation is something close to [95:01] murder!

 

But as you can see from this graphic here that’s not the case people are willing to go home. And wither with a staged policy of, for example, getting rid of all illegals and criminals with dual citizenship for a start, you’d get rid of a quite a large chunk of the undesirable immigrants that are here. And by incentivizing people you’d probably end up we’re not talking about a completely hundred percent White ethnostate but getting to an England the Great Britain that is pretty much the Great Britain we grew up with, say ninety-five indigenous 95% indigenous. You’d be left with the immigrants that with the people who have come here that really want to stay and really provide value to the country. But we’re still gonna get called Nazis and fascists for even suggesting it.

 

Horus: A massive world unto Laura further turning this up and publicizing it, by the way, and massive world until iconic loss for his video in the same vein a few days ago. Everyone should check that out and share that one around. So I was there a question?

 

Simon: It’s more of a statement. Okay what do you think guys is the question?

 

Horus: There’s no right this is great for anyone who says repatriations can’t be done and it’s not going to happen it if fucking is! It’s happening already.

 

Chris: Yes I think is a White pill. I’m sorry to go backwards that was Gavin he’s just emailed me is him he thinks he’s coming on your show at seven o’clock. Simon he said he never said he wasn’t coming on so that was him. So that was him. There you go okay. So I told him I’d tell you.

 

Oh yeah that graph it was incredible I mean, they I thought Dan’s sorry the Iconoclast video with uh his name not power was it just talking about it and they just this idea that if you can’t do that you can’t do that everyone loves it the progressives like you can’t do that I mean, having millions of these people walk all off way around the world and flood their countries there’s such a bigger deal and everyone was just let it happen while they were in their dinner but what send it back you can’t do that! I mean, it’s absurd! It’s just absurd and I thought it was really great Laura to think that out yeah agreed.

 

Simon: One of the entry I suppose we need to what I wanted to do now is talk about the kind of practicalities of how this would go about. One of the interesting points that Dan raised I thought, or Enoch Powell raised in the interview that damn played with him in 1976 oh I think it was. Is all you have to do in many respects is to make is to make Britain a less conducive place to be. And not give not make life so easy for people who have just arrived here.

 

And the example that that Enoch Powell use would was not giving people benefits for dependents that are living in foreign countries. All you need to do is apply UK law and very, very quickly this is the life in the UK isn’t as nice isn’t as cushy and probably if you change that people start to leave.

 

Chris: Yeah I really I agree I think there’s a few different things there for the money there for the easy ride and with a few few things like what you just talked about a cultural change. Just White people collectivizing I think will make them think will hang on this is slightly more hostile to the easy ride we thought we were coming to.

 

And this is sorry to come back to it but this is kind of what Gavin’s saying he doesn’t think this stuff is gonna be difficult. He thinks these people start leaving in their droves once they see just the initial changes well, you know, once they see little changes happening where people are collectivizing people are changing their minds pressures being put. They’ll start thinking well I’m not gonna build a life here, because I can see what happens in 5, 10, years and I tend to agree with him. I think it’s really White pilling stuff. We, you know, you’ve kind of been sold this idea that things are set in stone and far from it.

 

Horus: I think a fair number of people would start leaving even if we just had sort of frequent extra bacon expressions in the media, or from a few politicians seriously! Quite a lot of people to here purely, because of the ridiculously pathetic! Craven state that the country as a whole is in. And if you just had a bit of assertiveness, you would have quite a lot of people quite frightened, and it would some of them would start eating back out of the door right, because if we like actually we’ve ever seen assertive Saxons in our lifetime.

 

And it’s no joke right, you know, [100:02] people who are the Anglo-Saxons and Celts you and not under the leash of traitors, or not I’m not wholly under the latest traitors, will be quite a fearsome sight! Before like quite a lot of the scumbags you’ve come in. And the people who genuinely loved us, you know, you’re genuinely liked and have adopted our way of life they were happy to go. I’ve got a jewish friend ended happily cause themselves English and I it’s just not in any way antagonistic towards the source, or subversive. And like that’s a sore person at once then you actually, you know, contribute, a good friend like. People who’ve come in it, because they see now easy to exploit we are they can be got rid of quite easily, at relatively little cost stuffing.

 

Chris: I agree and sorry just quickly so I mean, I also think these things like where criminals get sent home and, because once you send there all the immigrant criminals home then their families go home and again I think that starts the ball rolling. People think we’ll hang on this isn’t what we thought it was. No I think this is all very interesting. A very, very White pilling.

 

Simon: I think something else you can do and particularly with the Muslim was in question well actually Muslim and jewish question. Is simply apply law on things like, for example, well polygamy with Muslims, you know, a man in Britain can have one wife and one family and one set of benefits for that family if they’re unemployed. You apply English law on halal and kosher on Sharia and birthing courts on gentle music mutilation. And once the environment is geared in such a way that it’s going to be very different difficult for these people to practice with their religions which they sincerely believe in, then they’re going to be look there’s gonna be less propensity for them to stay I’m sure.

 

Chris: That stuff particularly Royals me, because these laws already in place. Why we’re letting people have multiple wives and claim benefits for all of a man their kids this is just insane! These laws already exist! Just implement them, shocking.

 

Simon: Yeah totally! And also I’ve kind of thought about this quite a lot other things that you can do with this yeah simply stopping the favorable treatment. I think it’s pretty clear that this positive discrimination I don’t think that’s the term they use now and in this century but positive justice discrimination in terms of benefits housing jobs, you know, we’ve seen the cases in the BBC. As soon as that stopped and you and you give you put people on an even playing field then that’s also going to make life much more difficult for them. At the moment we’ve got a society that’s completely geared to making the immigrants triumph above the interests of the indigenous population.

 

Chris: Well it’s absurd that these people have become protected groups, because it’s a really it’s a very weird little language sort of linguistic trick that, because they’re protected groups. Of what actually that means is they’re first-class citizens, because we’re not protected we then become second-class.

 

I remember when I first saw mark say about us being second-class citizens in their own country I didn’t kind of buy it. But when you think of it from that angle that these other groups are protected and, you know, look at Rotherham look at all that lot, the media the authorities the social services the police that they all turn their backs! Just crazy! Absolutely crazy!

 

And yet all that’s got to change! And actually that stuff has got a change in line with our laws that are already there it hasn’t got it we I’m going to change our laws people have just got to enforce them. I find this side of things particularly infuriating, because the other things should be on top of those things. But they that’s not even being done. I mean, what, how much do our governments hate us?

 

Horus: I think that’s a crucial point our Lords should actually not only not change they should be restored to what they will were they were like a lot of the laws have been added, you know, the powers have been added to state over the last 20 years, specifically to deal with problems mostly caused by Muslims. All the new powers and the consi intelligence services saw the ability to lock people up without trial for 28 days.

 

That’s all coming to deal with problems that have been imported all of that should be repealed! Like it got rid of! All the new all the new bodies set up so ever to us make sure we closed! Christen our engines should be restored and the people who supposedly caused the need to override those things should be expelled [105:00] obviously! Obviously! Right it does shouldn’t even be the same she expelled from the country. So in this moment sorry here I was just going to say Kevin seems quite intent on you looking at your emails.

 

Simon: Yeah I’ve seen I can’t do the show and right at the same time.

 

Chris: Simon and Horus I don’t know where but this is the direction you want to take things in but it’s kind of relevant to the direction we’ve gone in what do you make of Kai Murros and his angle and what’s going to happen? Because I ain’t Irv you dim and he says that there’s going to be not a revolution of such but a violent uprising. His kind of angle is, because we haven’t got the privilege of White flight he says you move out of London you’re in Birmingham in a couple of hours. And he says when you chase animals into corners us when they’re at the most ferocious. And he’s completely sold on this. He says that Europe is going to explode in the next few years.

 

Horus: Yeah I have a litte whirlwind right he’s saying we will win.

 

Chris: Because we got the numbers and also we’ve got nowhere else to go this is our only homeland, you know, it’s not like it’s not like America where you can drive for five hours and move to another White community. We’re running out of them.

 

And that’s his whole angle he gave a great speech in London a few years ago. No one’s seen it’s worth checking out. But I do I listen to him sometimes I think it’s kind of rousing for the sake of rails. It’s kinda like nationalist propaganda you listen to one of his speech you listen to him talk and you all get sort of fired up. And then you that slowly sort of dissipates and you become a nationalist, rather than support me.

 

Mark doesn’t buy it at all. Mark mark says if the White people haven’t haven’t done that on the back of all the child rapes they’re not going to do it at all, which is also a good point.

 

Simon: I think we need to rest and they think well collectivise a lot we need to be aware of who we are and yeah simply who the who the enemy is who the invaders are. And before that kicks off we need to be aware of that and once the rasa Nation starts, once the collectivization starts and the awareness of our identity begins, then I think there’s still a political solution.

 

And if well before things get really violent I think the environment is gonna become more hostile and with more hostility whilst we’re still a voting majority and bring in things like repatriation in a more hostile environment where they’ve got less benefits I think that’s the thing to be focusing on now, rather than some kind that pie-in-the-sky idea of a of an ethnic civil war, because nobody wants it really.

 

Horus: Seems you Chris that Kai Murros seems between two things at once. Is like spot prediction and part I don’t want to I’ll choose a better word, because what were the word that comes to my mind plus something illegal but, electrifying, you know, it’s part yeah and the election electrification at the same time which I think is how reality is, you know, in things can become true, because you expect them.

 

So he is so more that we believe that we will fight. And I think he’s employing, you know, it’s horrific violence for more than we believe that we are at least capable of that and destined for that if not something before that. Then we will eventually fully turn and face the enemy and we will demonstrate that, in fact, they were wrong to her to have tried to chase us down.

 

I like to imagine that we, you know, if nothing else we will at least manage that. And he betrays it as though it will be glorious, right? That we will eventually take back everything that it’s asked yeah it’s a crazy thing to imagine. But obviously I don’t want it to come through all that killing so I hope that actually we achieve something before.

 

That mom is well I don’t have any predictions but my expectation is that if we are to win it will be by, in fact, fracturing and breaking apart and taking down in pieces the current ruling class. Which I think can happen without violent Wars. Well there is violence already fought without a great explosion of violence. But as to what will happen I really have no idea is this oh it’s all kind of in our hands if anything.

 

Chris: I might my faith is in the White work why ethnic English people realize in they [110:00] are a class getting that class consciousness sort we’d saw it for the Marxist little bit yeah getting that consciousness together, collective eyes in and, you know, we’re only we’re only vulnerable, because we’re not, because we’re totally atomized.

 

We’re being attacked by collectives, by Islam by the government, by the polices and there’s such a huge number of us so much more than all of them if we were actually to collective eyes I think politics will change that will be downstream of that kind of cultural and social change. And that’s when it all starts, because no political party is going to sit there and try and do what they’re doing now if they see the ethnic English as a collective, because they’ll be thinking, you know, we have to have beat these people. At the moment they go.

 

Horus: I think no Morgoth says I’ve been last year that struck me was that if you look at things from the point of view of that rulers I’m wrong probably very mangling what he said. But if you look at things from the point of view of rulers they may already be terrified of us! They the things that they’re doing these awful outrageous things that they’re doing to constrain our freedom then much worse than destroy us, could actually be interpreted as acts of desperation already.

 

I don’t know whether this is right. But it may be the case, because they realize that they’ve done such bad things already that they’re already destined for the gallows! Which I’m not threatening anyone but I’m saying there are people angry enough that should their power break down, if it breaks down quite suddenly and so they don’t have it they don’t have a chance to fly out the country, you know, before they got before they got hold of by revolutionaries of some kind there’s this intense anger and hatred towards them! And so maybe Pollak.

 

Chris: No I think you’re absolutely right! I thought I totally agree with that! I think that all these draconian censorship measures these aren’t things I put in place worried about the future, these are a response to things they’re seeing they’re trying to tame the beast that’s looking to get out of this cage! Okay one of the things cause anyway.

 

Horus: I’d like to think that.

 

Chris: No I think most certainly I think that the more draconian the more fear that you can measure. Kai’s got these ideas where he says that come the revolution there there’ll be there be teams of teenage nationalists going into the universities and tearing the professor’s off of the stage and making a walk around the towns with little balls around their neck just explaining their treachery!

 

Horus: And that’s a lovely image, because they are some of the worst most malevolent people against a Fisher some remind us all in case, you know, it’s Entropy if we got any only got a few minutes left. They might be.

 

Simon: No no questions have no donations so not a very significant.

 

Chris: People were too engaged to dare tear themselves away from the screen.

 

Horus: All right that’s good yeah I retract my.

 

Simon: I’ve got I’ve just refreshed it yes I’ve just refreshed it I was gonna make an interesting point now. Okay as you can see I refresh Entropy. We’ve got 5 GB pounds from George who says thank you George. Dangerfield was right recent optics are horrendous if we follow this path we’re done pushing anything relating to the JQ, or World War Two is suicide to any, nor me look at how people reacted to the labor anti-semitism scandal.

 

So people are I’ll say you’re right there Chris. Okay this the next super chair is from Steve Ben Bob who says three sends three US dollars. Chris I still get three about three letters per year from Scientology even though I told them not to contact me some 20 years ago. Interesting points I don’t know.

 

Chris: I think it was, because I said when I look when I release that video about wild cut tires it was like I was swooped down on like I was leaving Scientology I think that’s what I mentioned that,

 

Simon: Yeah, and we probably got no got that much time for questions do Matias got there’s got the top question it’s not about adopting, or promoting National Socialism it’s how you will respond without lying and cooking nonsense when Emily Emily Maitlis says we fought a war against these evil ideas such as homogeneous policies. We yes some what’s it disingenuously uses it [115:01] uses the wish but she would.

 

This is one of the things I think that there’s difficult there’s a clip of Nick Griffin kind of denying his beliefs. I think he comes out worse and comes out as weak. I think it’s in the hard talk interview that he does perhaps he comes out as weak because, you know, this isn’t what he thinks we’re in a very difficult situation on this.

 

Chris: Yeah mark mark said that to me he said it’s important to be honest, because you’ll get called out otherwise and so that again complicates things.

 

Simon: Yeah. I the last what we were talking about previously I think yeah I mean, obviously people are increasingly dissatisfied with the powers that be and they’re introducing draconian laws. But we’re in an international situation. It’s not just Great Britain something very similar happened is happening in lots and lots and lots of different countries.

 

And I was gonna get onto this at the end of the stream but we’ve only got three minutes so it’s probably not worth it. But the example of what’s happening with coronavirus now. They’re succeeding in bringing the lock down. They’re succeeding in introducing elements of a police state relatively easily. What on earth can we do about it?

 

Horus: Keep working on this such a bland answer I guess but keep raping people yeah.

 

Simon: I mean, yeah I find it very difficult to believe yeah I don’t know I think we’re in a good situation.

 

Chris: Simon can you repeat that questions their apologies it went funny for me.

 

Simon: I was saying that in the perhaps it may be true that people the powers that be are introducing draconian measures, because they’re scared of us. But it’s there’s an international network of countries it’s much bigger than just Great Britain and very, very sadly what we’ve seen through the corona virus is how successfully this international operation works, because they’ve managed to introduce even more draconian measures in many, many countries and no, or hardly anybody is complaining. And is pathetic here people are clapping like seals at 8 o’clock every night yeah. In 30 seconds everybody’s going to come out on their butt on the balcony and clap like idiots. Sometimes I give up there’s this times when I get kind of very depressed by this.

 

Chris: Oh no no I mean, that I think the pandemic thing is excuse me something on this scale is relatively new I mean, if this fades out say August November try again next year. I think the novelty edge excuse me and people have had a bit more time to get bit more information but I am I couldn’t be more optimistic about things like, you know, I my channel didn’t start up as a nationalist channel. It kind of became sort of a sort of a classic liberal channel. Then it got a bit more red pilled and it slowly got to around today. But even about a year ago when I was talking about these things looking at the difference in the numbers, the amount of new channels popping up the amount of newbies coming over I just see something happening.

 

And I just see something growing. And again like I say I’m getting 30 odd emails a day and so many of them are saying things like two years ago I started tentatively looking at this stuff but now these are the conversations I’m having in the pubs with all my friends these what my fair family are talking about get-togethers. And this is coming all the time! I think this stuff is pretty like wildflower fire!

 

And I also think that 30, 40 years of multicultural propaganda, well that was all very well before the internet, but now the Internet’s changed that power. And also it’s got to the point now where the internal contradictions of multiculturalism are exploding in people’s daily lives and no amount of propaganda can do anything about that.

 

And people are looking for solutions people are looking for answers and people are scared and that’s when people get busy. I think the next five years are gonna be incredible! And in five years time you see where we are I think it’s going to be amazing!

 

Simon: Well on that note I think we should finish. As you can see that the people are clapping and hooting the horns here in Barcelona. So perhaps perhaps everybody apart for the bloody catalogs are gonna break free, because they cooked as fuck to be perfectly honest. Anyway Chris it’s been really great talking to you it’s but it’s been great getting to know you actually it was long overdue and thanks for a great show. Everybody to say [120:00] information,

 

Chris: You know, though give well I didn’t scream tonight, because my stream was a bit high-energy and I was worried I’d be too tired for this but now I’ve done this I’ll be doing a stream on my channel in about 20 minutes and thanks for having me on Simon and you Horus it’s been an absolute pleasure I feel like we talked about some relevant topics. And thanks for the chat I’ve been following that lots of very interesting stuff. So I’m glad I came.

 

Simon: Well thanks for coming. Horus only a final thought.

 

Horus: I just hear a plug to my friend history bro who was on Chris who did a video with Chris recently and I think they might do another one soon but they did an interesting chat about Angkor Wat which you can see on history post channel. And Chris I would just say to you I am very glad that you didn’t stop at the armored skeptic stage!

 

Chris: Me too!

 

Horus: But thanks for coming on.

 

Chris: Nice one thank you.

 

Simon: Thanks everyone! Good night. See you next week.

 

Horus: Cheers all.

 

[121:02]

 

 

END

 

 

============================================

 

 

See Also

 

Simon Harris – My Speech to the Patriotic Alternative Conference – Mar 16, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 19 – A Conversation with Nick Griffin – Apr 14, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 21 – Keeping A Political Project On Point with Dangerfield – Apr 28, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 23 – Is Populism and Patriotism Enough? with Paul Rimmer – May 5, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 22 – Gavin Boby on Mosque-busting and the Breakdown of Society – Apr 28, 2020 — Transcript

Simon Harris – EF 25 – The State of the Art with Jeff Winston & Nick Cotton – May 19, 2020 — Transcript

 

 

============================================