Monika Schaefer: Good evening. It is Saturday, the 20th of July in the year 2024, and you are tuned into the Republic Broadcasting Network. I am your host, Monika Schaefer, and this is episode four of The Flipside with Monika. I’d like to encourage you, first of all, if you have the means, to support RBN. It does cost money to run a network such as this and they are doing a summer fundraiser in which you can get something in return for your donation. Well, you always get something in return. That is a wonderful free speech network!

 

But more specifically, they do have some special T-shirts to give away. You can find the information how to donate like the telephone number on their website, Republicbroadcasting.org. Before I introduce today’s guest, and I am hoping he does show up, I just talked to him less than 2 hours ago, but I think we’re having a hard time reaching him right now.

 

But anyway, before I do that, I have some other things to say. So I’d like to give a shout out to a patriot whose online persona is Katana. He has a website, katana17.com. And I’ve been acquainted with Katana since just days after I made my video in 2016. That was that fateful video called Sorry Mom, I Was Wrong About the Holocaust. And the reason I got acquainted with him then is because he transcribed it right away, and he put that transcription onto his website with memes and images. It was really nice. I was quite surprised, actually, that that showed up.

 

So then I was introduced to his work. And what he does is he transcribes a lot of videos and interviews, which he thinks are important to preserve in this other format, the written format or the printed word. There are many advantages to having things in a written form, and he had a section back then – I’m sure he still does on his website – that explained the many different advantages to having things like videos and interviews in the written form.* I mean, you could print it off and read it. It does give it some degree of permanency. Some people prefer to read things rather than listen to an interview. There’s all kinds of reasons.

 

 

Anyway, then, over the years, since 2016, I have received a tremendous amount of support and encouragement and assistance from Katana.

 

In fact, his encouragement for me to write a book was absolutely critical! And I don’t think I ever would have written that book that I wrote without Katana’s encouragement. And the book that has the same title as my fateful video, the Sorry Mom, I Was Wrong About the Holocaust. The video was just six minutes long the book is a little bit longer than that! [chuckling]

 

 

Anyway, so I just want to say thank you, Katana. Oh, and of course, and the reason I wanted to do this shout out now, I’m very grateful to him for also having transcribed the first three episodes of this show, The Flipside with Monika.

 

So thank you to Katana!

 

Okay, now I would like to introduce my guest. I’m wondering if he’s had any luck getting on or., …

 

Oscar: I’m on now.

 

Monika Schaefer: Okay, good.

 

Okay, so I’d like to introduce my guest, who was one of the founding members of the Truth and Justice for Germans Society back in 2014. And his online persona is Oscar.

 

Now, through the years, I have learned so much from this man. Every time we had conversations together, he shared his insights with me, not only on historical events, but about race relations, about democracy, and even about nutrition.

 

So I think we might connect some of the dots on these seemingly disparate topics tonight.

 

But first, let me welcome Oscar onto the broadcast and ask you if you could please tell us, just give us a little bit of background. What led you and what motivated you to become a founding member of the Truth and Justice for Germans Society? Which, by the way, just before you do that, I just wanted to mention that I am involved in that society. So is of great interest to me. And the title of that society does say it all, really, what it’s about. I mean, obviously there’s lots to it, but the Truth and Justice for Germans Society. Okay. Welcome Oscar onto the show.

 

Oscar: Hi, Monika. Can you hear me okay?

 

Monika Schaefer: Yes, I can. Thank you.

 

Oscar: Okay. Yeah. Thanks for having me on. So I joined the Truth and Justice for Germans Society, I believe it was 2014. The society was started by a German fellow who had been, … This was kind of like a project he’d been working on for a long time. He put a lot of information together in a website, and then he wanted to create, like, an organization, a society to go along with the website. So he approached myself and a couple other people, a couple of friends, and asked us to help them set up this society. So that’s sort of how it started.

 

Now, myself and the two other people that he approached to help set it up, I mean, we all knew each other. We were sort of, I guess, at that point called “conspiracy theorists” because we were discussing, and 9/11 and all sorts of other things, and the direction society is going in. And, of course, you know, World War Two plays a big part in that. So that’s sort of how it initially got started.

 

[08:15]

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah. And obviously, if you were friends with him and he asked you to help with the founding of the Truth and Justice for Germans Society, it means that you had opened your eyes to what is going on in the world.

 

And you mentioned the word “conspiracy theorists”. Yeah, that’s a great term that was foisted on us, I think probably back in, after the Kennedy [JFK] assassination, because they noticed that too many people were noticing that something was wrong with their assessment of things. So they turned that term into such a derogatory term. And it’s been used ever since to make fun of or belittle people who are actually seeing, noticing patterns.

 

But, yeah, go ahead.

 

Oscar: It’s just to discredit people who are interested in finding out the truth and what’s really going on.

 

And also researching and discovering that most of what we’ve been told about history is a lie! You know, most of everything we’re told in society is a lie! You know, whether its history, nutrition, immigration, “Holocaust”, everything!

 

Monika Schaefer: Exactly!

 

Oscar: It’s all a big lie!

 

Monika Schaefer: That’s why I thought we might connect some of those dots today. Because even if it sounds like those topics that I mentioned, that I have personally learned a lot of things from you, and that was including nutrition, sounds like that doesn’t really have that much to do with the other topics like history, Holocaust, race relations. What does nutrition have to do with that?

 

But then, …

 

Oscar: Well, …

 

Monika Schaefer: Go ahead, please.

 

Oscar: Nutrition has a lot to do with it because really, I mean, what our enemy is doing is weakening us! And they poison our food, and then they give us an upside down food pyramid. When you’re not eating a nutritionally sound diet you’re going to be weaker physically and mentally. So it’s part of the overall war against White people.

 

Monika Schaefer: Exactly!

 

Oscar: Nutrition factors in very, very much. I mean you have the vegan and vegetarian cults which ensnares, like, most young women, and this creates more health problems. It makes it harder for them to conceive. So it’s also an attack on White fertility.

 

Monika Schaefer: I agree.

 

And you mentioned against the White race in particular. Do you think that the nutritional attack or the assault on us through false information about nutrition, do you think that is specifically aimed at European people, at White people?

 

Oscar: Completely! Because pretty much every young White female girl is ensnared in the vegetarian-vegan cult. They get them young and they get them in this cult, and it creates nothing but health problems. And like, I said, it’s going to make it very difficult for these people to conceive children.

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah, I mean, I would agree with you. And they, I think they can do it through taking advantage of the empathy, we love nature, we love animals. Isn’t that part of it?

 

Oscar: Yeah. Yes, very much so! The whole thing about the cruelty to animals and, it’s like the vegans are all about:

 

“Oh, you know, we’re against the killing and torture of animals!”

 

And meanwhile, that person has like a nice watch with a leather strap and leather jacket. And I mean, there’s a lot of hypocrisy that goes along with this whole agenda as well. But, at the end of the day, it is what it is. And it’s just one of the many weapons of used to attack the White race.

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah, I agree. You know, the other day we were talking on the phone in anticipation of this, and we were talking about diseases in the past, and specifically we talked about the plague.

 

And I think that many of us have reached different conclusions now about that. Do you want to talk a little bit about that?

 

Oscar: Well, again, I mean, we were told that the plague was this highly contagious disease that was spread from human to human.

 

And I think certainly the Covid scam has opened a lot of people’s eyes to the fact that viruses are not real and like, human contagion is not a thing. You know, the concept that humans pass disease to one another. I mean, if that was true, we would have gone extinct a long time ago.

 

So this brings you back to the other theory of poisoning of the wells, which now seems to have a little more legitimacy once we start realizing that it wasn’t a contagious outbreak spreading from human to human, it was something else.

 

I mean, there is some documented evidence of people being caught poisoning wells, and tried and executed. But the six o’clock news is not going to talk about stuff like that.

 

Monika Schaefer: No, and neither are they going to teach that to the children in school what the real causes of the plague were. And they probably won’t mention the (((tribe))) that, who were these well poisoners. These are things that were not taught in the mainstream sources nor in our public education system!

 

And interesting. I’m glad you brought the, made the connection between then and now. This Covid, the bio-weapon, which they coerced through very strong measures. Like people were fired, people were not allowed into places, young people were not allowed into universities, or institutions like that, if they didn’t roll up their sleeve and get that bio-weapon. Oh, excuse me, they called it the “vaccine”. But even now it’s like that has disappeared from the news cycle because they’ve got other things to distract the public from.

 

Like, for example, Trump’s ear supposedly being shot and everybody’s talking about that now. And this other huge matter which is affecting millions of people who are either dying or are severely injured, that’s just gone away. It’s like it’s being forgotten. Or is it being forgotten? Do you want to comment about that? And bring then to now?

 

[16:57]

 

Oscar: The mainstream news is not going to ever address the number of vaccine injuries or the number of people who’ve died from the vaccine. They’re just going to ignore it. The only place you’ll get any news about that or information is on the alternate media.

 

And like you said, they’re just going to move on to their next pandemic or their next crisis or whatever, like the supposed assassination of Donald Trump. I mean, all these events are very fishy.

 

Monika Schaefer: Oh, yeah, that’s definitely an understatement. I would say! [chuckling] It’s a piece of theater. And even at that, even if it was real, we’re talking about a governance system, which we touched on this in our pre-show conversation the other day, too, about democracy.

 

And I hope we’re not jumping topics here too much, but I do think this is all related, and we can tie this all together then. But this governance system that I was taught in school:

 

“Oh, it’s government for the people, of the people, by the people!”

 

And this was hammered into our brains! And we just thought it was so great because they always told us it was the best system, really the only system. Like, it was so solidly implanted into our psyche that really we could just think:

 

“Well, how can it be any other way? Of course this is the best system.”

 

But what do you think about that, Oscar? Should we even be paying attention to voting and democracy? And is this working for us? Do you think this is really working for us? [chuckling] Go ahead.

 

Oscar: Well, no, it doesn’t work. Your vote doesn’t matter, really. I mean, democracy is just a, just a warm up round for full on communism. You know, we certainly saw that with the Covid pandemic. We all had this notion that we live in a democracy, and you wake up the next day and you’re not allowed to leave your house, and if you don’t take an injection, you’re going to lose your job. It’s like, how did that happen overnight? That’s, well, so much for our democracy!

 

Monika Schaefer: Actually, I find that a really interesting statement to say that democracy is actually a stepping stone to communism. To me, that’s a new idea. It’s really, really good, actually. We should expand on that a little bit more. We should explore that a little bit more. How does that happen? You’re right. Like, going from, … yeah, go ahead.

 

Oscar: Well, your vote doesn’t matter. I mean, let’s say you run a business and you have a family, you own a house. You have a vested interest in the state of the economy. You have a vested interest in the health of your country s But when you go vote and then let’s say this 20 year old girl with pink hair and she’s a transgender lesbian. Well, your vote carries the same weight as her vote. She has no stake in the economy. You know, she just wants to tear everything down!

 

So that’s another problem.

 

Monika Schaefer: I guess that is a communist idea, isn’t it? That everybody is equal, so everybody has a vote! No matter what position you have in life. That right there is, …

 

Oscar: Well, again, I mean, this notion of “everybody and everything is equal”, that’s a communist ideal, because nothing is further from the truth!

 

Monika Schaefer: Exactly!

 

Oscar: People that have no vested interest in the economy, the state of the nation, whatever, their vote carries the same weight as people that have a very definite vested interest in the economy and the nation. So this is a problem.

 

And Western countries are all multicultural now, and different cultures have different values, different outlooks on life and they’re going to vote for the party that’s soft on immigration so they can bring all their relatives into the country. Democracy doesn’t work. It creates, like, a mob rule.

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah. No, this is a very profound idea, I have to say. I mean, I was so into the whole “democracy thing” all my life, and then I even ran as a candidate, and please don’t hold it against me, but I ran in that Green Party, which I now understand to be “watermelon party”, which is really the worst of them all!

 

And what I mean by “watermelon”, it’s green on the outside and red on the inside. It is really a communist party!

 

But now we’re talking about the whole idea of democracy is communist, but the Green party legitimizes it. Go ahead.

 

Oscar: The hidden agenda of the Green Party, and like because about the same time, Green parties appeared in pretty much every Western country. But the Green party was used as a vehicle to start introducing all these crazy “green initiatives”. And then over time, all these ideas eventually became adopted by the mainstream parties. But they used the Green party to float these ideas out into the public sphere. And then over time, the mainstream parties just eventually adopted all these policies.

 

Monika Schaefer: Bingo! You nailed it! Because this is the idea that’s been percolating in my head, too. This very idea that the Green Party actually sets the agenda, even though they are still, and they have been very much just on the fringe. Took them a long time before they even got a single seat. Then they got a few seats, and yet they are setting the agenda, all the way!

 

In fact, I’ll just tell you a little quote from Elizabeth May. And I used to think it was so noble! Elizabeth May, the leader of the Green Party of Canada back then, when she said this, and now still she says:

 

“I will always.”

 

Sorry. No, this is a different quote. She said:

 

“I don’t care if they steal our ideas, as long as they implement them! I don’t care if they don’t give us credit for their ideas. I just care that they use our ideas and put them into practice, like implement them.”

 

So I thought that was really noble because I thought:

 

“Wow, she’s so modest. She doesn’t need to take the credit.”

 

And yet what I see is that she was basically encapsulating exactly what happens, is that the Green party sets the agenda. They bring forth the ideas, and then the main parties, the big parties, the “gray parties”, as the Greens used to call them, they implement them. Isn’t that interesting?

 

Oscar: Yeah, well, once they’ve, you know, been floating around in, out there on the media for X number of years, people get used to hearing this and then over time they just become more acceptable to these ideas. When you look at these green policies they’re trying to implement, like this Green New deal right now. I mean, really it just ties into Agenda 2030.

 

So it’s not about going green. It’s about going without!

 

Monika Schaefer: Indeed.

 

Oscar: You know, we have an abundance of energy and resources. But those who pull the strings, want everyone to be equally poor. And that includes being energy poor.

 

[26:53]

 

Monika Schaefer: Through a big, big fat lie about carbon and carbon dioxide. I mean, that like, … Go ahead. Sorry.

 

Oscar: That’s the biggest lie of them all, is the CO2 is going to destroy the atmosphere and kill us all!

 

Monika Schaefer: And yet CO2 is the stuff of life! [chuckling]

 

Oscar: Like the pre-industrial CO2 levels of 280 parts per million. I mean, that was dangerous. Dangerously low!

 

Monika Schaefer: Exactly!

 

Oscar: That’s approaching extinction level.

 

Monika Schaefer: Exactly!

 

Oscar: So now it’s up to, like, around 400, or more. But the result of that is the earth is getting greener and agricultural yields have improved. And when plants get more CO2, they can survive with less water. So it’s an all around better situation if there’s a bit more CO2 in the atmosphere.

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah, I think it’s interesting that you say:

 

“That’s the biggest lie of all.”

 

Because I think you’re right. And it took me longer to dissect that lie or to come to terms with it than the Holocaust lie, even though the Holocaust has been drummed into us since we were born, basically. And the Holocaust lie is punishable if you question that one.

 

Whereas if you questioned their narrative on climate change, so far anyway, you don’t go to jail for it. Although they start inserting words like:

 

“Oh, climate denier!”

 

And we know that that weaponized term has its power from the “Holocaust denier” term. So who knows in future what all they will deem us criminal for disagreeing with their narrative on.

 

But, yeah, that one is a huge lie because they are using that narrative of climate change and that we are burning up and we are responsible for ruining the planet. They are using that for their 2030 agenda or whatever all these other agendas are called.

 

And I think we are going to a break now, but we will be right back.

 

[29:21]

 

[music]

 

[29:44]

 

[ad]

 

[36:10]

 

[music]

 

[37:00]

 

All right, I would like to welcome you back to The Flipside with Monika. And I would like to also invite you, if you would like to call in, the number is 512-248-8252. And there’s also a 1800 number if you can’t call on that number, it’s 1800 313 9443.

 

But first, I’d like to just make some more observations with my guest, Oscar. And you probably know what song that was on the bumper music after the ads, before and after the ads there. And the fact that there are many German people who have been so brought down to their knees that they flinch when they hear that music because they have been made to feel badly about their national anthem. Do you want to comment on that, Oscar?

 

Oscar: Well, I guess that’s all part and parcel of the, … After World War Two, they instituted the so-called de-Nazification program. You know, pretty much every school book, every book published between 1933 and 1945 was destroyed by the Allies. They were the real book burners of history!

 

So that was part of the de-Nazification process. I mean, everything about National Socialism had to be destroyed, because it was the most effective form of governance that the modern world has seen! It wasn’t just the economic miracle. It was also a cultural and spiritual revolution as well. And if it wasn’t squashed with World War Two, it would have spread to most of the Western world.

 

So this is one of the main reasons for World War Two, what Hitler and what the Germans were doing. It was showing everyone that there’s a better way! You know, it was really a struggle of European nationalism versus jewish globalism.

 

And unfortunately, the end result, the bad guys won and the good guys lost. I’m referring to the Germans. They were the good guys in World War Two!

 

Monika Schaefer: Indeed, indeed! Everything been turned on its head, hasn’t it?

 

Oscar: Yeah, I like to quote what Goebbels said once. He said:

 

“If we are to lose this war, the world will fall into a state of eternal darkness.”

 

And, well, right now things look pretty dark in the Western world! [chuckling] You know, we’re being massively overrun with third world immigrants. Our economies are being trashed. We just went through this whole Covid scam where they injected 80% of the population with some mysterious poison.

 

Now they’re throwing this climate change green agenda at us. And there’s the digital currency looming on the horizon somewhere.

 

So, yeah, I mean, this is everything that Hitler and the Germans were fighting against. This is exactly what they were fighting against!

 

Monika Schaefer: Exactly! Yeah. It makes me weep to know that, to learn that! And then to have Hitler be so demonized! I’m telling you, it took a long time, even after I learned the truth about World War Two and that the Holocaust didn’t happen. And actually, everything was kind of backwards and reversed in terms of what they told us. Even then, it took a while before I could decontaminate myself from those lies about Hitler. Because even though I then understood that he was a good guy, not this devil incarnate, I would still flinch when I saw him portrayed in a positive light.

 

I have, in the meantime, been very successful at decontaminating myself from that mind poison, so I do not flinch any longer! And I really think he was one of the greatest men that ever lived!

 

And I will just say the jews, they head up making the curriculum, and they own the media, the mass media, and they have poisoned us with their lies and deceptions about Hitler. And I guess it’s because of that fantastic way of governing, the National Socialist way, and what you just described that was really, really great.

 

And I think you could expand on that. It was spiritual in addition to their attitude towards the environment, everything about it was so good! Like you say, it would have spread to many more countries. Go ahead.

 

Oscar: It definitely would have, especially when they can see that Hitler circumvented the international bankers, that the German economy was thriving. And other countries could have easily followed that same program and achieved similar levels of success. Because Germany was thriving in the middle of The [Great] Depression.

 

Monika Schaefer: Exactly!

 

Oscar: The United States and England were mired deep in the recession, mass unemployment, poverty, misery. And by 1935, the German economy was booming. The standard of living was rising dramatically. People were happy. People were optimistic about the future. So yeah, I mean this why, …

 

Monika Schaefer: And brought., … Go ahead, finish your thought there.

 

Oscar: Oh, yeah. I sort of lost it!

 

Monika Schaefer: Okay, no problem. He brought the Germans out of a state of poverty and suffering. Like after World War One, there was hunger in Germany. I know that from firsthand. Well, actually, I guess I should call it secondhand, it’s from my parents. Does one call that firsthand or secondhand?

 

Anyway, my parents, they lived that poverty after World War One. My dad was born in 1919. And, I mean, his mom took him to the doctor at age four because he was bow-legged*. So malnourished and he hadn’t started talking yet, and she was concerned about him. The doctor said:

 

“No, don’t worry, he’s fine.”

 

[* Rickets is a condition that results in weak or soft bones in children, and is caused by either dietary deficiency (Vitamin D) or genetic causes. Symptoms include bowed legs, stunted growth, bone pain, large forehead, and trouble sleeping.]

 

But that was the poverty that he was born into. And my mother, well, she was born a little bit later, 1928. But Germany after World War One was so poor that so many suicides took place. All kinds of things like that.

 

And then after Hitler came to power in 1933, things really, really changed!

 

And like you said, the middle of [The Great] Depression in the rest of the world, and Germany was doing very well, and leaders from various countries went to Germany to see:

 

“How did they do that here?”

 

And to see how he was doing that economic miracle.

 

So, yeah. Did you want to just comment? And then after that we could take a caller.

 

Oscar: Yeah, well, it’s actually not a complicated formula. He freed his people from the clutches of the jewish banking cartels. And of course, he also got rid of all the jewish sponsored degeneracy that was going on in Germany in the late twenties and early thirties, the Weimar Republic, I mean, so, …

 

Monika Schaefer: So, yeah, I like what you say. It was not a complicated formula! [chuckling] Get rid of jewish influence, jewish power! That is not complicated formula. Yeah.

 

Oscar: You have to get rid of the jewish money power and the jewish influence over your society. And I mean you just look at the United States today. Well, that’s like Weimar 2.0.

 

Monika Schaefer: It certainly is. And here in Canada, too.

 

Oscar: Yeah, but I mean, I’m not sure there’s a Hitler in the waiting to get us out of this mess!

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah!

 

Oscar: I think this time every individual’s gotta see their own way out of it. And hopefully enough will do that it’ll create a big enough movement and change in society.

 

Monika Schaefer: Yes, that’s right. Everybody needs to act. And if you’re looking for leadership, just look in the mirror, and don’t wait for somebody else to do something. I think we’re at that stage. You’re absolutely right!

 

Oscar: Donald Trump, unfortunately not the savior of the White race.

 

Monika Schaefer: That’s right. I agree 100% with you.

 

Oscar: Anyone who’s put their hand on the Wailing Wall* is not someone you can trust.

 

[* The Wailing Wall, also referred to as the Kotel, the Western Wall, or Solomon’s Wall, and whose lower sections date to about the first century BCE, is located in the Old Quarter of East Jerusalem in Israel/Palestine. Built of thick, corroded limestone, it is about 60 feet (20 meters) high and close to 160 feet (50 meters) long, though most of it is engulfed in other structures. A Sacred Jewish Site: The wall is believed by devout jews to be the Western Wall of the Second Temple of Jerusalem (destroyed by the Romans in 70 CE), the only surviving structure of the Herodian Temple built during the realm of Herod Agrippa (37 BCE–4 CE) in the first century BCE. The temple’s original location is in dispute, leading some Arabs to dispute the claim that the wall belongs to the temple, arguing instead that it is part of the structure of Al-Aqsa Mosque on the Temple Mount.]

 

Monika Schaefer: I agree with you. Well, let’s take a caller, Bradley in Texas.

 

Oscar: Okay.

 

Monika Schaefer: Can you, …

 

Bradley: Hello. Great to speak with you.

 

Monika Schaefer: Well, welcome to the show. So do you have a question, or a comment?

 

Bradley: A comment, I guess. It’s just very enlightening to hear, very refreshing enlightening people talk about the history that we’ve been denied. [chuckling] You know, the big book burning that happened in Germany, though they didn’t show you the books, they were perversion books. Kind of like what’s going on now with what they’re pushing LGBTQ, all this crap!

 

[49:41]

 

Oscar: Yes, that’s correct. Yeah.

 

Bradley: Yeah. And I’m very aware of the Holohoax. You know, it was garbage too. And so few people are aware of these things. Most of the stations I listen to are limited hangouts. I met John Stadmiller back around, 2000, under Lisa Beeth and her husband, Bill Beeth. We’re at a conference with Ron Paul. Really interesting to meet him, and I love his network.

 

And so I thought I’d tune in, listen to what show he has playing. And lo and behold, some really enlightened people. It’s really refreshing. I enjoy your talk.

 

Monika Schaefer: Well, thank you so much! And did you have a question for our guest?

 

Bradley: I can’t think of one, really. [chuckling]

 

Monika Schaefer: Okay. Well, it’s really, really nice. It’s very refreshing to have your call. Thank you so much!

 

Bradley: Okay, thank you.

 

Monika Schaefer: Okay.

 

Bradley: Bye bye.

 

Monika Schaefer: So, Oscar, is there anything in particular you want to lead the conversation into, or carry on with?

 

Oscar: Well, I’ll just touch on the Holocaust for a minute.

 

Monika Schaefer: Yes, very appropriate. Because I do see that as the linchpin lie, underlying jewish power. That’s how I see it. Anyway, do, …

 

Oscar: But, yes, I mean, that’s correct. I mean, in a way, they very much predicated their future on the Holocaust lie. And that’s probably one of the reasons they so fiercely protect the Holocaust lie. I mean, pretty much every Western country now has laws against denying the Holocaust. I mean, even in Russia, it’s against the law to deny the Holocaust.

 

But there’s a very simple formula I use, and this applies to any agenda!

 

So when you have any agenda that requires censorship, you know it’s a lie! Whether it’s the Holocaust, Covid, 9/11, whatever! If it requires censorship, it’s guaranteed to be a lie! The truth never requires censorship!

 

Monika Schaefer: I agree. I agree 100%! The truth does not fear investigation and it does not fear debate about it. Yeah, that’s absolutely true!

 

And I would say that the Holocaust epitomizes the jewish narrative of always being the persecuted people and that everybody’s out to get them. And the Holocaust is the modern day, like, it epitomizes that narrative that goes back a long ways! I think they’ve been crying the blues about being the persecuted people for a long time! But now, Holocaust is the modern episode of that.

 

And why are they making all these laws in all our countries? It’s because if that, it’s not a matter of if, it’s when, because it’s already happening big time. The Holocaust lie, when that falls and really falls, their whole house of cards tumbles down!

 

This is what I think. Because boy, oh, boy, I think the Holocaust lie underpins everything! I mean, when we object to immigration, they shout:

 

“Oh, racist! That’s Holocaust is gonna happen! Another holocaust is gonna happen [chuckling] because you’re racist!”

 

I mean, that’s just one example, but it underpins their power, let alone all the money they’ve extorted for it.

 

We have another caller, Ed, in Iowa. Would, would you like to bring in Ed?

 

Oscar: Sure.

 

Monika Schaefer: Mr producer. Do we have? Okay, Ed.

 

Ed: Hello?

 

Monika Schaefer: Hello. Welcome to the show.

 

Ed: Okay. I wasn’t sure. I didn’t know I was on.

 

Monika Schaefer: Okay, go ahead. Do you have a question, or a comment?

 

Ed: I have a comment. And it’s a extremely important for everybody to listen to this. What do you think is the biggest lie that we’ve been told to keep us in check? What do you think it is?

 

Monika Schaefer: Go ahead, Oscar, if you want to answer that.

 

Ed: Do you guys know what it is?

 

Monika Schaefer: I mean, me, I think it’s the holocaust, but go ahead, Oscar.

 

Ed: No, no, it’s not even close! The biggest lie that they’ve told us is that they are the sovereigns. Okay? Here, what I’m saying. They have told us over and over and over and over that they, the government, and of course, the people that will operate the government are the sovereigns. That’s what they’ve told us over and over and over.

 

And so what does that do to the mindset of all the people? It makes them believe, obviously, it makes them believe that they don’t own anything, that they are serfs, I guess, if you want to call it that.

 

But the truth is, Donald Trump has said this several times. And I guess it goes in one ear and out the other. But he said many times:

 

“This country belongs to you guys!”

 

And that is absolutely, 100% correct!

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah, I guess in terms of thinking that we are governed, who has the right to govern us. That’s what you’re saying, right? In effect.

 

Ed: Right!

 

Monika Schaefer: Oscar, do you want to comment on that? Because we only have a little bit of time left, and I’d like to give you the chance to comment on that, Oscar.

 

Oscar: Well, that’s a very good point, because most people, you know, look to government to solve all our problems, and they’re the ones creating all the problems. So it’s, again, it’s kind of an upside down situation. We have to stop being so dependent on the government. But the government, that’s one of the things they do is they want to make us more and more dependent on the government. You know, they want to bring in Universal Basic Income and all that stuff.

 

Monika Schaefer: Very communist. So we only have a minute left, and I would just like to thank you so much for coming on, Oscar. That was really, really interesting. I enjoyed it a lot.

 

I also want to tell the listener that next week, Blackbird9 is going to be taking my spot. This was a commitment I had even before I took on this show. So he’s going to be gracious enough to extend his Snack Shack to 2 hours. So I will see you all in two weeks from now. But thank you, Oscar!

 

And if you want to have a last word, you have about a half a minute. And thank you also to Ed and the other callers for calling in. Thank you. Go ahead, Oscar.

 

Oscar: Okay, Monika. Yeah, thanks for having me on. I would just say that from what we’ve seen, especially with Covid, don’t comply with the next fake agenda that they try and push on us. You know, don’t comply with digital ID, digital currency, don’t comply with bird flu, or don’t comply with anything to do with the Green New Deal. Vote with your dollar. It’s much more effective than your vote at the ballot box.

 

Monika Schaefer: Thank you. Those are really good last words. Thank you so much! Okay, bye for now!

 

[58:27]

 

[music]

 

[58:49]

 

[ad]

 

[59:59]

 

 

END

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See Also

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Monika Schaefer – The Flipside with Monika – Ep 1 – Intro – Jun 29, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 2 – Jul 6, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 03 with Paul Fromm – Jul 13, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 08 with Alfred Schaefer – Aug 17, 2024 – Transcript

Monika Schaefer – The Flipside with Monika – Ep 15 with Jürgen Neumann on Ernst Zündel – Oct 12, 2024 – Transcript

 

 

 

 

Keith Woods: All right. Welcome, everyone. I’m back. I have a big guest today. A lot of you were really looking forward to this, and a lot of you have requested this before. It’s Ron Unz, the editor publisher of the Unz Review, one of my favourite websites. I often plug it at the end of streams here. You’ll notice when I’m recommending links for people to check out. And yeah, great, great aggregator of stuff that’s kind of broadly in the sort of dissident Right scene, or not even just dissident Right.

 

I mean, they publish people like Michael Hudson and so on. And his own series, American Pravda, is something I would recommend to everyone as well. I’ve been listening to the audio versions of that today where Ron goes over sort of revisionist history, takes on the 20th century as it relates to World War II and the JFK assassination, 9/11, and so on. And yeah, I’m excited to have one. It’s great to have you here, Ron.

 

Ron Unz: Hey, great to be here.

 

Keith Woods: Thank you. So what’s your own background? You don’t seem like the typical kind of person to end up in the position you’re in. It seems like you have a more sort of establishment conservatism background. You’ve been involved in Republican Party politics. So yeah, just like, what’s the general background there of how you made your way to kind of this side of things?

 

Ron Unz: Well, I mean, my original background was actually in theoretical physics.

 

In other words, I originally thought I studied theoretical physics in college, and I thought I’d probably be doing an academic career. And then basically around the mid 1980s, I ended up taking a detour where I took a summer job working on Wall Street. One thing led to another, and I ended up actually spending about the next ten years or 15 years of my life writing financial services software for Wall Street firms. And after about a year or so, I love to set up my own small company. And that really was sort of my main activity for a long period of time like that.

 

Now, I’d always been very interested in public policy and politics, and so after I moved back to California in the early mid 1990s, I ended up becoming involved in some of political campaigns out here. I just was very unhappy about what was going on in the state, and I actually ended up I didn’t expect to win, but I actually ended up challenging Governor Pete Wilson for renomination in his own Republican primary and then got involved in various other issues initiative campaigns, for example. I ran a series of successful initiative campaigns to shift California and the rest of the United States away from teaching immigrant children in their native language, so-called bilingual education towards making sure that they were taught English from the first day of school.

 

In other words, it seemed to me it really made no sense for children when they start school, not to be taught the English language and that ended up really being quite successful.

 

And in fact, bilingual education has largely disappeared around the United States because of those efforts. And I got involved in various other political activities as well. And then probably it was then probably about the mid to late 1990s when I became again actively involved in public policy, again more on the issue of international foreign policy.

 

In other words, I was very concerned about some of the actions we were taking, especially after the 9/11 attacks when we shifted towards the attack on Iraq, the Iraq, War, which I viewed as being probably a disaster.

 

And so I ended up actually providing some financial support to a magazine, the American Conservative, that was set up to oppose the policies of George W Bush with regard to Iraq and a lot of other things like that.

 

And so I ended up serving as a publisher of The American Conservative for about, I guess it was probably about seven or eight years. And then just about a decade ago, I ended up leaving to set up my own website, the Unz Review, which I thought would be a useful venue for my own writings.

 

In other words, at that point, at first I really was thinking more in terms of eventually doing a lot more writing of my own and having a website that I could basically use to publish my material on.

 

And then as it was, I got tied up with some software issues for a few years.

 

And so the website really primarily was providing a location for other writers, alternative media from the Left and the right to really have their articles published. Because in some ways one interesting thing I noticed gradually was that sometimes people, both who considered themselves very much on the Left or on the Right sometimes actually agreed with each other about many things that they might disagree with the more mainstream of the political spectrum on.

 

So it was the sort of thing where I felt by providing an Avenue for both people from the Left-Right libertarian camps to sort of cross-fertilize each other and trade ideas, it would show that sometimes they might agree with each other on things that they didn’t even realize. So that really had been probably the main thing I’ve been involved in over the last ten years.

 

And then about six or seven years ago, I ended up getting much more actively involved in going back to writing of my own. And just as you mentioned, the American Pravda series, which deals with a lot of controversial issues from the last 100 years of American society, is certainly the place where I’ve published most of my articles, basically during the 1990s. Most of my writings probably dealt with issues of race and ethnicity and social policy, affirmative action, bilingual education, multiculturalism, immigration. While probably in the last six or seven years, the focus probably has been more on foreign policy history and again, sort of looking at the history of the 20th century.

 

Now, one other thing I should mention is that from about the mid 1990s onward, I actually was involved in a major project to digitize the collected archives of many of America’s leading public policy magazines or opinion magazines of the last 100 years The Nation, The New Republic, National Review, Harpers, and also a lot of magazines that disappeared that had been once very influential but then had gone out of business. And by going through and digitizing all those old publications, I really came across a lot of facts and interesting aspects of American society from the 1920s, 1930s, 1950s that really I’d been very unaware of just by standard college history courses or things like that.

 

So, in other words, it provided a great deal of background information that was new to me and new to other people. And that’s actually one reason I started questioning a lot of the history that I learnt in college. Because when you actually come across articles published in America’s leading magazines from the 1910s and 1920s and you see the picture they portray of American society is so different than what you’d always imagined it was at the time, it really just opens your mind to other possibilities.

 

So, I mean, that’s a fairly long introduction, but that’s basically where I came from on these sorts of issues.

 

[0:07:50]

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, you mentioned immigration. You haven’t always had sort of an anti-immigration stance. That’s one thing I noticed looking back at your articles. When did that kind of change happen? You kind of evolved your stance on immigration in around the early 2010s, is that right?

 

Ron Unz: Right. I’ve always had mixed feelings about immigration, but generally very opposed to many of the anti-immigration activists around.

 

In other words, basically, it seems to me, immigration has both positives and negatives. And probably the biggest negative that’s become apparent to me in the last, 20 years looking at American society has been the impact of large scale immigration on economic issues.

 

In other words, one reason, for example, for the severe economic decline of much of American society has been, I think, the very large scale immigration we’ve seen over the last 30 or 40 years. A lot of the critics of immigrants say that immigrants are lazy, they’re on welfare or something like that, or they commit a lot of crime, and I don’t think there’s really any evidence for that at all in American society. Now, it may be different in other countries, but not in America.

 

The problem, though, is that when you bring in a large number of eager workers who are willing to work for low wages, you obviously, by the law of supply and demand, drive down the wages for everybody competing against them in American society. And that, I think, is probably one of the strongest arguments you can make against existing American immigration policy.

 

And the flip side of that is the exact reason why America’s business groups business interests have been so strongly pro-immigrant because they see that large scale immigration helps to keep down the wages of the workers. And so things that are beneficial for, obviously, employers or for business groups can be very harmful sometimes for the economic interests of the workers who they’re employing by driving down their wages.

 

And one of the interesting things about it is if the issue were handled, I think, the right way, it would be much easier for America to solve that problem than many of these, for example, anti-immigrant groups have focused on. And the reason for that is that the groups most competing with new immigrants in American society are existing immigrants, recent immigrants.

 

So for example, if the issue were cast in economic terms like that, I think a very substantial fraction of America’s immigrant or recent immigrant population would be certainly very supportive of the notion of taking steps to reduce the flow of future immigrants.

 

And in fact, one of the issues that I raised that probably was my own contribution to debate, which really had, I think, pretty substantial impact, is the issue of one of the best it’s the minimum wage.

 

In other words, the whole notion of raising the minimum wage to a much higher level by itself, I think would tremendously reduce some of the immigration problems because most of the immigrants who come here are obviously willing to work for relatively low wages. If you raise the wage, the minimum wage, to something much higher, 12 or $15 an hour, it would act as a formidable deterrent towards immigrants basically coming here since they wouldn’t be able to take those jobs very easily. And it would also act as a formidable deterrent towards business groups hiring workers at a lower wage since the wage would not be that much lower. And what I ended up doing about that was basically about seven or eight years ago, I ended up shifting the debate in American society on the minimum wage and successfully causing a revival of the minimum wage as a major issue in American society.

 

So for example, in California right now, the minimum wage is $15 an hour where as of a decade ago it was, I believe, about $8 an hour. So we’ve roughly doubled the minimum wage in California. And the same thing, for example, has happened in various other parts of the country as well, though it’s not happened on the national level. And if more effort were put into raising the minimum wage, I think that would be a very effective means of severely greatly reducing the problems that immigration has been causing in American society and decreased a lot of the incentive for immigration down the road.

 

[0:12:23]

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, your articles on immigration are interesting. To look back at them, you were making arguments that were seemed to be very unpopular at the time, that some tropes about Hispanics committing disproportionate amount of crime actually wasn’t accurate, Hispanic immigration.

 

And you also pushed back, which I thought was interesting, against the narrative about the 1965 Immigration Act, right. That’s pretty popular in Right-wing circles in the US. Like, it kind of all went wrong after the 65 Immigration Act. Like that’s what opened the borders. That’s what changed this immigration policy from exclusive to Europeans to open it to everyone. You had a very different take. You said the 1965 Immigration Act actually restricted immigration because it did something about the ease with which South Americans could immigrate to the US.

 

Ron Unz: Sure, it’s really a very simple issue. America traditionally had an open immigration policy for basically most of our history.

 

And then in 1924, an immigration act was passed severely restricting immigration from Europe.

 

In other words, we cut off most of our immigration from Europe, and at the same time it eliminated immigration almost entirely from Asia or from Africa.

 

So in other words, Eastern Hemisphere immigration was largely reduced in the 1920s partly because of concern over these economic issues or political issues.

 

In other words, there was a movement to restrict foreign immigration to the United States, but it excluded the entire Western Hemisphere.

 

So in other words, we kept our open borders policy towards Latin American and Caribbean immigration.

 

In other words, anybody from Mexico or the rest of Latin America who wanted to immigrate to the United States would have to pay something like, I think it was $14 or $18, wait a couple of days, and they could immigrate here. So in a sense, we kept what amounted to an open borders immigration policy towards Latin America. The reason we didn’t have much immigration from Latin America for the 40 years that followed was that Latin America was tremendously underpopulated.

 

In other words, the population density was lower. So there just weren’t that many people who would come here. Some came, but not that many. And then it turns out, in about the 1940s, 1950s, and 1960s Mexico and Latin America, the rest of Latin America underwent a tremendous population boom, a population explosion.

 

For example, the population of Mexico, I think had quadrupled in a period of about 50 years, even excluding the large number of Mexicans who moved to the United States. So it turns out the 1965 Immigration Act was widely perceived as increasing immigration to the United States because it reopened the possibility of large scale immigration from Europe and from other parts around the world.

 

In other words, we undid the 1924 Immigration Act, and Europeans suddenly could move to the United States, where for about 40 years, very strict quotas had been placed against most of the European countries.

 

But at the same time, the 1965 Immigration Act also imposed quotas for the first time on Mexico and the rest of Latin America.

 

So in other words, prior to the 1965 Immigration Act, there was no limit on Latin American immigration. And given the fact that Latin America was right around then beginning to experience a tremendous population explosion. If not for the passage of the 1965 Immigration Act, you could imagine millions upon millions of Latin Americans moving to the United States as immigrants every year.

 

And so while it’s true that about 60 million Latin American, sorry, 60 million Americans are either immigrants or the descendants of immigrants from those parts of the world after 1965, if not for the passage of the 1965 Act, the numbers probably would have been much higher. It could have been 100 million or 150,000,000 or something like that, simply because changing immigration law in the United States is obviously a very difficult thing to do politically.

 

And in fact, as you know, I mean, for decades now we’ve been arguing about it, and simply because with business groups very interested in having immigration at very high levels, they can almost always block any members in Congress to reduce immigration.

 

And in fact, for the last, 20 years, business groups have been making an effort to even further open our borders, to have an amnesty and increase immigration even to much higher levels than before. So it sounds, I mean, it’s very counterintuitive. And certainly many individuals focused on immigration issues are under, are unaware of the facts. But the truth is, the 1965 Immigration Act, by sharply restricting immigration from Latin America for the first time, probably prevented much more immigration than it supported.

 

In other words, we had many more immigrants from Europe and we had many more immigrants from Asia than we would have without the 1965 Immigration Act. But if it hadn’t passed, probably Latin American immigration would have been far larger than it ended up being.

 

And since the majority of our immigrants have come from Latin America, it sounds counterintuitive, but the 1965 Immigration Act probably played a role in reducing net immigration to the United States rather than increasing it. And that’s something, again, that most people aren’t aware of its the sort of thing a lot of anti-immigration websites have written on the subject over the years. And when I’ve brought it to their attention and they’ve checked into it, they’ve found out that what I was saying was correct.

 

And so they’ve stopped writing new articles denouncing the 1965 Immigration Act. But they obviously can’t take down the hundreds of articles they’ve previously written on that subject.

 

And so it’s one of these things, it amounts to sort of a mistake that got into circulation about 30 or 35 years ago that probably will never be corrected. But it’s the sort of thing with all those thousands of articles there misfortune the 1965 Immigration Act. It’s hard to say what will happen, but I mean, basically anybody can go and just check the details.

 

In fact, you can even read Kevin MacDonald’s book on The Culture of Critique where he actually discusses the 1965 Act and the fact that it actually, for the first time, restricted immigration from Latin America. So it’s simply a factual matter. And there are a lot of stats floating around the Internet, and that’s simply one of them.

 

Keith Woods: Well, I don’t mind this narrative because it vindicates the Irish, right? We always get blamed for the 65 Immigration Act. Wasn’t it Ted Kennedy?

 

[0:19:26]

 

Ron Unz: Yeah, he actually played a very minor role.

 

In other words, basically he was a very junior Senator at the time. And it’s true. Certainly the Irish groups and jewish groups and Italian groups were all in favour of the 1965 Act because their immigration had been cut off to the United States.

 

And so it was suddenly opened up again after 40 years. But the number of European immigrants the point is, Europe was no longer suffering a population explosion at the time, and Europe had also become quite prosperous by 1965 or 1970. So there wasn’t the pressure to move to the United States that there probably would have been 30 or 40 years earlier.

 

Keith Woods: And you mentioned this a little bit earlier when you’re talking about the arguments around immigration and the fact that you think newer rivals in the US. Could be won over to Nancy immigration position. That’s another narrative that was very popular a few years ago, this narrative about immigration that if it’s not stopped in the US the Republicans will never win another election. And eventually they’ll realize this and they’ll become sort of an implicitly White anti-migration party. Didn’t quite play out that way.

 

But it is interesting looking at some of the polls from the last couple of years where it seems like among what’s classified as Hispanics, however they divide that up, that it’s like 50-50 Democrat-Republican, and some of them even lean Republican. So a lot of the things people took for granted about demographics and the political process there seem to be being challenged.

 

I’m just curious how you see that playing out. Like, do you think the Republican Party can become a party that’s viable in this new multiracial America? And then what does that do for the debate around immigration? It almost seems like it’s taken something of a backseat since Trump. Like there was a little bit of disappointment about Trump, and now I don’t know, I get this feeling among people on the Right in the US that they almost feel like that’s lost to an extent in terms of managing the demographics, like on the state level. But yeah, I don’t know what your feelings are about that.

 

Ron Unz: Well, I certainly think I’m not too surprised that there’s been a substantial shift of Hispanics and Asians towards the Republican Party.

 

In other words, they’re right now getting the Republicans are still getting less than half, but it’s probably 40, 45, sometimes closer to 50% from Hispanic and Asian groups. I don’t think it’s so much that the Republicans have attracted them, but many of the policies of the Democrats have been so disastrous that they’ve pushed many of those groups away.

 

For example, I think probably the biggest issue has been the crime issue.

 

In other words, there’s been a gigantic rise in urban crime in many parts of the country. And you’ve probably seen some of the videos where especially attacks by blacks on Asians, many times elderly Asians have been attacked and killed just walking on the street.

 

And so that, I think, has caused a tremendous shift of Asians towards the Republican Party simply because when you have a situation where there was a massive increase in crime in the United States, urban crime a year or two ago, and the response of many prominent Democrats was to say, we have to defund the police.

 

I mean, that’s utter insanity. And that, I think, is probably the reason many ordinary Hispanics and Asians started giving another look towards the Republican Party.

 

Also, for example, a lot of what I guess you could call the sort of wokeness or the transgenderism, those are not things that are particularly appealing to ordinary Hispanics or Asians or Whites, for that matter blacks. In other words, a lot of people who are more ordinary working class people have been pushed out of the Democratic Party because of some of its extreme positions it’s taken.

 

And so, again, it’s not a question of, like all the Republicans, the Republicans gaining necessarily 60% or 70% of these groups, but there’s definitely been a shift in that direction. It’s interesting that the shift started probably about four or five years ago.

 

In fact, if anything, when Donald Trump was elected, he ended up actually doing much better among Hispanic voters than anybody expected.

 

In other words, the media portrayed Trump as being a fanatic hater of Hispanics, that he attacked Hispanics, that he said all these nasty things about them, and surprisingly enough, he actually got a much larger share of the Hispanic vote than most people expected because he ran on working class concerns.

 

In other words, he ran saying, I intend to improve the economic position of ordinary working class Americans. Most Hispanics are working class, and so they were attracted by that argument, even if they were repelled by some of his other arguments. And then once he came into office, the fact that in some ways the economy was doing better under him caused again, many of those people to shift in his direction.

 

[0:24:30]

 

So the funny thing about it is, even though Donald Trump was portrayed as a tremendous villain by the media, somebody who hated Hispanics, who was anti-Hispanic, racist, he actually came close to getting the highest Hispanic percentage of any Republican president in modern times, almost equaling what Ronald Reagan had done 30 or 40 years ago.

 

So it’s the sort of thing, the Republican Party, if it’s simply concentrated on issues having to do with these economic facts or some of these social issues like the extreme policies in the public school. Sometimes I think it just naturally and a law and order policy I think would probably do much better among Hispanics and Asians and Whites and to some extent blacks than it would be if it simply tried some of these other things.

 

I mean, the whole thing about it, a lot of the Republican elites tend to believe that support for higher levels of immigration is the way to win Hispanic votes, and that’s not at all the case.

 

In other words, Hispanics are mostly motivated by bread and butter issues, by meat and potato issues, and larger scale immigration, in other words, is not something necessarily that improves the economic posture of ordinary Hispanic workers since they would be competing against these new immigrants.

 

And so for that reason, I think, for example, there certainly could be some political strategies the Republicans could follow that would be much more advantageous in that way. But I don’t really see any sign of the Republicans actually adopting it, partly because the Republicans are so much the captive of the same business interests that support large scale immigration that the Democratic Party is as well.

 

So, I mean, from my point of view, I think many of the attacks against immigration over the last, 20 or 30 or 40 years have been severely misguided. But I do think strong arguments can be made towards reducing immigration on entirely different grounds, and I think probably those lines of attack would be much more successful than what the Republican Party or what Conservatives have tried to achieve over the years.

 

Keith Woods: Another thing I’ve noticed recently, especially since I went back looking at Twitter, and I don’t know if this is due to Elon Musk’s, Twitter being more relaxed on this stuff and not having shadow banning, but it does seem like there’s something of a sea change in terms of people are really discussing the issue of black crime now. And it’s not just a few kooks out there like Jared Taylor or Colin Flaherty. It’s quite mainstream Conservatives that are discussing this issue. And you go on Twitter and there’s constantly these viral videos showing what it was like in public schools for White children and so on. Yet Scott Adams and his recent outbursts, which got a lot of support, actually. Yeah.

 

I’m just curious about that it’s kind of something people have been speculating on lately. Why do these mainstream Conservatives that have ignored this for so long seem to be embracing it now? Or is it just an organic thing that the viral effect of this stuff being out there, and after all the years of censorship, that eventually it just reached a boiling point. But yeah, I don’t know if you have a take on that or what, …

 

[0:28:00]

 

Ron Unz: Well, I mean, all of those things are factors, but another factor is black crime in the United States has become much, much worse than it was a few years ago.

 

In other words, in the aftermath of the George Floyd incident in Minneapolis that really forced a lot of the police to be adopting a much more defensive posture.

 

And again, there have been all these cases of, for example, police being prosecuted on grounds of, for example, sometimes even just shooting back at a black criminal and things like that. And so when you have so many police being very worried that they could become the next sacrificial lamb on something like that, if somebody takes a video of them, I think the police basically have pulled back in a lot of these cities.

 

And at the same time, the media narrative has been so extreme the last couple of years, the notion of, for example, police murdering large numbers of backs, killing blacks for no reason at all, that I think has in turn, enraged much of the black population.

 

And so there’s been a tremendous rise, I think, in the degree of black violence in many of these urban centres. Again, I mean, some of the things, for example, that have happened in San Francisco and other parts of the country, New York City as well. Elderly Asians simply walking on the street and suddenly being attacked and beaten or sometimes even killed by blacks in a random fashion. That was not something that was occurring five or six years ago. And things like that get on YouTube, they get on Twitter, and they go viral in just the way you’re saying.

 

So when you look, for example, at the rate of black homicides, it’s much, much higher than it was a few years ago.

 

Keith Woods: Do the policies of Trump have anything to do with that? He had the First Step Act, and he had a few Acts that kind of relaxed restrictions in terms of letting violent criminals out of prison early and so on. Did that play a factor?

 

Ron Unz: Oh, I think it certainly did.

 

In other words, Trump on that issue, in a sense, followed very much the liberal agenda, which was strange because.

 

I mean, the media portrayed him as an ultra Right-wing fascist or something like that. But I mean, he basically supported the media line of basically letting a lot of criminals out of prison.

 

So, for example, there’s been a tide of that.

 

For example, back about 20, 30 years ago, when crime was very high, there was a massive wave in California and other states to put people in prison for much longer periods of time. There was the three strikes movement, and in California, the percentage of the population incarcerated rose dramatically.

 

So in other words, many more people were put in prison, which might have gone too far in that direction. But on the other hand, with so many people in prison, obviously crime went down.

 

And so then for about 15 years, 15 or 20 years, with a decline in crime rates, partly because of those very high levels of incarceration, then there began a movement saying that we should really let more people out of prison, we should reduce sentencing, we. Should eliminate three strikes. And that ended up developing momentum of its own.

 

So now, for example, the number of people incarcerated in prison in California is much lower than it was ten or 15 years ago, and sentencing is much laxer. Unfortunately, one result of that is that crime rates are much, much higher than they had been, especially violent crime rates, which is what people are most concerned about.

 

There was also an effort, for example, on the part of various liberal or left liberal donors, George Soros being the best example, to fund District Attorneys who would be much less harsh on criminals than before. And that actually happened. The District Attorney, for example, in San Francisco was recalled from office because crime rates had spiked under his laxer policies. And there’s an effort actually to recall the District Attorney in Los Angeles for the same sort of reason.

 

So in other words, it’s been a mixture of a number of different factors. There was a sense that America was incarcerating too many individuals unfairly, and in many cases, those individuals were black. There were too many black men in prison.

 

And so that shifted towards an effort towards letting them out of prison, which resulted in tremendous increase in crime rates, especially in combination with the police being very nervous about being filmed and being sentenced if a criminal ended up dying or was an innocent person was shot in any of their actions.

 

So it’s a mixture of basically the police being much more cautious than they were in the past, District Attorneys sometimes refusing to press charges with the severity they had in the past, and many prisoners being let out of prison. And the result of that has just been much, much higher crime rates before.

 

Also, for example, in some cases in California, for example, I think shoplifting less than I think was like a couple was changed to misdemeanors.

 

So, for example, cases there were video cases where people would, for example, walk into a grocery store or walk into a drugstore and just fill a shopping bag with items that they then would sell on Ebay or sell on the Internet. And when someone like that basically is not prosecuted for the crimes, and when ordinary shoplifters are not prosecuted, it obviously gives people an incentive then to escalating to more serious crimes.

 

And here, for example, in Palo Alto, there have been many cases over the last few years of gangs of ten or 15 or 20 people coming here from Oakland or coming here from another city, rushing in a group into a high end department store and just stealing everything. Stealing, for example, Apple, looting an Apple store, looting other stores, sometimes breaking into, …

 

Keith Woods: Jewelry stores.

 

Ron Unz: Exactly. And when things like that get on the Internet and there’s a sense developing that crimes like that are not being punished, it obviously causes many other people to start considering doing something similar.

 

So I mean, crime is certainly a serious problem in the United States, and probably within a few years there’ll be such a reaction against it. We may go back to what we had 20 years ago with much stiffer sentencing, but at least for now, I mean, one reason there’s more concern about crime is that crime is much more severe than it was.

 

[0:34:45]

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, the popular issues for the Right are always crime and immigration. Right. I mean, you can see it with the guy in El Salvador, like, massive support for his policies. But yeah, it’s incredible. You get someone like Trump in office and he took extremely liberal positions on that issue. But I’m sure it’ll be more of a focus as maybe immigration becomes a bit more contentious and the country becomes more multiracial. I’m sure the crime issue will come more to the forefront.

 

But by the way, for the people watching, we’re also live on Cozy TV. We actually have more viewers on Cozy than YouTube tonight, which is interesting. The sort of old tech side is winning. There’s 500 watching there live. And you can send Super Chats if you have a question for Ron Unz on Power Chat. The link is there.

 

Now, actually, the reason I asked you on originally was because this thing about the origins of Covid right. The US government started putting this out that now they believe that it came from a Chinese laboratory.

 

And I thought it was interesting because immediately the reaction of the sort of old media types was like, oh, the conspiracy theorists have been proven correct again, and this kind of vindicates us. And we’re always right in the end, and the mainstream has to give in and not approach it with a great deal of skepticism. The government lies about everything, but not this kind of thing. And so, yeah, I went back to your articles on this because you’re one of the few people that has been pushing an alternative theory. There’s kind of been two theories, right. The sort of mainstream accepted theory was it came out of a wet market. It was like a natural mutation.

 

And then a lot of people speculated that it came from the laboratory in Wuhan. There are arguments for that. Supposedly someone that worked on the WHO investigation said that China pressured them heavily not to investigate the lab.

 

But then that’s something they would do either way, right, if they don’t want that narrative circulating. But you’ve promoted an alternative theory that you think elements of the US government or the US Deep State are responsible and that this was a means of sort of economic warfare against China. But instead of me summarizing it, maybe you can explain it to the audience.

 

[0:37:13]

 

Ron Unz: Sure. Well.

 

I mean, the whole thing about is when the virus first appeared in Wuhan, right towards the basically, it was first discovered probably right at the end of 2019.

 

So, in other words, the world started hearing about it in January, early January 2021, obviously, nobody had any idea what was going on.

 

In other words, a mysterious virus suddenly appeared in the city of Wuhan, and it seemed contagious it was spreading. And people also weren’t even sure how dangerous it was, what the death rate would be. And there were obviously a lot of concerns. And fairly quickly, within about a month or two, a standard narrative was formed, the sort of official narrative on the part of the American science establishment that the virus was natural.

 

In other words, it had mutated in probably a bat or some other form of animal, and it spread to the humans in Wuhan and then was going out from there.

 

So, in other words, the natural virus theory ended up being the dominant establishmentarian narrative for about a year, a year and a half in the West. And it was supported by a couple of paper, early papers that came out in nature health and in science magazine, where a number of very respectable scientists said that the virus was obviously natural.

 

Now, at the same time, there was a counter-narrative, fairly widespread in the alternative media and also anti-China groups that got started very early on. And that narrative was that the virus had come from a laboratory.

 

Keith Woods: I remember, sorry to interrupt. I remember Steve Bannon was pushing this very, …

 

Ron Unz: Exactly, and it got started very early.

 

In other words, basically, I ended up hearing it seeing on the internet in January, probably early to mid January, before almost anybody in the world was even focused on Wuhan.

 

In other words, before the virus had spread to any other country. And the story that they were putting out was that the virus had come from the Wuhan Institute of virology. Now, it just so happened the city of Wuhan, most Americans, most Westerners had probably never heard of Wuhan. I don’t think I’d ever heard of Wuhan until the viral outbreak.

 

Wuhan is a large city. It has a population of 11 million, but it’s an interior city, so it’s not the sort of city that most Westerners. It’s not like Beijing or Shanghai. And Wuhan is the site of China’s most advanced viral research facility, the Wuhan Institute of Virology, which was set up, I think, about eight or nine years ago.

 

So it makes perfect sense. We suddenly have this mysterious virus appearing in a city in China, and by an amazing coincidence, that same city has China’s most advanced viral laboratory. So it didn’t take too much to put two to two plus two together. And to see that why many people started arguing that the virus had probably leaked out of the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

 

In other words, the argument was some people claimed it might have even been developed deliberately as a Chinese bioweapon. Others said, oh, the Chinese were just running experiments on viruses in that facility, and it suddenly leaked out.

 

So in other words, the two arguments that ended up being widespread for really the last three years are, first of all, the natural virus argument, which is basically that the virus is entirely natural. It simply came from some animal species and happened to appear in the city of Wuhan at that time.

 

The other narrative, which was supported by many members of the Donald Trump administration trump sometimes implied it. Mike Pompeo implied at some of the people of his administration is that it leaked from the Wuhan Institute of Virology, the lab leak hypothesis. And then once it leaked, it then spread around parts of the city of Wuhan and eventually spread around the rest of the world.

 

So, in other words, it was a Chinese virus that devastated the United States eventually when it got here, that devastated Europe that’s probably killed 20 million people around the world.

 

And so, again, those are perfectly plausible theories.

 

But one thing that made me very suspicious early on, as early as January, before almost anybody was paying attention to that virus in the city of Wuhan, when it was just getting a little bit of coverage, there was already a tremendous propaganda campaign in the alternative media, especially the anti-China alternative media, portraying the virus as having come from the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

 

In other words, it happened very early on. Radio Free Asia, which is one of America’s propaganda outlets, was talking about the virus having leaked from the Institute, the Wuhan Institute of Virology, as early as January 6, before anybody else in the world was even paying attention to this disease, before a single person had died in the city of Wuhan. And that basically made me suspicious about why would there have been such a massive propaganda campaign targeting China and targeting the virus before almost anybody in the world was even paying attention to some obscure disease in the city of Wuhan, which most people had never heard of at all.

 

So early on, I started thinking that there are obviously two possibilities. The virus might be natural, or the virus might have leaked from the Wuhan Institute of Virology the way some people were suggesting. But there was obviously a third possibility as well. At that point, the virus appeared in the city of Wuhan when America was at an extreme international confrontation with China over issues of trade, over issues of national security.

 

In other words, China and America were in a confrontation at that point in time. What then happened a few weeks later, …

 

[0:43:01]

 

Keith Woods: That was the time the Hong Kong protests were going on.

 

Ron Unz: Exactly.

 

Keith Woods: This is part of Covid as well.

 

Ron Unz: Exactly. Hong Kong protests. And there’s a lot of suspicion that America, …

 

Keith Woods: Well I mean, they were definitely like, funded by the National Endowment.

 

Ron Unz: Exactly!

 

In other words, basically there were a lot of suspicions that the CIA or some of the American intelligence organizations were putting together the Hong Kong protests to basically cause trouble for China to disrupt China’s control over Hong Kong.

 

And again, I mean, that’s the sort of thing countries do all the time. But it seems to me that at that point in time, first of all, you’ve got to understand, I mean, China already had a larger, real economy than the United States. As far back as 2014, the Chinese economy was growing much more rapidly than the American economy, and it was larger in real terms and had been larger for a number of years. China was building up it’s military, and by all measures, all American national security experts agreed that China was America’s most formidable international rival down the road. And in the immediate terms, in other words, there was a feeling that Russia was weak, Russia was declining. America, anyway, had two to three times Russia’s population, a vastly larger economy than Russia.

 

So China was considered the future threat for the United States. And that’s actually why, for example, when Donald Trump became into office, one of his first actions was to take economic action against China.

 

In other words, saying, we have to reduce China’s economic strength. We have to cut our trade ties with China. We have to block, for example, China’s technological development. And America ended up kidnapping the chief financial officer of Huawei, restricting exports to Huawei, China’s most important technological company.

 

So, in other words, America was taking all these actions targeting China.

 

And so it just made me suspicious at the time that this mysterious viral epidemic breaks out in China at the point when America is most hostile to China.

 

And then a few other things came out, probably by about the end of January, I’d come across some other facts which I hadn’t been aware of at the time. First of all, the virus appeared in Wuhan probably towards the beginning of probably early November, possibly late October, but more likely early November.

 

Now, it turns out that was exactly when Wuhan was holding the international military game, the world military games, at that point in time. And there were 300 American military officers participating in those games in the city of Wuhan.

 

So just looking at it logically, if 300 Chinese military officers visited the city of Chicago in the United States, and immediately after they left, a mysterious viral epidemic suddenly broke out in the city of Chicago, it would certainly make people quite suspicious of what was going on.

 

I also found out that it turns out in the years 2018, there had been I probably should step back a little bit. This is stuff that basically I ended up working out five months, six months later, but really all ended up falling into place.

 

There’s a man, for example, named Robert Kadlec who for decades has been America’s leading biowarfare advocate. As far back as the 1990s, he was writing articles saying that biowarfare was the wave of the future. Biowarfare was the best means of severely damaging an international adversary and doing it in a plausibly deniable means, in other words, so that nobody could prove what was going on, a virus would appear in another country. And he pointed specifically at the use of viruses to damage the food supply and the economy of a geopolitical rival.

 

Now, it turns out Robert Kadlec was brought into the Trump administration in 2017. In 2018, China was suddenly hit by a mysterious viral epidemic that severely damaged it’s poultry industry.

 

Then in early 2019, right at the beginning of 2019, China was hit by another mysterious viral epidemic that wiped out 40% of China’s pig herds, the largest in the world and China’s primary meat source.

 

So, in other words, we have America basically elevating a top biowar for advocate to the Trump administration.

 

And then in the following two years.

 

[0:47:50]

 

Keith Woods: What position did you say he had?

 

Ron Unz: In the Trump administration? Assistant Secretary of Health and Human Services, which, strangely enough, that’s Fauci’s area, in other words, basically, he ended up being, he was basically put in as America’s chief biowarfare expert or something like that. He actually served a similar role in the George W Bush administration about 10 or 15 years earlier, but he was brought in in 2017 in the Trump administration.

 

And then in 2018 and, 20019, China’s food supply was suddenly hit by these mysterious viral epidemics, with some claims that the swine flu was being spread by small drones.

 

In other words, there were rumours in China, there were stories going around that drones were spreading the disease throughout the entire country.

 

And then in late 2019, suddenly the Covid virus appeared in the city of Wuhan.

 

Now the city of Wuhan, even though most Americans have not heard of it, it’s one of China’s leading transit hubs. It’s a city of 11 million, and it’s the place where many of the rail lines converge.

 

China has Lunar New Year holidays, which are the equivalent of Christmas, New Year’s, and several other holidays all rolled into one. During Lunar New Year 450,000,000 Chinese typically travel. In other words, they basically travel to their ancestral villages. They travel back home again if they’ve been working in cities. So it’s by far the biggest holiday for China. Now, the virus appeared in the city of Wuhan.

 

Keith Woods: That’s in February, right?

 

Ron Unz: Exactly, that’s basically January, February, late January, early February. The virus appeared in the city of Wuhan and then started growing exponentially. So since it was a new virus that nobody heard of I mean, the Chinese only discovered it’s existence on the last day of December in 2019, and the Chinese didn’t even realize that it was contagious until early January 2019.

 

Once it then began spreading in the city of Wuhan, the Chinese finally, then in mid to late January, ended up instituting a severe lockdown and managed to stamp it out. But if they waited just a couple of weeks, the virus then would have spread throughout the entire city of Wuhan. And Wuhan, being a transit hub it would have spread out throughout the entire country of China with probably tens or hundreds of millions of Chinese being infected. The result of that.

 

Keith Woods: I’m just sharing an image on screen there for the audience, just to illustrate what you said about the Wuhan as a transportation hub. You can see in the green is Wuhan, and it’s right in the middle of all of these lines that connect these major cities like Shanghai and Guangzhou and so on.

 

Ron Unz: Exactly. Now, the whole thing about the virus, at first, nobody really knew how dangerous it was, and most of the evidence that come out later, obviously, it’s very much more dangerous to elderly people than younger people.

 

In other words, I think if you’re over 60, you have 100 times greater chance of dying than if you’re under 40. But overall, for the average American population, the death rate is something between 0.5 and 1%.

 

So in other words, we’re talking of a sort of bioweapon potentially that would not wipe out a population, but still it ended up killing about a million Americans.

 

So the result of that, if it had spread out throughout China, China would have to if tens of millions or hundreds of millions of Chinese have been infected, China then would have had to take tremendous economic measures, locking down the entire country to prevent millions upon millions of Chinese deaths. In a sense, China would have had to do, under those circumstances, very much what America end up doing once it’s spread back here. And so we would have seen tremendous disruption to Chinese society, disruption to the economy, as happened all around the world.

 

And so the point about it is probably the best way of looking at this type of virus, of these characteristics, is that it would have the characteristics of a very effective anti-economy bioweapon.

 

In other words, something that isn’t an anti-personnel weapon. It’s not intended to kill 30% or 50% or 70% of the population, but because it would be fatal to enough people, it would cause tremendous disruption in a society if it became widespread in that society.

 

So anyway, I’m jumping at it myself on some of that. But what I then ended up, as the pieces started coming together, one thing I discovered about a year later, which really was quite surprising, was, as I said, Robert Kadlec was America’s leading biowarfare advocate. And it turns out from January to August, 2019, he ran something called the Crimson Contagion Exercise, which was a federal state planning session, a series of exercises on how America would prevent leakage of a dangerous respiratory virus if such a virus were to appear in China.

 

So we’re talking about from January to August, 2019, America, under it’s chief biowarfare advocate, ran this massive planning exercises exercise to prepare itself for the appearance of a potentially dangerous Covid like virus in China. And such a virus then appeared in the city of Wuhan, just a couple of months later, which seems an awfully remarkable coincidence, if it were a coincidence.

 

Another factor which, …

 

Keith Woods: Can I just ask. I’m just imagining, like, someone that’s skeptical, listen to what they’d be then pushing back. Why did the US seem so kind of unprepared for the whole thing? It took a few months to even react, right?

 

[0:54:01]

 

Ron Unz: Exactly. America’s reaction was unbelievably incompetent.

 

I mean, the whole thing about it is not only that, but we botched the production of the CDC testing kit.

 

In other words, we did almost everything wrong. You can imagine the scenario I’m talking about, this sort of biowarfare scenario. The key factor to keep in mind is there’s absolutely no evidence that Donald Trump himself was at all aware of or involved of what was going on.

 

In fact, there’s tremendous evidence that he was absolutely not aware of what had happened. When the Covid virus started leaking back to the United States, and infecting people here, Trump basically said, oh, it wasn’t a problem, it would go away itself, people should ignore it, it wasn’t dangerous, that sort of thing.

 

So there’s absolutely no chance that he under my scenario, that he would have been aware of what had happened.

 

My argument is that it probably was an action taken by lower level officials in the Trump administration, probably a small hand.

 

Keith Woods: Wouldn’t they have foreseen that America won’t be prepared for this, and this will potentially do as much damage to the US?

 

Ron Unz: You see, part of it is that America dominates the world of propaganda.

 

In other words, America really dominates the world of media and propaganda. And one problem is you sometimes tend to believe your own propaganda.

 

Remember when the SARS epidemic, the original Coronavirus epidemic, suddenly appeared in China in 2002 and, 20003. It never spread much outside of China. It had a very high fatality rate, I think it was 20% or 30%.

 

So it was a very dangerous virus, but very few people outside of China were ever infected or died. It never spread to the United States, I don’t think. I think maybe one person died in the entire country. When the MERS epidemic, another Coronavirus suddenly appeared in the Middle East. I think it was 2007, 2008, something like that. It never much spread outside the Middle East, and not a single American ever died of MERS. So we had these two previous waves of Coronavirus infection, both of them natural.

 

In other words, they found the animal reservoir, neither of which had done any damage to the United States, it turns out. The National Health Organization, in late 2019, did a study on which countries in the world were best prepared to cope with any epidemic that might appear. Any dangerous epidemic. America was ranked number one. Britain was ranked number two.

 

In other words, all the West European countries were considered to have the best healthcare systems at coping with any epidemic of any sort that might appear. China was down around 50 or 60.

 

So in other words, anybody naively looking at all these international comparisons would have thought, well, SARS never got to the United States, MERS never got to the United States. The previous Coronavirus epidemics from the Middle East and from China had never done any damage to the United States. All the international bodies agree that America is best prepared at coping for any respiratory or other epidemic that might happen.

 

And so they might have believed that by organizing these exercises, eight months worth of planning for potentially dangerous Chinese virus that might appear that plus these other steps would basically safeguard America from any significant blowback. So it’s possible a few Americans would be infected, a few Americans would die, but by contrast, China potentially would be devastated.

 

In other words, hundreds of millions of Chinese might have been infected if the Chinese hadn’t reacted as quickly as they did.

 

And so the problem was the reality ended up being very different.

 

In other words, partly because of Trump’s basically unwillingness to confront the virus once it started leaking back into the United States, America basically just reacted very, very poorly.

 

And in fact, we had no idea how to cope with it.

 

In other words, our testing kits didn’t work. We refused to use the German testing kit that they’d already produced. And so for that reason, we had no idea what we do. And we ended up implementing lockdowns, then off and on for about a year or two, and then a controversial vaccination drive after that.

 

So the problem is, the scenario I’m talking about is not a scenario where America’s national security establishment as an organized body spent months or years planning and biowarfare attack against China.

 

The scenario I’m talking about is a small group of individuals, probably one or two of them near the top of the Trump administration, deciding to take this step without Trump being aware of it, without getting his authorization and simply deploying the resources, the lower level resources of the American national security establishment in this action, but without Trump or the top officials knowing what had happened.

 

[0:59:15]

 

And so, because Trump didn’t realize the virus was dangerous, he basically prevented any effective reaction once the virus unexpectedly leaked here and started infecting people. And there are a lot of other factors involved as well.

 

One early thing that made me extremely suspicious about the virus being more than it seemed was the fact that the second country in the world hit the hardest with Covid early on was Iran.

 

In other words, Iran became the second epicenter of the Covid world-wide outbreak, even though it has one of the lowest Chinese populations in the world.

 

In other words, only a few thousand Chinese people live in Iran, while the other countries that were fairly early, like, for example, northern Italy, has 300,000 Chinese living and working there, many of whom had returned from the Lunar New Year holidays and been infected and carried the infection there. Spain was another very country early infected. 150,000 Chinese live and work in Spain. So we had countries that basically had hundreds of thousands of Chinese, as you would expect, getting early infections with Covid because they got it from travels back to China.

 

And then you had the holy city of Qom, the centre of Iran’s political and religious establishment, becoming the epicenter of Iran’s Covid outbreak sooner than anyone, any other country in the world. And the infections hitting China’s political and religious elite. For example, 10% of Iran’s entire Parliament became infected by Covid before a single political figure anywhere else in the world had become infected. And that all happened.

 

In other words, if you trace back the pattern of infections in Iran, the first Iranians probably became infected just two or three weeks after America had assassinated Iran’s top military commander, general Kostam Suleimani.

 

So in other words, we have a situation where America assassinates Iran’s top military commander, and just a few weeks later, the Iranian political elites are infected with this mysterious virus, even though Iran has much less of a connection to China than most of these other countries that have not yet been infected. Not only that, but at the time all this was happening, I really was very surprised that nobody in the world noticed what was happening in Iran.

 

I mean, the fact that the Iranian infections had happened right after Iran’s top military commander had been assassinated and I couldn’t imagine why the Iranians hadn’t noticed what I noticed just by reading the newspapers. And then I found out a year later, not only did the Iranians accuse America of having launched a biowarfare attack against Iran and China, it was in all the Iranian newspapers. The Iranian political leaders accused them. They even filed a formal complaint with the United Nations accusing America of having launched a Covid biowarfare attack against Iran. But none of it was ever reported in the American media.

 

[1:02:21]

 

So in other words, it never got into the New York Times, it never got into the Washington Post, it never got into the Wall Street Journal.

 

So Americans were simply not aware of the fact that the Iranians were accusing America of having launched a biowarfare attack.

 

So we have a situation where basically the two countries in the world at that point in time that America was most hostile towards were China and Iran. And those were the two countries hit with this mysterious viral epidemic that had characteristics later argued obviously came from laboratory. And that’s actually something I should say from the beginning. I’m not somebody who is a trained virologist. I’m not a microbiologist. So I’ve generally stayed away from the science aspects of the issue, even though my background is in physics. Physics is not microbiology.

 

So the point about it is I can’t say whether the virus itself is natural or artificial. But there’s been a tremendous amount of evidence that’s come. Out over the last year or two. That the virus. That the characteristics of the virus, the genetic characteristics of the virus, the [word unclear] and cleavage sites. Other aspects of the virus are exactly the sort of thing you would expect to be produced in a laboratory and are very different than would defined in any of the other Coronaviruses that would be found in nature.

 

So, in other words, the individuals who are advocating the lab leak hypothesis are really making two separate points. They’re pointing to a tremendous amount of evidence that the virus was produced in a laboratory, the virus was a product of bioengineering, the virus did not come from nature.

 

And then they’re making the case that, well, if it came from a laboratory, well, there’s the Wuhan Institute of Virology in the city of Wuhan. That’s obviously a place that must have come from the problem is that there’s very, very little evidence that the virus either was created in the Wuhan Institute of Virology or that there was any lab leak in that Institute.

 

For example, just to give an example, early on, there were all these claims made of, for example, people having gotten sick in the laboratory or the virus having spread earlier, but there’s really very little evidence for any of that.

 

And in fact, there have been some quite a lot of detailed examinations of the timing involved. And the timing really shows that virtually nobody in China was aware of any virus spreading until right towards the end of December, in other words, long after the virus had appeared in the city of Wuhan.

 

Furthermore, an Australian biologist named Danielle Anderson was actually working at the Wuhan Institute of Technology during the period in question. She was very friendly with the people. It’s a research Institute. It’s not a biowarfare lab or anything like that. And she specifically says she’s seen absolutely no sign that a virus of that type was being worked on in the laboratory, was being developed there. There were no indications of any lab leak having occurred, and she’s very skeptical of anything like that having happened.

 

Some Western journalists then interviewed a lot of the people at the laboratory, and there’s simply no indication that any of them were aware of anything going on, any sort of lab leak or anything like that.

 

Furthermore, when you look at the pattern of infections in the city of Wuhan, the pattern of infections is on the other side of the city from the Wuhan Institute of Technology.

 

So, in other words, if the virus had leaked out of the laboratory, you would expect at least some of the early infections to be in the vicinity of the laboratory. But instead, it’s about ten or 12 miles away on the other side of the river, centreed on the wet market that people were often talking about.

 

In other words, that’s clearly where the virus first appeared.

 

[1:06:22]

 

So we’re talking about a situation where there’s really quite a lot of scientific evidence and a lot of people who have great deal of expertise on the structure of viruses, on DNA issues say that the virus very clearly came from a laboratory, was bioengineered.

 

In fact, someone like, for example, Professor Jeffrey Sachs, who was the chairman of the Lancet’s Covid Commission, he really became very suspicious that the people he’d put on the commission who were investigating the origins of the virus were simply covering up the fact that the virus was artificial rather than natural.

 

In fact, many of the early statements that have come out, you have all these experienced biologists saying what they looked at. The structure, the structure of the virus clearly came from a laboratory.

 

In other words, it’s not the sort of thing you would expect to come from nature. So essentially, there are three possibilities. There’s the natural scenario, the lab leak, accidental lab leak scenario, and the third scenario, which I think is by far the most likely, which is the deliberate biowarfare scenario.

 

Most advocates of the lab leak scenario spend their time and effort arguing that the virus was bioengineered in a laboratory, that it has characteristics, genetic characteristics of that sort, and they have very little evidence to supporting anything like a lab leak having happened at the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

 

Most of the supporters of the natural virus theory focus on the fact that there’s very little evidence of a lab leak. And when you look at, for example, the spread of early infections, it’s on the other side of the city. There’s simply no evidence for any lab leak having occurred. And they tend to soft pedal the characteristics of the virus itself, which arguably seem quite likely to have been produced in a laboratory.

 

So we’re talking about a situation where if you look at the third scenario, which I think has the advantages of the other two, but none of the disadvantages, we’re talking about a situation where America is in a major confrontation with China and Iran, the two countries America is most hostile towards.

 

America has the oldest and largest biowarfare programme in the world. We’ve probably spent about $100 billion over the last 60 or 70 years on biowarfare, and suddenly a mysterious virus breaks out in China and Iran, hitting those countries right after America spent eight months in the Crimson Contagion Exercise, preparing itself for the possible appearance of a dangerous respiratory virus in China.

 

And so all of that, I think, is really quite strong evidence. But there’s one piece of evidence that really constitutes something closer to a smoking gun.

 

As I said, Donald Trump almost certainly had nothing to do with this.

 

And by the way, I should say that under normal circumstances, the notion of America or any major country launching a biowarfare attack against a leading international adversary without the leader of that country, without the President of the United States being aware of it, is utterly ridiculous. But the Trump administration was not a normal administration.

 

In other words, there were all these other things going on that were entirely kept away from Donald Trump.

 

In fact, some of the stories came out afterwards. Some of Donald Trump’s top aides would hide his own Executive Orders from his desk.

 

Keith Woods: I remember there was something published in the New York Times where it was like the headline was something like, I’m a member of the Deep State, and I’m sabotaging Trump’s administration plan to be a senior member.

 

Ron Unz: They just ignored him totally. Again, what I’m talking about in this case is a small group of individuals deciding that America has to strike a major blow against China, it’s greatest long term adversary, severely damaging the Chinese economy, maybe even causing the overthrow of the regime, and also probably striking Iran at the same time. And obviously, they really felt, well, Trump is not the sort of person to bring it into the loop on something like this.

 

So the fact that Trump was totally unaware of this meant that when the virus started leaking into the United States in the way that nobody really expected at the time, our reactions, trump basically told people to ignore it, pay no attention to it, forget about it. It would go away by itself. And so we ended up having a huge epidemic. By April, tens of thousands of Americans were becoming infected, and many of them were dying. It was spreading around the country. It was a gigantic disaster.

 

So for very obvious reasons, our intelligence agencies decided to try to explain to the public that they were not the ones responsible for this horrible disaster that potentially could kill hundreds of thousands of Americans. And four separate intelligence sources went to ABC News and told them that the Defense Intelligence Agency, one of our leading intelligence agencies, had produced an intelligence report describing this potentially cataclysmic disease outbreak taking place in the city of Wuhan, had distributed to our top officials, had sent it to the White House and ignore it.

 

[1:11:46]

 

So in other words, the intelligence agencies were trying through the leak, through the leak to ABC News, to explaining that they had warned the government of what was going on. They had warned of this terrible epidemic taking place in the city of Wuhan and the danger of it spreading. And the government, the White House had just ignored the problem.

 

So it wasn’t the fault of the intelligence agencies. And basically, it’s exactly the sort of thing you would expect them to do they basically had a secret intelligence report.

 

Now, the truth is, probably many, many of these reports are constantly being produced, warning of all sorts of things going around the world.

 

And so it’s not too surprising that Trump paid no attention to it. But the key thing is, the date of the report was November. It was early November when the report was produced.

 

So, in other words, in early November, the Defense Intelligence Agency had produced a secret report describing a potentially cataclysmic disease outbreak taking place in the city of Wuhan before there was an outbreak in the city of Wuhan.

 

In other words, according to most of the current timelines, probably in early November, there might have been ten or 15 people who’d just gotten infected in the city of Wuhan and were starting to feel a little sick. In a city of 11 million, there’s no way the Defense Intelligence Agency or any outside source could have been aware of what was happening at that time.

 

So that, in effect, was a smoking gun of foreign knowledge of the events. Now, as you can imagine, the Pentagon immediately denied the existence of the report, even though four separate intelligence sources had confirmed the fact that the report existed when they leaked it to ABC News. And it had been reported by the top people at ABC, the Pentagon, when they realized they were talking about November, that the report had been produced in November, they claimed the report had never existed.

 

But then a week later, Israeli TV reported the fact that naturally the report existed. The report had been sent to Israel, the report had been sent to all of our NATO allies, the report certainly existed, and the report had been produced in the second week of November.

 

So we’re talking about a situation where the Defense Intelligence Agency had produced a secret report distributed to our NATO allies, to Israel, and to our top government officials about a potentially cataclysmic disease outbreak taking place in the city of Wuhan before any significant number of people have been infected. And that is exactly the sort of thing that I think demonstrates foreknowledge, again confirmed, …

 

[1:14:27]

 

Keith Woods: Just for the people watching what should people search just to find that specific report, because an interest in the report?

 

Ron Unz: No copy of the report was ever actually leaked.

 

In other words, we don’t have a copy of the report, but it was reported by four sources to ABC News and then separately confirmed by Israel that it was sent to Israel and our NATO allies. And they describe the report and that sort of thing. It’s in my articles, and in fact, there’s sort of a summary that provides links to the ABC News story and the Israeli TV news story that explain the nature of the report.

 

So we’re talking about a situation where if you have foreknowledge of something like that, it’s very, very difficult to explain that unless at least some people in the American government were aware of the disease outbreak before anybody in China.

 

In other words, there’s absolutely no evidence that anybody in China and the Chinese government was aware of the virus invisibly spreading in the city of Wuhan until right towards the end of December, six or seven weeks after the American Defense Intelligence Agency had produced a report talking about this potentially cataclysmic disease outbreak taking place in the city of Wuhan.

 

So when you’re talking about something like that, again, that is basically the hard information we have. We have these news stories. ABC News, the New York Times reported the Crimson Contagion Exercise that went on for eight months right prior to the appearance of the virus.

 

The scenario, I think that’s most plausible to explain that evidence is, again, a small group of officials, probably one or two of whom might have been near the top of the Trump administration, decided to deal a severe blow to our Chinese and Iranian adversaries using an anti-economy bioweapon of the sort releasing in Wuhan and then separately releasing in the whole city of Qom, infecting them and damaging them.

 

And then they probably then notified individuals in the Defense Intelligence Agency saying that they had some intelligence report about some disease epidemic in the city of Wuhan.

 

In other words, it’s not at all clear whether anybody who produced the report in the Defense Intelligence Agency would have been aware of what I believe was an American biowarfare attack against China. It’s simply that they would have then been leaked intelligence probably by some of the conspirators.

 

Keith Woods: Wouldn’t you expect China to be aware of this, China’s own intelligence agencies and so on? And would you have expected them to go public with this?

 

Ron Unz: That’s the whole thing.

 

In other words, the Chinese, early in 2020, in February and March 2020, started making some accusations towards the United States.

 

In other words, they basically claimed the virus had been brought to China, probably by American participants in the Wuhan war exercises.

 

Keith Woods: They haven’t been disclaimed?

 

Ron Unz: Again, they’ve never specifically accused America of a biowarfare attack.

 

In other words, they’ve claimed America probably brought the virus to China, without specifying the circumstances. And I think probably part of it is there’s no proof.

 

In other words, it’s not that the Chinese or anybody else has proof. America dominates the world media. And so if the Chinese made accusations, people would say, well, where’s your proof? And they wouldn’t really have any proof.

 

In other words, what I’ve explained right here is, I think, a lot of strong evidence in favour of this scenario, but it’s not hard proof.

 

In other words, there’s absolutely no hard proof. It’s not like we have a confession by any of the participants of the world military games or anything like that. And the other thing to remember is the Iranians did specifically accuse America of a biowarfare attack. Their media reported, the top leaders reported it. Nothing happened.

 

In other words, the world media, which is under the control of the West, totally ignored the Iranian accusations and it did them no good at all.

 

Keith Woods: Arguably the US, just after killing Soleimani. You’d imagine Iran would maybe accuse the US of being involved regardless, right?

 

Ron Unz: Well, that’s actually one reason they did it, is because the timing. In other words, the fact that the disease outbreak hit the Iranian political elites like three weeks after we’d assassinated their top military commander. I mean that sort of coincidence is just so amazingly strong. I mean, you know, the whole thing is the fact that the virus allegedly jumped 4,000 or 5,000 miles from the city of Wuhan in China, all the way to the holy city of Qom in Iran, which has almost no Chinese population, was just a very implausible thing.

 

And so the Iranians naturally put two and two together and accused America, but again, they didn’t have any proof.

 

Another thing I should mention is back, …

 

[1:19:28]

 

Keith Woods: You think there would have been a separate leak done by the US in Iran?

 

Ron Unz: Yeah.

 

In other words, there’s no way. It’s very unlikely it would have suddenly jumped thousands of miles to a city with almost no Chinese population. It’s possible, …

 

Keith Woods: I guess maybe one objection is you said like previous SARS viruses, like they didn’t leave China so the people conspiring this would have thought, well, this will do damage to China, but we won’t really have to worry about it. But if they were looking at the Covid virus specifically, what seems to make it unique is how contagious it is and how easily it spreads.

 

And even in January 2020, there were people saying like, restrictions lockdowns, that would all be pointless because the way this virus functions, there’s basically nothing we can do except let it spread. It’s too contagious to do anything about.

 

So the theoretical people planning this, would that not have factored in that, well, this is so contagious that it would be impossible to confine it to China and Iran and the whole West is going to have to deal with it.

 

Ron Unz: It obviously ended up being a total disaster. What you’re saying is exactly what happened. But remember the scenario.

 

Keith Woods: So you think they probably didn’t take exactly how the virus would, …

 

Ron Unz: Well, the whole thing about it is the scenario I’m talking about is typically when a government like the United States might consider an action like this, it probably would go through 20 levels of planning stages.

 

In other words, we’re talking about a huge number of different individuals being brought into setting up the procedures for something like that, going through all these different possibilities.

 

The scenario I’m talking about was basically a rogue operation run by probably a small group of conspirators in the Trump administration. Since it was a rogue operation that was kept away from Trump himself and kept away from most of other top officials, they couldn’t have basically had all these planning sessions. It was probably just a small group of people who really ran the thing more in a seat of the pants operation.

 

In other words, basically they assumed that some of these defensive measures like the Crimson Contagion Exercise, the fact that the SARS virus hadn’t spread, the fact that the DIA secret report would warn of the epidemic taking place in Wuhan. They probably believe that the combination of those factors and America’s outstanding public health system ranked internationally as the best in the world at coping with any epidemic.

 

Keith Woods: When you say elements of the Trump administrator, are you mentioning something like a John Bolton type figure that’s working with elements of the CIA?

 

Ron Unz: Probably the two most likely suspects.

 

And again, there’s no way of telling who would have been involved under my scenario, but the two most likely suspects, I think, would probably be Mike Pompeo, the Secretary of State who’d previously been head of the CIA, or John Bolton, the National Security adviser. They were both ferociously anti-China. They were the leaders.

 

Keith Woods: Pompeo was very bullish, very against China, I think. Wasn’t he head of the CIA when the Hong Kong protest. There’s a suggestion that he may have been heavily involved there.

 

Ron Unz: Exactly. And for example, and John Bolton, by some accounts, John Bolton, we basically ended up kidnapping the CFO of Huawei, the daughter of the founder, when she was changing planes in a Canadian airport, and we ended up holding her for about a year, a year and a half.

 

I mean, it really almost caused a complete rupture with China. Allegedly, John Bolton ordered that, the seizure of a top Chinese business leader without informing Donald Trump.

 

In fact, the story came out about six months ago. Donald Trump afterwards said, but you arrested somebody who’s like the equivalent of my daughter in China. Why did you do that? And Bolton basically had done it without Trump’s permission.

 

So when things like that happen, when America basically arrests one of China’s top executives and potentially imprisons her for 20 years in the United States and it’s done by John Bolton, without informing Donald Trump of what he’s doing.

 

I mean, that’s exactly the scenario I’m talking about, where you had Pompeo and Bolton, either of them being senior enough to have organized something like this with a small group of conspirators around them.

 

In other words, their aides, their assistants. But I think probably someone like that could have arranged something like this. And the whole thing about it is, from their point of view, Trump, they probably regarded as being they probably didn’t want to take the risk of raising this sort of possibility with someone like Trump and just basically deal a severe blow to China and Iran without Trump knowing about it.

 

And then, obviously, once it ended up being a gigantic disaster and a million Americans died as a consequence, with two years worth of lockdowns, with all the controversies over vaccines under that scenario, obviously the people involved would be very concerned about anybody being becoming aware of what happened.

 

[1:24:48]

 

Keith Woods: All right, just one other question, because I just imagined the other thing that the audience would maybe be skeptical of is how useful Covid would even be as means of economic warfare. I’m sure people will say, well, it only really killed people that were very elderly or had underlying conditions. And even if the Chinese didn’t deal with it with severe lockdowns or whatever, they could probably more or less get on with business as usual. That is kind of the, I think, sort of dominant consensus on Covid. Now, it’s maybe worse than the common cold, but not as serious as was originally taught when it entered the West?

 

Ron Unz: Right. Well, you’ve got to remember, right now we’re talking about the Omicron version of Covid which is much milder than the original Wuhan version. Also, at the time the virus first appeared, nobody would be sure about the fatality rate.

 

In other words, remember, the original SARS that appeared in China had, I think, something like a 15% fatality rate. And early on in the first few weeks, there were all these rumours going around that the virus was extremely deadly.

 

So, in other words, if you’re the Chinese government, and if you have a massive spread of this virus throughout your country and you don’t know anything about the fatality rate, you don’t know that it would generally be targeting only the elderly. You couldn’t take any risks.

 

So, in other words, if the virus had spread throughout the entire country, probably 10 or 15 million Chinese would have died.

 

In other words, the original version of the virus probably had a 0.5% to 1% fatality rate. China has 1.4 billion people.

 

So if you multiply it out, I mean, we’re talking about many, many millions or even tens of millions of deaths in the country, plus a complete collapse of the Chinese healthcare system because it wouldn’t only be the people who would be dying, but the people who would be very sick for a period of a few weeks.

 

And also, the thing about China is China is a country that is much more respectful of its elderly.

 

So, in other words, a disease that would kill a large fraction of their people in their 70s or 80s might be treated even as a greater risk than something in the West, where there isn’t as much respect for elderly, including, for example, the party leaders in China.

 

So the whole thing about it is I’m not saying, for example, that the virus involved necessarily would have wiped out China’s entire population, but it probably was sufficiently contagious and sufficiently deadly that a country like China would have had to take very strong lockdown measures to control it. And if hundreds of millions of Chinese had been infected, it would have had a devastating impact on Chinese society.

 

The interesting thing about it is there was actually a 40 year veteran of American biowarfare who ended up writing a number of pieces on the Internet. And I ended up checking into his background, and it looks like he probably is exactly what he claimed to be. And he really was arguing it was basically in January when I came across some of his statements. He argued that the ideal sort of anti-economy bioweapon is something with a low fatality rate, but a very high rate of contagion.

 

In other words, something that was very infectious but had low fatality rates would tremendously disrupt a society.

 

In other words, if you had something, for example, that would simply kill 10% of the population, it probably would do less damage to a society than something that would infect 80%, 70 or 80% of the population. Even if only made the people sick and only killed a small fraction of them, it would tremendously disrupt a society.

 

So the point about is if the original Covid virus had spread around China, killed many, many millions or even tens of millions of Chinese and devastated the country, you could easily imagine the result would be a collapse of order in China.

 

In other words, people would blame the government for having failed in its mission to protect them. I mean, just like for example, look at all the incredible anger there’s been in the West over the fact that the governments have fallen down on the job with regard to the lockdowns, with regard to all these other policies.

 

So the point about it is, again, it wasn’t designed to be 100% effective at destroying China, but it was probably felt by the people involved that it would have a good chance of dealing a severe body blow to China, damaging the Chinese economy, damaging Chinese society and destroying much of the political legitimacy of the ruling Communist Party, which it probably would have if they hadn’t reacted as effectively as they did.

 

Because remember, even in the last six months, or a year, there’s been a lot of growing resentment in China towards the endless lockdowns to control the virus. And that’s despite the fact that the West and the rest of the world had suffered much more severely over the last couple of years than China did.

 

So in other words, there was some loss of legitimacy in the Chinese government even under the circumstances where 20 million people have died around the world with almost nobody dying in China until very recently.

 

So the whole point about bioweapons, as Robert Kadlec had written back in the 1990s, they’re a plausibly deniable means of severely damaging an international adversary.

 

In other words, there’s no proof America had attacked China or Iran or any of these other countries with bioweapons.

 

And so there’s nothing really the Chinese or the Iranians could say internationally that the global media which America controls would take seriously.

 

Well, one other point I should make is about six or eight months ago, the Russian general in charge of biological warfare held a press conference focused on the biolabs, whatever the 20 or 30 biolabs that Russia claims to have found in Ukraine. Biological warfare labs that he claimed were preparing biological attacks on Russia. And he actually specifically accused America of having released Covid as a biowarfare attack against the rest of the world, especially China and Iran.

 

And again, it got almost no attention in the American media. So probably very few Americans are aware of the fact that the Russian government has now officially accused America of having released Covid as a biowarfare.

 

So we’re talking about the Iranian government, the Russian government, and to some extent the Chinese government have all pointed the finger of blame at the United States. But since none of it is ever reported in a serious way in the American media or the Western media, probably very few Westerners are even aware of it.

 

[1:31:53]

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, it’s a very interesting theory. I mean, like you said, there’ll probably never be a smoking gun. We’ll probably never know for sure. But I think out of the three plausible theories that you laid out, I think that probably is the most plausible in terms of fitting with the facts and explaining things.

 

Ron Unz: It’s partly, I’d say it’s the process of elimination.

 

In other words, there seems to be a great deal of evidence that the Covid virus was bioengineered in a laboratory.

 

So the natural theory goes out the window.

 

And also they’ve never found an animal reservoir.

 

If it came from a laboratory. The two possibilities are the Wuhan lab that leaked out or the sort of biowarfare scenario I’m talking about. And the problem is there’s just no evidence of a Wuhan lab leak. And there seems to be a lot of other evidence that elements of the American national security establishment were aware of the viral epidemic before it happened.

 

So I think the combination of those two things is strong enough that it’s the sort of thing if the American media or even the alternative media began reporting the story, in other words, if it got almost any coverage at all, it could be facts would be shaken loose. But virtually all the coverage, probably 99% of all the discussion has either been natural virus or lab leak. And nobody is focused on any of this other evidence, even though it comes from mainstream media sources.

 

Keith Woods: Now, another thing you’ve been writing about recently, which I shared to my Telegram because obviously this has been hot topic of discussion the last few months is the topic of excess deaths. And I don’t know if I can even see that says the V [vaccine] word on YouTube. The terms are so ridiculous but related to medical treatments broadly for Covid.

 

But you’re one of the few people I’ve seen in the kind of brother Alt media sphere that kind of actually took a hard look at this and broke it down by demographics, by vaccination status, by country, by obesity and health status. And yeah, they’re very interested in the articles. People complain to me a lot that I don’t talk enough about the topic of side effects and excess deaths.

 

But honestly, it’s like the only pushback I’ve really seen from the stuff you’ve presented is kind of a lot of anecdotal evidence. There’s a lot of articles of people dying from heart attacks, young people. The problem with that is it seems like if you had Covid, you’re seven times more likely to get myocarditis from the vaccine. Obviously, those numbers could be wrong, but still, in a time when a lot of people have had Covid, which does affect the heart, you would expect there’d be more myocarditis.

 

I mean, that’s the only thing I noticed from having Covid myself that was different from any regular flu, is I was getting like, very sharp heart pains, which was a pretty weird experience. But yeah, we know it affects the heart.

 

But anyway, the basis of your article is you broke it down and showed that although there are a lot of excess deaths in the US, the UK, some other countries, if you break it down by the working age population, a lot of countries actually have a mortality deficit. They have less than what would be the expected number of deaths.

 

And there’s a few interesting things to come out of your article. I’ll pull it up in a second while you’re talking. I should have had already. But yeah, there’s a few interesting things to come out of me.

 

One thing is that there’s no real correlation that can be established between the vaccine rollout and the excess deaths. Like, a lot of countries that’s pointed to they had excess deaths prior to the vaccine rollout, and then they have mortality deficit after.

 

Countries that have low vaccine rollout, like Bulgaria, I think it only has like, 34% uptake of vaccines. They have much higher excess deaths than some countries that have very higher vaccine rollout. There’s countries with almost 100% that have mortality deficits.

 

So the long and the short of it is there isn’t any direct correlation you can establish based on the numbers between vaccine status and deaths, even if there’s a lot of stories of a lot of people dying right now that’s being shared around.

 

And the other thing was the obesity element that you analyzed. So trying to find an explanation, you broke it down by obesity and well, maybe I’ll let you explain that aspect of it.

 

[1:36:30]

 

Ron Unz: Sure. What I focused on is the single most important factor that gives you a high risk of dying from Covid is your age.

 

In other words, elderly people have a vastly greater chance of dying of Covid than younger people. I think it’s probably if you’re over 60, you have 100 times higher chance of dying than if you’re under 40.

 

So the point is, when you’re looking at individual countries and seeing, for example, what the pattern is with vaccinations or with Covid deaths, excess deaths, it’s probably better to focus on the working age population. People who are I think the figure is generally from about 16 to about 60, 16 to about 64 in that age range. So that you’re sort of getting out of the fact that some countries have much higher elderly populations than other countries.

 

And then when I simply looked at those countries, I saw America had probably the highest rate of excess deaths of any country in the working age population. And strangely enough, the other countries with very high excess deaths were not the ones you’d sort of imagine.

 

In other words, basically, Canada, which had very different has a very different political system than the United States had very high excess deaths as well. Britain had high excess deaths. A few other countries did as well. While in the other countries, like Sweden or Denmark or the Netherlands had relatively low excess deaths. And the pattern seemed to be, more than anything else, it was due to obesity.

 

In other words, if you look at the charts of national obesity, those countries that have the highest rate of national obesity seem to have the highest rate of working age excess deaths. Which isn’t that surprising, because we know that Covid is much more dangerous to people who have weight problems, people who are obese than people who are thin or average weight.

 

So, in other words, it seemed to me that rather than looking at any patterns of vaccinations, or even the particular type of vaccination, the obesity factor was by far the most important element in determining the death rate, the excess death rate for working age populations. And when we’re talking about working age populations, excess deaths, we don’t have to worry about the fact of whether we’re talking about what they died, whether they died with Covid or whether they died from Covid. We’re simply talking about the total number of deaths in that country relative to deaths under normal circumstances for the few years before.

 

And so it seems to me that a lot of these concerns about vaccinations, I think, to be honest, are sort of misguided, or possibly due to the fact that in the United States we’ve had such a high rate of excess deaths. And the government the fact that the government and media in the United States has sacrificed the trust of so many Americans.

 

In other words, it’s been so dishonest about so many things for so many years that there’s naturally a sizable fraction of the American population that immediately becomes suspicious about anything the government or the authority or the media say on anything.

 

And so it seems to me that probably the obesity factor, just by looking at about 15 or 20 or 30 different countries, was the biggest factor in how much negative impact Covid had, how many people Covid killed outside of the elderly range.

 

Keith Woods: Now, one thing is, how is the expected deaths being calculated? Because for the countries that have a mortality deficit, this is something I’ve heard before for some of these projections is the expected deaths is based on the number of annual deaths from the past five years. Obviously, the past two, three years includes Covid itself. So maybe that expected number of deaths is higher than it should be, and then you get mortality deficit, but maybe you still have some excess deaths in there. Is that accounted for or how is, …

 

[1:40:36]

 

Ron Unz: There are lots of different ways of doing it.

 

So, in other words, every individual person can use the benchmark for excess deaths that they want. The one I was using was the simplest one possible.

 

In other words, in all of these countries, I just took the average deaths for the five previous years prior to the Covid epidemic, average prior to the Covid and comparing it now, that’s certainly not perfect.

 

In other words, for example, in some of these countries, there had been a steadily rising death rate over those five years.

 

And so it might be better to use, for example, a linear interpolation method or something like that. But the simplest possible method you can use is simply to average the deaths over the previous five years and compare it to the deaths for the last three years of the Covid epidemic. And that’s basically what I use in most of those countries.

 

Keith Woods: So, for example, I’m just sharing an image from the article you wrote.

 

So this is the US for 2022, ages 15 to 64, and orange is to say that there’s excess mortality.

 

So you can see it actually declines a little bit as the year goes on in 2022, which yeah, I don’t know what you make of that specifically, but I’ll pull up another one you included, which is the rate for France, where there’s actually a mortality deficit, like we said.

 

Ron Unz: Exactly.

 

Keith Woods: Yes, you can see that the blue is a mortality deficit.

 

So there’s actually less deaths than you would expect based on the five years prior to Covid.

 

Ron Unz: Right. And I mean, to some extent, we’re talking about, remember working age people where the death rate is normally very low with the lockdowns most of these countries had, the result was that, for example, regular illnesses like the ordinary flu was stamped out because of the lockdowns.

 

And also you had, for example, a decline generally in traffic accidents because fewer people were driving, factors like that. So it depends country by country. And I’m certainly not saying the differences are necessarily as enormous as those two tables there.

 

But when you’re looking at 30 or 40 different countries, each of them over three or four years, and the pattern seems very clear, that the ones with excess mortality in the working age population are the ones that have the highest obesity rates in the world charts that points towards obesity as being a very large factor. And it’s sort of interesting.

 

One thing I hadn’t realized is that for some reason, the countries in the Anglo sphere the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Britain tend to have much higher obesity rates than most of the other Western countries. I don’t know exactly why. Maybe it’s Western advertising, American advertising or something like that. But for example, you have much lower levels of obesity in the continent or in the Scandinavian countries than you do, for example, in Australia or Canada or Britain, and that seems to be the closest, the most important factor with excess deaths with Covid.

 

Keith Woods: Another thing I could think of in terms of trying to sort of steelman the other position of people we listen to this is could you say, okay, so we see some countries have a mortality deficit, but if we had two, three years of Covid couldn’t you say, like, Covid wiped out the low hanging fruit? In a sense, like it killed a lot of people.

 

And so then there are people that maybe would have died in 2022 or 23, but now they’re already dead. So then, basically, if you have a couple of years where there’s a lot of excess deaths and people with underlying conditions and overweight people are dying, then you’d expect that a couple of years after that, you’ll have a lot less excess deaths because, like I said, the kind of low hanging fruit is gone. So is that something you’re factored in? Because then maybe you could still have excess deaths against what you’d actually expect if you factor that in.

 

But if you compare it to the five years prior to Covid, it looked like a mortality deficit.

 

Ron Unz: Right. But what’s interesting is many of those countries had deficit mortality from the beginning of the Covid epidemic.

 

In other words, the deficit mortality began in 2020 and it continued in 2021 and, 20022.

 

So, in other words, there was no increase in deaths during the period of those years, despite the fact that, for example, many of them had very heavy vaccination drives.

 

Another example, which I focused on later in a later article, was that probably the country in the world that had the highest elderly population, the highest percentage of elderly population was actually Japan.

 

In other words, Japan had a much larger elderly population relative to its overall size than any other country in the world. I think 50% larger percentage or twice as large as any as the next most country in the world. So you’d expect a very high rate of Covid deaths in Japan for that reason. Also, Japan then had one of the world’s most extreme vaccination drives.

 

In other words, there was probably more vaccine in Japan than almost any other country around the world. And the result was Japan basically had relatively low mortality rates compared to most other countries.

 

So, in other words, when a country with a high elderly population that follows a very heavy vaccine schedule with boosting and vaccine still has relatively low deaths, to me, that’s evidence that the vaccinations aren’t nearly as dangerous as some people say.

 

[1:46:16]

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, I encourage everyone watching again to go and check out the archives. If you just search Ron on American Pravda, you’ll find the archive there. And I think that the Covid ones are all included in that because I’m sure a lot of the audience will be very triggered by that take, but I’d invite them to try and go through your article and disprove it because I tried to sort of steelman that position. But they’re the two objections that I could think of but you’ve dealt with them. And I really think what you presented in terms of cross analyzing the data is pretty solid.

 

But I guess that gets us to another question, actually, which again relates to another one of your articles, which I really liked, which is I think it’s called Alex Jones Cass Sunstein and Cognitive Infiltration. It’s something like that. I shared on my Telegram a while back. But it relates to the phenomenon of conspiracy theories, and obviously neither of us are blanket against conspiracy theories.

 

I mean, if people look at the American Bravo series, right, you have alternative texts on 9/11 and JFK, and your Covid theory and a host of other things. But you did analyze this phenomenon, which is interesting, the idea of cognitive infiltration. That there was this advisor to Barack Obama, Cass Sunstein, that wrote a paper where he talked about flooding the discourse of conspiracy theories to kind of introduce bad or ridiculous theories to kind of discredit anti-government narratives. It was actually Michael Collins Piper that talked about this a lot. You cited one of his books.

 

You thought an example of this was like the Sandy Hook thing, the narrative of crisis actors, which is a narrative that’s kind of persisted. I’ve seen that for other events like that since.

 

But maybe an obvious example people could think of is like some of the ridiculous theories that went around about 9/11. Like, that there was no planes, that there were holograms or missiles or something. But yeah, just a lot of very bad, very weird conspiracies related to 9/11.

 

I’m just curious because you’re obviously pushing this theory about the origins of Covid but at the same time, there’s been a lot of, I think, very bad, very weird conspiracies that have popped up on the Right since the origin of Covid And it seems like it kind of shifted the Right into a much more sort of conspiratorial frame. Like suddenly this old sort of Birch Society narrative about the UN controlling the world or Klaus Schwab and Bill Gates implementing global communism. This was like the very popular new frame among the Right. I’m kind of surprised in how mainstream it’s gone in terms of establishment. Conservatives talk about that kind of thing now, but you’re obviously pushing a theory about the origins of Covid.

 

But then you have theories out there. Covid doesn’t exist. There was these weird, like 5G theories I remember back in 2020, actually, I remember those few months. It was a weird time in terms of all the I almost forget about some of them, but like the 5G theory that there was nanobots going to be activated by 5G towers, all this kind of stuff.

 

So, yeah, I’m just curious. Do you think that was a case of what you described with the cognitive infiltration and flooding the zone with bad narratives. Do you think we’re seeing a lot of that on the Right?

 

[1:49:48]

 

Ron Unz: I think that’s very possible.

 

In other words, if you’re trying to basically hide something that is as serious as the scenario I’m talking about, one way of doing it is obviously just as you’re saying, to sort of flood the zone with a proliferation of every possible conspiracy theory so as to distract people, have them wandering off in different directions.

 

I mean, the strange thing about it is, in nearly all ways, my Covid scenario is actually a very mainstream establishment sort of scenario.

 

In other words, almost everything I’m saying about Covid is pretty much what you’d find in the New York times or most of these other publications, with the one exception being that it was an American biowarfare attack.

 

Now, the fact that America spent probably $100 billion on its biowarfare infrastructure over the last 60 or 70 years, the fact that we have the world’s largest biowarfare program, the fact that it’s the oldest biowarfare program, the fact that, again, it’s been giving out money through the Eco Health Alliance and all these other groups monitoring bio facilities around the world. I mean, all that is stuff you can just read in the New York times.

 

And the one element that is never discussed in the mainstream media is the possibility that elements of the American government might have used that biowarfare infrastructure.

 

And the truth is, when a mysterious, dangerous virus suddenly appears in the two countries that America is most hostile towards.

 

I mean, it’s not all that irrational to start wondering whether it might have been an American biowarfare attack. And when you start looking at the facts, I mean, one reason I’ve often said people are so reluctant even to raise this possible issue is because once they do, the pattern is so clear, the evidence is so strong.

 

I mean, the fact that basically the top Iranian leadership was infected with Covid in the holy city of Qom just a few weeks after we’d assassinated their top military commander.

 

I mean, that’s an awfully remarkable coincidence! And when all of these factors are brought into play, I think probably people would fairly quickly decide it’s at least as plausible as the other scenarios that they’ve been discussing.

 

So the problem is, once you sort of open the door, I think you’ll have a lot of people starting to ask themselves whether a million Americans died and we had years worth of lockdowns because of the blowback from a botched American biowarfare attack. And when you’re talking about, for example, Americans.

 

I mean, the suffering Americans underwent, I mean, probably the Covid epidemic, including everything about it, all the lockdowns, the deaths, the controversy over the vaccines, everything like that this is the worst disaster to hit the United States since the Great Depression. I mean, huge numbers of deaths huge amount of inconvenience. Our entire economy was disrupted.

 

And the fact that there’s a very real possibility it was because of a botched American biowarfare attack is probably almost too horrifying for most Americans to even contemplate. But we really have to ask ourselves, why did we get ourselves into the situation?

 

In other words, America’s biowarfare facilities had already gotten back in the 19, I think it was around 1968 or 1969, there was a famous case of a nerve gas facility in Utah that leaked and it killed 5000 sheep. If the wind had blown in a different direction, the nerve gas would have probably devastated Salt Lake City, Utah, and probably killed tens of thousands of Americans. For that reason, Richard Nixon, president Richard Nixon a year or two later, ended up announcing that we were terminating, we were abandoning our biowarfare facilities, and we signed on to international conventions to ban biowarfare. So in theory, biowarfare has been banned all these years, but it’s been brought in through the back door under the grounds of biodefense.

 

In other words, there’s really no difference between biodefense and biowarfare.

 

In other words, the argument is you produce all these dangerous viruses so that you can better defend against them. And the problem is whether it’s a lab leak or whether it’s something else. I mean, we’ve now had probably 20 million people around the world die from the impact of Covid. And if Covid had been more dangerous, if it had mutated in a more dangerous rather than a less dangerous direction, we could have had many, many tens of millions of deaths around the world.

 

So I just think it’s just unconscionable that neither the media, neither the mainstream media, nor even almost any of the alternative media until very recently has been willing to look at the facts regarding the Covid outbreak and the evidence that I’ve been writing about now for three years.

 

One thing I should say is, in the last few months I’ve been very impressed with the work that’s been done by the Daily Skeptic, which is a British alternative newspaper, alternative media outlet focused on Covid. They’ve really had a series, the editor has had a series of very good articles going through a lot of these issues, connecting up the dots, and I’d certainly recommend them very much.

 

But, I mean, the point is, aside from The Daily Skeptic and aside from the work that I’ve done, a very small number of people here or there, almost all of the alternative media has been very unwilling to look at the reality of what probably happened.

 

And now that, for example, the Covid epidemic is winding down now, I think to some extent, probably the controversy over the health measures taken to control it are subsiding. I think it’s much more important that people go back and ask how this disaster happened, especially with some of the hearings that the Republicans are now having in the House about the efforts that were made on the part of Fauci and others to basically start developing some of these dangerous viruses and do some of the bioengineering that could have led to the creation of Covid.

 

[1:56:04]

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, just on the topic more broadly of China and the US. We can get to the Superchats after this topic, but I guess this relates to the whole cognitive infiltration thing. You do observe this dynamic with the old media is very anti-China and the CCP, and they’ll often have a narrative like the mainstream media or the US Government is actually like pro-China, like we’re the anti-China ones. And you just get some utterly bizarre narratives, like the balloon thing recently that Biden is passing secrets to the Chinese, and he’s also letting them fly a massive spy balloon over the US. And all this kind of thing.

 

But, yeah, it does work. I mean, you get these conservative Right-wing types that are very skeptical of the mainstream media, very skeptical of the government.

 

But then their take on the sort of neocon push for war with China, it’s like the government isn’t saber rattling enough with China. They’re too soft on the CCP.

 

I’m just curious where you see that going, because you see Tucker Carlson now, he’s been a figure that’s been, you know, very good in terms of pushing a lot of populist talking points and pushing back on. He’s one of the few people to push back on the US involvement in war in Ukraine, and he platforms a lot of anti-war voices, but he’s getting very aggressive in his rhetoric on China. And this whole narrative has shifted to, like, we need to withdraw from Ukraine so that we can fight China over Taiwan, this kind of thing. He has these people like Eldridge Colby on that are very hawkish on China.

 

I’m just curious how you see that playing out.

 

I mean, that’s a very big question to ask you, but in terms of, would the US be willing to go to war over Taiwan? And maybe more importantly, do you think the US is capable of reforming itself to be able to fight China, or is there just too much ideological hubris there? You’ve mentioned that to an extent already.

 

Ron Unz: Well, I mean, the whole thing about it is for the last 30 years, America has reigned as the sole superpower on the world after the collapse of the Soviet Union. And for 60 years or 70 years, we’ve done our best to try to make sure that we prevented China and Russia from moving together.

 

In other words, basically, that was Richard Nixon’s great success, and it was followed by the people who came afterwards.

 

In other words, the fact that we were able to become, in effect, a quasi ally of China was one of the reasons we won the Cold War against the Soviet Union.

 

The one thing no geopolitical strategist in all of modern American history has ever considered is that any group of American leaders would be stupid enough to push China and Russia together again. And that’s exactly what we’ve done over the last couple of years.

 

In other words, we basically are almost at the verge of war with Russia right now over Ukraine. I mean, basically we are. I mean, NATO is more or less at war with Russia on Russia’s own border, which is an extremely dangerous situation. At the same time, we’re saber rattling towards China.

 

So the inevitable result, basically, we’ve pulled back on our agreement. Since Richard Nixon opened the door to China, we’ve always agreed that Taiwan is part of China, the One China policy. That was the pillar of our diplomatic relationship with China, and we’re not pulling back from that.

 

So what we’ve done is do everything we can to alienate both China and Russia at the same time and drive them together, which is exactly what happened a few days ago, the meeting in Moscow between the leaders of the two countries. We’ve also pushed Iran into that same camp, and most recently, we’ve even pushed Saudi Arabia into that camp. Even Saudi Arabia.

 

Keith Woods: That was very interesting, a deal brokered by China with Iran.

 

[2:00:20]

 

Ron Unz: It’s an incredibly important development! I mean, basically it means we’ve lost our strength in the Middle East.

 

I mean, Iran and Saudi Arabia re-established diplomatic relations after decades of hostility through the good auspices of China and the Chinese diplomats in Beijing. I mean, Saudi Arabia has been our most important Arab ally since Franklin Roosevelt met with them, I think, in 1944 and 1945.

 

So, I mean, we’re talking about 70 years of an alliance that we’ve now thrown away. And Saudi Arabia and Russia are two of the leading oil exporters in the world.

 

I mean, the two of them together, largely together with Iran, largely control the oil market around the world.

 

Basically, we’ve destroyed ourselves diplomatically. I certainly would agree with all of these Republican critics of the disastrous job the Biden administration has done on these issues. But they say we should have attacked China more ferociously than we did, which is ridiculous.

 

I mean, the point is, China has the world’s largest industrial capability. Russia has the world’s largest storehouse of natural resources. If you combine them together, they’re stronger than the US. And NATO. And what we’ve done is push them together.

 

And the fact that we destroyed the Nord Stream pipelines, I mean, everybody knows we did it, and most people were sure we did it even before Seymour Hersh, one of America’s most renowned investigative journalists, came out with all the details of it. The point is, we committed an act of war against Germany, our most important continental ally in Europe. We devastated the European economies because of these energy issues.

 

I mean, there’s a perfectly reasonable chance. I mean, it was a very mild winter. Not for the fact there was a mild winter, it would have been a terrible economic situation with the prices of energy and we still might have problems, for example, this summer because of air conditioning requiring a lot of energy. And the next winter. We have inflicted tremendous damage, economic damage upon Germany and our other NATO allies. We destroyed their infrastructure, illegally.

 

And so I think that is the sort of factor that went into the Saudi calculation.

 

In other words, the Saudis thought to themselves if we would destroy the Nord Stream pipelines of Germany, perhaps we’re not the sort of ally they should be involved with and when you take Saudi Arabia, Iran, Russia, China and a few of the other countries who have alienated around the world we’re in a very weak situation compared to what we would have been a few years ago. And what we’ve done is just so utterly irrational driving all these countries together that if we were deliberately trying to sabotage America’s strategic position we couldn’t have probably done a better job of it.

 

And it’s unclear what will end up happening with the Ukraine, but I mean, for example, I’ve been following very closely general Colonel Douglas Macgregor, again, very highly regarded military analyst. And he’s convinced that the Ukrainians are suffering very severe losses, and that the Russians will end up winning the war probably in the next few months and gaining control of most of Ukraine or at least as much of it as they want.

 

Now, again, I’m not a military expert. There are people on the other side who claim that the Russians are the ones suffering losses.

 

But, I mean, the fact that we’re basically right now depleting our storehouses of ammunition and weapons, much of which is being lost in the Ukraine war. I mean, basically there have been all these stories in the mainstream media of the fact that the Ukrainians right now are using up in a month the sort of munitions that America typically produces in a year.

 

And so if at some point we got into war with either China or Russia or some other major power around the world we’ll be in a much weaker state than we otherwise would have been and it was so unnecessary.

 

In other words, I’m very impressed with someone like for example, with John Mearsheimer who you’ve probably seen his lecture about how we basically spent all these years provoking the war, provoking the Ukraine war with the Russians, doing everything we could to try to avert any early peace after the war broke out.

 

And we’re now in a position where we basically are committing an awful lot of our military resources and $120,000,000,000 of our financial support to a regime that I think has a very good chance of losing in the next few months. And then where will it be? The Russians ended up calling up their reserves. They’re basically mobilizing and they might end up coming out of this with a much stronger military force than they’ve had in decades. And we brought it on ourselves, and now we’re looking for another fight with China at the same time, which is just insane.

 

[2:05:27]

 

Keith Woods: And you do think the US would be willing to go as far as war with China over Taiwan?

 

Ron Unz: Well, I hope not.

 

I mean, the whole thing about is China does not want war with Taiwan. China has basically said from the beginning that they’re willing to wait decades to reunify with Taiwan.

 

And in fact, for example, Taiwan right now, there are two political parties in Taiwan. One of them is more anti-China, and the other one, which actually was the original Kuomintang that came from China, that had been traditionally the government of China. They’re much more friendly towards China, and I think they probably have a fairly good chance of winning the next election.

 

So China certainly doesn’t want to start a war with Taiwan. But if we persuaded the Taiwanese to move towards independence, it’s certainly possible that China might end up demanding a blockade over Taiwan.

 

In other words, China could use their long range of missiles to declare a naval blockade of Taiwan, and then that either America would try to break the blockade, which would mean war with China, or America would have to give in on something like that.

 

So it makes absolutely no sense that we’re in one conflict with Russia right now, and at the same time, we’re looking for a new conflict with China.

 

Basically, under the right circumstances, we could have perfectly amicable relations with both Russia and China.

 

In other words, it’s a give and take situation. They have to recognize our interests in certain areas, and we have to recognize theirs in other areas. Ukraine was a red line towards Russia, and by crossing that red line, by forcing the Ukrainians over it, we started a war. Taiwan is a red line for China, and I certainly hope we don’t start another war with China over Taiwan.

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, I mean, sometimes people have these very structuralist interpretations of geopolitics where everything is for some very sensible, objective international relations reasons.

 

But I really think you can’t make sense of the strategy as it relates to Russia, except just being downstream of the ideology of the people in the State Department and genuine hatred of Russia and what it represents and genuine commitment to global dominance, basically. Because, like you said, the way it’s played out really isn’t going to benefit them in the long run. But look, we’ve gone over 2 hours. I’ll get to the Superchats now.

 

Ron Unz: Sure.

 

Keith Woods: So let’s see. Imperious sent a Superchat. He said if America wanted to devastate China economically, it would simply remove it’s most favoured trade status and hasten the already ongoing exfiltration of manufacturing into the next 14 Latin and Asian countries with better labour costs.

 

Ron Unz: I’m skeptical. Really? It would be that important. The thing to realize is that most favoured nation status was certainly very important for China. 15 or 20 years ago when they were building up. But from what I’ve read, a large fraction of the Chinese economy is now entirely domestic.

 

In other words, they’re not nearly as dependent on exports to the United States as people think they are. And I would argue probably in many ways, America is more dependent on exports from China, low cost exports from China than the other way around.

 

In other words, if you go into Walmart or if you go into a lot of the stores, a huge fraction of our goods come from China. And if we ended up cutting off those goods, I think a large fraction of the American population would suffer even more than they are economically. And that’s certainly.

 

I mean, the economic scenario that he’s talking about was exactly what Donald Trump was focused on.

 

In other words, he was talking about decoupling America from China. But China already has a larger economy than the United States.

 

In fact, an interesting article by a top French policy analyst that I just was looking at a couple of days ago. If you look at, for example, on a real basis, purchase power parity basis, the productive sectors of the economy rather than service economy, which is much more nebulous, China’s economy is already three times larger in real productive terms than the American economy, already three times larger, and it’s larger overall in real terms in purchasing power parity.

 

So the point about it is we’ve passed the point where any of these actions America could take could really severely damage the Chinese economy. While, on the other hand, releasing a virus there could have caused devastating losses and could have really damaged the economy in a very much more effective way.

 

I mean, the truth is, trade issues don’t have the sort of impact of something that could have basically caused the collapse of the Chinese economy or the sort of lockdowns that could have inflicted on the Chinese economy would ultimately happen in the American economy.

 

And also, I’m not necessarily saying it was a sensible action to take, but I’m saying inflicting severe economic damage through a highly contagious, low lethality virus is exactly the sort of thing an experienced biowarfare expert would certainly consider. And the fact that America spent all those decades building up it’s biowar infrastructure means that some point somebody without even asking permission of Donald Trump might decide to use it.

 

Keith Woods: All right. Covid was a fear virus said: Those other Western countries didn’t push fear as a way to control their populations. They more or less used the well earned public trust to calm everyone. Couldn’t access debts just be explained by countries that push fear versus those that pushed calm. I have no idea what point you’re making there.

 

Ron Unz: I’m skeptical. I mean, we’re talking about basically a million Americans died over a couple of years more than previously died if things had gone on the same way. And the pattern of excess deaths seems very closely linked to the obesity of the country.

 

So I think those sorts of objective factors are probably much more likely than questions of fear or lockdowns or anything like that.

 

Keith Woods: Anonymous said Ron Unz versus Ron DeSantis. Who wins in one on one pickup basketball game winners crown king of Florida. May the best Ron win. All right, thank you, Anonymous. Some real high quality Superchats tonight.

 

Another anonymous said, does Ron Unz eat onions? You don’t have to answer that, Ron. Anonymous, why did left liberals in the USA and the EU fall in line to support lockdowns and other such measures which hurt their domestic economy if the attack was directed at China and Iran?

 

Ron Unz: Well, I think as far as I know, the whole thing is American lockdowns actually began right my own part of the country.

 

In other words, the first lockdown in the United States occurred in the San Francisco bay area and was organized by the public health officer of Santa Clara county.

 

In fact, she lives here in Palo Alto. America was suddenly faced with this spreading virus, and we didn’t have any kits, so we couldn’t even tell who was infected, but we knew it was invisibly spreading around the country. Nobody really knew what to do.

 

[2:13:08]

 

In other words, Donald Trump and most of the people in his administration just said, oh, don’t pay any attention to it. It’s not a danger. It’ll go away by itself.

 

And yet suddenly there were more and more cases of people being infected in the Bay area and other parts of the country. I think what probably happened is these public health officers saw that China successfully stamped out the virus through the use of lockdowns in the city of Wuhan in the province of Hubei, and decided, well, if China had used lockdowns to stamp out the virus, the best thing we could try is something similar to that.

 

So, for example, the first lockdowns in the United States began here in the five counties of the San Francisco bay area. A day or two later, it spread to Los Angeles. A day or two after that, it spread to the rest of California and then New York City, New York state and other parts around the country until probably about half or two thirds of the country was locking down. The original lockdowns were intended to last only two or three or four weeks. The problem is they weren’t strict lockdowns.

 

In other words, China basically implemented extremely strict lockdowns in a few cities. To begin with, they stamped out the virus, and within a month or two, the country was back to normal again in the United States, because the virus was very contagious and the lockdowns weren’t at all strict or extremely strong. What ended up happening is the virus continued to spread. And so since the government didn’t really know what to do, they continued the lockdowns then going for weeks and months and for basically a year, or a year and a half.

 

And so the lockdowns ended up really being very ineffective. But they were ineffective not because I think in theory they would have failed, but they just were ineffective given the nature of American society. And it was simply impossible to have the very strict lockdowns that the Chinese had followed.

 

So, again, whether the lockdowns were a good idea or not at the time, I can’t really say, because they ended up failing. Maybe if they’d been done differently, they would have been more successful. But as it is, we ended up getting about 70 or 80% of the population infected despite the lockdowns, and we had a million excess deaths. So it’s not clear whether the efforts really ended up achieving much.

 

Keith Woods: All right. Yeah, this is kind of your last chance to send a Superchat, so if you want to go to Power chat, send them in. Did We Fall sent this on YouTube. I don’t know if you can see that. He said Unz Review and American Pravda are both essential reading. Does Ron foresee any great upheavals in the coming years? A Soviet collapse type event for the West where the system loses credibility and dissenting views prevail?

 

Ron Unz: Well, unfortunately, I think something like that has definitely been happening in the West. I mean, when you look at the tremendous loss of credibility in the American government and the American media, I mean, you know, 40 or 50 years ago, most Americans believed whatever the media and the government told them.

 

One reason, for example, with something like the JFK assassination, that there wasn’t much more of a backlash against what happened is the government, the elites, the media said it was a lone gunman, a random nut, and most people believed it. Most people accepted what the government told them. Even at the time of the 9/11 attacks, I think there was still a strong reservoir of belief in the government and the media.

 

But now we’ve reached the point. I mean, take, for example, the Covid epidemic. You have probably 20% to 30% of the American public that believes the vaccines are deadly and that the government or our elites want to kill them.

 

I mean, that’s much worse than, I think, almost any other country around the world. And it’s because the ruling elites in the United States, the government, the media, the corporations, most of the power centres have just been so dishonest for so long about so many important issues, that I think they’re undergoing the same tremendous loss of trust that was found in the last stages of the Soviet Union before the Soviet collapse.

 

I think when you look at some of the things going on in American society, or even, for example, the events right now going on in France, the protests in France, I think we’re seeing the West really undergoing much of the same disintegration that the Soviet Union and the Eastern Bloc underwent, 30 or 40 years ago.

 

In other words, I don’t know whether we’re at 1985 or 1987 or 1989 or 1991, but I mean, the degree of hostility towards the American government, or look, for example, the fact that we had a protest over the Donald Trump’s election. The fact that Donald Trump was elected president. Donald Trump, in my opinion, was an extremely flawed candidate, and I think most people would probably agree with that. He was opposed by 99% of the American media. He was massively outspent.

 

The other side spent billions of dollars more than he spent in his 2016 campaign, and he ended up winning the presidency despite all those tremendous handicaps. The reason he won is that the ruling elites of the United States, as exemplified in Hillary Clinton, were so tremendously hated, so tremendously disliked, so tremendously distrusted by the American public that people were willing to vote for a reality star like Donald Trump, over basically keeping things the way they are.

 

And in the case of, for example, when he was running for reelection, the fact that all the elites have to get together and ban him from social media, they have to ban any reports from Hunter Biden’s laptop, all those other factors. If not for those tilts on the scale, I think Trump probably would have been reelected despite the fact that there was such a massive effort on the part of all the unified elites to get rid of him.

 

So, I mean, the point is, when you have something like that happening in American political campaign, it just shows the tremendous hostility there is deep within the American public towards so much of the American leadership class, the American establishment, the Deep State, whatever you want to call it. And I think that’s getting worse rather than better.

 

[2:19:46]

 

Keith Woods: All right, Imperious sent another Superchat. Very generous, Superchat. Thank you, Imperious. Always appreciate your contributions. He said:

 

“Should jews police their own regarding anti-White racism just as much as White people police their own regarding non-White racism? If so, how? Are words enough? Or should there be firings and fines and moderate jail time for incitement against Whites?

 

Ron Unz: Well, I mean, certainly one aspect of our website is that even though we cover a lot of controversial things, the fact that we have much more of an open discussion on jewish issues than most of the other alternative websites, I think, is one sort of important aspect of what we do now. The point about it is, I think the biggest problem we face on all these issues is the media.

 

So, for example, most people, their view of reality is constructed by the media. And if the media constructs a false view of reality, a distorted view of reality, the result is that people believe that they’re acting in a reasonable way when they’re actually not.

 

I mean, the perfect example is what I was saying in the aftermath of the George Floyd death.

 

I mean, there seems to be a lot of evidence that George Floyd died of a drug overdose and a lot of those other incidents of alleged blacks killed by the police in a wanton fashion.

 

I mean, the real stories are very different than what most people believe. But if the media portrays those incidents as being the random killings of innocent blacks by the police, it’s not at all surprising that you get a much higher rate of black crime, of black violence, of black attacks.

 

And so the media is the fault involved. In the same way, I think if more jews in the United States or the Western world became familiar with the true history of the last hundred years, rather than the media portrayed history, which portrays things in a very distorted way, their attitudes towards things would be very different.

 

In fact, a piece I’m just about to republish has to do with the famous case of Leo Frank, the ADL, which was the founding incident of the ADL.

 

In other words, we’re talking about an organization like the ADL. I would bet probably that the vast majority of people in the ADL, in its leadership, probably believe all of the propaganda that the ADL and similar organizations put out about the massive tide of anti-semitism, all of these horrible things that have been done to jews in the United States, around the world, some of which are true, but many of which are not true.

 

And so the point is, once we have a more realistic view of the history of the last 50 years or the last 100 years, I think by itself, that would cause many jewish individuals to take a much more reasonable approach to things than they do right now. Because they get their knowledge of the world from the same movies and TV shows that I think most other people do.

 

And it’s in many cases an extremely distorted view of the world, a view of the world that basically engenders a tremendous amount of hostility, most of which really should not exist.

 

And so that’s a very severe problem.

 

Now, the truth about it is that some of the criticism made against jews or organized jewish groups is correct. Some of it is not, but a great deal of it is correct. And once the facts are brought out, I think that’s the best way to have any chance at harmonious relationships between all these different groups in our society, including blacks and non blacks and jews and non-jews and other groups like that. So it’s a very difficult position. But I think the media and the false portrayal of reality by the media, by the academic community, is a large measure of the problem involved.

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, it’s funny. Some people in the chat, like, thought you were going to dodge that question or something. They’ve obviously never visited the Unz Review guys. You should just check out the American Pravda series. It doesn’t exactly shy away from these issues.

 

Okay. Anan said:

 

“Hi. What is your opinion on Bitcoin and CBDCs?”

 

That’s the Central Bank Digital Currency.

 

Ron Unz: To be honest, I’m very skeptical of Bitcoin. It’s not something I’ve really paid much attention to or investigated, but I just don’t see why it’s worth the money it is.

 

In other words, basically, it’s mostly used by people who want to buy it because they hope it’ll go up in value.

 

In other words, it doesn’t really have an economic use. It’s not that people use it in transactions.

 

And in fact, given, for example, the energy cost involved, it’s reached the point where I think Bitcoin is very ineffective. It’s too expensive to use in ordinary transactions.

 

So that’s why some of the other crypto-currencies, I think, are more being used in that. But I should say I’m not an all expert in crypto-currency, and I was amazed when Bitcoin first became as valuable as it was, and I couldn’t imagine why it was going up. And I was not at all surprised when it went back down again. And now I know it’s gone up again a little bit the last few days. So I really don’t have a strong opinion on it.

 

But probably to the extent I do have an opinion, it’s probably much more to the conventional wisdom of someone like Jeffrey Sachs or someone like Paul Krugman, or someone like basically most of the leading investors, basically traditional investors just don’t think Bitcoin really makes sense as an investment, and I’ve never been involved in it myself.

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, I agree with you.

 

I mean, I’m not exactly an expert on crypto, but everything Bitcoin can do, another coin can do better. If it’s digital cash, there’s things like nano that do instant transactions with no fees and barely any energy. If it’s privacy, it has no privacy. If it’s smart contracts, it doesn’t really have that.

 

So, I mean, yeah, it’s purely the network effect, which how long can that last? I just don’t really buy that it’s going to be like an infinitely expanding network. The richest man in the world has already bought it and dumped it.

 

[2:26:22]

 

Ron Unz: Warren Buffett has been very critical of Bitcoin.

 

I mean, the truth about it is, if you remember about 15 years ago, there was a feeling that housing prices, the mortgage markets, were going up infinitely in the United States.

 

In other words, everybody was buying houses and speculating on houses because they felt housing prices could only go upwards. And the end result was the market collapse, and a lot of people lost everything they had.

 

And so it wouldn’t surprise me if the same thing happens with Bitcoin.

 

In fact, I think there was one claim that right now, the energy cost to produce a single Bitcoin is not that much lower than the lower end of what Bitcoin value was, at one point back maybe a few months ago or something like that, after one of those collapses took place.

 

So if at some point, obviously, the value of a single Bitcoin becomes lower than the energy mining costs of the Bitcoin that produced it, you could see a complete collapse in the Bitcoin market.

 

So, again, it’s not something I’d really rather stick to things where I at least have done some investigation.

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, I do think crypto is around. It’ll get a lot bigger and there will be huge growth there. But I just don’t think it’s Bitcoin. I think Ethereum will flip Bitcoin and other coins will take over and eventually it’ll collapse.

 

Okay, I think this is the last Superchat, Mike said:

 

“Is the suppression of all the Chinese protests in 2019 sufficient motivation for China to have released the virus? At the time, it just seemed to me like it was the golden excuse for them to shut everything down?”

 

I do remember some people having that narrative that was like CCP pretence to end all the riots and anti-government protests and implement full authoritarianism.

 

Ron Unz: I’m very skeptical of that. I mean, the whole thing about it is the only protests I’m aware of really were in Hong Kong, which is not even really part of China proper, and Hong Kong is a very small postage stamp.

 

So, in other words, if the Chinese wanted to deploy heavy forces, they certainly could have stamped out the protests very easily to whatever extent they wanted. There were no protests anywhere else in China, and the clamp down, basically the lockdowns then were relaxed a month or two later, as soon as they said that, they’d stamped out the virus.

 

It was only last year or so, when the extremely contagious Omicron version got it leaked into China, that they had to have a series of lockdowns, which they finally gave up on and ended up letting the virus spread. And ended up I mean, probably like a million extra Chinese died probably in the last six months because of the spread of Omicron. But it would have been much more serious if the original Wuhan virus had been spread instead.

 

So, I mean, overall, I’m very skeptical of those sorts of scenarios, and I think probably what happened in China was exactly what the government said was happening.

 

In other words, they found this mysterious virus, whose lethality they weren’t sure of at the time, that was spreading very rapidly and threatened to infect the entire country and potentially kill many, many millions of Chinese. But the Chinese stamped it out very quickly in the city of Wuhan, in the provinces, and then life in China went back to normal.

 

So the funny thing about it is, six months after that, life in China was almost entirely back to normal everywhere in the country, while it was the West and America and other parts of the world that were suffering from these very severe lockdowns.

 

So I really am very skeptical of those sorts of complicated explanations. I don’t think the governments in either China or the West did anything other than what they claimed to do. It’s just that the Western governments did a poor job of stamping out the virus early on when they might have been able to.

 

Keith Woods: All right, well, that’s all of the Superchats. Yeah, we’ve gone, two and a half hours, so I do appreciate all your time, Ron. And yeah, again, I recommend everyone check out the American Pravda series. It’s great. I’ve been listening to them today. I need to catch up on more of them. Apparently, it had a big role in red pilling Nicholas Fuentes, I’ve heard him mention that.

 

Ron Unz: That’s great. And what I should say is that the side of the website, if you go to our basic website, there are sections, for example, there’s the Covid section, there’s the Public Health Vaccination section, and that has some of my articles grouped in those sections.

 

So if you’re interested in the Covid issues, going to that section basically contains those articles summaries and also the video clip of the ABC News report regarding basically what might be called the smoking gun of the Secret DIA Report, describing an epidemic in China before it actually happened.

 

Keith Woods: Yeah, and just in general, Unz is a great website to visit, Anyone that’s worth reading, Andrew Joyce, Michael Jones, all the sort of big names this side of things, you’ll catch what they write republished there.

 

So, yeah, this was great. Thanks for joining me, Ron. Thanks for everyone that Superchatted and tuned in and take care of one.

 

Ron Unz: Hey, thanks for having me.

 

[2:31:52]

 

END

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============================================

 

YouTube Comments

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173 Comments

@johnnywesley7695
1 day ago (edited)
Unz is wrong about the 1965 Immigration Act. What the Act did is allow immigration through family-based sponsorship which in turn has turned into what we call “chain migration”. The 1924 Immigration Act severely restricted immigration. Then, the 1952 Immigration Act allowed for certain kinds of immigrants with a preference strictly from Europe. The 1965 Act got rid of non-European restrictions and allowed immigrants to come from everywhere, but it did put country quotas and a cap on green cards. As things improved in Europe, less Europeans moved to the US and more third world immigrants who had families already settled in America had them sponsor them for green cards. Once they received green cards, they would eventually become citizens and end up sponsoring other family members left behind — chain migration. Today, the top 10 countries where immigrants are coming from, zero European countries are even on the top 10 list. Mexico ranks number one, followed by China. The rest are Latin American countries, Central American countries, and rest Asian countries. So Unz claiming it reduced Latino immigration is entirely false. Just look up the data via Pew Research.
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105

14 replies

@50centpb7
1 day ago
His take on this doesn’t seem to pass the smell test, just the intentions behind the 1965 immigration act were obviously not to reduce net migration. The complete opposite was true.
26

@wangChung-on4kx
22 hours ago
This entire thing is a larp use critical thinking
2

@nickmoser7785
21 hours ago (edited)
Also prior to the 1924 immigration act we had the Nationality Act of 1790 mostly limited access to U.S. citizenship to White Protestant immigrants from Western Europe—who had resided in the U.S. at least two years and their children under 21 years of age.
7

@wangChung-on4kx
21 hours ago
@nickmoser7785 God Bless I love you, without Christ, we are just Jews
1

@MichaelJohnson-ij5ei
21 hours ago
Am I wrong in thinking his woefully absurd take on this is purely determined by his chewish background? If everything was the same, except America was historically a chewish majority state, would he have the same take?
7

@wangChung-on4kx
21 hours ago
@MichaelJohnson-ij5ei Kanye I love you j-wish (Christian ) God bless

@nickmoser7785
20 hours ago
@wangChung-on4kx wrong Judaism split from Christianity not other way around. Christianity is the religion of the old and New Testament
4

@sergeytheweberian7064
15 hours ago (edited)
​ @MichaelJohnson-ij5ei Unz is tricky with this, sorta like Rothbard. In that he did call out The Lobby and tribe’s strong connection to Communism and censoring people to the right of neocons while also being a defacto civic nationalist. And i don’t think he is insincere about it. It’s just that people of his background have rather natural tendency to downplay ideas coming from ethnonationalist camp even when they come eventually to deconstruct the rest of leftist historical and political mythology.
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@kw8831
15 hours ago

@Sergey theWeberian I completely agree with your take. I just discovered Roy Unz several weeks ago so this has been on my mind recently. If you just read an article or two of his, you’d get the impression that he is the rarest type of Jew, a full blown based ethno-nat! but after reading many more of his works I kept getting off put by little things, & occasionally something major. It made much more sense after I discovered his heritage…
Not that his Jewishness necessarily makes him wrong or our foe. Roy Unz is not on our side & that’s okay, we should not expect that of anyone but ourselves. With that said some of his articles are brilliant and while he isn’t on our side he certainly isn’t on our enemies either. That’s fair enough to me!
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@magaelectrician657
11 hours ago
I don’t think he knew the audience he was talking to
2

@glaucon7337
7 hours ago
It’s not complicated. He is saying that without it the Hispanic immigration rates would have been higher, not that it would be non existent. He explained it very clearly.
1

@musphat3311
22 hours ago
His theories on the pandemic are genuinely intriguing and thought provoking
27
Keith Woods

1 reply
@p.pingtam7253

@p.pingtam7253
18 hours ago
What you thought it was the evil chinese, bruh?
, clever boy.
3

@pantsmonsterv6
1 day ago
Unz has done incredible work. Thank you!
51
Keith Woods

@LT-xb5su
1 day ago
Super excited to watch this. Two of my favorites
22
Keith Woods

@zonefreakman
1 day ago
I haven’t really read the Unz publication but I’ll give an open ear if Keith is willing to interview the owner of it. Starting off his immigration argument with saying that one of the biggest negatives of it is the economic problems that come with it is pretty milquetoast though. But I do like his perspective of having brought together people from the left and right on his website rather than being an echo chamber. I’m not sure if it will be effective long term but it’s something different.
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1 reply
@cascadiapatriot7831

@cascadiapatriot7831
17 hours ago
It’s obviously in our faces everyday, on the streets, at work, in schools, at stores, in advertising, media, entertainment, and many other areas that the most serious problem with immigration is something other than economics.
5

@k.k8291
1 day ago
Very interesting interview. I’ve always been curious about Ron Unz given his fantastic website (its comment section is of the highest quality I’ve ever came across).
22
Keith Woods

1 reply
@bigolboomerbelly4348

@bigolboomerbelly4348
1 day ago
Totally rocking interview bros!! Im gonna start the new Ron fan club!
9

@joeshmoe4656
23 hours ago
Everyone should check out Douglas MacGregor. Excellent analysis of the situation in Ukraine. He does a lot of interviews with smaller channels Keith, you should try and get him on!
20

1 reply
@brotherjamesstrang

@brotherjamesstrang
21 hours ago
Didn’t know Unz was so soft spoke, very soothing.
8

@UndergroundFriendly
13 hours ago (edited)
29:52 while discussing the subject of increasing amounts of black violence, Keith emphasizes the word “relaxed” followed by a distinct pause.
5

1 reply
@Andrew-cc4vk

@Andrew-cc4vk
9 hours ago
I caught that too

@rorschach6809
22 hours ago
The Pravda series is amazing. Great man
4

@justinhoward218
1 day ago
Yes, fantastic work from Unz. Might need to be backed up on Bufferchute and Odysee l think lol
8

@simonaguilar3646
1 day ago
Love the website. Unz’s own articles not so much.
7

@goodmorningweimerica9741
13 hours ago
Excellent interview with Ron “in other words” Unz!
3

2 replies
@GaryHost-zb5jv

@GaryHost-zb5jv
9 hours ago
I’m glad someone else picked up on this. In other words, I watched some of his talks after seeing Keith would be bringing him on, and noticed he uses the phrase a lot.
3

@goodmorningweimerica9741
8 hours ago
@GaryHost-zb5jv yeah just seems like a tic or something. I notice a lot of intelligent people do something similar when speaking for long periods of time.

@thethinredline4714
1 day ago
I have been for someone from our sphere to interview Ron Unz and who better than Keith Woods
14
Keith Woods

@retter2critical
9 hours ago
This was Unz-Believable!
1

@jewelcitizen2567
1 day ago
Wow… massive scoop kudos to you!
7
Keith Woods

@harryrichards4899
6 hours ago
Unz cheesin at keith is so funny
1

@hansnielsen6280
1 day ago
Great stream, very interesting
1

@indigo6981
9 hours ago
Great interview
1

@MichaelJohnson-ij5ei
22 hours ago (edited)
He’s wrong about migrants not being on more welfare & not committing more crime.
Stats across the board, regardless of nation/continent of origin, show that migrants are more likely to be on welfare. Bearing in mind that there was a time (for most of American history), when America was developing into a superpower, that migrants & settlers received no welfare at all. Welfare + mass migration is just asking for an economic disaster for the common man.
Then in terms of crime, a lot of the migrants flooding into America are coming over the Southern border, & they absolutely do commit more crime. They may not have crime rates as bad as African Americans, but it’s still substantially higher than the White population. I think it’s typically double/triple the rate, & they’re far more likely to be involved in gang activity. Then you also need to factor in that plenty of jurisdictions are now counting Hispanics as Whites, so the true discrepancy is even worse in reality.
Regardless, it’s not even about economics or crime for me, they could all be model citizens waiting on us hand & foot & I still wouldn’t want them here. It’s about the social cost, it’s about self-determination. America as a European melting pot, despite some national frictions, worked because it was formed by people with racially & culturally/religiously similar backgrounds. It’s a lot easier for these people to be absorbed into the host race/culture after a generation or two. Whereas an Indian or Muslim will always consider his interests foreign to those of a White Christian background.
In some ways it is even worse when they’re more capable migrants, because then they have the ability to obtain power & naturally, as I just pointed out, their alien interests agitate against those of the host race. You see this all the time by any alien migrant with any sort of political or legislative power. They’re not thankful towards the host people, they’re only concerned about transforming the nation to reflect/protect their interests & identity, just like chews do. In fact, the way Unz talks about immigration, not even factoring in the social/dispossession cost, reflects his own chewish out-group background. In other words, if Unz was living in Israel as part of the host race, then I’m almost certain he would be factoring in this cost, & it would likely be his primary concern.
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3 replies

@Leathal
18 hours ago
It’s clear that even the “good ones” see the native born population as essentially indistinguishable worker units that are no longer replacing themselves through reproduction and thus replacement through immigration is the only path that can be envisioned. It’s not their culture dying out. It’s not their standard of living decreasing. With one specific exception, nations have no purpose but to fill a prescribed role in the grander global machine
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@UndergroundFriendly
11 hours ago (edited)
the other thing he missed with regard to immigration and crime is that you tend to see much higher rates among the American born children of immigrants than their parents. they’re most often the ones who become gang members, etc.
1

@crimson1453
5 hours ago
Thank you! This dude genuinely seems very misinformed.

@calengr1
1 day ago
2:17:10 trust level analogous to late USSR
3

@louduva9849
1 day ago
Fascinating guy. I like Ron.
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Keith Woods

3 replies

@chrisandrews4927
18 hours ago
Glad you’re still around, Lou. Been making me laugh in the comment section for the better part of a decade.
6

@marylamb1407
15 hours ago
Unz is like Makow. “Just as Noam Chomsky strategizes to neutralize leftist anti-semitism by making it seem that Israel is a client state of the U.S. and “neo”-conservatives fund and theorize and promote only those ‘conservatisms’ which lead to bigger government, and military action abroad in favor of Israel.
Makow works the crowd that has its eyes on the NWO. He concedes to small J**ish crimes to direct what would otherwise be a beneficial anti-J**aism which could free us, to a fictional and illusory entity, the Illuminati.” Wintermute. You notice how Ron blames a lot on the CIA but never mentions the Mossad. One would think they are seperate organizations.
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1

@MrTrenttness
8 hours ago

Thank you

@kirktuss4819
14 hours ago
Unz Review legitimizes the internet.
1

@calengr1
1 day ago (edited)
2:22: 01 ADL :self perception and sense of history; 2:14:15 skeptical re crypto

@thevanillamaster8103
1 day ago
Unz was one of the first people who redpilled me early on
1

@cwilliams6884
11 hours ago
proud monolinguist here, thanks ron

@yankeecornbread8464
9 hours ago
Presents a believable political explanation for why “1965” doesn’t do what we think it does, until one looks at before and after photos taken in metro areas. And not just there. Rural areas in the interior are now visibly different.

@thethinredline4714
1 day ago
I don’t agree with Ron on the 1965 immigration act
48

14 replies
@odyssey9707

@odyssey9707
23 hours ago
Its okay to disagree with someone, believe it or not.
8

@donjuanmckenzie4897
22 hours ago
He has a point though
4

@moma8518
20 hours ago
Can you explain why? He gave good reasoning and has evidence to back it up, can you refute the reasoning he gave?
2

@thethinredline4714
19 hours ago
@odyssey9707 sure

@thethinredline4714
19 hours ago
@moma8518 look at America before and after 1965
17

@bruno.6610
15 hours ago
@thethinredline4714

@Kevin-kb9nz
12 hours ago
To some extent its inevitable that a rich country will be flooded by a poor one when there is no or very little natrual barrier.
2

@mooseolini1447
12 hours ago
​ @moma8518 I may misunderstand the finer details of the 1965 act and Ron’s arguement, so what follows is my very basic and probably flawed understanding.
As far I understand it, America’s immigration policy prior to the 1965 act, stressed that only “free white men of good character”, could migrate to the US and become citizens.
After the act was passed, anyone could potentially gain citizenship.
Ron is arguing that immigration was higher prior to 1965 and lower afterwards, without regard to the race of those immigrating.
Prior to 1965 only Whites would immigrate, afterwards, any race could immigrate.
I don’t know whether or not what Ron says is true, that immigration rates were higher before the act but regardless, I know which type of immigrant I prefer.
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@donjuanmckenzie4897
11 hours ago
​@Moose Olini His argument is that 1965 Act RESTRICTED Latin American immigration, and without it Latin American immigration would have been even higher than it has been
1

@mooseolini1447
11 hours ago
@donjuanmckenzie4897 “Latin American” is a deceptive term. Latin Americans can be White, black, Mestizo, Castizo, Indio, etc.
If “Latin American” immigration was higher prior to 1965 than after 1965 (doubtful, honestly), then it would’ve been White ones who were taken in, as immigration policy at the time restricted citizenship to other races.
My point is that regardless of immigration rates, American immigration policy was superior prior to 1965 because it only granted access to Whites.
Ron seems to dismiss the relevance of racial considerations in his argument.
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@enjoful
9 hours ago

@DudeReturns-ty1bg
3 hours ago
Dude the critical drinker complains about ethnic diversity then reinforces it.
1

@johnnywesley7695
2 hours ago
@donjuanmckenzie4897 It didn’t restrict Latin American immigration. 1965 Act opened immigration to any country through family-based sponsorship. As a result Mexico now is the number 1 country where family-based immigrants are coming from. China is second and India is third.
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@jmedlin81
22 hours ago
very ‘normie-tier’ COVID takes.. wild to hear people still speaking highly of the vaccine, and still speaking of COVID as if it’s a legitimate dangerous threat. I didn’t expect this chat to be so COVID dominated. As someone with several family members having had strokes and other lasting health issues just after the jab, I had to tune out.
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18

6 replies
@p.pingtam7253

@p.pingtam7253
18 hours ago
I betcha Keith is jabberwocky’d.
5

@cantankerouspatriarch4981
15 hours ago
Ron’s take on covid is strangely bluepilled. His views
on pretty much everything else are decently accurate.
5

@ryanthompson3446
15 hours ago
Yep super disappointing, big yikes for me.
5

@conoraq
9 hours ago
This isn’t Infowars, dunno how you ended up here but you’re out of your depth

@milan6555
9 hours ago (edited)
I am neither here nor there on the covid topic, but I know people who died from covid, who didn’t take vaccines. And no, they were not seniors. Does that mean the vaccine was not harmful to anyone? No, definitely not. But this topic is more complex. People on both sides are just obsessed with their one sided version of it and it’s tiresome.
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3

@magaelectrician657
1 day ago
Raising the minimum wage would reduce immigration??? He needs to flesh out this idea a bit more….this is bonkers
10

4 replies

@evanschulz7375
22 hours ago
Strict immigration policy and border enforcement/deportation would work better.
6

@peenweinerstein9968
16 hours ago
At least it’s a palatable proposal to a modern government… not sold on its effectiveness tho

@magaelectrician657
11 hours ago
@evanschulz7375 seriously I mean wtf.

@UndergroundFriendly
11 hours ago
yeah, and he didn’t even explain that claim in any level of detail that supported his argument.

@Kevin-kb9nz
13 hours ago
Please do a follow up with his views
on the holocaust.
2

@evolassunglasses4673
1 day ago
Very interesting. The only other person I have heard on the anti lab leak theory is Patrick Henningsen from 21st Century Wire (also presents UK Column on Fridays).
2

3 replies
@smashedpumpking

@smashedpumpking
1 day ago
Patrick’s great, excellent speaker. Really enjoyed his recent chat with James Delingpole
3

@evolassunglasses4673
1 day ago
@smashedpumpking yes, I saw that. I’d recommend that, it’s on James Delingpole’s Odysee channel.
2

@shayneswenson
23 hours ago
I love when he btfo’s Ukraine regime narrative enjoyers on Twitter spaces
1

@chrishsmith451
1 day ago
Interview steve sailer next
8

@thebrickton1947
1 day ago
Australia’s deindustrialisation, reduction in smoking, western diets and general affluence has contributed to the obesity epidemic, in my opinion, which is what I have seen, everyone was athletic in the 70-80s. Today, popular media promotes the obese clumsy father as an archetype, and the mass abide to the norm.
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4 replies

@zonefreakman
1 day ago
Reduction in smoking and deindustrialization? I don’t understand how those things are supposed to contribute to obesity rates. True you have less appetite if you smoke, but there are plenty of obese smokers. It’s a non sequitur. The diets which you’ve mentioned too, is one of the biggest factors in the obesity epidemic, and a lifestyle of laziness. And I’m not sure how lack of industrialization contributes to obesity. Before industrialization most people were not obese, then some time after industrialization obesity rates skyrocketed with mass produced unhealthy food, and comfortable lifestyles.
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2

@nolanhardy3320
23 hours ago
@zonefreakman what he is referring to is post-industrialization, which outsources the industrialization of a nation without removing the abundance that comes with it. This way it is different than pre-industrial state of a nation, because prior to industrialization men had to still toil in the fields. In post industrial societies, you have mostly desk jockeys and great reduction in laborious jobs.
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1

@thebrickton1947
23 hours ago
@zonefreakman smoking surpresses appetite, before automation when aus was expanding and industrial, a large portion of the workforce did manual labour, it ‘road the sheeps back’, and realied upon agriculure and mining, and we had a domestic industry supplying goods to themselves. I have worked many of these roles, many of which are gone due to outsourcing to chinese slave labour
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@thebrickton1947
23 hours ago
@zonefreakman otherwise, I agree with all your points

@gabbyk1391
1 day ago
“The largest problem I see with immigration has been economic.”
This guy doesn’t get it. Not worth conversing with him after he says something as shallow as that.
19

4 replies
@cascadiapatriot7831

@cascadiapatriot7831
17 hours ago
It’s in his genes.
5

@bruno.6610
15 hours ago
He’s jewish, c’mon be fair
1

@milan6555
9 hours ago (edited)
Any kind of argument against it, is appreciated.

@gabbyk1391
7 hours ago
@milan6555 I’m at the point now where I don’t even argue or discuss with people on YT anymore. It always leads to nothing. If someone like you ever asks to be told why something blatantly obvious is the way it is they’re trying to prove something. You can find arguments against it all day if you wanted. You’re on Keith Woods channel friend. He has entire videos about this very topic. So where did you come from and what are your motives?
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@jmedlin81
22 hours ago
1:34:55 I worry when people take Pfizer, CDC, WHO etc at their word, regarding COVID causing the heart issues. It seems these heart issues are vaccine caused, and they’re being blamed on COVID.
12

1 reply
@make756perday

@make756perday
19 hours ago
“If you’re going through hell keep going.” -Winston Churchill
1

2 replies
@whatda7705

@whatda7705
1 day ago

1

@MikeSmith-go8wk
18 hours ago
Unz fails to recognise that a mix of socialism and nationalism fixes everything. Therefore Unz fails.
3

1 reply
@Dixey71

@Dixey71
13 hours ago
Well he is Jewish
1

@marylamb1407
14 hours ago
Honestly Keith this stream was a flop. Unz is as cutting edge as Chomsky. BTW both serve the same purpose, inking the waters of truth.
5

@calengr1
1 day ago
2:09:50 China 3x USA in real goods

@dr.johnbarron746
23 hours ago
interesting man
2

@matthewcarpenter3137
1 day ago
Wow big guest indeed.
1

@marccroft3328
19 hours ago
Not saying he’s all wrong, but be careful, Keith – since you have apparently attracted these types
5

Keith Woods
·
4 replies

@moma8518
19 hours ago
Types of what? Can you elaborate

@marccroft3328
18 hours ago
The 60% revealers & 100% diverters
3

@KeithWoods
18 hours ago
Huh
8

@bruno.6610
14 hours ago
@marccroft3328 What does Unz divert from?

@seapigbs4167
1 day ago
Why does Ron get so little heat?
7

9 replies
@satireofcircumstance6458

@satireofcircumstance6458
1 day ago
Don’t know. But it’s not like he and the contributers on his site pull their punches at all about the taboo subjects.
6

@persiandrum9871
1 day ago (edited)
It’s a fair question. Some surmise that if the ADL and other hall-monitors bring any attention to Uno (especially his excellent article on Holocaustianity) it would only add to their ever-mounting problems. Others think that perhaps Ron is placed there as a relief valve. Who knows? Either way his American Pravda series, while not always on the money, is very worthwhile reading.
Show less
9

@Leathal
1 day ago
He’s like Norm Finklestein on the left – neither are getting their doors knocked down for mainstream speaking engagements, but they’re both oddly allowed to freely speak on forbidden topics without repercussions. (Norm is strictly anti-Israel, he doesn’t discuss the ‘bunga and is mostly pro degeneracy but it’s certainly weird how he can casually drop hard r’s in interviews and such)
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7

@evanschulz7375
22 hours ago
Do a nose check.
5

@cromartie1984
17 hours ago
and yet zemmour had lot of trials.

@marccroft3328
15 hours ago
Controlled opposition

@smittywarbenyagermangensen4860
21 hours ago
In other words, on the other hand
1

@beatsbyjiro8291
16 hours ago
so funny ron is talking about american crime and woods is talking about crime being linked to immigration which is a european view, our biggest crime element has been here since the 1700s
2

@ArilandoArilando
16 hours ago (edited)
55:00

@gorillabiskut
1 day ago
Where Steve sailer at doe?

@ThomasBoyd-pe3wc
1 day ago
Based.
2

@nathanhoskins
11 hours ago
My covid related comment got scrubbed FFS.
2

@ryanthompson3446
15 hours ago
Rons c0vid take is cringe.
9

@schoenengutentag
16 hours ago
Very interesting interview. But wow, the chat is just full of nonsense and “just so-” or “heard it from dude on bitchute”-opinions.
4

1 reply

@milan6555
9 hours ago (edited)
I hate to say it, but bever underestimate the grug element within the dissident sphere.
2

@sniper6668
4 hours ago
The Giga-Jew

@KissSlowlyLoveDeeply-pm2je
1 day ago
early life
8

@dancooper4733
20 hours ago
Unz is jewish. That doesnt matter anymore, eh?
4

6 replies
@australiafair5926

@australiafair5926
20 hours ago
If you refuse to engage with any Jewish research/literature you won’t be able to participate in any public conversation. Just don’t take on a Jew as a moral/political guru/leader.
9

@chrisandrews4927
18 hours ago
Honestly no, it doesn’t. Some people will give a nuanced answer involving making perfect the enemy of the good, optics, learning from your enemies, engagement with anyone outside of the “dissident right ghetto” is worthwhile, etc. I’ll give you the real answer- we already lost, our “fight” is over, so we might as well have interesting conversations with interesting people.
Show less
2

@evolassunglasses4673
16 hours ago
He platforms Kevin Mcdonald.
2

@odinsire3879
1 day ago
Based Jew
21

5 replies
@WakaWaka2468

@WakaWaka2468
1 day ago
Nah, the only truly based J was Bobby Fischer.
16

@johnnywesley7695
1 day ago
No. He’s wrong about the 1965 Immigration Act
9

@bruno.6610
14 hours ago
@WakaWaka2468 Otto Weininger

@odinsire3879
12 hours ago
Yeah, he is wrong about that. But overall he seems like a solid guy.
1

@alaskantundrawolf8831
1 day ago
One of the good ones, like Eric Zemmour and Doja Cat.
1

@ericmay4421
1 day ago
Unz is the best
1

2 replies
@Dixey71

@Dixey71
13 hours ago
Nah

@ericmay4421
12 hours ago
@Dixey71 Admittedly his voice can work your last good nerve.

@555Trout
22 hours ago
Weird dude. Fed sus.
1

1 reply
@Dixey71

@Dixey71
13 hours ago
He is Jewish
1

 

==========================

See Also

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Mark Collett — It’s Okay To Be White — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — Christmas Adverts – Multicultural Propaganda — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — What We Must Do To Win — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — Assad Didn’t Do It – Faked Syrian Gas Attack — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — The Plot to Flood Europe with 200 Million Africans — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — The jewish Question Explained in Four Minutes — TRANSCRIPT

 

============================================

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Version History

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Version 5:

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Version 2: Mon, Mar 27, 2023 – Updated YouTube Comments (173).

Version 1: Sun, Mar 26, 2023 — Published post. Includes YouTube comments (xx).

Woes: Hello and welcome back to Millennial Eight. This is the final interview stream this year, and the penultimate stream. And it’s with the much venerated Morgoth, of Morgoth’s Review. I don’t think he needs any introduction. He has been a heavy hitter on Millenniyule in previous years. One of the main figures in the movement. Morgoth. Welcome back to Millenniyule.

 

Morgoth: Hello again. Thanks for having us on. The pressure is always on, I guess the first year that I’m really feeling the pressure of the last stream, the big hype stream and everything. Maybe next year just kind of plop me in the middle of the schedule or something, because I do feel it. I’m just a bloke with an opinion at the end of the day.

 

Woes: [chuckling] I’m sorry. Maybe I laid it on a bit. I remember sending you a thing last night:

 

“Morgoth descends on Millenniyule tomorrow!”

 

Like the original over Arda, Descended Upon Arda. [chuckling] Yeah, it was just a comment I saw from someone. Don’t worry about it.

 

Morgoth: Especially because you’ve got people on who are publishing books and everything. [chuckling] I’m just a bloke from the Northeast, so I’m acutely aware. Hopefully I can say something of interest which hasn’t been covered because what I’ve managed to gather is being great this year.

 

I mean, I have to say that I’ve been taking a bit of a bit of a break from the Internet for the last ten days or so. I’ve hardly been online at all. I’ve done like two Telegram posts in a week or something. I think it helps. I like to do that each Christmas. Just a sort of social media Internet detox. And I’m out and about and I’m seeing people and whatnot. It’s really nice. So you really feel your brain as well.

 

Woes: Yes, well, that’s what I’ll be doing in the new year once Millenniyule is over, because I really do feel it becomes like a pressure cooker with all the stuff that’s going on, all the opinions being thrown around.

 

And of course, the disputes of various natures. So there is a lot to process. Yeah, I think it does overwhelm. So I’ll be taking a break for a few weeks, probably in January.

 

Well, I guess we can get to the actual meat of things. The last two years, and this has obviously been analyzed on Millenniyule this year. I don’t know how much of it you’ve watched, but people have reviewed the end of Covid as a pandemic and as a current ongoing news story. And then it’s evolution into something that for some people is historical, and for others it’s the harbinger of things to come. But then it’s supplanted in the news cycle by the Ukraine war.

 

So in general, before we get to what we’re going to talk about, and I should say we’re going to go through some of Morgoth’s articles on his Substack throughout this stream. That’s what we’re going to use as the sort of backbone of the stream.

 

But before we get to that. Would you have any overall summary thoughts about 2022, as compared to the previous two years?

 

Morgoth: Well, yeah, I think things are just worse. I don’t want to be like black pilling straight away on the stream, there’s plenty of time for that. But I just get the feeling that the system has just gone out of control. It’s as if there isn’t even the pretence anymore. That what the public want, it won’t matter, whatever the issue is, whether it’s the immigration, which is higher than what it’s ever been before, all this kind of Agenda 2030 stuff coming in, and how it all connects together. The billions that gets funneled to Ukraine, which we’ve never had a say in.

 

And we’ve got no control over what the elite are doing, and what they want to do with us!

 

I mean, on the quick switcheroo that happened, where Covert just died, straight away, they just kind of put it away as AA [Academic Agent] was saying, and then they got the Ukraine out. And it’s interesting because AA was saying, yeah, don’t make out your only thing.

 

And I was kind of on the front lines of the Covid discussion, which is unusual for me. I’m very rarely dragged into drama. But in the Covid one, I was kind of like in a prominent position on a certain side.

 

And I was adamant that when the Ukraine thing happened, I wasn’t going to get involved in it. My sort of geopolitics, I’m not a geopolitics bloke. And my sort of take on that is kind of a boring, petty English nationalism. I’m an isolationist.

 

So my general sort of view is that England, Britain, the UK, should just stay alone. It’s just stay out! Like we’ve been messing around in people’s affairs, over the world for hundreds of years now. And I’m just, enough is enough! Can we not just sort of dedicate ourselves to our own country, and sorting out the shit that we’re in here, before we go off on another adventure with the Americans as their little lap dog? I just get sick and tired of it!

 

I mean, part of the reason people hate the Anglos is because of this. It’s because of this endless sort of drive to cause trouble, and to stir a bother around the world, and meddle in people’s affairs. I just hate it!

 

And you can see that our London is up to their necks in it. The politicians are up to their necks in it again. So my general take on foreign affairs is that as close to being an isolationist as you can possibly be. In the way that Ireland used to be, where they would just be looking after their own country, their own borders, and whatever happens on the outside, do your best. It’s difficult. I get that, in a world of great powers. It’s difficult to remain aloof. That requires it’s own form of diplomacy. But at least have a go on it, instead of just being a bunch of shits! Who are constantly stoking up trouble around the world, which we’ve been doing for way too long!

 

[07:47]

 

So that’s my general view on foreign affairs. And the thing where Covid ended, and I was like:

 

“Well, that’s good in a way, because, I call my brand ‘Morgoth’s Review’. I like to discuss movies, and books, and things like that.”

 

But that’s always the content that I do, which always gets sidelined for more serious things. So there’s people who send me a message or send me an email about this or that movie or something. And I’m like, I haven’t even watched it because there’s all this stuff going on!

 

And so when the Ukraine war kind of started, I was like:

 

“Well, okay, so I’m out of this one. I’m not going to be getting in drama on Telegram because of this one. This is not my thing. I’m sitting out!”

 

And you can actually see it on the Substack. I went back and [chuckling] I was talking about movies, and books, and things, and then did a few videos on them as well. The classic movie streams with Endeavour. And everything. And I was kind of thinking, like:

 

“Well, maybe we did get carried away!”

 

Maybe at the end of the day, because the other side of the argument towards the sort of the technocratic thing. And I don’t want to get hung up on this because I know AA has covered it well, and I agree with all of what he was saying last night.

 

I did a video in 2021 called, The Elephant and the Whale, which is similar to what he was saying last night. Where you’ve got this technocratic power and then you’ve got the power which is rooted to a geographical location. When the Ukraine war started, it was kind of like the elephants, as I call it, they kicked back. I know what the Third Positionists were saying all along, which was like, there’s a conflict if you’re talking about having One World Government, One World system, there’s going to be a conflict with regional powers because they do have their own interests.

 

The American Deep State has its own interests around the world and especially in the Middle East. And this is going to run counter to an actual sort of One World system. So you get that tension there which isn’t new, which has been around for a long time.

 

So I was thinking, well, okay, maybe we got a bit carried away and there’s a bit more life in the elephants than we thought, and all of that. And I was like, well, whatever the case, we’ll see how it pans out.

 

And then as the conflict deepened, I was thinking maybe the sort of the technology stuff, maybe it isn’t as much of a danger as we thought. We didn’t get the digital IDs.

 

Woes: Not yet!

 

[10:49]

 

 

Morgoth: Not yet. Well, yeah, and then all of these other things and then as the conflict eaten I was thinking all of a sudden it was like:

 

“Oh, no! The fertilizers supplies have been cut and there’s going to be like, food shortages and we’re going to have to eat the bugs!”

 

And then it was like:

 

“Oh, no! We’re not going to be able to import all of this cheap energy anymore from Russia. We’re going to have to go full sustainability and especially following the Agenda 2030!”

 

And then there was all these different things began to come out of it. You’ve got to be kidding me! I thought this was done with! I felt like Sarah Connor on The Terminator, when the Terminator blows up in that tanker?

 

Woes: Yeah [chuckling]!

 

Morgoth: She’s given Kyle Reese, like, a kiss and a cuddle:

 

“It’s all over!”

 

And you see the wreckage, and the background begins to move and you think:

 

“Oh, Christ almighty! It’s still there, it’s still coming after us!”

 

So that was my general kind of thing on all of that. But I deliberately didn’t involve myself with the drama around which side to take on Russia and Ukraine. As an Englishman, I can only speak for England. My view is we should just keep out.

 

Woes: Yeah. Well, I think it’s not as much of a contradiction as some people are saying. We’re between Covid and the Ukraine. I think it’s alarming how quickly this occurred in time together. But the Ukraine, War doesn’t mean that Covid didn’t happen and wasn’t significant, or vice versa. I think it’s just two different factions at the elite level who to some extent are vying for power and to some extent are cooperating.

 

And as you just said, it’s strange, and this is the point made by the [word unclear] among others, it’s strange that a lot of the goals of Agenda 2030 are accelerated by the Ukraine, War. So these aren’t even in contradiction, really.

 

They’re in contradiction, I guess you could say, in terms of mentality or attitude, but not in terms of end results, really. I mean, the end result is still going to be that a lot of Europe, let’s say life in Europe is going to be markedly different from how it was in 2019, just as they said in 2020:

 

“We’re never going back to 2019.”

 

And now the energy shortage, the synthetic food, and all that.

 

Why aren’t we planting food right now? Why aren’t we planting vegetables? And I said this in I think it was, whenever it was, April or something. Why are they encouraging British farmers to stop farming? That’s insane! At a time when exports from Russia and Ukraine are completely disrupted. And then again in the Netherlands, the same thing. Why are they trying to shut down 30% of the farming sector, at a time like this? It’s completely insane!

 

During the war, people were and it was encouraged by the State. I don’t know to what extent it was organized by the State, but people were plant using grassland anything, any land that was available, to plant vegetables to stave off the shortages. But no one’s doing that now.

 

Morgoth: I did a video for it. They called them Victory Gardens. They would grow potatoes on the roundabouts, and sports fields were turned into cabbage patches, and all of this kind of thing:

 

“Dig for victory!”

 

And all of this. So you had this big sort of national effort to use all of the ground that was in the country to turn it into producing food.

 

And we were not doing anything of the sort, despite the fact we could easily in lots of different ways. The reason they’re not doing that is because their bosses have invested their billions in all of these fake foods. And that’s what they want to feed us.

 

[15:16]

 

Woes: There’s a thread by Andrew Anglin on Twitter. He’s now up to 12K, by the way. And he’s saying that well, it’s looking very bad, especially for Germany. But then that has repercussions all across Europe. They want regime change in Russia, they might well want regime change in China as well. Germany is going to have to deindustrialize. It’s going to be massive, the repercussions of all this.

 

He thinks that it will dominate the entire century. And he may be wrong. I don’t really see why he would be, but it seems quite obvious. If you don’t have cheap energy, you cannot have an industrial powerhouse. I don’t really know what else to say about that. Maybe we’ll get back to it later. Unless there’s anything else you’d like to say in summary about the year?

 

Morgoth: Not really. I mean, I think it feels as if we’re in free fall. Maybe I said that last year, but it feels worse this time. There’s some of the things that I’ve covered and all of it traces back to this kind of technocratic thing. In one of the videos that I did this year, it was quite late in the year, I think it was September or something, was a deep dive into Serco and how that connects with the migrant crisis and all of this kind of thing.

 

And over the course of the year I began with rounding up on the Covid stuff, I was doing cultural stuff. And then as things went on in the year, I began to sort of think of it in terms, … You have to conceptualize this, all the people who rule us, … I did a video on this which got a lot of views. It was just a quickie one with my phone as well when I was out for a walk.

 

But basically it seems like the people who rule us are at war with us! I don’t know how you can put it in a different way. Now you can say that:

 

“Well, we’ve got these plans that they want to implement. All of the Green Agenda.”

 

And they’ll have reasons for that which I can come on to later. I don’t want to go too much on Spengler because I know like, [word unclear] and [word unclear] we’re talking quite a bit about it. But I think there is a sort of logic behind what they’re trying to do, but it’s purely indifferent to the wishes of the people.

 

And I think it gets to a point where you ignore the wishes and the well being of the people to such a degree that it actually does become like malicious and malevolent, and something really sinister! What you just said about not growing vegetables, not growing food, is part of that you think, well, okay, a responsible government would think:

 

“Well, okay, let’s get on board with this. Let’s use all of these nudge departments and applied psychology NGOs for something which is actually useful, instead of just manipulating them and cattle prodding the public and going along with stuff which is which is destroying them!”

 

Because that’s all they do. I mean, like, why do these nudge departments exist in the first place? All of this clever, as Brian Garrison always says on UK Column like this applied psychology, we’re just swimming in it in Britain, much more than what people realize.

 

Everything which comes out of the government or which is in the adverts, it all connects. Even the story lines on soap operas now are like a sort of memo which has come out of an NGO and extremism.

 

Woes: So prolefeed at this point in 1984, it’s made by machine, it’s just bullshit. Except at least prolefeed sort of left you alone to live whatever degenerate life you wanted as a proletarian. The nudge stuff is actually reprogramming you all the time!

 

Morgoth: All the time. And you can see it. UK Column do this where they dig into the sort of the internal papers of the government and the language that they are using. And it’s always this kind of abstract language, it’s always like changing perceptions, perception management, so that something which is destructive or something which is wrong is then sort of presented in a way which is like positive, or at least neutral. And they do it on everything. And I think the people kind of sense that there’s something not right, but cannot quite explain it.

 

And so as the year went on, the term, I picked it up from Andy Nuigi [sp] where he was calling it “High Strangeness”. And I really liked the term and I liked the way he was using it. Where you suspect that something isn’t quite right, but you can’t really explain it. And you can’t prove it either. And part of this is where I think it’s across the West, but obviously in Britain, and it’s because we basically live in land which we don’t know what the truth is of anything.

 

I mean, there’s so much sort of discussion around things with Covid, around with the vaccines and everything. But the truth is we don’t know because we’re not being told the truth! And whatever comes out of the government will be filtered through various sort of NGOs and nudge and applied psychology departments. So that what you actually are presented with is the most positive outcome for the government itself. And it doesn’t make any sense. And you’re just supposed to go along with it. And you see this over and over again!

 

[21:48]

 

Woes: I might just interrupt. I think maybe the most egregious, crass, example of this is that they are clearly replacing the population. They’re pumping Africans into Europe, and into Britain at alarming, unbelievable numbers! And meantime, they’re saying to you, the “Great Replacement” is a conspiracy theory! So you’ve got obviously contradictory things going on there by the same people, the government. And you’ve got to somehow reconcile that. While your town changes around you, your government are telling you that it’s not happening! That’s just a crazy thing to think. Oh fuck!

 

Morgoth: Even the way that they’ll do that. When they had this thing was at that little town in Yorkshire where they were going to just destroy it with asylum seekers. What was that called again? I forgot the name.

 

Woes: Linton-on-Ouse.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, even there. So you got locals and some people going along and they’re putting a fight or protesting. But even there you got this kind of fake opposition, NGO, Hope Not Hate connected thing which went in. And when they go in, it’s all of the language they add as well, like outreach programs, challenging perceptions, and challenging preconceptions, and local community, presenting a positive outcome. And all of this technocratic language, which just means population management. Really, it just means bamboozling the population with horseshit so they don’t know if they’re coming or going anymore.:

 

“Well, we just like our village the way it is. Yes, but why is that? Why do you hate these people?”

 

Because the question that you always get is:

 

“Well, okay, what do we do about it instead of moan?”

 

And I think the question that we need to have is on sovereignty. Because we tend to forget that the government is supposed to represent us, and they don’t.

 

None of this stuff has been voted for! None of this is the will of the people! All of the climate change stuff that they’re bringing in. And once again, you’ll see that on the back end in the Deep State, there’s all of these White papers being published about how to get people along, how to kind of create incentive structures, how to change people.

 

If you’re going to have like, fake meat or something, it’ll be where what they’ve discovered is that the kids, like, young people will more than likely go along with fake meat burger, like a “beyond meat burger” or whatever, than their father. So what they’re doing is finding ways for the young people to shame older people and frame it in a way where:

 

“You’re just sort out of touch and you just don’t get it. You’re stuck in the past! Look at this, this is healthier, this is cheaper, this is more sustainable!”

 

Yeah, it’s all of this psychological manipulation. And people half the time don’t even understand what it is.

 

But the problem is we’re supposed to be living in a liberal democracy. The government is supposed to represent us in Parliament, and our interests. And it just doesn’t happen. What you’ve got instead is top down technocratic control. It’s just that it calls itself a liberal democracy. They just didn’t change the name.

 

I was thinking today, if you go back, if you got on a time machine and you went back to 1980 and, you know how on Millenniyule you’ve had people kind of going through all the events of the year? And if you went back to somebody, you went into a pub in 1980 and you said:

 

“Hello, I’m from 2022.”

 

And they say:

 

“Oh God, what’s its like? Flying cars, spaceships and all of this?”

 

You’ll be like:

 

“Well, no, there’s none of that. The government forcibly vaccinated the entire population with something experimental. They are letting in a million immigrants a year. And then you’ll be surveilled and you’ll be deplatformed, you’ll be persecuted if you complain about it too much. People now get arrested for praying silently in their own heads against abortion clinics. We are going to outlaw the car!”

 

And you could just go on on! They would think:

 

“Jesus Christ! What happened! Was a revolution? Is it some kind of crazy communist dictatorship which somehow took over?”

 

And you’d say:

 

“No. It’s liberal democracy. We call it the same thing. It’s just that the actual substance of it is radically different!”

 

And you can say:

 

“Well, maybe the population never really did have a say, even in 1980.”

 

But I think they had a bit more of a say than now. At least it wasn’t like this.

 

Woes: I think they were taken more seriously by the government, because even if the government was even by then controlled by globalist institutions, and I think it probably was. Even if democracy was always a sham, and I think it probably was, I think they still were scared of the public in a way that they simply aren’t now. Well, I don’t know about that. Maybe not quite the right thing because they are scared of the public. But it’s more like contempt, like you would despise a wild animal that could attack you at any moment, that kind of thing. This notion of the public as a fickle, aggressive, mass of just unthinking apes, that seems to be the general perception.

 

I mean, again, I come back to the White House and I’m sorry to go over to America for this, but I think it’s largely transferable to here. The White House when Biden first got in, and the army were all outside the big fence, all of that. That seems to be an administration that does fear the public, but not in a good way, not in the way that the government is supposed to fear the public, in a democracy. In a the democracy the government is supposed to fear the public insofar as it doesn’t want to let them down, doesn’t want to fear them voting them out at the next election. Respects them, takes them seriously.

 

It’s not like that it’s more like that wild dog could bite us at any moment unless we keep it under strict control. That seems to be the attitude that the government now has towards the public.

 

And I think that’s basically what’s changed here. I think in the past, up until I don’t know, it would be difficult to set a date on this gradual continuum, really, rather than a hard change. In the past, I think the government felt:

 

“We’ve got to at least pretend to take them seriously. We’ve got to at least pretend to care about them. We’re going to at least pretend to care about what’s good for them.”

 

Whereas at this point, it’s just:

 

“You’ll do what you’re told or you’ll be deplatformed, demonetised, discredited, demonized, hounded down, your house raided, knock on the door in the middle of the night, or whatever. Your bank account closed down, newspaper articles about, you lose your job. It’s kind of totalitarian.

 

[30:08]

 

Morgoth: It’s funny because I mentioned before that I’ve kind of been quiet for the last week, or ten years even, I don’t know, at least since the 21st when I went on Christmas. But I just wanted a Christmas break, basically. But what that does is give me time to sort of catch up on what nerds on YouTube are talking about, what new movies are, the slagging off, and all of this.

 

I’m coming to this because I’ve been writing a script all day for a video essay, which I’m hoping to get out soon. And what happened. What I discovered, of course, just taking a break from the politics and dabbling a little bit of nerd culture, is that Disney released a Star Wars series called Andor, which wasn’t shit! And it wasn’t even that woke, but it was really gritty and kind of sinister. And the usual kind of Molar [sp], Critical Drinker, and all that crowd, was saying it was great.

 

I thought okay, fair enough. And what it does is depict – I don’t want to give too much away because this will be a video essay – but what it does, Andor, is kind of a realistic portrayal of what life was like living under the Empire. So there’s no light sabres in it. There’s no Sith. There’s no Jedis, and all of this. It’s just these bureaucrats. And they’re also highly effective. They’re also very intelligent.

 

And what I thought was interesting when I was looking, and I watched it all over the last few days. And I’ve actually quite enjoyed it because it is like this meditation on totalitarianism. But what I thought was interesting about it and what I’m going to get into in the upcoming video is that a lot of people on the Left, like the Left sort of video essayists on YouTube with massive channels, like 650,000 channels and stuff. And they were also celebrating it. One of them called Just Right. They were saying like it was Antifascist art. So what it was, was a meditation on life under fascism.

 

My response to all of this is like, it’s funny that they have to always look back at fascism, as their “go-to”. When you dig into it, it turns out it is like Marxism. It is about fomenting rebellion against totalitarianism. The script writer admitted it. And the main character is supposed to be modeled on a young Joseph Stalin.

 

But I thought it was kind of weird because when you look at it, it’s got a Brutalist architecture and everything, what they’ve done, I thought it’s kind of weird because they’re saying they are sympathizing with the rebels who are to the point where people are literally having their bank accounts closed down. The Empire have got new legislation to trace, like which funds are going where and whatnot. Give me a second. It’s all about these rebels. And some of them are idealists, some of them are anarchists, some of them just want to go off-grid. Some of them are saying, …

 

Woes: Like very familiar!

 

Morgoth: That’s exactly what I put in the essay! Amongst the kind of the rebels, because they’re not yet organized or anything. All they are is they’re kind of collectively pissed off and sick of the empire, but they haven’t got a clue what to do about it. So this kind of new series traces that process.

 

And what I thought was interesting about the big sort of Lefty channels was that they were saying this is Antifascism, which it was. But what they’re doing is assuming that they are like the rebels, they are the revolutionaries. But can’t they see that they are actually the empire? Like a fucking tyranny! Because that’s the truth! But they can’t own up to that, they can’t admit that they’ve got too much power, and that they’re vindictive.

 

I mean, all you’ve got to do is look at Oxford Street. That could be the utter domination of the rainbow flag, with all the triangles in it. I don’t even know what you call that one. But that’s that was an imperial form of domination! Jesus Christ, man! They’ve got people kneeling to black men! Like literally kneeling to their icons. But they are, what the rebels? No! They need to understand what it is they have become and what it is they actually do.

 

[35:19]

 

Because I don’t believe we are living under a Marxist system, I think we’re living under a sort of hypercapitalist oligarchy, and they just use Left-wing types as useful morons, useful idiots, as the kind of the bureaucratic core.

 

Because as I say, you don’t need this. When they talk about the “banality of evil”, and that will chaff at people in the chat, I think, because it’s Hannah Arendt when she’s talking about Adolf Eichman, I think it was. But the main point to that was that she’s saying when you actually look at evil straight in the face, it isn’t anything metaphysical, it isn’t anything mysterious, or esoteric. It is like a kind of boring bureaucrat.

 

In our time and the system that we’re living with, that’s absolutely the case. There’s nothing mysterious or deep about these people who do it. They are just like automatons. If you look at somebody like Jeremy Hunt, or Tony Blair, or Rishi Sunak, or Matt Hancock, they are all nothing but managers and bureaucrats! There’s nothing more to them than that. And yet these are the kind of the petty bureaucrats. And that’s not the top, for God’s sake! Like the ones in the local councils who cover up atrocities in Rotherham and all of this, they’re even worse. They’re just completely brain dead!

 

And this is how the system functions. And there’s a conspiracy theory that goes around by that John O’Looney, or something, he always comes out with it. And it’s that the migrants who are coming over the English Channel, like they are actually secretly UN soldiers. And that at some point in the future, there’s a signal going to go, there’ll be a new lockdown or something. And all of these, like, migrants are going to, like, don their uniforms and be like boots on the ground, occupying force.

 

I just think it’s so wrong, because it doesn’t understand the nature of the tyranny that we’re living under. It isn’t hard power. We’re in a Panopticon, where everybody, … If you go to the pub, this is something that I did post on Substack. I got kicked out of a pub by a barmaid at the end of June, at the end of summer, because of my politics. It’s a funny story that I could go into, but, …

 

Woes: It wasn’t even your politics, insofar as nationalism, or whatever, was it? Was it not about the, … You tell the story.

 

Morgoth: So I went into a pub. I was in an area in Tynmouth. And they’ve got these pretentious little sort of pubs there. And I popped in because I don’t like the vibe there, but I do like the real ale. It’s kind of like I know it’s hipster and all of that, but nevertheless, there are some lovely stouts. I like a nice pint.

 

So I went in and I was having a few pints. I stood at the bar talking to the blokes, and these places are very small, so you’ve got, like one barmaid.

 

I just looked at her and she had, like, bright red hair, she had the piercings, she was fat. I knew that this was a product of the university. I knew that she was going to be Left-wing.

 

And I got talking, I had about three or four pints, but I got talking to a couple of fellows at the bar, just general chat. And it got on to the Ukraine kind of thing. And my general point was that the West had provoked Putin. Because they had this kind of standard bulldog nationalist take where it was kind of like toy boy Twitter, where this is now the great sort of patriotic struggle, and we’re going to stick it to the Ivans. And it’s like this sort of post modern replica of World War II, over and over again. It got a little bit of a heated discussion, but it was just blokes at the bar, you know what I mean?

 

So the barmaid was just throwing me daggers! And what I thought was interesting about it was that she kind of watches over the atmosphere of the bar. And she has her own politics embedded within her, which she’s picked up. She’s from university or whatnot. But the thing is, she is politicized. But most of the blokes, most of the normies in the pub, like, they wouldn’t be they were just a herd. But when she heard me going to talk and coming out with certain opinions, nothing controversial. But there was something in her which detected that I was an enemy. And it was like she had to protect the flock.

 

[40:58]

 

Woes: It’s interesting. I wonder what it was. Was it your body language, facial expressions, things you said? How did you give yourself away here?

 

Morgoth: Because I was saying that the West provoked Putin. And I was mentioning about how it’s the “next thing”, what do you call it? The “current thing”? And I was talking about how everybody had Ukraine flags and they had replaced their mask avatars with Ukraine flags. And I was mainly focusing on how easily brainwashed everybody was and that it was mainly just the money power, and this is it.

 

And she came around behind the bar. So it was me, and by this time one of the fellows left. And I was talking to this blog and I was saying, I mentioned offhandedly, the Chinese came into it. And I said that our leaders don’t look out for us, because at this time I was saying we’re going to sit in the cold in winter. And for some reason or another, I can’t remember exactly, but I said that:

 

“The Chinese aren’t ruled by retards, and we are.”

 

And she screamed from behind the bar:

 

“You will not use that word in here!”

 

And I said:

 

“What word? Chinese?”

 

And she said:

 

“No! The other one beginning with R!”

 

And she says:

 

“Do not use that kind of word in here.”

 

And I said:

 

“Why? Is ‘retard’ politically incorrect now?”

 

And she went:

 

“Yes, it is in here!”

 

And I said:

 

“Look, at the end of the day, you’re a barmaid. Are you not supposed to pour the pints, and just sort of shut up?”

 

And she said:

 

“You not just supposed, …”

 

Like I’ve been drinking in bars in the Northeast since the mid 90s. Like, I’ve never known anything like this! I said:

 

“I’m being thought policed by the barmaid in the bar here?”

 

And she said:

 

“It’s in my contract that I have to keep, …”

 

What was it again? It was some kind of bureaucratic language about keeping it civil and all of this kind of thing. And I was like, all right.

 

But what she was really doing was a “flex”. She was letting me know that she’s in a position of authority, and that she having to sort of reel me in, if, you know what I mean. She was thinking:

 

“He’s an enemy! He has ideas and a way of expressing himself that I’m not comfortable with. He’s not a normie. He’s in the game! He is politicized!”

 

So what happened next was that obviously by this, I went off on a long speech about how the Deep State and capital and how easy it was for them to Hoodwink the Left into being useful idiots. And I said:

 

“You remember when you had all the Left against war. And look at them now, they’re all like, ‘oh, let’s nuke Russia’!”

 

And I went into how easily manipulated they were. And all you had to do was give them a sense of authority and a sense of power. And of course, she sat behind the bar like just soaking all of this up. And she was fucking seething, she was! [Woes bursts out laughing].

 

I was saying, they were the most pathetic bastards on earth! I was saying:

 

“All you need to do is let them feel great, let them see it nice, and they will literally support Big Pharma. They will literally support the Deep State! And all we have to do was promise to plant Rainbow Flags in Kiev. Oh, sorry, “Keeth”, because that’s the new thing. We just changed our minds like this.”

 

And she was just going, honestly, she was just like staring straight into the back of the head.

 

And the conversation went on. It got a little bit more controversial because I began talking about immigration, and stuff, as well. [Woes bursts out laughing] There was two blokes there, and I said:

 

“You do know that you’re going to be, or your kids are going to be, minorities in Britain?”

 

And these are sort of, for a start, like, this is two middle aged White blokes in a bar in North Tynside.

 

And one of them turned around, just laughed, and he said:

 

“So what! Who cares?”

 

And she put her hand on her hip and she was kind of like:

 

“Yes, so what have you got to see it as that?”

 

And I was like:

 

“Well, okay, can you name me a single other ethnic group in all of history who have willingly and rapidly allowed themselves to become a minority in their own country? Has it ever happened, or did they not fight tooth and claw for that territory? You can’t claim that this is a normal state of affairs, when you are the outlier in all of human history!”

 

And then she said:

 

“Oh, well, so you’re a racist now on top of everything else?”

 

And I went:

 

“Here we go again.”

 

I said:

 

“You’re just regurgitating things that you’ve heard on the television.”

 

I said:

 

“You’re like a robot. It’s just like these little attack words again and again.”

 

And she said:

 

“I think you’re just going to have to leave. I’m not putting up with this!”

 

That was it. And I was like, I’ll finish my pint. That’s it. And as I walked out, like, three or four people cheered! As if:

 

“He’s gone! Finally, he’s gone!”

 

And, you know, it was like Al Pacino in Scarface leaving the restaurant:

 

“Say goodbye to the bad guy.”

 

And I just thought:

 

“There’s no way ever, you’re going to reach these people. Never!”

 

Woes: This thing about the English pub is very important. It’s possible that non-Brits who are listening to this perhaps won’t get the significance of the situation you’re describing. Because the English pub, and the Scottish pub, were places where I mean, it would have been unthinkable, even in our adolescence, it would have been unthinkable that something like this would happen. That a mere conversation, would lead you to get thrown out of a pub!

 

Because the pub is a place where traditional sort of rowdy atmosphere, it’s not family friendly, it’s definitely not politically correct, it’s the place where men discuss everything! Everything! And there are no holds barred.

 

That’s kind of almost the point of the pub, in a way. You could say it has a weird sort of Internet blood sports thing. And I hate to say that, but it’s got this weird sort of egalitarianism about it where men of all classes, and it’s men. It’s specifically, men, who would go to pubs on their own.

 

Men of all classes would go to the pub and get into quite heated discussions with each other about everything! Whether it’s football, current events, religion, politics, whatever, everything! And probably also very sort of autistic niche subjects as well, everything.

 

And the idea that debate would be circumscribed in a pub is just laughable! Up until this era, up until now! Like the last ten years. Prior to that, it’s just unthinkable.

 

[49:06]

 

Morgoth: I did say it was sort of pretentious, really. There was a certain type of people in there. So if you go to a kind of more chavy pub, you can actually just say whatever you want. The price that you pay is that you’ve only got, like [word unclear] Back Label and Guinness.

 

But when I was leaving and there was people cheering, the bad guy was leaving and all of this, I thought:

 

“At the end of the day, fuck you people, I’m going to go to the social club. I’m going to go and have a watery, pint of [word unclear] Black Label and be among my own kind, who are still in their way, like free!”

 

They may have pitbulls under the table and all of that [chuckling]. Everybody’s wearing a football top, but it’s a bit like the proles, …

 

Woes: I was going to say the pub you were in was more like “Outer Party”.

 

Morgoth: Yeah! [chuckling] But it was just the fellow who says:

 

“Nobody’s replacing me! I haven’t got any trouble!”

 

What he was trying to do, was be a kind of a bit of a macho, hard man, but in terms of justifying being ethnically cleansed in his own country! I mean, what a tit [chuckling]!

 

Woes: Well, [chuckling] this is it! And that leads back to things like the 90s “Lad” culture, but especially the more contemporary hipster thing, where you’ve got a guy with a big thick beard, but he’s advocating for his own replacement! Or he’s advocating for LGBT rights, or something. Just something completely the opposite of traditional masculinity. It’s very strange, it’s very perverse.

 

Morgoth: I said basically like, well, okay, so he was saying that nobody is attacking him, he doesn’t feel that he’s in danger. Bearing in mind, by the way, like North Tynside is still one of the Whitest parts in England. I’ll just slip that in there. But nevertheless I said:

 

“Well, okay, it’s a shame that the girls in Rotherham and all of these in Burnley, and all of these places where they got mass raped off immigrants, it’s a shame that they weren’t as secure as you, isn’t it?”

 

And then it fell back on the sort of:

 

“Well, White men do that as well!”

 

And I was like:

 

“No, they don’t! No they don’t. They do not do it in that ethnic way! Mainly because they’re all cucks like you!”

 

Woes: Well, [chuckling] yeah, that’s part of it. But also when people say this, that White men would do it too. The reason the Pakistanis do it, and I’ve got to be very careful what I say here. But people will say:

 

“The reason the Pakistanis do it is that they get away with it. If White men knew that they would get away with it, they’d be doing it too. They’d be gang raping twelve year old girls!”

 

And I simply don’t believe that they would!

 

Morgoth: No, I mean, it didn’t sound right the way I put that, just there, that they are all cucks. This isn’t to say that you should be doing terrible things or anything like that. But it’s more like the mentality of him where he doesn’t even see an “us and them”.

 

Woes: I think everyone understood what you meant. It’s an imperialistic aggressive, you could say hyper masculine thing that they are doing there. It’s not feminine, what they’re doing.

 

Morgoth: The outgroup will definitely see him as “the other”. It’s just that he doesn’t see any “other”. But I don’t even believe that fully. I think he was just going along with what people wanted to hear in the pub in the here and now. He probably hasn’t thought about that. He certainly didn’t know what he was talking about, because he’d never heard of even the fact there was grooming gangs.

 

Woes: It’s alarming! Some people really don’t. I mean, I remember just a few months after the Rotherham scandal. I was in a debate, I got into several debates on Facebook. Back in those days, I was always on Facebook, before the channel really took off. And this was what I did online, was getting to very, very involved debates on Facebook.

 

And time and again I found English men, British men were just insufferable! They were just absolutely awful to get into debates with! Because their priority was to be fashionable, and to show that they had fashionable views. And this was kind of a cross-class as well. It wasn’t just sort of middle class hipsters or whatever.

 

And I remember just a few months after the Rotherham thing that there was a guy who had never heard of it! He didn’t know! And I don’t know, I was utterly perplexed! I didn’t understand how can you not have heard about this. But I guess this is it. He probably had heard about it and he’d just forgotten, he just deleleted it. It wasn’t something that was useful to him in proving his social acceptability. It wasn’t of utilitarian value to him, so he just simply forgot it. Whenever it came up in a Facebook debate, he was lost.

 

Morgoth: Behind the scenes. I’ve been doing a lot of writing on a bigger project, which isn’t ready yet. But I actually touch on this a lot from a sort of [word unclear] perspective of power. And I think one of the problems is that because these immigrant groups, they are clients of power. I know, like people like to sort of pin it on like Sharia Law or whatever it is, but I think you really have to take it back to power, and the power structure.

 

And the fact is they are protected by power, and White people aren’t. And somebody who’s pissed off about all of this, when he looks at the immigrant group in question, he knows that there’s a power behind him, there’s a power behind that, which is the power of the State.

 

Woes: It’s like the barmaid behind him, staring at him, as you experienced. The same sort of thing.

 

[55:43]

 

Morgoth: Yeah. It’s not so much the immigrants themselves, it’s the fact that they know that what you’re looking at really is a friend of power, and that he isn’t. And that’s quite an intimidating thing. Because, you know, that when if anything happens and anything kicks off, power is going to back them and not you. And that’s exactly what’s happened, time and time again!

 

Woes: Yeah. I think this is an area where the ordinary guy is just screwed, really! Because you have to think your way into a position where you win the approval of the powerful. And at this point that means a very unnatural position. It means forgetting all sorts of things, contradicting all sorts of things.

 

I guess the alarming thing about the last few years and it wasn’t just Covid, it was there before then, is how amenable people, how pliable people are, how able to believe contradictory stuff they actually are. There’s not that much rationality in the ordinary person. I think this does relate to class in a way. The middle class is just the worst for this. They’re just absolutely awful for this!

 

I think the working class, still the Midwit meme, similar sort of thing. It’s the middle class who are just the upholders of delusion, pretension, lies, fashionable lies! It’s a Ukraine avatar. But of course, you also do get the working class who are aspiring to be middle class. And they know that the way to do it is to ape that behaviour, to have the fashionable view on everything. Because there now is a “fashionable view” on every given topic!

 

Morgoth: Yeah, this is part of why she detected me as some sort of heretic straight away, because in all of the “current thing” avatars, I was going through them one by one and kind of critiquing them and knocking them down.

 

But I did think it was interesting to think of it what we’re engaged in, because we are politicized. And then you’ve got all of these sort of normies that aren’t. And then you’ve got some chubby cow who’s like a Leftist. She’s had her own kind of political awakening in the universities and whatnot, and in all of the social circles that she moves in.

 

And it’s a bit like in the Matrix where you’ve got like people who are awake, and then you’ve got the Agents, and everybody else is just like these holograms, just like this dead herd. That’s actually what it’s like.

 

When she was aware straight away that there was something wrong with me, I was an enemy, even though I wasn’t using racial slurs, or anything like that. It was just there! It was just sort of detected, the alarms went off. And then her task was to sort of make sure are that I was contained and controlled.

 

Woes: To cut you off from the others present, so that your influence couldn’t spread.

 

Morgoth: In real life in the pub!

 

Woes: Just for the sake of my mental image of this girl. Was she middle class? About 25?

 

[59:23]

 

Morgoth: It’s hard to tell because they dress like shite. It’s like this deliberate dressing down. To be fair, the accent that she had wasn’t from the northeast either. It was from further south. It was more like a nondescript sort of middle England sort of accent, rather than regional.

 

So in a place, lake Tynemouth or Newcastle itself, there is the heavy presence of hipsters, and irritating university types. They like it for some reason. There’s a big university presence. There’s just something about Newcastle which seems to attract them. I don’t know why that is, but it’s as if they go to a place like Newcastle because it’s perceived, or once was, as being a bit earthy, and a bit kind of authentic.

 

So then they’ll go along and just dominate it and turn it into a hive of shit liberally! Which was even in my own drinking career, I used to go to the bars in the Big Market and it was wild! And you weren’t under control.

 

I used to meet up on a Saturday afternoon with all me mates. There’d be about twelve of us, and we’d go drinking. And we’d begin in a little pub in the back alley on the Big Market called Printer’s Pie. And nobody was watching what they were saying in any way at all! Even the idea of it would have just seemed incomprehensible! Nobody would have been able to believe it. And there’d be a barmaid there as well. But the barmaid’s task was to just bring your beer, and look cute.

 

Woes: Yeah, not tone police, for fuck’s sake!

 

Morgoth: Yeah.

 

Woes: Just on the word “retard”. When you were talking when you were telling the story, I remembered that the word “retard” gets you an instance reprimand on Twitter. It’s a word that some people, quite a lot of people have fallen foul of this. There is no context, I don’t think there is any context in which that word is allowed on Twitter. Maybe if you’re quoting someone else, you might get away with it. But it’s like a red flag word. I don’t think it would result in an immediate ban outright, but it would get picked up by the algorithm and you’d be screwed just for using that word.

 

In the same way as she was saying that word is not allowed in here. That is a bad word. That’s like a hate word. It’s like the N word, or whatever.

 

Morgoth: I mean, I thought retard was just a nicer way of saying spastic, or spaca!

 

Woes: [chuckling] It is! But it’s kind of like “coloured” as opposed to something stronger. It’s less bad than the very strong word, but it’s still really bad.

 

Morgoth: So what do you get if you call somebody a spaca?

 

Woes: Oh, I don’t know.

 

Morgoth: The thing is that’s kind of archaic, isn’t it? A lot of people [chuckling] wouldn’t even know what that was these days, who’ve been so softened, you know what I mean?

 

Woes: Yeah, I don’t know. This is just a horrible thing about the pub. When you first started telling the story, I had the image of her, … I didn’t catch you saying that it was a hipster place. So I was thinking it’s a stereotypical English pub.

 

Morgoth: But it’s difficult to actually say what that is anymore, because the pubs where I used to be able to say whatever you want, I think there’s always, … It takes you to class, because I was always in working men’s clubs when I used to go out, the Big Market was all working class.

 

Back in the 90s you would have places in Newcastle which were a little bit more up market, but they tended not to be pubs at all. They would be like restaurants or something. It was like if you’ve got money, if you’re well to do, you’ll go to a restaurant, and it’ll be all kind of lovey dovey, and gentle, and swanky.

 

But for the rest of us, sort of factory jobbers who are let out for a day to spend our wages [chuckling] on a Saturday, in one go. It was just all of the pubs, all the pubs were yours.

 

And what began to happen, I went away in the early 2000s and I would come back and I could see like, it used to be, where the the Quay side was like a total dump! It was really dilapidated. It hadn’t changed at all since the Get Carter movie, and all of this. But then when Blair got in because Newcastle and the Northeast in general were really big on Labour, to be fair, when Blair got in, there was just hundreds of millions got funneled into Newcastle especially. And all along the Quay side, you had all of this development coming in.

 

Woes: Kee? Kee? Sorry. [chuckling] Are you not familiar with that meme?

 

Morgoth: No.

 

Woes: Sorry, I didn’t mean to interrupt. Go on.

 

[1:05:18]

 

Morgoth: You had all of this development going along and the stuff that they brought in, it seemed to be like targeting, and it didn’t want people like me and my mates going in anymore, though we still did, when I came back.

 

But it was a much more genteel kind of thing they were bringing in. It looked different as well. The carpets and the sort of rough and tumble of the old pubs, that all went, and you got this much more sparse and everything was glass. You got more and more people from down south popping in and appearing. And it was just different.

 

So then you ended up where this kind of the actual Geordies would just hang out in the Big Market and then on the hay market. And it just sort of kept creeping in, until everything just, … So I don’t know. I would never go there now anyway. But it was changing, and you got all of this money coming in and it kind of changed into something more middle class than what it was.

 

Because I remember the Big Market was wild. It was famous for it. I’m not saying it was great, I mean, it really was just fat slags rolling around with their knickers hanging down. It deserved a bad reputation that it had. I’ve got to be careful about being too kind of romantic about it, because it was kind of grotty and seedy. And it was tough and there was people getting glassed. I’m not going to be too kind of bleary eyed and nostalgic about it all. It was a bit of a dump, if I’m honest.

 

Woes: The thing is, though, this process applies not only to places like that. It also applies to the kind of places that I went to in my younger days. Gothy places, grungy places, all of that has now been, I don’t know how you, blandified, streamlined, consumerized.

 

If you look at a place like Camden Market, for example. When I was an art student, it was 20 years ago. And it was kind of grimy, it was kind of dilapidated. And it was where middle class students, art students, and whatever would go.

 

And it was kind of cool. And it felt quite, I’m not going to say countercultural, because I don’t think it really was, but it was countercultural in a harmless way. But it had a nice atmosphere.

 

And if you go there now, it’s been New Labourized, it’s been Blairified. There’re glass and steel, the Victorian buildings have been they’ve been given contemporary extensions and add ons. And it’s big names are there now. Everything is commercialized in a way that it just wasn’t 20 years ago.

 

And other people will say, that’s rose tinted. Of course, there was all this commerce. Of course I know that. But there’s this fileting of culture, this streamlining, of flattening of culture, down to something that is very bland and efficient, and anyone can dabble in it.

 

It is a process that I think has been almost universal. I mean, I think only the most, maybe the highest echelons have been immune to this process over the last, 200 years. It’s a depressing thing!

 

But again, it makes me think of the World Economic Forum with their graphs and pie charts and their diagrams about how everything is going to be very streamlined in the future. It’s the same kind of process of just simplifying and just ripping the soul out of everything, whether it’s a working class pub, or some grungy place, whatever.

 

[1:09:18]

 

Morgoth: I remember I came back and I went for a drink with me mates, and he said:

 

“It’s changing around here now, isn’t it?”

 

He said:

 

“They should do it on the Quay side.”

 

And this is before all of the multicultural language was seeping in. And I remember distinctly the first ever time I heard the word “multicultural”. I lived abroad and I was watching television. Oh, no, I was reading. I used to get the Sunday Times and I’ll have to get it on Monday. But it was a big, thick book, and I’d read it all the way through, everything that was in it. And that was like me catching up for the week on things back home.

 

And I remember reading an article, and I’d already seen the problems with immigration in places like France and Holland. And I remember it was sort of dawning on me that they were doing it properly now to Britain, as well.

And I remember Gordon Brown using the word “multiculturalism”. And that was the first time. It was in an article about something and it was the first time I’d ever seen that word like that. I’d never heard the word “multicultural” before! I don’t know what it was, maybe 2006 or something. And it was just sort of expected that I knew what it meant and I thought it was a good thing.

 

And it was strange for me because I’d been away, I hadn’t been home that much, so I was out of touch with all of these subtle changes to the language that was being used. But I knew that I hated the term straight away! Because I was like:

 

“We’re not multicultural! It’s our culture! And who decided this?”

 

Instantly, I knew that I hated it! But I went back anyway, and I went for a drink with me mate, and he was talking about some of the changes that were happening down on the Quay side. And he said he hasn’t been down there in a while.

 

“I like it down there these days. It’s very diverse!”

 

Woes: Oh my God!

 

Morgoth: And remember, this is somebody who’s just like me! And I thought, and I said:

 

“Diverse? What does that mean?”

 

I said:

 

“You’ve got the kebabs in there?”

 

And he’s saying:

 

“All those people from all over, they’ve got food stalls. It’s an amazing array of, …”

 

What do you call it?

 

Woes: An [chuckling] incredible range of restaurants!

 

Morgoth: It’s an incredible range of food stalls along the Quay side! It was just the way that he sort of absorbed this kind of language, which had been worked out, like I say, in the government, in the NGOs. This kind of positive sounding language.

 

I mean, it didn’t take him long before he changed his mind, but it was just without thinking, he’d come up with this new term. [chuckling]

 

Woes: Back in the day [chuckling]!

 

Morgoth: There was multiculturalism, and now he has me mate coming up with this word like “diverse”.

 

Because we’d never used language like that. We’d never used it. You would just call them foreigners. It was right there. When people say Britain’s always been multicultural. I’m not that old, but I remember a time I was an adult before I’d even heard that word.

 

Woes: Yeah, well, I’ve been ranting and raving of a Telegram channel called Forgotten History UK. I’ll just shill it one more time. It just started on Telegram two weeks ago or something. They’ve already got more than 1,000 followers, and it’s fantastic! And it shows mostly, mainly London, mainly in the first half of the 20th century and the end of the 19th. And it’s entirely White.

 

There is no way, … Even the capital was vastly, vastly White! I’m not going to go on about it because I’ve mentioned this enough times before.

 

But this whole idea that Britain has always been diverse or multicultural is just utter nonsense! And that’s the capital. If you then talk about a regional place like Newcastle or Edinburgh! At my primary school, there were three non-White kids. Two of them were a couple of Chinese sisters, and then there was a half black girl. That was it. I guess there were several hundred pupils, that was all. And then at my high school, there was again something like five of them out of over 1,000.

 

Morgoth: In all the years of me going to school, there was one black girl who was about five years older than me. And then there was another one, but she half black and she was a few years younger than me. That’s out of all of the classes and all of the years at school, that was it. That was it!

 

Woes: It’s just such an obvious lie. And the scary thing about this, and this relates to what we were saying earlier, is how people go along with this, who are the same age as you and me, so they know damn well! They could remember if they wanted to. They could remember their own schooling, their own childhood. And they would know that it wasn’t always diverse.

 

And then people older than us, people in their their fifties and sixties and seventies, who parrot this bullshit. They can remember 20, 30 years further behind, further back than you and I can. And yet even they are coming out with this bullshit. This is something I find amazing! Sorry, go on.

 

[1:15:17]

 

Morgoth: I remember, this is true. People are surprised at this, but I swear on my life it’s true. When I was a boy, I used to stay at me grandmothers, when I was little, ten years old or something like that, and I used to take the homework over. My granddad was a very knowledgeable man. He used to help us with the homework.

 

And one of the projects that I had it was something to do with religious symbols. And my grandfather took a look at it and he saw that there was actually, I had this book and I opened it up and there was like all of these Sikh symbols, and there was the Hindu stuff. So it was there in the education curriculum, even that far back. But what he said, he said:

 

“What’s the name of the teacher who’s giving you this?”

 

I won’t mention it because I might give too much away, but I mentioned the name of the teacher. And me granddad went:

 

“I bet she’s jewish.”

 

And I was like qy where? Why?”

 

He [chuckling] kind of saw this I was looking at all of these, from his perspective, all of these kind of foreign religions that he would think I had no business learning about. I should learn about Christianity. But I was being taught these other religions. That came to haunt me years later. And I thought:

 

“That’s really weird that he should say that, actually!”

 

Woes: Very based granddad there! That’s amazing! It is amazing because, without wanting to get onto too controversial topics. It’s funny how people, … Because we think we’ve sort of alighted on some quite arcane knowledge on that matter, on the internet.

 

But people a long, long time before us, who certainly didn’t have the Internet, somehow knew about it. And I don’t know how they did. I really don’t know how they, … I mean, if they got into nationalist politics, organizations, or whatever, obviously I can see how they would find out about it then. But otherwise how did that enter their lives? It’s difficult enough now for it to enter people’s lives. It’s something you’ve really got to seek out. Amazing!

 

Morgoth: I think before the war, for that generation, basically everybody was anti-semitic. Maybe not in the way which has emerged on the internet in more recent years, but there was a certain stereotype around that group. And they all knew it as well.

 

Woes: But it’s not the sort of miserly, money grubbing, type that we’re talking about here, is it? With your granddad

 

Morgoth: Yeah

 

Woes: He’s talking about this woman pushing multiculturalism, but obviously wouldn’t use that term.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, you got to be careful what you’re saying because by ascribing stereotypes to a group and everything. So, yeah, that’s just an interesting

Woes: I certainly never want to do that. [lol]

 

Morgoth: That’s just a little interesting personal anecdote, take it or leave it from me.

 

Woes: Well, I mean, I can remember, to show the other side of it. Middle class boomer woman, teacher. A school teacher. And in many ways, she was a really good, kind, lovely person. But she imbibed the politics of that time, that era. And I think this is around about the year 2005, maybe 2010. And I said that:

 

“I think it’s right that school kids in Britain are taught about Christianity, and I don’t think it’s necessarily right that they’re taught about the other religions.”

 

And her answer was:

 

“They should be taught about all religions equally.”

 

Because from her perspective – she was an atheist. So from her perspective, it’s just a matter of curiosity. It doesn’t matter! There is no religion that is a part of our culture, that’s a part of our identity. It’s just a matter of academic interest. So therefore all religions are of equal interest, equally large, equally small, whatever. And no particular religion should have any prominence over any others.

 

So, I mean, that’s a truly sort of multicultural notion there. Well, it’s a boomer multicultural notion [chuckling]! Because it’s all detached, it’s distant, it’s something remote, it’s a matter that doesn’t concern us, it’s not our problem. It’s just something that’s of intellectual interest. Whereas a more contemporary multicultural treatment of it is this is a core part of everyone people’s identity.

 

[1:20:35]

 

Morgoth: Yeah, it’s pure relativism, because then not one of them is more important than another. So you end up with nothing of your own, because, well, it’s got no place. There’s no special place for yours.

 

Woes: Exactly! And that was the point I was making, that Christianity should have prominence over the others because this is a Christian country. That was what I was arguing at the time. Bear in mind, this was 2005, 2010. And what I would now see is Christianity and Paganism should be taught about. And we’re not saying that religious instruction, as in:

 

“Here is the truth, children.”

 

I mean, it just learning about the religion.

 

I would now say, yeah, Christianity, but also Paganism. Back then, it was just, I only knew about Christianity, and I just didn’t like this idea that Sikhism, Hinduism, Judaism, Islam, that these would be given equal place in the curriculum. I learnt about those religions at high school because I took that subject. Religious studies. Fine.!

 

But to say that why you should do away with Christian hymns at school, and I’m sure they have by now, I’m sure that’s just been completely eradicated. And I think that’s crazy, because this is all about identity. It’s not even about the religion itself. This is giving the children, it’s inducting them into a tradition, and if you take that away, they’re going to be inducted into no tradition! And so, of course, the only thing available to them will be to crap, popular, culture. This precious little of that as well, oddly enough. Go on.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, what they’ll be indoctrinated into is like, Left-wing value sets and political correctness, like inequality, and all of these things. That’s what replaced religion. I mean, again, I remember coming back. My youngest brother was still at school. And I remember coming back, and throughout all of my sort of childhood, I had one medal and two certificates or something. And the medal I got was for doing the great, some fun run thing that they had through [word unclear] Park. Basically, I had almost nothing [chuckling] like achievement.

 

But I came home. My brother’s bedroom was because he was still at school until the mid 2000s, and his bedroom was just completely plastered in certificates! And it used to piss me dad off because he said:

 

“You get certificates for nothing!”

 

He said he came home, he came last in a race because he got drunk with his mates the night before he went into school. He was about 14 or 15, and he couldn’t run, he could hardly finish it. And they still gave him a certificate! What kind of loser attitude is that?

 

And this was the whole thing when New Labor came in, you saw that all of a sudden, everybody’s “special”, everybody gets a prize, even if you’re completely useless! So what you do then is abolish hierarchy. The person who’s actually really fast in a race doesn’t really matter because you’re going to get the same thing at the end of it anyway. So you’re destroying the incentive to strive towards greatness.

 

Woes: Yeah, you’ve devalued excellence. It reminds me of, and I’ve mentioned it before, although not on this Millenniyule, a documentary, and it’s a fascinating thing! It’s called the Loony Left. It’s from 1985, or 86. It was an American reporter who came over to Britain, to London, and because at that time, the London had a reputation for being full of, you know, loony lefties, especially the education sector and social work and whatever.

 

So this journalist interviews various people and it’s remarkable! Absolutely remarkable, how the stuff that was going on in London in 1985 is the stuff that we tend to associate with the Blair era, 15 years later. We tend to think that the doctrine of multiculturalism, for example, that actually predates even this, the doctrine of multiculturalism was first sort of announced as the policy in Britain, I think, in 1981, with the Scarman Report. And, you know, it obviously floated around academia and Lefty teacher training colleges for a few years before that. But it was official as from 1981, which is just amazing to think of now.

 

But anyway, this documentary is full, and I would absolutely recommend that people watch it. It’s one of the most interesting things, because it shows how long a lot of this stuff has been going on. It’s not just today, it’s not just, 20 years ago, like the Blair era. It’s been going on since at least the mid-eighties. And enough that by the time that crew came over to do this documentary it was very prevalent throughout London.

 

And one of the things that they found was, … And I dare say it was a bit skewed, a bit selective, whatever, I don’t really care, because at this point, you know, that it is that prevalent. I mean, it’s just obvious.

 

So one of the things they found was right, I think I found it. Yeah, that took a while. Okay, sorry about that. Apparently it’s 16 minutes long, but I thought there was a longer version. But anyway, here it is. I’ll paste into the live chat.

 

One of the things they found was in this school in London where the competitive sports had been abolished. So everyone was a “winner”. And of course they did, … Oh Read Johnson has already linked to it. Thank you very much. Let me just check if that is, … Yeah, that is the version. Thanks very much.

 

So competitive sports have been abolished. There were no real rules. There was no way to win, and no way to lose! So therefore everyone was a “winner”! Of course, that completely gets rid of hierarchy! I have no idea how that maps onto the mind of an adolescent boy, a teenage boy. I mean, you’re built to be very competitive at that age. So I don’t know what that does to them other than neuter them.

 

[1:27:51]

 

Morgoth: I came last in one marathon one year and me dad just tossed a fit. It was horrible. He was saying:

 

“It’s an absolute disgrace that you’ve come last! There’s not a single other person, …”

 

Because it was mixed. But he wasn’t even counting the girls. It was just like you have a list of the girls names and then the boys names and I was at last, because I’ve always been shite at running. And my name was at the bottom. And he was like:

 

“There’s not a single other lad that you can point to say, ‘I was at least faster than him’. At least then you would have that. You’ve got nothing! You’re last! It’s the worst! Look, you’re literally at the bottom. It’s pathetic!”

 

And I thought:

 

“Christ almighty! This is a bit much, isn’t it?”

 

But that was the way it was.

 

Woes: Yeah. I had similar your dad would be embarrassed if you didn’t do well. If you didn’t do as well as he thought you could do. There was a sense of shame and that you’d let him down and you fucking had! I mean, let’s be honest, if that happens, your dad is probably right. Mothers can be a bit delusional about their children’s abilities, but fathers tend to be much more realistic. And if your dad thinks that you could have fucking done better, you probably could.

 

Morgoth: Yeah.

 

Woes: That shame you feel is, I think, healthy.

 

It was absolutely about at least you could point to one other person that could have been last. It’s quite a ruthless kind of mindset when you think of it like that. But it didn’t happen again. So, that’s that.

 

Woes: Yeah. Well, I guess we are an hour and a half into this. Do you want to talk about some of the articles that you wrote this year [chuckling]?

 

Morgoth: Yeah [chuckling]!

 

Woes: It’s been a nice chat, but let’s, …

 

Morgoth: Let’s get one of the ones that I did early in the year, which in January this is so early in the year, I might have actually spoiled it on Millenniyule last year. But it was called Cthulhu’s Big Data Hall. And it gets back to the whole Covid thing. And the idea that it wasn’t just about virus. There were so many more things came in with it.

 

And the article that I wrote plays around with the idea that what the system, what the government and the Deep State have actually unearthed about the population. And the way I approached it was that if you imagine, say, the vaccination status is the people, and if you imagine somewhere in the British government, you’ve got somebody with a giant map of, let’s just say the UK. It would be England and Wales, I think, and Scotland as a seperate thing.

 

But let’s just say a giant map of England and Wales. And on there, what you’ve got, this is the way I can describe it. On there you’ve got just a huge blue blob for all of the people who’ve had, let’s say, just say, two vaccines, because I’m still getting them. But two vaccines there, and it’s a massive swathe of blue, but you can kind of Zoom in, because we all got the letters to our doors from the NHS. It was a personal invite. You get text messages so they know who you are.

 

And what I thought was interesting was that they could Zoom all the way in on one single blue pixel, and it would be Jeff D from Burnley, and it would have his thing. But then you can kind of make that go away. And then you could have, say, orange. And what you would then have would be that all of the people who just had one vaccine and there’d be fewer of them, but there’d still be a lot. And the same thing applies. You could still scroll in and you could still Zoom in on one single orange dot.

 

And then you could do it again and there would be red dots, but it would be a much smaller group and they’d be spread out. And then you could still do that and you could still scroll all the way in onto somebody, on one single red dot, and that would be the unvaccinated. Now, on the face of it, that doesn’t matter, because the way people talk about it, well, this is just all about the Medicine. This is all just about vaccinating against the virus. That’s all rubbish!

 

Because if you think of it, like the way I’m describing it here. And you Zoom all the way in, all the way in on the one little red dot of an unvaccinated person. You’re seeing a lot more actually. What the data reveals there altogether is something a lot more than just people who didn’t get the vaccine.

 

Because what you’re also revealing there is the red dots that have shown up and you can see their addresses. You know who they are. They are also the people who are completely immune to the most intense propaganda campaign that there’s ever been. On top of that, they are by extension distrustful of the system. They don’t trust the government, they don’t trust the experts, they don’t trust the scientists. They are critical thinking.

 

In other words, what that reveals to the system all of those little red dots because of the vaccine campaign, all of them, all of a sudden, they’ve got all of the dissidents in the country standing there, sitting there on a map presenting themselves to you with their addresses and their telephone numbers. You know exactly who they are!

 

Now, people will say:

 

“Well, actually, they always did know who you were.”

 

But that’s not true. Now they will, I’m sure that me and Woes like, you know, we’ve popped up on the radar. But if you imagine, for example, a single millennial woman, single woman, 35, she works full-time in an office. Now, she is according to the usual sort of data sets, she is extremely compliant with what the system wants. She’ll tend to just go along with it. But not all of them will. And not all of them are in the live chat. Now, not all of them are subbed to people on Substack, or all of this. But all of a sudden, that person there’s a red dot there. And it will be, perhaps, a 35 year old woman who consumes this kind of content and who thinks like a dissident. But until that moment has been utterly grey and unknown to the system.

 

But now all of a sudden because of a vaccine rollout, she’s there revealed! And I’m just using that as an example. So what this allowed the system to do, … And they will think like this because I’ve read how these things work in the Nudge Departments applied psychology. What they are looking at then are people who they’d never known, weren’t actually triggering the alarms on the system. They weren’t doing content, they weren’t leaving comments anywhere.

 

But all of a sudden they can now see them. They can now see that benign, boring, 35 year old woman, who works full-time, pays her taxes, she’s a good citizen. But secretly she too is distrustful of the government, and she too is distrustful of the experts. And quietly she is a dissident. And now it would never be known before, but now it is known! So going forward they’ve got a complete read out of who is distrustful of the regime in this country thanks to the vaccine rollout. And that was what that article was about, which I was quite proud of, called Cthulhu’s Big Data Hall.

 

[1:36:23]

 

Woes: Yeah. Years ago there was an advertising campaign, I think it was for either the TV licence fee, or driving, car tax, or something, and it said:

 

“You can’t escape the computer.”

 

That was the slogan that was on. I remember seeing it on huge billboards. It was quite a long time ago, actually. And it was this sort of openly flirting with totalitarianism, deliberately, knowingly saying to say:

 

“You can’t escape the computer.”

 

It’s a really shitty thing to say to the general public, because they haven’t done anything wrong, or at least not yet. And you’re basically saying to them:

 

“You are under the thumb. You are dominated!”

 

It’s very rude! It lacks any finesse at all.

 

And that’s the thing. It was the first time when I saw the state not even trying to have finesse, not even trying to soften the blow. It was just being completely aggressive towards the public and trying to make them feel intimidated and scared.

 

And that was to do with, I don’t know what it was some computerized system by which they would track who had and hadn’t paid some tax or other, whether it was a licence fee for the TV, or whatever it was. And that’s a version, an early version of what you’re talking about. But I guess that would be down to the individual address. But even then it was not exact because some people didn’t even have a TV. And certainly a lot more people nowadays don’t have a TV.

 

With the Covid vaccine it’s much more precise. It’s every individual within the address. And it’s definite. And it’s not just about:

 

“Oh, I want to dodge paying a bill. I want to see if I can get away with not paying that 20 quid.”

 

Or whatever it is, or 100 quid. It’s got nothing to do with money, because you didn’t have to pay for the vaccine.

 

So in other words, it’s a direct reflection of how susceptible you are to government programming. It’s got nothing to do with you trying to save some money. It’s are you on board or not?

 

[1:39:01]

 

Morgoth: It’s behaviour. They’re tracking the behaviour of the population by this so the big blue blob, which is like 80% or something. People don’t seem sure. But what they’ve got there, it goes back to what I was saying earlier, the girl and the bar. Where all of a sudden, it’s like she’s monitoring the conversation in the bar to make sure that it doesn’t take directions. Another version of her somewhere in the bureaucracy is doing that for the whole population.

 

And what you can see is that this is the sort of the framework of a Social Credit System. Because they’ve already got all of your information. People could say that I’m just paranoid, but I actually do think they’ve absolutely got something like this where they can see all of who hasn’t been vaccinated and their revealed preferences.

 

It also means they’re critical thinking. They’re not susceptible as the propaganda. They don’t trust the state. That’s handy to have on people in your population, because what they’re looking at is a purely sort of Schmidtian way is their enemies! Right there! They popped up on the screen.

 

So when you go forward and it’ll come in in a different direction through the iPhone or tracking your carbon stuff and all of this, …

 

Woes: With the CBID

 

Morgoth: Yeah. So when people say:

 

“Oh, well, it’s over now.”

 

It’s not now. All along, the people who were going on were saying all along its about much more than a vaccine. And you can see that it’s been this giant data gathering, along with a lot of other things. But it’s been this giant sort of exercise and gathering data on the general population.

 

There’s no way to hide anymore. They know who you are. You’re right there. They know you don’t like them, they know you don’t trust them. And you thought:

 

“Oh, well, I’ll just keep my head down, and go and [word unclear] my job. I’ll watch a bit of Odyssey on the side, but I won’t have an account, so I’m not logged in anything.”

 

You’re still there! You’re still on the grid now.

 

Woes: Absolutely! And if they did want to implement something, some social programme in a town, let’s say. Let’s say Oxfordshire, for example [chuckling], they would now know exactly which residents in that area they might want to, who knows, put in prison just to get them out of the way, whatever. It doesn’t matter! Or just keep an eye on them. They would know exactly which ones are likely to cause trouble.

 

Morgoth: Well, do you remember when Justin Trudeau said all of these people who won’t get the vaccine, and was with the truckers and everything, he said:

 

“They’re extremists and they’re racists? !”

 

Now, if you go back and you think of that data gathering thing, I would say that this sort of the dissident right community or whatever you want to call it, and the nationalist scene, would have the highest percentage of people who didn’t get the vaccine in the whole country.

 

Now, if he’s got access to that data, he is actually correct. I know that it sounds ridiculous, but if he’s had, his policy wonks get in touch with him and give him data on who is actually refusing it, it may well turn up that they’ve just kind of filtered it through algorithms and you can begin to build up a picture of an average person who is refusing to get it. And it may well be that their politics swing sharply to the Right. But they are usually distrustful of the government.

 

I know everybody laughs when Trudeau says the people who are refusing it, they’re racist, they’re sexist or whatever. He may have a point there, he may have access to information which you didn’t realize.

 

Woes: Absolutely! I would say a similar thing about Brexit. I think your average sort of Brexciteer, UKIP, voter and so on, would bulk at the idea that they were racist. And the Left would constantly say, Brexit is a racist thing, Brexciteers are racists, and so on.

 

But I think there was a certain truth to that. It was a sort of unconscious and really genuinely unconscious feeling about homeland and your own people and so on. And you wanted them to be sovereign, you wanted them to matter again. So the Left, I often think that the Left know the Right better than the Right know themselves.

 

Morgoth: Yes!

 

Woes: But now they really do [chuckling]! Because of the technology.

 

Morgoth: Now they’ve got you! We’re living in a panopticon. You’ve got to assume that you’re being watched all of the time, which is why I don’t do the edgy stuff anymore, because it just seems like suicide. And the cost, is just, isn’t worth it anymore. And you can kind of get your point across just by being careful and thinking carefully about what you’re saying, how you’re putting things.

 

I mean, I kind of dropped the ball earlier in the stream when I was telling the story about the bar. Calling him a cuck within that context, is a little bit dodgy. I would like to take that back. But this is kind of where we are now. You’ve always got to watch what you’re saying. You’ve always got to be on the alert. How could that come across? Could that be reframed? Should I get the knock on the door, or my bank account gets closed?

 

This is the reality of how we live now. It isn’t coming. It’s here! And you have to be realistic about it. And a lot of the content this year has kind of reflected that. This kind of disorientating thing that you’ve got where you never know what’s true and what isn’t.

 

Woes: Yeah, well, that was all the way through Covid that was the case where you just didn’t know what was true and what wasn’t. We don’t need to go into that now. Let’s move on to the next article that you want to talk about.

 

Morgoth: Well, there’s a lot of them. Another one that I did, which is a complete shift in gear, I called America’s Toxic Rebrand.

 

[1:45:53]

 

Woes: Yeah, I remember this one. I really liked this one! I thought you made a very good point in it about how well you can tell yourself.

 

Morgoth: Well, yeah, so it gives me a chance to indulge one of the sort of me favourite loves, which is like, 80s movies, and why you had that sort of positive vibe around at the time. If you look at the woke stuff now, it’s just completely rancid. And you had that Qatar football tournament, and it causes trouble because they’re trying to export the transsexual stuff, Black Lives Matter stuff, Rainbow Flag. Nobody wants it, everybody hates it.

 

And I thought the stuff that I grew up with, during the Christmas, I just watched all of the Indiana Jones movies again, which are problematic for different reasons. We could probably touch on that if you want. But still, it’s so much fun.

 

Just generally in the 80s it began to petrol a bit. In the 90s, America had a way of selling itself to the world. If you look I mean, there’s Indiana Jones, but then you’ve got, say, Marty McFly, Back to the Future, or Goonies, or Ghostbusters or all of these things. And if I was a dictator somewhere in the Middle East, I would be more worried about like Rocky than what I am about woke Star Wars, because your population are going to be immunized against just how blatant and disgusting the agenda is.

 

Whereas what something like Rocky does is give you a slice of the American dream. It’s saying to you, obviously it came out before Reagan came in, but it was kind of foreshadowing what was to come. And then throughout the 80s, you just got Rocky film after Rocky film. But what you’re getting is a little slice of the American dream. It’s where if you work hard, if you stick in there, stand on your own two feet literally pull yourself up by your bootstraps and all of that, then America is the land of plenty. It’s a land of freedom. The world, like in Scarface, the world can literally be yours!

 

So that’s a positive thing to sell. You will be free. There’s not going to be any crazy ideologues tormenting you can get comfortable. All you got to do is work hard. That’s actually a very good sell. And I’d be worried about that message creeping in.

 

I mean, it’s no surprise that it was at its peak in the 1980s during the Cold War. So the image that the people in Russia, or Poland standing outside of shops in lines waiting for bread, and then you get this little glimpse of America, this whole positive thing where if you just work hard, it will all be yours, and you’d be free. Nobody’s going to tell you what to do. That’s one hell of a message. But when you get to the woke stuff, it’s just rancid! Absolutely rancid!

 

Woes: And depressing, and lifeless, and sour, and not life affirming at all. It’s doctrinaire! It’s shrill, it’s nasty, it’s not upbeat.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, so nobody wants that. And you just think, why, just from a purely strategic perspective, you think, what a fuck up that is. Why would you want to present Lizzie [sp] and all of the transsexuals to the world? Knowing that they just don’t like it! There isn’t a positive vision. It just makes America look like a lunatic asylum! And I can never understand just from that perspective. Or, unless they are just so hell bent on annihilating traditional America that they don’t even care!

 

Woes: I’ll show a clip from our comedy program. I got this. Let me just see when I saved this file, because it will indicate when I saw this for the first time. But it was about, it was June last year, and the programme is called Shrill, ironically. And it’s supposed to be a comedy. So I’m going to show this clip. It’s 1 minute and twenty seconds long. And bear in mind that this is supposed to be a comedy. Here we go.

 

[1:50:52]

 

Black female: So, yeah, with first-time clients, I like to talk through the kind of thing you’re thinking, where you want to go with your hair.

 

White female: I brought some inspiration. This is what I’m thinking.

 

Black female: Okay. Well, I mean, this is Bob Marley.

 

White female: Didn’t know who he was.

 

Black female: Okay, but you wanted dreadlocks like Bob Marley?

 

White female: Yeah, I think I could really pull that off. Don’t you think I can pull it off?

 

Black female: I don’t, but it’s not really about that. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of the term “cultural appropriation” before?

 

White female: Oh, I love culture! I went to Berlin once, and all my friends there had dreadlocks.

 

Black female: Yeah, I’m sure they did. Okay, if I were to wear my hair in dreadlocks and I went into work, say, in an office, I would get told to wear my hair straight, to look more professional.

 

White female: That would be really cute.

 

Black female: Okay. Yeah. You’re not getting it. Let’s just not do this. I’m going to ask you to leave.

 

White female: Wait. What? Why?

 

Black female: I tried to explain, but you weren’t listening. So let’s end this now.

 

White female: What is happening?

 

White female assistant: It’s nothing personal. It’s just that we hate you here. Bye Siena. Come on. Thanks so much for coming.

 

White female: Are you serious?

 

White female assistant:: I just made food and you’re keeping me from eating it. Let’s go. You should just leave.

 

[White female enters carrying food for assistant.]

 

White female: She’s not going to do your hair.

 

———————-

 

Woes: Isn’t that just absolutely fucking dreadful!

 

Morgoth: That looks like a parody. That looks like somebody taking the piss out of them!

 

Woes: It’s not.

 

Morgoth: What’s the message they’re trying to send of that? If a young White woman isn’t, like, well versed in Critical Race Theory stuff, they just have to be thrown out of her hairdressers?

 

Woes: Yeah.

 

Morgoth: Christ.

 

Woes: I mean, that she’s a loser. And bear in mind that she’s clearly middle class, a bit naive. She’s been to Berlin, so she’s travelled a bit. But she’s not aware of racial issues because she’s got White privilege. And she carelessly talks about appropriating black people’s culture with their dreadlocks. So she’s an idiot. She’s a privileged idiot! And so she’s just to be degraded and humiliated until she gets the idea, until she gets in line. In the meantime, we should all hate her.

 

Morgoth: You see, that the problem, it’s the hairdresser and that other lesbian thing. They are the ones in positions of power. They’re in the position of power both in the hairdressers, but then they’re also in a position of power in society at large, relative to that White girl. There’s not a single institution which would take the side of the White girl! The idea that it’s sort of institutional racism and that she has privilege, it just doesn’t exist. It doesn’t exist anywhere.

 

I was thinking about this recently because of the White privilege thing, where there’s the race, what’s the Act that Enoch Powell? The Race Relations Act, was it?

 

Woes: I think so, yeah.

 

Morgoth: And then you also in 2010, you get the the Equalities Act. And like the Equalities Act, literally sort of sections out minorities. They literally call it “protected groups”, protected groups of people. And White people aren’t in there, but all of the blacks are. And gays. White people can be in there, if you’ve got one of those things, if you are gay, or trans, or whatever.

 

But that legislation, it seems to me, is incompatible with White Privilege Theory. Because what the you can’t privilege two different things at the same time. So people who get into these arguments about trying to say that White Privilege Theory doesn’t exist because I’ve got to work full-time and everything. There’s nowhere in law can you see it, can you point not a single piece of legislation or any acts, or any policies which are there to the benefit of White people. But the Equalities Act. It’s right there. It’s right there. And it privileges, protects, special groups.

 

Woes: Yeah, I think the idea is that we need to have this special protection for minorities in law, because Whites are privileged in the culture just sort of by default. And so they don’t need to be protected in law, because they racistly protect each other in practice, in the culture.

 

Morgoth: But they can’t actually prove that. So if you say, well, the default position of the society is White, well, they’ve got policies in place to do away with that, to prevent that from happening. But there’s no policies anywhere to actually say, well, this is a White society, and we deserve representation.

 

There’s a good channel that I watch sometimes called Truth Stream Media. It’s a couple from Texas. They have done good stuff on the Technocracy and all of that, and they’ve started to release, it’s an hour and 40 minutes long video deep dive into Stanley Kubrick’s The Shining. And in this first episode, I understand what they’re trying to do.

 

What they’re doing is saying that they’re digging into the dispossession of the Native American Indians and then saying, this is in The Shining. It’s a prominent theme. And the idea is that there is an unsettled past. There’s something on the land and the mountains, and sort of the ghosts of this injustice that was done to the Native American Indians. And this is what you see.

 

And if you actually have a look in the Overlook Hotel, it’s called the Overlook Hotel, of course, because something is being overlooked. Something has not been addressed.

 

In actual fact. I was talking about this to Endeavour the other day. In actual fact if you’re White in America, you’re getting bombarded with what happened to the American Indians all the time. And Endeavour pointed out that actually it’s mainly with the blacks in Canada. They get bombarded with guilt about what happened to the natives.

 

Woes: Yeah, but this is 1980 though. One point to make here is that the Overlook Hotel is called that in the novel, which was written by Stephen King. And there’s really not any racial, … I mean, the stuff that people talk about in the film. This is my favourite film, so I know a fair bit about this stuff, and the theory and all that.

 

And I actually think that it’s probably true about Kubrick working this theme into it. And I don’t even think he did it maliciously. I don’t think he did it in the stereotypical jewish way, undermining. I think it was a genuine thing. And it is a genuine thing that we’re injustices done with the Native Americans.

 

Now, I’m not saying that that means America should be cancelled, or that it’s evil, or whatever. I’m just saying I think it’s true and I think that White people are very aware of unfairness, whatever. I don’t really care to justify this. I think it’s what he was going for there. But Kubrick, I don’t believe was the sort of stereotype anti-White filmmaker in the way that we think of today. Sorry, go on.

 

[1:59:06]

 

Morgoth: In their video about it, they dig up all of these posters. And I know, again, I don’t want to sort of just rehash what other people have said, but when you’re with [word unclear] and you’re talking about the Faustian and spirit, you do actually get all of these pioneer sort of posters, where it is about just going off into the Wilderness and taming the untamed.

 

Woes: This is what I mean this is what I mean. Right? Eventually that’s going to come back at you.

 

Morgoth: Yeah.

 

Woes: I think this is what Kubrick was reflecting in the Shining. You can be the pioneer, you can be the imperialist, you can be the adventurer, you can be the conqueror. Fine! That’s one thing.

 

But eventually all the stuff that you’ve conquered, and all the stuff you’ve dominated, and all the stuff literally you built the hotel over the Indian burial ground, all of that is eventually going to come back in some way. And I think even White people, I don’t think this is something that comes from jewish malevolence, or whatever.

 

Morgoth: Well, when you get the Faustian spirit, when it comes to actually going around the world, and claiming ownership over land and all of this, then what you look at with a lot of the Left the critical race stuff, it is a sort of demonization of that spirit.

 

So what they are talking about with Whiteness, a lot of the time they will then tie it to capitalism, stealing resources from places, and whatnot. What they’re actually doing is demonizing the Faustian spirit. They’re actually looking critically at it. And the reason why I was saying it’s like an intangible thing and it seems like mumbo jumbo, it’s because it doesn’t exist as a kind of policy, or a constitutional statement somewhere. This is why the Whiteness stuff is kind of amorphous. But I think that’s what they’re getting at. I think they’re looking at this kind of expansive nature of Western civilization, and then kind of saying:

 

“It’s time to atone for all of this stuff.”

 

Which leaves you thinking:

 

“Well, okay, we either double down, or we grovel on the ground in guilt!”

 

It’s a funny one.

 

But what I was going to get at was that what they were touching on was that the National Parks were established, and the National Parks, in their view, were a sneaky way to get policies passed which dispossessed to the Native Americans because they didn’t have sort of formal legislation which tied them to the land. It was just taken for granted that they belonged there, and that was their spiritually, their place in the world. So the National Parks were established and they had in the small print it was like:

 

“The land will now be protected in this pristine way. It will not be touched by man anymore.”

 

And with that they could then begin to clear the Indians because all of a sudden the land belonged to the American government, seemingly for benign reasons. And you know, they did actually establish all of these amazing parks and whatnot.

 

But there was a downside to it as well. And before everybody starts voting this down and tying this arc back to something which matters to us. And it’s that the native people of Britain don’t have a piece of legislation which binds them to the land like this.

 

And so you end up in a similar situation to the Indians, because all of a sudden it’s just a matter of the government making policies and you just happen to be on this land, which you’ve always been here, you’ve got a spiritual connection to it. Your ancestors have been here for thousands and thousands of years. But all of a sudden, when our people are trying to defend their right to this homeland, it’s like they’re overpowered by all of this policy and all of this legislation.

 

You can see here why civic nationalism is so toxic as well, because that’s what that is. It’s just like a formal sort of treaty. It’s an appeal to legislation. And we need to find a way to say, well, actually, we’ve got something which is beyond the government, and beyond constitutions, and beyond man made written laws. And this is the problem that the Indians had and it’s a similar problem to what we have as well.

 

Woes: Yeah, that is an interesting way to look at it. To get back to that clip from Shrill because I think it ties in with the article that you wrote. You said that they are in charge and the White girl doesn’t have a single institution that would back her up. I think you’re right, but I think that they know they’re in charge. I think that they know they can abuse her, they can humiliate her because they wouldn’t be doing it otherwise. I mean, the whole thing is an exercise in, well, exercising power. It’s an exercise in humiliating the person who is under your control.

 

So I think they know that they’re in charge at this point. I think that stuff like that, where it’s not attempting to see her point of view, invalidating her point of view, invalidating the idea that she could have a valid point of view [chuckling] that is the behaviour of a tyrant, oppressing someone, oppressing a group. So it’s kind of there. I don’t think in this context, they’re not even pretending to be underdogs anymore. The gloves are off.

 

[2:05:08]

 

 

Morgoth: Have you noticed this year? You can see this slipping in now because what they’ve done with [word unclear], there’s a new phrase coming out and they’re calling it the “global majority”. So it used to be, because it’s tied with the climate stuff and having one system to rule the world. If it comes out that people in Africa and Asia are going to be facing droughts or whatnot because of the climate change, then they are suddenly being reframed as the “global majority”. And what this does is put like the industrial White nations automatically into a minority sort position, which it’s implying, …

 

Woes: Minority in a bad way as well. Minority here isn’t a good thing. It’s not exotic and special in these protections. It’s a “selfish” minority.

 

Morgoth: It’s a complete inversion. So we all of our lives we’ve been told in the West that:

 

“Well, you are the majority in your country, we’ve got to have the Equalities Act. We’ve got to protect all of these little groups. This is just the way it is. It’s a moral thing to have all of this stuff to protect and fawn over these special minority groups.”

 

Just like what you were saying before. It is because you are the dominant culture that we have to protect all of these people and give them special dispensations.

 

Now all of a sudden they’re pulling the rug from Europeans, from the West, and they’re now going to turn around and say, :

 

“Well, we need all of these climate change policies brought in to protect the global majority. And at the end of the day, you’re just a minority. You’re going to have to get on board! You’re going to have to go along for the greater good!”

 

There it is again. For the greater good of the planet, for the greater good of humanity. I mean, since why does the “greater good” mentality not apply to what’s happening in our countries? Why can’t you say that? Let’s say, that black people just have to shut up and stop complaining for the greater good of society! For the greater good of society you’re just going to have to stop complaining all of the time, all right? Slavery and all of this? You’re just going to have to deal with it for the greater good. That’s just the way it is.

 

And yet when it comes to a larger technocratic, holy cow, they’re going to do a switcheroo! And they’re going to say:

 

“Well, you’re just a minority, so you’re just going to have to get on board. You’re just going to have to deal with it!”

 

Woes: Yeah! White people have been subdued. I don’t know if that’s quite the right word, but they’ve been browbeaten on the basis that they are the majority. They are the bullying, tough, powerful, greedy, strong, unfragile, majority. But then you can switch the lens. And so from a global perspective, they’re actually the minority! But they’re still selfish and greedy. [chuckling] The fact that they’re selfishness and greediness and so on was established on the basis of them being the majority in their countries. It doesn’t matter because from a global perspective, they’re a minority. But those negative attributes that you’ve ascribed to them and that they’ve internalized still persist in their thinking. They still think, :

 

“Okay, I’m White, therefore, I’m privileged, therefore, I’m powerful, therefore, … But actually there are so many other people in the world, much more than White people, who are oppressed, who are fragile, who are vulnerable. And so I’m a selfish minority, I’m a destructive minority, who is ruining it for everyone else!”

 

So this is the switcheroo that has happened.

 

Morgoth: It’s to do with living standards. If you want to have the same living standards in the West that we had in the 1990s, 1880s, or whatever, then you’re just a minority. You can’t expect that just to continue on in that degree of luxury forever. You’re just a minority. Think about the global majority. Think about the greater good, the greater good of the planet! If we can then divide up your give out your wealth as to other people! People will say it’s cringe to call it “communism”. It kind of is. It kind of is.

 

Woes: I don’t think that we should be self conscious about this. In a sense that there are communistic elements to what is going on. And I don’t think that we should shy away from that for the sake of being called cringe or whatever.

 

[2:10:20]

 

Morgoth: Communism was also purely technocratic. And they developed a solution to a problem, but the solution was corrupt. Chernobyl is a perfect example. I remember I was attacked because I said the rollout of the vaccine could be our version of Chernobyl. But I love that HBO series that came out about three years ago. And it’s just beautifully done. A lot of those actors pop up in that [word unclear]..

 

But when you actually have a look at what happened with Chernobyl, when you get to the end of it, it’s a disaster. And within the Soviet Union, they have this court, they actually say:

 

“Well, okay, what went wrong, really?”

 

And what caused it, was that they were using rods, … It’s been a few years. There’s a special kind of rod that they put in which helps cool the reactor. And further down the bureaucracy, they realized that these rods were really, really expensive. So there was a few of them got the proper rods, decent ones, but then they began cutting corners and they ordered cheaper ones in, because they were themselves under like a sort of incentive structure to get costs down on everything.

 

And so they ended up getting these cheapy rods. But the actual sort of performance of the reactor wasn’t changed to calm it down a little bit because now the coolant system wasn’t as efficient as it was on paper.

 

And so what you have is a kind of technocratic fuck up. But where in the system does the problem lie? And you end up with a complete catastrophe through institutional corruption, cutting corners. And sort of not wanting to rock the boat, being scared to speak out and say:

 

“Hang on a minute, this could be a disaster!”

 

Because that would be your career on the line. All of this, all of this kind of stuff. And the vaccine thing was kind of similar. It’s a similar system. I don’t know, I have went on a bit of a tangent their, but that’s kind of like how we got there.

 

Woes: Yeah. Well, this is the thing about if you’re going to place the faith in technocracy, that this is the danger, that eventually and you hear about this happening in the Soviet Union as well, where they would come up with some system and again, it was all for the greater good. They’d come up with some system, they’d think it was perfect, and then it would backfire in some way, and the bureaucracy would not be able to respond in time. Or there would be an imperative not to respond because that would be raising the alarm, putting your head about the parapet, contradicting your superior, and thus screwing things up. So you would get the blame for it or you would get punished for ruining it for everyone else.

 

So in other words, the bureaucracy, or the technocracy was primed to not respond to reality, but to really dwell in a fictitious version that was optimal for it’s desires. [chuckling] I mean, it’s just awful. So if you submit to a technocracy, this is what you’re potentially submitting to. There has to be this commitment to reality.

 

And what we’ve seen so far with the technocracy that we’re living under and this is why everyone should be very skeptical about it, is that it is not married to reality. I mean, whether it’s about men and women, race, Covid, the vaccine, climate change.

 

I remember in 2006, 7, people sounding the alarm on the climate change thing. And it’s been going on for a very long time. Now whatever is going on with the climate, and I actually don’t see anything happening with the climate, except for the fact that winters, I think, were colder when I was a child. Big deal! Whatever is going on with the climate, I don’t believe what they are saying! I don’t believe what they’re claiming!

 

Because they were wrong about everything else. They were wrong about LGBT! They were wrong about race, they were wrong about men and women. They’ve been wrong about everything, virtually, everything! I mean, the only thing I could probably agree with them on is pollution. We don’t want pollution. We don’t want to be pissing up the environment. That’s only sane. But really on everything else.

 

They are not only dishonest, they’re nuts! And I don’t say that to let them off the hook in any way. They’re deranged. They’re completely ideological. And so it just seems like we’re primed here for disaster, because they don’t care about reality.

 

A good example of this coming up just before you intervene, the electric car thing. Well, the batteries are expensive to produce. And also there’s now the energy shortage. So I mean, what are you going to do? People aren’t going to be able to fucking drive! So anyway, go on.

 

[2:15:52]

 

Morgoth: I mean the thing this is what people say with the cars. And they’re saying:

 

“Well, you can’t do that. There’s not enough power in the grid to charge!”

 

Like I don’t know how many cars are in this country, like 15 or 20 million cars. There’s no way you can charge that many cars each night. So each night the the grid would have to charge 20 million, like super sized lithium car batteries. And people say this is why it can’t happen. It just can’t happen because the power grid just couldn’t handle the load.

 

But the thing is but yeah, you just won’t drive! You just won’t be driving a car. That’s what that tells you. Don’t think they’re going to step back from that and think:

 

“Oh, no! We’re going to have to get all the diesel, we’re going to have to get all of the gas pipelines in. We’re going to have to we’re going to have to get normal car engines back again, because we just got, …”

 

No, that’s not what’s on the cards. What’s on the cards is that you’ve got two cars per street, and everybody just gets a bus and everybody shares.

 

Woes: It’s interesting here because this is where the two agendas seem to match up with Ukraine, and the neocon agenda there, but also the technocratic agenda with Nord Stream. And I realized that Nord Stream there are also neocon reasons for doing that. But it really also speeds things up for the technocrats.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I think what caught me off guard was at first thinking, like I mentioned at the start, at first thinking, well, maybe our side of this did kind of overreact. And at the end of the day, countries have got geopolitical interests and they need sometimes, … Bill Gates doesn’t have tanks. The technocrats don’t have a standing army. At the end of the day, if you can put an army in the field and you can fire missiles, it does matter. It does really matter.

 

And so yeah, there was a bit of a kind of moment there. It was away only, yeah, okay, so maybe there is two different forces. But then it didn’t take long and actually we’re just heading in the same direction that we were anyway. In fact, now we’re heading there faster.

 

And it was almost like in my case, sort of underestimating just how determined they were to bring in this surveillance grid. The big mystery is like how convenient all this was. I tend to agree with AA here. I think you’re talking about two different kind of clubs which overlap but it still gets confusing, when you go all the way up to the top of the money power. But yeah, I kind of agree with AA on all that.

 

Woes: Yeah, it is confusing. But either way we’re still heading for the same place and we’re not heading for it faster, as you said. So that kind of, … Again, I think that people should be very careful about claiming that the Social Credit Score isn’t coming, the CBDCs aren’t coming and so on, because it really seems like they are. I mean, it’s going to happen in dribs and drabs. Fits and starts, or whatever the phrase is, but I don’t see them backing down on this.

 

Why would they? I mean, as an elite, CBDCs are in their interests. It doesn’t matter what kind of elite they are! The Social Credit Score is absolutely in their interest. If you’re a totalitarian elite, if you want control over the population, then that’s useful to you don’t need to be ideologically persuaded of it. It just is self evidently useful to you.

 

[2:20:13]

 

Morgoth: It matters as well because people say that this is a distraction from demographics, from racial politics, from the JQ, from the usual sort of nationalist talking points. And I understand why as well. Because I get it.

 

But the problem is this system really does appear to be coming. If it comes in, and remember when I was talking about the map with all of the dots on it before? If it comes in, then your ideology, and your aims, and your political, that doesn’t matter. That’s never ever going to be allowed! It will be neutralized before it even gets off the ground.

 

So it’s saying whatever you want, whatever your vision is, whatever your ideal society is, will never get anywhere! I mean, if you look at the state of things now before it even comes in, if you look at what’s been revealed, the collusion between the American Deep State and Twitter, where they’re just outright flouting and they don’t care. The mainstream media just doesn’t care. The idea that, I don’t know, the plan is to sort of red-pill normies and have this mass awakening with so many people able to vote, they’ll vote in like some kind of Neo-National Socialist party or something like that.

 

This assumes that you’re living in a liberal system which will allow you to do that, whereas they’re just not, they don’t care! As I said earlier, we’re not living in a liberal democracy of any of the terms, we’re not living in a liberal democracy, we’re already in a technocracy! And they will break their own rules to shut you down. People don’t like hearing this. They will just drag you off in the middle of the night at the end of the day. And I don’t see this heroism of just willingly throwing yourself into the meat grinder.

 

But the problem is that people say, well when you talk about this, you talk about Social Credit system coming in, you talk about being monitored and all of that, then this is a distraction from the kind of the populist revolution which is coming. We shouldn’t be talking about this. We should be focusing on winning the political election, getting people and all of this. But you can’t do it under the system they’re bringing in, whatever it is, even if you’re a far Leftist or whatever, there will be a certain set of guide lines and a certain set of protocols written into the grid, written into the system, which will be monitoring everybody all of the time.

 

And if you are planning on running a Right-wing party, far-Right party, nationalist party, which has all of these from the position of the centre, all of these really edgy ideas, they’re just going to cut you off! It’ll just be like pulling a plug. There’s no way around this problem, this fundamental problem. Whatever it is that you want to see happen, it depends whether or not this system is going to let you do it.

 

Woes: Yeah. I think it’s important to say, I understand why people don’t like hearing this because it’s kind of like a meditation on despair and defeatism. It’s very negative. It’s depressing. I get it! I’m fucking depressed about it as well. But we’re trying to face the reality so that it doesn’t trip us up later on.

 

The reason people don’t like hearing this stuff is, well, they think, well, what is the solution then? What should we do? And the answer is, I don’t know. And this is why I keep coming back, to just try to better your own position, as an individual and as a family, and so on. That’s the best advice that I can give. And I know it’s not great, but I’m sorry, right now there’s nothing else I can think to say.

 

[2:24:45]

 

Morgoth: Well, first of all, you have to acknowledge the problem. Once you’ve actually acknowledged the problem and what we’re facing, then you can say:

 

“Okay, I need to make sure that I’m somewhat independent.”

 

Even a little thing like having a big stash of cash, because the machines can go out at any time, having basic things. They’re already talking about having blackouts and stuff. It’s related, but if you look at in Europe, they’re all about just rolling blackouts for a long time. Have you got gas canisters, like a little camping stove with five or six tins of gas? Because it’s going to help.

 

So you begin with the most basic things. But this is where we’re going. And in, in the the long term, it’s grim. It’s grim. I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I’ve been screaming out this thing for years.

 

And still when you look like just recently we’re spending something like £140 billion to build some kind of port. What’s happening, we’re talking about the global majority. So what’s happening is that our wealth is being transferred to Africa, and various other places.

 

And the reason they’re doing that is because they can’t afford the infrastructure. They can’t afford to have 5G towers everywhere. They can’t afford all of the solar panels, and all of the infrastructure for what is coming. They can’t afford that. And it’s kind of like they want them to have it.

 

They want it to be everywhere because it gets back to the sort of purely technocratic, sort of obsessive mindset where it has to be everywhere. African countries, places in Asia, they can’t really afford that stuff. So they can’t have a sort of black part on the grid. They can’t have something which isn’t properly connected. So we’re going to have to pay for that. They’ve got like 140 trillion war chest for this, and that’s like the richest people on earth. They’ve gone all in on this.

 

How great would the costs have to be before they sort of cut their losses and think:

 

“Well, actually, we’re not going to do this.”

 

They’re going to be pretty bad, to be honest. [chuckling] They’re not going to back out of this one very quickly if they’ve got that kind of money on the line.

 

Woes: Yes, I agree. To get back to a bit of a segue, but to get back to the article that you wrote, because I think it was a very good one. I remember at the time thinking it’s a very good point that America in the 80s was something that was attractive and appealing. Regardless of whatever shallowness, consumerism, commercialism, big money, celebrity, culture, whatever, it was still something that could be appealing. And in contrast to everything that we’re seeing now. Oh, God! The contrast is very stark.

 

As you said in America then, the idea was that if you work hard, you can make a life and you have a family easily, you have a house in suburbia, all the rest of it. And all of that is seemingly now being taken away, or evaporating. This is depressing.

 

But that brings me back to the Shrill thing, because while that’s happening, they’re implementing this new way, this new ideology. In the Shrill clip. I don’t know if it’s clear, but as far as I know, the manly woman, the masculine woman, the actress is transgender, at least she says she is! [chuckling] And probably a lesbian!

 

So I think that is an interracial lesbian relationship between those two people. Then the White girl comes in and sort of upsets all of that with her heteronormative White privilege. And they reject it and ejects the foreign element, as it were, which is traditional. Which is traditional White society. That’s what’s going on there.

 

And just to finish off the point, it’s joyless. This is the point that we’re making in the article. There is no happiness to this. This ideology is not one that brings happiness, or fulfillment. It has its own momentum. It sort of justifies itself. But it doesn’t make the people who follow it any happier or more fulfilled. That’s the big difference.

 

I mean, at least in 80s America, it worked for people, despite the shallowness, despite the stupidity of it, whatever. It did lead you to have a good life, at least materially, and in other ways as well, because you were free. And this is what’s going away.

 

[2:30:11]

 

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Morgoth: It’s interesting as well when you see something like that andor that I was talking about it’s like a cringe sort of Star Wars thing. It is politically correct. Some of the positions that black men are in are kind of absurd, but whatever, it isn’t the kind of Last Jedi big sort of global hormone fest. And it’s almost as if there’s a latest transition has happened where you’ve gone from the kind of big gear walk kind of bullshit which is poorly written and just kind of pisses everybody off to this kind of Superrealist hard, gritty, just raw representation of totalitarianism. That’s an interesting thing, the way that’s happened, because I think it’s something similar. It’s kind of like what we’re looking at in the West. One of the video that I never got made this year for one reason or another was Ten Little Signals in Blair Runner 2049 of the Great Reset. If you look at Blade Runner 2049, which is a kind of favourite in distance rate circles, it’s surprising how much is in that. I mean, you open the scene and you’ve got the book Farm. He also lives in a pod and his girlfriend is a hologram and he is himself like a replicant. That’s not a robot, it’s just a genetically modified human. In the law as well, it’s mentioned that they had this kind of great sort of cyber crash where all of their documents, all of their knowledge, was lost. So when they go through the archives, they have gone back to having physical copies of everything because when you store everything in digital space, there’s a chance that everything will just get wiped out in one goal. Even just that is an interesting thing as they head toward I bought a new computer recently and the laptop just sort of it cost me an arm leg, but I need it for what I do. And I kind of put discs into anything. There’s no disks. I mean, up here I’ve got a nice computer, I’ve got a little laptop, there’s a backup and I actually can’t just put a disk into anything anymore. Which is to say you can’t own anything in the real world because what they want you to do is just download everything. It’ll never exist in physical space. I mean, thankfully, I’ve got a kind of nice DVD collection which I’ve had for ages. It would be a good time to just buy a DVD player because the time will come when you just can’t play them anymore and everything will be online, everything will be digital. And literally it’s a cliche, but you just own nothing. And it’s funny, like your new computer. You’ll spend a lot of money on a new computer and you can’t put a physical disk into it anymore. That’s done. What you have to do instead is get a subscription on some streaming service or whatever. If you play games and then you just download it, but you’ll not own anything physical.

 

Woes: Yeah, you can actually get a USB disk drive and connect it to the computer. It’s a separate thing that runs off the computer. And that’s what I was using. But with my old computer, I got two of these things and they stopped working after six months, each of them. So I just got a new one and it stopped.z Working after six months. It was fucking ridiculous. I have no idea what was wrong. I’ll try it with the new computer after millenniyule over because it’s my only way to watch all the programs that I love. They’re not available on streaming. It’s not going to happen.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, imagine if in the future I’m deliberately kind of just talking like proper Sci-Fi kind of thing here. I’m not saying this is going to happen, but imagine the future where, let’s say, Beethoven just disappears from the Google banks or something like that. It just drops out of existence. Beethoven’s back catalog.

 

Woes: There was a thing, and I think it was Amazon Kindle, and I think it was 1984, the book. And for some reason this is like ten years ago now, but it’s a Harbinger of what you’re talking about. They just deleted it off everyone’s Kindles. So people had bought the book and then it was memory hold. It was unpersoned. It was just erased. Maybe some sort of software glitch, I’m guessing, or the copyright law came in or whatever it was. This book was just instantly erased from everyone’s device. And that is an interesting and of course it was funny that it was 1984 because it’s ominous.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I was just scrolling through the other articles there for something to kind of get us on to some happier topics. But as people who are subscribed by substance notice, it’s few and far between them, afraid. But there was one of them that I did where I’m just going to go down here. There was a few of them that I did which are a bit more personal. I mean, I lost somebody close this year who died. But that’s an even gluviat subject. I’ll not touch on that. But another one, the running theme towards the second half of the year, what was the kind of unrealist to all of this? And I did an article recently which was like a true story, which actually happened. And it was in mid summer and there was a girl came knocking on the door. I heard a knock on the door. I had to be careful because I thought it might be the BBC again. Or here it is, a highly strange knock at the door. And I went down to a door and there’s this really pleasant girl there. She was about 15 or something, and she said, hello there. Have you got a minute? And she was dressed in a uniform, like a nice green uniform. And I was like, all right. I said yeah. You’re pleasant. He seemed nice enough. I’ll give you two minutes. And she was like, all right. She says there. I’m Kelly from St. John’s Ambulance. She says, do you know, where your nearest defibrillator is? I was like, well, there are things that people have when they have heart attacks. And she said, yeah, that’s what it is. I said, well, no, actually I don’t. Do you? And she pulled out her iPhone. I’m just kind of going through the article. She pulled out the iPhone, and it showed the area on some kind of map app. And you saw all of these defibrillators. She pointed up the street, and she said, well, that’s where your nearest one is, just up there. And I said, all right. She says, we’re working with the government, and we want to have a defibrillator on every street within five minutes of everybody in the country by 2024. And I was like, well, why? And she was like, well, because I got in more detail in the conversation in the article. But then she was she she pulled out her phone again and and she was reeling said she was reeling off this kind of bullet point and she well, having a defibrillator decreases your chance of dying of a heart attack by 70% if it’s within five minutes of the person who’s just had the heart attack or the stroke, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, Right, but hold on a minute. So we’ve gone from a situation where the defibrillators were around a little bit. We knew what they were, and now the government wants to have one on every street corner in the country. And she said, yeah, they also want to have at least two in every school by 2024. And I was like, is this not a bit weird? Is this not a bit like, what’s the thing? What’s changed that? All of a sudden, the government are, like, desperate. They’ve got this huge military operation across the entire country to get defibrillated as it’s like absolutely everywhere. Why would you do that? And she was like, well, it’s just a health thing. And I thought, well, do you not think it’s like something else? I mean, what’s changed with people’s health in the last few years that could be given so many people heart attacks, or is this kind of panic on? And she said I said, Well, I think it might be that vaccine. I’ve seen things on the Internet. This is the thing that I do when I’m sort of talking in the real world with people, is that you can come out with things which are kind of controversial and a bit edgy, but what you do is you just saw something online. What you do, you’re kind of disowning the controversy. And I think, wow, I just scattered. I says, I think I lose. There maybe the conspiracy theorists online, maybe they’re right. And she went, oh, what are they saying? Like, what do you mean? The conspiracy theorists online are saying that people are dropping dead because of this vaccine everybody got? And she went really? And I said, yeah. And she went, well, I asked this. Did you get it? And she says no. Good. And she says, Anywhere, Willie, because she was nice and because she was doing her civic duty in the kind of country we want this is the kind of thing, you’d see, this is good. It’s nice to see a pleasant girl in a uniform doing something good for the people, for the people of the country. That’s fine. But the problem is you’re left in this kind of weird place where, well, why is there this? And I looked it up afterwards and it is true that in I think it was in 2021, you can see that the government purchased 40,000 defibrillators to be deployed across the country. And at the same time, they’ve got another policy to get defibrillators into every single school, which is weird, isn’t it?

 

Woes: Certainly is. I mean, this is the kind of thing where you think, okay, there is a problem with the vaccine and they know there’s a problem with the vaccine.

 

Morgoth: Yeah. And you’re not giving any clarity, you’re not being told the truth. But behind the scenes, in sort of the Deep State, they’re working over painsteriously, all of a sudden they’ll just be defibrillators everywhere. But it’s perfectly safe and effective. But look, this is the thing. I haven’t got any proof that the two things are connected. I can’t prove it. Maybe they’re not. Maybe Kelly from St. John’s ambulance is correct. Maybe it is just a sort of thing that the government are ruling out because they care about everybody’s health so much. Maybe it’s got nothing to do with it. Maybe the vaccine isn’t doing that kind of damage to people. This is, at the end of the day, conspiracy theories on the Internet. And so the point is that you’re left in this kind of weird limbo of not really you’re not able to put anything solid under your feet and it goes for everything. You can move on from the vaccine. People will be like, oh, that’s all more rough. He’s going off on a vaccine again. The same thing can be said for the immigrants coming in the idea that I did a video about why do the government not just stop all of these immigrants? I mean, I loved Godfrey Bloom, just cut straight through the bullshit and he was like, I’ll destroy the boats. I’ll roll them up, I’ll send them back. And I don’t give a shit about the European Court of Human Rights or anything else. They just go back. It’s as simple as that. And it is, why have we got to put up with this ridiculous situation? And when you look at the circle kind of grift where all of a sudden you’ve got a prominent Tory donor. They signed a contract, I think it was in 2019 for millions. Millions and millions on the basis that circle would end up waiving all of this money in the faces of landlords so that they would have a very strong incentive to just kick out whoever was there. And mainly it’s going to be British people so that they can house all of these asylum seekers. Now, the thing is, they weren’t actually coming across the Channel in those numbers. Back in 2019, there was a few of them coming in, but not like they have been this year. And so isn’t it strange that if that didn’t happen, how does that sit with the contract the Government had with Circle to house potentially tens of thousands of migrants? They’re even going to offer to pay a council tax or everything you can imagine is being waved in the faces of landlords. Again, the Lefties on Twitter, which I saw on this, they were saying, well, the landlord is not being forced to evict British people. The dishonest fuckers that they are. No, he’s not. He’s not being forced by law to evict White British people.

 

Woes: They’ve written a system to incentivize him together, so they don’t need to force him.

 

Morgoth: Yes. So they deliberately played down the idea of the incentive structure. But again, the weird thing is it took like years until this has now paid off for Sergio and the other company that does it as well. And you think, well, is this not Malice of Ford? Why did the Government give Sergo so much money to house asylum seekers when they weren’t even coming in? And those kinds of numbers, we were getting the normal immigrants coming in, that’s fair enough. But this kind of thing where there’s just like tens of thousands of people crossing, that wasn’t happening then. So why did they give them that contract? Why does that contract exist? If they are going to patrol our borders, why does that contract exist? Once again, you’re just being lied to. You’re not being given the truth. At least on the Serco thing, you can look and you can say, well, this is weird, the Government signed a contract years ago on the basis that at some point there’d be all of these people coming in. They need to be housed. There’s an incentive structure created for landlords to evict the White British people because they can’t compete with what this corporation is offering and waving, dangling in their face. This seems to me it’s just like a warfare on the White British people, on our people in this country.

 

Woes: Yeah. Again, it’s a very depressing topic because there’s no way to sugarcoat it. I mean, it just is bad, it’s really bad. And I think this is becoming a tangible thing for people now in a way that it wasn’t five years ago. They’re now showing up in villages, towns, and that is predictable result not only of the quantities of people coming into the country, but also of the policies of distributing them. And I know that just recently the Tories announced this as a formal intention to forgotten how they voiced it, but it was to distribute them away from the inner city because stereotypically, historically they’ve been in the inner cities and that’s why people have fled the inner cities. So now the government wants to put them in small villages I’ve got to be really careful not to Fed post, but I don’t like this at all. I just find this absolutely outrageous. Because you’ll have an effect, it will have a very tangible effect on a village that it simply wouldn’t have on some fucking slum inner city that’s already been completely demographically replaced anyway.

 

Morgoth: Yeah. You’ll also notice the sort of technocratic mindset behind it, where they’re looking at spreadsheets and they’re thinking, well, this community is this sort of diverse and they can take this quarter and it’s all a numbers game. And as always with this mindset, is that it’s? The little people on the ground are just being crushed, but by sort of graphs, just by data. There’s no humanity within the data. I mean, I was reading an article there on AI art on Substack. I read so much good stuff on Substack.. And I was reading one fellow and he was trying to get grips with AI art and what it is. There was an AI art prize winning thing. It looked impressive, it looked great. He got into and he said he can’t deny that it is like a stunning piece of art and we need to address this philosophically. And he said his piece he got into a bit of philosophy, but then he brought up this picture of a Rembrandt painting and it was a man I don’t know the name of it. I’m not an expert on painting by any means, but basically it was a man on a bed and he was surrounded by by doctors or whoever was about five or six other men around him. And his arm was completely open and he had some kind of horrible wound. And in the background there was a this is this fellow this is not me, by the way. It was just the article I was reading, which is why it’s good to see blogging coming back. And in the background of the Rembrandt Peyton, you can see that there’s a doctor there and he has like a sort of drawing. He’s got a book with a diagram of a human arm. And this is strange because what he was saying, the fellow who’s writing The Horacle was that on the one hand there’s a man lying there with an actual wound in his arm. But in order to understand what’s happening in that arm, which is lying there, he’s lying there. There’s people there trying to address the wound. You’re taking orders from somebody who’s not looking at the arm, but looking at a picture, looking at a book with a diagram of a human arm, not the actual real meat arm that’s there. And his point was that this is the disconnect and this is going to be one of the problems with AI, is that it’s just the book and not the actual meat not the actual meat space. And so you see with AI, something similar to the problem with the technocratic mindset, where everything is just a sort of abstract data point which doesn’t have any actual relation to the real meat and bones people of the real world, which are existing around you. All of that just has to deal with the fact that you’re going to have all of this kind of efficiency dumped on you. Do you see what I mean?

 

Woes: Oh, yeah. Again, I think this is with the Technocracy, this is how it’s going to be. You will be in a situation in your real life, there’ll be something wrong, something goes wrong, you apply to the Technocracy, or it’s local subsidiary, and basically it’s a situation where a computer says no and you’ll be thinking, well, how does that rule or protocol that they’ve invoked here, how does that relate to my situation? And you’ll struggle to understand how it does. I mean, a perfect example is what we were saying at the start about we’re facing a possible food shortage. Why aren’t we planting vegetables? That’s the obvious solution here on the ground, literally. But we can’t because of some technocratic protocol. And of course, it’s a pretty obvious and cruel one in that instance. They don’t want you independent, they don’t want you self sufficient. But there could be all sorts of things here where you’ve got no idea why the computer is saying no.

 

Morgoth: Another thing is plant and victory gardens. How do you even do that in a multicultural society? You can do that in the London of 1942, where the message goes out throughout the local councils and everywhere.

 

Woes: It, …

 

Morgoth: Comes from the Churches, it gets into the pub with a couple of bureaucrats and some civil servants coming in to organize things. Okay, this is how it’s going to go. We’re going to turn the local playing field into somewhere in a group of potatoes or carrots, onions. And if you’ve got a garden, look, it’s not law that you’ve got to do it, but you’re going to be a bit of a dick if you don’t. That’s the way that’s going to go. There’s a roundabout. We’re going to turn that into a garden and we’ve got all of these stretches alongside the roads. We’re going to turn that into crops as well, all of these spaces we’re going to make produce food. Now, if you’ve got a homogeneous country where everybody is just White British and they’re Christian, that’s actually pretty easy to do. But for the Diversity is Our Strength. Crowd how the hell are you going to do that in a place like Birmingham or London or Bradford? What are you going to do? Are you going are you going to hardly print off how to grow currents in seven different languages? How are you going to organize them then?

 

Woes: Also be the mistrust. People will talk about how black kids, black teenagers would be ruining the cabbage patch just for the sake of it and whatever they might well be. But even if they weren’t doing that other ethnic groups will see that as a resource that they want to plunder and Whites will see it as a resource that they want to plunder from the other ethnic groups. I mean, it’s absolutely inevitable that that would happen.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, what you’d get would be that one ethnic group would have this particular territory if they would even bother, but they would do this on that particular territory and then there will be another it goes on. Maybe the Indians and the Muslims would have Lentils or whatever. You can imagine how it would go. And eventually they’re going to start and think, well, I want what they’ve got because the there exists. So instead of having in the glory days as of World War II, I can imagine you’d get thieves. But what you’re talking about, there would be individuals, or a criminal network within your own group who could be found and persecuted and that’s one thing. It’s totally different if you try and do that and you’re talking about groups who are just fundamentally different groups from the off, because then you’re not even talking about if you try to shame somebody from down the road, was caught stealing Barry’s turnips, then you can at least shame him as a thief. Because the context that that can happen in is that he still belongs to that group. He has betrayed the collective effort. He’s betrayed the one group and the morality and the well being of everybody by his fevery. You can’t do that if you’ve got multiple different groups because there’s no universalizing morality or ethic to bind everybody together in the first place. So all you’re doing is taking from the outgroup and this is multiculturalism defined and they call it a strength.

 

Woes: I mean, what would happen at first is that the flights would definitely be trying to live out the dream of, oh, this will be great, this will bind us all together. This will bind the different groups together because we’re now in a collective effort. And they’d quickly find that actually no, it’s you are sharing your resources, you are organizing, you are helping whatever the Chinese community and you’re giving them your seeds to help grow potatoes or whatever and they’re giving nothing back because why would they? And I think Whites will quickly learn this lesson. I remember seeing the height of the migrant crisis. There was a clip going around of some White guy, the well meaning young White guy, trying to distribute stuff to a crowd of refugees and they just started stealing. They just started taking tearing out of his hand. I think he had a bag and he was trying to give the bag one thing to each person and they basically just ripped the bag apart. And it wasn’t even something like they’re starving. How can you judge them for doing them? They’re starving people. It was entirely their behaviour. It was not cohesive, it was not unified, it was not civic engagement or whatever it was, just take the fight. He’s here with some resources. Let’s get them and that’s it. And then the infamous thing about the clip is that the young White guy eventually gives up and he actually puts his hands up in the air and just walks away. It’s like that moment of realizing, oh, these people are just not like my people.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, you see, they do this as well, where they’ll be like Moroccans rioting on the streets like it was for the last few weeks. Or you’ll have some kind of weird turf war between Sikhs and Muslims somewhere in Leicester, was it? And what will happen is, what about football fans? What about immediately you do this kind of thing as well? It’s not the same thing. It’s this desperate attempt to relativize everything and to take away the seriousness of what you’re seeing in the same way that they’ll kind of drag up the corpse of Jimmy Saville or whoever. Whenever you bring up the grooming gangs, that any way to protect them, any way to kind of muddy the waters and say, it’s not what you think it is, even though we’ve stood and watched them tear down statues, not just in America, but here as well. It amazes me the way you just don’t talk about these things anymore.

 

[3:00:24]

 

Woes: Not in the pub, at least. Sorry.

 

Morgoth: You can’t if you go and sit with Gary and he’s in Pitbull, you can say whatever you want there. I’m happy with that. The people that I go to normally is it is kind of half and half. You can see it quite a bit. And it’s the difference is if you got out of hand, they would say, watch what you’re doing. What’s what? You’re seeing me getting into trouble. But fundamentally, they’re on your side. The difference with Fat Lefty Trope was that she was just from the off. It was a political and ideological thing. The other is like, oh, steady on me. We don’t want to get into trouble, you know what I mean? And then you’d have to be pretty explicit, you know what I mean? Everybody knows everybody’s kind of you find ways, like the way we live, where everybody’s going to police their language and everybody even and this is the real world as well, everybody kind of gets it. And, you know, when people came to get it and you don’t purely spiral in the real world, you kind of accept the speech codes. You kind of accept that we can look at somebody and you kind of know that you’re on board with each other and you get it. And that the fellow who worked at that pub where that Lefty cow was. So I’ve been there before. About a year ago I was in there and there was a fellow working there at that time and he was about 40 and he was a bit of a wide boy. He was from the south, but he’d been all over the place, and he was like a total conspiracy theorist. You could say anything to him. He was all in for it. He was great. I don’t know, he was like low key racist. He got it. No Jwink. Wink. And he was kind of probably watching, I don’t know, like Alex Jones maybe, but he definitely wasn’t on the plantation. And you’ve got a lot to go with there. You’re not going to get, like, ideological purity that just exists on Telegram. The only place you get that is Telegram and a couple of podcasts. It doesn’t exist in the real world. And people are just thinking, I’m mad.

 

Woes: All right. I can’t think of anything to say in response to that. So let’s go to another article. Are you there?

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I was just muted. I’ve gotten the other one up, and it’s called the Digital Identity Game Show you are the Star, which it kind of sunk without trace, but I can’t really remember anymore. I didn’t read it beforehand, but what I was getting into is what I’ve touched on before, because we’ve been speaking about the kind of surveillance grid and everything and the way that it functions. And what I think is interesting when you see it in real world, you’re interfacing with technology so much these days, and it’s its just how much everything has been gamified, we call it. If you think of the Social Credit system, what in the end is a Social Credit system, and a Social Credit system which is emerging before us. What it is, is an incentive structure. And there’s something about the digital realm in all aspects of it, even from a primitive computer game up to the YouTube algorithm, to Twitter, to everything, it has these built in incentives to keep you invested. Now, that might be I mean, I don’t play video games anymore. The last video game that I played was Skyrim. And so what happens is you set off on a quest, and the incentive is you get through the cave and you get this new sword or this new axe, or you get this new shout, this new special power. So you’ll go through all of that in order, and what it’s about is unlocking something, unlocking a new thing, a new zone, and a new area, which you then go into, which eventually there’ll be something at the end of it, and you can unlock that as well. Even on an iPhone, it’s all about unlocking. It’s all about gaining access. This seems to me to be a sort of metaphysic which pervades everything about the digital world. Whether it’s gaining access to your iPhone, whether it’s about playing a video game, whether it’s about the YouTube or Twitter or whatever. All of it is about sort of its all about gaining access and then going on to the next level. All it takes for to turn that into a Social Credit system is to bring it into the way you actually behave. And so then it’s a matter of what is your politics. And it gets me back to the grid before with the sort of vaccinated people and whatnot we literally had it in the Corvette. You can see the imprint of the digital kind of logic, the ghost of the digital, just in this idea. Well, if you’re vaccinated, you can go out and you can do these things. If you’re not, then you can’t you stay in. So it’s like at a primordial level in the digital what would you call it? The digital landscape is this idea of locking and unlocking and then moving on and proceeding to what in a video game would be the next level. And so it’s in everything. It’s with your iPhone. It’s an inner Social Credit system. It needs to have rules to make it function. And it’s funny to me that you have all of these kind of incentive structures. Then when you look at the global carbon reduction thing, it’s as if it’s been tailormade. You know how people say covert was invented for the vaccine or not? The other way around, it seems to be that the climate change sort of emergency was invented for the Social Credit system. The Social Credit system wasn’t invented for then forever. You can have gain access to your fridge and you will be monitored. Your behaviour will be monitored, everything will be monitored. And it just interests me that it’s the logic of the Gamify system, which it begins with a video game, but eventually it’s like it’s imposing itself on the real world. Have you ever seen Tron Legacy? The second Tron movie.

 

Woes: I haven’t. I’ve only seen the first one.

 

Morgoth: It’s actually good. The Daft Punk soundtrack is great, but when you look at the story and the law and it was another video that I never got made last year. And you can trace it all the way back to BlackRock. BlackRock’s sort of supercomputer was a way of gaming the market because it would gather so much data and so much information that it was kind of able to predict the future. Every event everywhere would be processed. And so what they were doing was reducing the risk on investments. Maybe have been an avalanche. It was called Aladdin. Maybe that being like an avalanche somewhere. And then that was going to affect the weather, or the weather would affect the crops in this particular place, or the water supply was poisoned here and that would affect it just went on and on. They were all able to compute that. And in Toronto, it’s kind of interesting. We’re talking all about the technocracy and everything. And Jeff Bridges in Tron one, he’s like this idealistic boomer and he creates a digital world. At first I thought it was kind of ridiculous because it was before the internet, it really was just a video game, but it doesn’t really. Matter. The point of it is that he’s created a digital world. And by the time you get a tron too, he’s been stuck on the grid for I think it’s like 25 years or something. And he’s an old man. He’s a recluse. But what he’s done what he did was create a digital version of himself, which he called Clue. Looks pretty bad on the CGI now, but whatever. So the idea would be that Clue, he was programmed to create the perfect system, and the actual, real Jeff Bridges gave him access to all philosophy, all books and all of this thing. And what you’ve got is this juxtaposition where Jeff Bridges is like the quintessential boomer is there, and he has this glorious vision of the future. We’re going to unlock all of the knowledge. We’re going to all read Dostoyevsky, and we’re going to then study how Picasso, like, what made his painting so great. It’s going to be great, man. There’s not going to be any more work. We’re going to book a system. We’ll create our own system, and it’s going to be perfect. And I’m going to create an algorithm called Clue, and it will be perfect. He will create the perfect system. And what actually happens is that Clue creates an absolute dystopia, absolute nightmare of a place. And the reason he does it Klaus Schwab. Yeah, it’s Klaus Schwab. What happens is that organically, there’s these what do they call them? There’s a kind of race appears organically. They’re all White and blonde as well, and they’re kind of like elves, and they’re more sort of mystical and religious. I forgot what they’re called now, but basically there’s a girl in it. She was in this beautiful Eastern European woman, but I forgot what they’re called. Now, I’m sure somebody in the Chat has them, but this particular group of people are there, but they are an anomaly they’re not predicted for. And the problem that you’ve got is, how do you define perfect? Because in a Right-wing, where if you think of somebody like CS Lewis or Tolkien or these kinds of people, they would see that as being a thing of wonder, because they were a higher being, which were within the technological grid, but they were spiritual. And so organically, the grid had created spiritual beings. But the problem is that Clue couldn’t actually comprehend that that was to him just something gone wrong, and he genocided them all, and there was only the pretty girl left. So again, you get this conflict between idealism and utilitarianism. Clue was just a purely utilitarian algorithm. It’s kind of like the tragedy of the entire arc of Jeff Bridges boomer. Idealism is that he created this program. He created this computerized digital way of creating utopia, but it turned into hell and wiped out everything of value. And it’s interesting to me when you look at something that’s sort of a PR bullshit of the World Economic Forum, where you’ve got all of these kind of xylophone is playing, and it’s like it’s Happy ever after tomorrow. And everybody thinks it looks horrific, everybody scares shitless of it. But you know, that that is a vision of utopia. It is a vision of utopia. The problem is, it’s a vision of utopia from late 1972.

 

Woes: This is a concept that interests me. I remember reading this, or I heard you saying it. I think it was on the it was it was on one of the interviews he did this year. And I heard you saying this, and I wanted to ask you about this. I’m glad it’s come up. Why the Great Reset? When I first heard about it, and you were Clyde, and he’s a very old man, but the Great Reset seemed new to me. My first thought wasn’t, oh, that sounds old hat, or that sounds obsolete. So I’m interested in why you think it is. Why does it belong to the 70s, not the earlier?

 

Morgoth: Because what it hawks back to is, well, basically it’s retro futurism. So if you go back, there was a promise inherent within technology. If you look at the does actually die away a little bit in the 70s, but from an earlier era, there was a promise of technology, that technology would be a liberating thing. Technology would mean you wouldn’t have and I don’t just mean sort of doing the job at work more efficiently. I mean what the people like Arun Bastani and Ashaqar, what they call what is it, like future communists something or other fully automated space communism. And it’s where man will be liberated from labour. And in the future, what you see if you go back and you look at these graphics from the everything is taken care of, everything. Technology is solving all of the issues. Technology is going to bring about this great utopia. In the future, things will be better. It’s a quintessential, progressive, Left-wing vision of the world. Technology will make things better, and you shouldn’t be scared of it. And in fact, nobody it’s pure idealism of that era. And you can see what happened long ago, actually, in the kind of changed, and you begin to get a cynicism set in with technology. You begin to see movies like RoboCop or Blade Runner or Terminator. You begin to see pictures of technology gone wrong and all of this kind of thing. When we get to the digital age, you get a different problem again, because the technology has had a certain effect, but it’s an atomizing one, and it’s one where people are lonely. The social conditions have changed. So the way you can think of it is that nobody now thinks of themselves as living inside of some kind of giant sort of skyscraper with a helipod and with like, where you walk in. Now, if you imagine you walk into your house and you say, okay, lights on, television on. I want to have this thing made in the microwave. People in the 60s, they thought that was a good thing. They thought that was something positive. They thought that was a great vision of the future, mainly through a reduction of labour. You can see it’s a proper Left-wing, kind of Marxist even way of thinking where happiness is, when you just reduce the amount of labour involved in something. And in actual fact, where we are now, when you see the World Economic Forum and they come out with these things about how well, you’ll just talk to your fridge, and your fridge will monitor how many calories you’ve had today and how far your phone will monitor how far you’ve walked. And it will be optimized for your health. And everybody will think it’s wonderful. And it’s kind of like this vision that they had decades ago and never come to pass. And it’s just now, it’s like the revenge of it. It’s like, well, we’re going to do it. We’re still going to do this. All vision, this old idealism of the techno utopia from the 1960s, the 1950s even, we’re still going to fall now. We’re going to force it onto everybody. Even though in reality, if you talk to people, what, like in the here and now and in the 2020s, they’re not interested in it. They don’t want to know. What do they want? They want to have organic. They want to have families. They want to have log burning fires in their sitting room. They want to have gardens. They want to have meaning in their lives. And so what’s happened is that since that time, the wishes and the will of people has changed. They want to have something which gives them meaning in an organic real life again, which has been taken away from them by this sort of saturation of technology, and they want to go back. Nobody thinks of themselves as a 75 year old sitting in a pod, like watching YouTube videos or TikTok and then getting their latest vaccine update. People want to think of themselves as living in a comfortable home with the grandkids running through the door as they sit by a log fire. This is something too deeply ingrained in humans, and it runs direct. So this is what people want. And then you’ve got what the elites want and the technocrats want, and the two things are diametrically opposed to each other. They can’t function together. So what they’re going to do instead is just invent this colossal pyramid of lies to justify this archaic 50 year old vision and then Polish it up and tell you that this is their vision of the future.

 

Woes: Yes, I think that people are excited by the idea of having everything self sufficient, like your solar panels, the replicator from Star Trek and that kind of thing. Growing your own but more realistically, growing your own food, a farmhouse, the kids. That is an eternal thing. And I think that you’re right that there was a mid century obsession with technology, the white heat, the atomic age and yeah, I guess you could say that peaked in the probably the 60s, actually, and thereafter was people were ever more skeptical about technology. But the elites held on to that notion because it would empower them, it would put them at this absolute centre of people’s lives. I think centralization is a concept that is very appealing to technocrats, to control freaks, totalitarians, but is really annoying to everyone else. I mean, one of the things that’s said now about the postwar Britain, the welfare seed, is that it was too centralized and it was too bureaucratic, it was too distant from ordinary people. I don’t know, the Blair and all that in New Labor, they tried to reduce that somewhat by introducing consumer choice. I don’t know how much that was ever actually a legal thing. I don’t know how much they actually managed it. I doubt it, to be honest. The NHS now just seems to be a disaster. But either way, it is something that people have had to pay lip service to, like Tony Blair and the BBC has also I remember they introduced something called Producer Choice in the late 80s because they didn’t like the idea of doing everything in house anymore. It seems to be a general thing. As technology has advanced, it has become more portable, more modular, so you don’t need a huge system anymore to plug the device into so that it will work at all. It can work independently. But of course the thing where this changes is the smartphone. Because the smartphone is necessarily a very centralized device. It cannot work without calling the mothership for everything, absolutely everything, and it’s different motherships. It’s like the Uber mainframe, the Google server, whatever, the BBC website and whatever it is. But it’s a multitude of central point that it’s consulting the smartphone on its own is almost useless. I guess on its own it could do calculator stuff, or a calendar. Even the calendar now could be centralized. And then this also ties into the whole idea of the internet, the Wild West Democratization in the early 2000s, well, throughout the then it all stops around about 2010, 2015, and we go in this sharp turn towards centralisation and power consolidation and streamlining. So technology for a long time was heading in the direction that I think a lot of people find very amenable and pleasing. But it but it then ironically, long after they’d fallen out of their love with it in the 80s, but 20 years, 25 years after all of that, or 30 years after all that, it then did go in that evil direction. So you then did get Skynet, or obviously equivalents of Skynet. Yeah, but for a while it was actually something it was heading in a direction I think people liked.

 

Morgoth: It’s like you always end up running into the Clue problem. So whether it’s Skynet or Clue or in something like RoboCop, it’s like the oligarchy who are going to control it and privatize it and use it for their own ends and lie about the science and all of these things. It’s not new. The problems that we’re facing and which is coming down are not really new at all. But it’s just they’ve been predicted.

 

Woes: But now you’ve got evil people in real life making it real.

 

Morgoth: They’re actually doing it, actually implementing all of this stuff. And there’s a thing to address here which I think is interesting and I picked up on this as well. And in people in our circles, they want to push the gaq because it’s like this is the forbidden fruit. And they are right. You just look at the Kanye West thing and the Elon Musk thing and everything that’s been going on just recently. But the post war Meta narrative was based on the sort of demonization of White interests, of White people stepping off the plantation. And all of this comes back down to the nexus of the Holocaust, the Spectre of it hanging over like White people, European people, and everything has been built, morally speaking, the entire thing has been built on that. So they get the jewish people designist sort of Deep State America. They get a special dispensation which they absolutely abuse at every turn. So they will constantly attack White people on the basis of race. But then when somebody, the telescope is pointed back in their direction, they completely freak out and everybody sees the hypocrisy. It pisses everybody off. And to be honest, at this stage of the internet, like most people know as well, it isn’t the forbidden fruit that it was seven years ago, just through the mnematic nature of the internet. But nevertheless, still there’s kind of something cringe and boomerang about the obsession with Bill Gates or Klaus Schwab because I get it that certain sort of sections of our thing will say, well, it’s okay to talk about that because it won’t be banned. And they’re right about that. By the way, when I did the video about the Circle kind of thing, everybody was describing that to being some kind of Klaus Schwab scheme or conspiracy. I don’t know if that is. It is interesting that immigration has actually gone up in this particular time past when I thought it was even possible. But I do get it. It’s easy to just ascribe everything which is going wrong to that group because they don’t have the magical protective shield that the other group does. But what you’ll notice is that they actually don’t care. They don’t care what you say about them. They don’t care. You can say that Bill Gates is a psychotic maniac all day long on Twitter and he’s still going to buy up more land. He’s still going to subvert some other NGO about vaccine safety. He’s still going to keep pushing this stuff. And this is what I’ve said all along about the technocrates, that they really don’t care what you think of them. And this is different because in the past, even in the migrant crisis, there was kind of lip service, that there was a hidden hand. If we just kind of call that out, if we just pull the curtain down, then everybody will kind of get it and it all makes sense to the norms. But what happens when you’re dealing with an elite, which is increasingly becoming the case that they say, we are doing this? We know, you know, we are doing this, but we’re still going to do it. We’re not hiding what we’re doing. We create these cringe PR videos to tell you what we’re doing. We’re not hiding it. This is the agenda and we’re saving the world from climate change. We’re doing it in the interests of public health. We’re not hiding behind the curtain. We are absolutely open about it.

 

Woes: I think this is partly why people who are into the JQ think that this stuff is fake, because it is so open, there’s almost nothing to discover. It’s almost amazing that normes don’t see it, or they just don’t. I think they see it, they just don’t see the gravity of it. But then, as I say, there are people who are into the JQ who I think covers it because it’s kind of jealously, because it’s something they’ve discovered, it’s something they have worked out. So it doesn’t make sense to them that the technocrats are just being completely out in the open about it, about what they’re doing. It doesn’t really map on it. It’s a very different thing with the JQ. The crime is noticing. It’s not like that with the Technocrats. It’s completely different. They want you to notice. They say it themselves, black and white. They’re proud of it, they’re completely blasphemy about it. They feel that they’re changing the world and it’s righteous that they feel that they are completely justified in doing this. I mean, there are other reasons why.

 

[3:31:03]

 

Morgoth: There’s no great secrets to uncover. You can’t proselytize, you can’t sort of run around with your revealed truth, which will shatter the epistemology of the average centre rate guy, because they’re just right over there telling you what they’re doing. But at the same time, that other group, it still has a hell of a lot of power and influence. It’s arguably still the most dominant group. Yet we do have this other thing that’s happening.

 

Woes: Yeah, exactly. I guess that would be a good segue to talk about the Kanye West thing and your perspective on Elon Musk and the ADL hop take on that.

 

Morgoth: Can I just dip in the toilet?

 

Woes: Yeah, good idea. I’ll play the NST thing that I meant to play at the beginning. Here we go. It’s a difficult thing to do, actually, to make people aware of all of the information that they could be aware of to do with millennial. For example, the NFT people might not know that there is NFT this year. There was an NFT last year, and I thought, okay, this could become a regular thing, because at that time, NFT stood just the kind of thing, and they were selling for a lot of money. So I thought it’s worth putting in all that’s worked into trying to make it something pleasant and nice, because I do like the idea that there’s this commemoration. There’s this thing that somebody can own, and it is the NFC of millennial that year, and there’s only one of them. This sort of undulating stained glass animation similar to last year, and it works the same way. You can hover the mouse over it, react. I just think there’s something special about it. The NFC is unique. Only one person can own it, and I think that’s nice, so that’s why I do it. All right. Hello.

 

Morgoth: I’ve also started on the whiskey.

 

Woes: Okay. Over three and a half hours. Then I don’t know how long you want to go on for.

 

Morgoth: Half hour or so. the Kanye West thing was one of those things where I kind of sit it out because I’m not in touch with American zuma. I don’t know how they think. I’m in my 40s, I’m from the northeast of England. I’m just completely disconnected from their culture. I was like, well, I’m not going to say something one way or the other one okay, let me get on with it. We’ll see what happens. There’s a virtue that you kind of learn when you get older. There’s a virtue in saying, like, I don’t know, I don’t have the answer to everything, this thing that you’ve just asked me and my answer is, I don’t know. I guess we’ll see how it goes. But one of the things one of the things that I noticed the problem because I keep an eye on pop culture and stuff. Like I was saying earlier, it’s not so much the message. And I know people will say, like, the GIMP mask and the net and it just looks ridiculous. But for all I know, that could be a big hit with American Zuma. I don’t know. But what I do know about is a little bit about something just sort of studying pop culture and whatnot is the nature of celebrity. And I think the mistakes which have been made are actually centreed around not knowing what a celebrity is or what they’re supposed to do. If you think who is because Kanye West is the biggest pop star in the world or whatever, I know he came in. I don’t know, I’ll just go with it. Let’s just assume he is the biggest or at least one of the biggest pop stars in the world, but he isn’t an ideologue, and he isn’t a great speaker. He isn’t going to give like some huge, powerful speech. Whatever the attraction, the draw, the power, there is the celebrity status itself, not what he’s saying. And what I see is that that’s been just systematically pissed away. I’ll tell you an example of if you think, okay, the celebrities of today, it’s one of those things where you don’t really get stars anymore like we did in the early years. You go back a few decades, it was easy to say, Clint Eastwood is still a star, but then he was a big star back in the day. Madonna was a big star. She was a superstar. And to dear, I’d say Tom Cruise is a quintessential star. He has that aura. So then you have to think, okay, what is a star? What is it that we think of as a star? And it’s somebody who is higher than you and is out of touch that you don’t have access to and you don’t really know what their thinking is on certain things. You don’t really know what their takes are, and whenever they kind of descend into that, they lose a bit of that star aura. Perfect example of this is Robert De Niro. So Robert De Niro. I love his movies. I’m a movie fan. I can and have with endeavour and classic movies. They spoke for hours on end about how great something like The Deer Hunter is, or you think of Good Fellas or The Godfather Part two. But one of the things about that is that when Robert De Niro began to go on Saturday Night Live, and he began to do the rules of Jimmy Conway from Good Fellows, but this time he was flagging off. Donald Trump, and this time.

 

Woes: He was.

 

Morgoth: Doing Jimmy Conway, but kind of cooked Jimmy Conway, where he’d become like a shit lab on a celebrity show. And he was calling Donald Trump like a mutt. Are you for fucking really fucking mutt? And all of this all of this kind of Good Fellas kind of band up, but it was like, in the service of the American Deep State and shit, liberty, and it was fucking awful. And it’s because what happens is that he’s suddenly that kind of mystique has gone, and then it gets worse again. Social media is why I think we don’t really have celebrities anymore. Social media kills the stardom because it allows the pools. It allows the common filth and dumb plebs to actually gain direct access to the stars. And I looked up Tom Cruise’s Twitter account. He has, like, an actual verified Twitter account, and it’s the most boring Twitter account in the world. It’s literally just a couple of scenes here and there from the latest Mission Impossible movie or whatever. He’s not complaining about politics. He’s not kind of claiming down the gutter. So Tom Cruise kind of retains that kind of mystique of the celebrity. Even when you think of the Oprah Winfrey thing back in the day, when it was the Scientology, he survived that because he was even more out of touch. It was like, Scientology is this kind of kooky, bullshit religion, which the super rich and the famous get involved with, but nobody that you’ve ever known really knows much about Scientology. It’s just a little garbage. It’s like space aliens and whatnot. Okay, whatever. Like cookie we had celebrities, they get a pass for that because they’re above and out of reach. When you look out to Kanye West and you think, well, okay. His big thing was his celebrity. What happens is you don’t see Tom Cruise going on. Tim pool’s livestream. It just doesn’t happen. Why? Because he has people telling him that, well, you don’t do that you make one appearance on America’s Most High Profile, make sure if that once every two years, except for that, you are out of reach. To be fair, I mean, Leonardo DiCaprio is another one. He could have had that, but he pissed a lot of it away by prattling on about climate change all of the time. And this is what I think is being lost on the Kanye West thing. It’s not really so much the message, but it’s when social media is where celebrities go to die, because all of a sudden, you’re just another one of us. You’ve descended from that lofty perch, being unaccessible, being a literal star in the heavens, shining above everybody, and then all of a sudden, what? You’re talking at Gavin McGinnis. And, you know, he’s in it for the grift. You know he’s there for just like, kind of get his own name back in the newspapers are the same with Alex Jones and the same with Tim Pool. But I do get it. It’s not so much the message that’s the problem. It’s the fact that what you’re doing is pissing away all of that sort of iconic celebrity status by going on, by turning up, by sort of appearing as if you’ve got your cap in hand, begging to go on somebody’s livestream. That’s just death. So it isn’t the message, it’s the fact that the celebrity status itself is being lost here. And I’m not against it. And this is the thing you always get the kind of all you are coming after him. Now, look, I would say maybe too late. This is just my perspective on it. But what I would suggest was that instead of like begging people to go on their live streams and doing all of these extra long form interviews, which always just take away the aura of the celebrity status, which is all he has, then what you should have been doing is just releasing a bunch of Enigmatic promote videos, putting on Twitter. Look, even that, even in the sort of the context of social media killing celebrity, yes, but it gets worse because he had a Twitter account of 30 million followers, giant platform. We all saw what Trump did. It just stepped down from being completely out of touch. Okay, that’s a massive audience. He never had a reply. Some clever tweets would have gone a long way. He pissed that away as well. Elon Musk back on. He deliberately ruined that and got banned again. So now we have a Telegram channel.

 

Woes: I think that there’s a lot to pick up on there. I think Kanye West is 45 years old. Let me just make sure about that. And yeah, he’s 45 years.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, he is.

 

Woes: So it’s not like he’s 20.

 

So I think when people say, well, this is a Zoomer thing, maybe you and I are too old to really understand how he interacts with the youth. I’m not sure about that. But at the same time, maybe it’s true. Maybe you and I just don’t get this. I don’t know. I think another aspect of what you said, maybe coming down from the stars and being a regular guy will actually endear him to a lot of people. I mean, again, it’s impossible for me to predict this black I’m not a black American. I don’t know how they think. I don’t know how they’ll feel about this, but I do think that all of this could have been handled choreographed a hell of a lot better. But he didn’t. When you’re in his position, everyone around you is of a certain persuasion. They’re not going to want to rock the boat on this issue. So who would you go to for advice on how to do this? Well, he went to Nick Fuentes and Milo.

 

Morgoth: Yeah. So what you end up with is, like, live streams on altright channels.

 

Woes: Yeah, well, Alt-Lite, let’s be precise.

 

Morgoth: I thought that’s what I said. But I mean, how could you better have done it? The first sort of wave where he was just, like, stripped of all of his money, like billions of dollars just gone because the ADL clicked their fingers. That was that was a fucking outrage. That’s disgusting that they have that amount of power to be able to do that. I totally get it. So the problem is actually, how do you capitalize on that? And my approach to doing that would be not to be to piss away, like, a Twitter account of 30 million followers by kind of deliberately getting on Elon Musk deliberately putting Elon Musk in a in a horrible situation. Where he’s like, okay, you’re gone, so you you keep the Twitter account so you don’t have to rely on people’s fucking Gavin McKenna’s livestream. But it’s gone now. Okay, so he still has a lot of following. You can still do some Enigmatic sort of promote videos where you leave it hanging in the air. The fact that all of this stuff has happened, who did it, why has it done it? Why can’t he talk about these things? Why is it that you say this group has power and then they react by using that power to destroy you, but you’re not allowed to say that we’ve got the power in the first place? It’s a completely ridiculous situation. It’s an open goal. It was flunked, in my point of view. I’m not even sure what’s going on with it now.

 

Woes: Well, unfortunately, he’s got them to prove his point. He’s got them to prove him correct. But in order to do that, he had to lose everything. That’s the price of it. I think he’s still got 200 million. So he hasn’t lost everything, but he has lost, I believe, 800 million of his fortune. It’s a difficult thing to know. I mean, I think you’re right that he should have been more subtle about this instead of just going all and certainly saying that he admires Hitler for Fox’s sake. But some people have said he’s mentally ill. I think he actually might be. I think he this might be a guy who’s hit some kind of impasse in his life and is just destroying it, just tearing his whole life down. I don’t know, but it seems kind of like that to me. There are ways to if you’re really pissed off, if you’re really angry, there are ways to get revenge. There are ways to set the record straight. There are ways to get your perspective across without destroying everything that you’ve built.

 

Morgoth: Well, I’ve seen people say that this is a sort of an artistic statement. In other words, the controversy itself is a kind of art form, which I kind of get, which I don’t buy it, to be honest, but okay, I’ll take the argument on. I understand it, but I still just don’t see how going on a live stream with government guests in particular, but even then, Alex Jones is kind of the well is poisoned. I actually like Alex Jones. I can actually enjoy Alex Jones show, but I’m well aware of what that says to the normal person. Now, here again, I’ve got to be careful, because I don’t know how that goes down in middle America or with kind of sort of disaffected people under 25 in America. I’ve got no idea. I’m not in that scene. I’ve got no connection to that. So maybe they’re all just loving this and it’s this kind of big, radicalization thing that’s going on. For all I know, that could be happening right now. But what I do know is that when all you have is celebrity status and then you piss away, that the aura of celebrity itself, then you’re just another bloke running on the Internet, and that’s exactly what you need to avoid. You never need to do that. And as I explained, you can see with all of these other celebrities when they engage in politics, some of the mystique is lost forever. Now I’ve got to deal with the fact that Neil McCauley in Heat, one of my top three movies of all time, is just this tedious shit lib when he’s doing the bank heist and the sound of the rifles. And the shootout coming out or when he’s we do call Leone and he’s young and he’s looking after his family and he realizes he has to kill the local mafiat on for the great to survive and get ahead, and he contemplates killing him and he switches through it and all this great performance. Amazing. It’s like, yeah. And then all of a sudden, he’s just like this pathetic rumour crying about Donald Trump or something. It’s all shattered. And it isn’t just the politics. It’s something more than that it’s the accessibility of it. It’s the same way that to be honest, Madonna never really recovered after revealing her tits and snatch the celebrities. What is the aura of a mystique then? And it’s the same if you’re going to wear a black mask and you’re going to talk to Annette or Alex Jones. The magic and the mystique of the celebrity status is the only power you’ve got. And so what you’ve done is just destroy it because it’s just like everybody else on the internet. You’re just another online shit poster.

 

Woes: Yeah, I agree. And I do think that it would have been better if Kanye West still had his Twitter account, for sure. 30 million people. That’s a fucking lot of people that’s your average European country I would get.

 

Morgoth: They could have been releasing just a set of Enigmatic videos to get the message across, which didn’t just go crazy, just enough to get everybody pointed in the right direction. All of those promote videos could have ended with a question about what happened to him and his fortune and about who you can or can’t talk about. He’s got 30 million followers. Imagine what that would have been on Twitter. This is why I’m saying it’s not the message, it’s the way that they’ve gone about it. I think it’s just completely spastic. So right now there could be videos floating around deliberately provoking in millions upon millions and millions of people. The question, why is it that happened? Why is it that with a screenshot of Jonathan Greenblatt, why does he have this power? Who are these people who elected the ADL to be the monitors of free speech in America? These kinds of things all there on little two minute promote videos from a Twitter account with 30 million followers? Absolutely.

 

Woes: I mean, that could have had a real effect on the culture. It could have changed society. It certainly would have been something that couldn’t be ignored. It would have to be addressed somehow. And then, of course, you can respond to that and it keeps going. In theory at least, he could have stayed on Twitter, especially Musk’s Twitter. I think Musk actually wanted to start I think Musk was kind of enjoying it and it was helping him to get one ADL and so on.

 

So I think he could have stayed on Musk’s sweater if he played it a certain way, but instead he insists on going the whole hog and then posting the Swastika and the Star Dave, whatever it was, and that’s it. And then that brings us actually to Elon Musk, because his comment on that he screenshots of a DM that he sent to Kanye West saying this is not love, about the swastika in the star of David, and Musk’s comment on it was, this is not love. That is fucking cringe.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I think he’s trying to hold Kanye West to his own standards. At the end of the day, mosque is just a sort of Gen X kind of libertarian type and he will feel for all the reasons all of the other ones did. But nevertheless, the idea of that is like, I can’t defend this is what he’s saying. I can’t stand in your corner. But this is the problem. One of the problems is ideology, because ideology blinds people to reality. A lot of the pain we all know what we want. We all know what our goals are and what our first principles are. But when you kind of get locked in to solve on the tracks of ideological purity, then you just end up in the fuck up. Tame and tame and tame again. And it’s interesting to me that well, it’s interesting that people fuck up on one thing and then they stumble in onto the next thing and fuck that up as well in this scene. And here we are where it’s like everybody jumped on board the year train, which could have been so much better. It could have been fun. Like I said, I’m not colour signaling the signal. I know the trap there. I’m not colour signaling what it is that he’s actually saying. I’m saying the way that they’ve gone about this is kind of retarded. What are we up to now? We switched Twitter account from 30 million followers to a Telegram chat with 10,000 or something like, who gives a folk? And then what is he going to do next? He’s going to go on somebody’s stream. Next week on Odyssey. It’s the biggest pop star in the world. You kidding me. This is the positive outcome for what could have been in the good books of Elon Musk, leaning in to what at that time, Musk himself was doing, which was winding up the ADL, but doing it in a way where he wouldn’t be caught, where he couldn’t be held accountable. What you were doing was drawing out the ridiculous amount of power this obviously Zionist organization is, but not doing it in a way where the canons could fire back on you. Because at the end of the day, in Moscow’s case, it’s like, I’m just a liberal, I’m just a sensible centrist. I just believe in free speech. It’s the ADL who are calling for censorship. It’s the ADL who are getting people just fleets for billions of dollars. I’m just a liberal guy, I just want to have free speech. That’s fine. But in a realistic scenario, there is limits to it. Funny enough. It actually brings me to another article that I wrote called Centrist Caesarism, which you may actually see.

 

Woes: Yes, this is a very interesting concept because it immediately predated something happening on Twitter, which was just after, I think you wrote it, just after Musk took over. Then Sargon of Akkad got reinstated on Twitter after you wrote this article. And then the sensible centrism emerged. Yeah.

 

Morgoth: And that’s strange, isn’t it? That’s how that worked out.

 

Woes: Yeah, it really is. It was uncanny. Now, Academic Agent was on Millennial last night, and he talked about sensible centrism. I think from his perspective, it is basically and I might be twisting it here, I hope not. It’s basically don’t be an Edge Lord for the sake of it. Don’t drive people away for the sake of being the most controversial person in the room. Don’t have cartoonishly extreme opinions. It’s just sort of silly. And it is. It’s juvenile. And I’ve said the same thing for years. The issue I have with sensible centrism, and I said this to Academic Agent last night, is the word centrism. I think we should be sensible, but I think that the centre is where people don’t really believe in anything. Like Elon Musk doesn’t really believe in anything. I think in order to really defend something, you have to be an extremist in a certain way, because the people who are dead against that thing and want to destroy it, they’re extreme in their own way. Again, I’ve got to be careful how I phrase this, but I think in order to save a thing that is under attack, that takes extreme measures, or it could do at any rate, the ideas are going to be radical relative to the time in which they are appearing. In other words, I think that my ideas are completely sensible. I think that my great-grandparents would have agreed with me on virtually everything and everyone everyone in Britain would have agreed with me on virtually everything four generations ago, but relative to the norm today, my ideas are radical. That’s just a fact. And I wish it weren’t true, but I think it is true. So if I try to rebrand myself as a well, I’m actually a centrist and my enemies are the extremists. The reason I think that will fail is they have the power. They have the power to rebrand and reauthor things. I don’t the term, all right, at one point, it meant one thing, and then the mainstream media took it out of our hands and changed the definition, and there was literally nothing that we could do they just owned it. They just took it and altered what it meant. And they can do that because they have the power. So if I tried to say, I’m actually not this bad guy you might have heard about I’m actually a sensible centrist, the issue with that is that I’m kind of pissing into the wind, even if it’s technically true that my ideas aren’t that extreme or whatever.

 

[4:01:42]

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I have to point out there’s a difference between my article on centrist Caesarism and the sensible centre thing, because my article, my essay, which, yes, it’s funny enough, it did predate by about five days the explosion under the scene of the sensible centres, which is funny. It’s a funny thing, that. But nevertheless, my article is not about, let’s say, the far-Right, because we have to be explicit if we’re talking about the centres position, you’ve got the far Left, you’ve got the far-Right and you’ve got the centre. My concept here is not that the far-Right will somehow disguise themselves as centrists and get in under good optics and being kind of moderate and claiming the normal position. Rather what I was getting at was that actual centrists, actual people who are centrists, will actually step up the bat and then defend their own position. Now, there’s a few things to touch on. Here what I got into. I kicked the article off. It was quite a long article. Obviously, it has sort of connotations of Oswald Spengler’s Caesarism. So if you go back to actual Caesar himself, Julius Caesar, he wasn’t an extremist, he was also a pragmatic centrist. And this is clue. Again, I’m not coming at this from the perspective of the dissident of far-Right sphere subverting the centre or claiming the centre. It is the centre itself which is actually realizing itself.

 

So that’s important. And so if you look at sort of Caesarism in general, they would be populist, but they were first and foremost pragmatic and not idealists. And I kicked the article off by there’s Brett Weinstein and his wife, who do a podcast, which I’ll dip into now and then for the Cuva type thing. I watched. Obviously he’s jewish, but I think she’s a gentile. But the sentiment, what they expressed was that we are upper middle class, where professionals are highly educated, where we are liberals in a genuine, classic liberal sense, and there is nobody anywhere in the American political sphere who represents us. Nowhere. So an example of this would be the rule versus weird sort of discussion in America about abortion. And the way they framed it was that on the one hand, you’ve got where people want to ban abortion completely, and then on the other hand, it’s like the other side of the argument is that basically it’s just killing babies. As soon as they’re born, it gets insane. And they were saying, where is the middle ground on this? Where is the nuanced centrist middle ground position on this? Where was it on the vaccines? Where was it on covert? Where is it on immigration? There is no middle ground. It’s a very American thing. And so it got me thinking, because the potential resources that this position has are quite large, but they’ve got a problem and they’ve got the same problem that classic liberalism always has had, and it’s that it’s easily cooked and subverted. So, yeah, we bring Elon Musk into the equation, who is himself a classic liberal with a massive amount of resources, as we’ve seen. And we’ve also seen what he’s trying to do with Twitter. And what interested me was when he said that both the far-Right and the far Left would be equally pissed off with the way he was going to handle Twitter.

 

Woes: So I remember a Remnant poster talked about this. He made a post and he said, this shows you how vaped his thinking is. No, well, go on.

 

Morgoth: I completely disagree with that, because basically it isn’t vaped if he’s just going to shut down the extremes of both sides. Because what this amounts to is power without ideology. It is arbitrary. In Elon Musk’s case, it is purely sort of defending the centre against the extremes. So what you’re talking about is something which is purely pragmatic and made up on the fly. And if you detect something which is a danger, let’s say Kanye West with a swastika and the Star of David or whatever, but at the same time, over on the Left side of that is just outright child abuse and paedophilia both get banned. So the sort of the ontology here is what you have to draw on the question, is it vehicleed or can it stand sore? Well, it will need a kind of ideal to draw itself on. So what will that idea be? Well, it will be, and this is the long standing criticism of Han Alvarez and a sort of 1980s idealism, which we spoke about, which when America was a good thing, when you look at all of the movie critic, YouTube and Sauron or Elon Musk, they’re not real classic liberals. They’re not classic liberals in the sense of like, Francis Galton or John Locke or all of this. What they really are is nostalgic for the 1980s. So they can actually draw on the 1980s as a kind of epistemology, as a kind of ideal and a vision to strive towards. And then they can say, okay, this is our ideal and we’re going to enforce it. And unlike in the past, let’s say, when it was like, we will platform our enemies, we will platform the far Left, they never really platform the far-Right, but we’re here, they seem to be learning. So then what the idea is, well, no, we’re going to ban them. We need just to be purely pragmatic, because in a sense, where we are in the civilization is beyond ideology. And the essence of Caesarism is pragmatic power, not ideology. Caesarism doesn’t in Spangler’s terms, it’s the end of politics. And what you end up with is just pure pragmatism again, for the greater good.

 

Woes: Well, when the world is as messed up as it is, can you get back to sanity? Can you restore no things from a centrist mindset?

 

Morgoth: No, you can’t. What you do is initiate, for example, from the centrist classic liberal point of view, censorship. You don’t do that, you don’t censor people. Otherwise it’s a kind of betrayal of your core principles. Well, it turns out that actually you will just sense of people in the name of the greater good, in the name of stability, in the name of order. And so this is when you bring in a word like aura, you begin to see the sort of Caesarism in the background. Vladimir Putin is in this. Way, just a centrist who is pragmatic when you see people crying because he jails White nationalists or whatever. Look, it’s an objective analysis. I’m not applying a value here. You’ve got to be a realist about these things. And the fact is, it’s just going to lead to instability within Russia to allow these certain ideas to percolate and spray. So you shut it down. Simple as that. And I don’t see why this isn’t going to be the thing that happens in the West where you get somebody who’s like, okay, call me. I don’t care. I’m going to shoot you down. I’m going to shut down Drag Queen Story Hour, and I don’t give a flying fuck about your First Amendment rights. That’s just wrong. You do not get to be sort of a Neo Nazi either. This is not me speaking. This is the central Caesarist. Son of speaking is the way that I framed it. And I think there’s a big base for that. And the reason why it leans into Caesarism is because people are just exhausted with politics. They’re just tired of it. On the one hand, the Caesar is a populist figure, but again, the populists aren’t far-Right or far Left. They just want to have a quiet life, and they will support who gives them that. It may well be that you begin to see people sort of centrist type standing up against the technocracy. We don’t want to live in this surveillance grid. I’m not like an extremist. I just don’t want to live in a kind of panopticon prison. Can somebody come and solve this problem? Can somebody come and get these fucking technocrats out of my life? Where my phone isn’t going to pass judgment on how many times I’ve gone for a piston here? Can somebody please just close the fucking border? I’m not like a White supremacist. Can somebody just do some normal shit here? Because this is getting insane. And it literally begs for a centrist to come up and say, yeah, I’ll do that. I’ll shut down the extremists. And this is the thing. It won’t make sense. Such a worldview is riddled with paradoxes because it’s power deciding in Schmidt. It’s the shift decisionism. You make the decision, and then you justify it afterwards. But the point is that they are the power, and then they will arbitrarily decide who gets to do what and who gets to speak and who doesn’t. This is life beyond politics. So when you say, oh, well, Leon must cook, he isn’t far-Right. He isn’t far Left. He’s a pragmatic centrist. So the essence of centrist Caesarism is different from his sensible centre because it isn’t a bunch of, like, far-Rightists wearing the camouflage of being more benign than what they are. They actually are that, but they have learnt to live with the sins of the past, if you like, when they were just travelled all over and cooked. Now you see it with Musk and Twitter as an example. Potentially, Donald Trump could have been lake this. So you see more and more of these figures popping up where it’s like, I’m not really ideological. I don’t have an ideological vision to implement on the world. I don’t have this perfect utopian system that I’m shilling, but I’ll just do what I can in the moment and make things best and shilling down. Extremists is point number one. And, yeah, it’s shit because that’s going to include us.

 

Woes: Well, yeah, I understand what you’re saying. It’s a pragmatic, sort of, okay, let’s just all calm down, and if the people who won’t calm down will keep them out of the room. But in the end, that doesn’t actually solve the real problems, does it? I mean, it’s a temporary solution. It’s like a sticking plaster, but it’s not actually solving the problems of society.

 

Morgoth: Well, no, there’s no vision. It’s stagnation and cultification. It’s just trying to hold it all together. That’s what Caesarism is.

 

Woes: Yeah.

 

Morgoth: To be fair, it does offer the degree of stability, but there’s no Catholics here. There is no happy ever after in the claim. This is why it’s important to get back to the issue that Caesarism is what happens when you went over the winter. Another mistake that I think people make is that when they talk of Caesar and not so much like Caesarism, it’s an age of turbulence. It is an age of sort of larger than life characters arriving on the scene and placing themselves in the centre of power and being at odds and at war with bureaucratic systems.

 

Woes: So would you say that this is a temporary thing, then? A temporary state?

 

Morgoth: I think it’ll just go on and on. It’s the tension that’s there. The tension and the turmoil is baked into the cake.

 

Woes: Okay, so things have reached such a point that extremism of different kinds have messed up the situation so much that at this point, it arrives at a sort of stasis where we won’t fix the problem, we just won’t allow it to get any worse. Yeah, right. I mean, that is a depressing prospect, and I understand what you’re saying. This is where the client starts to decelerate and then you’re just left with this soup of dysfunction. It doesn’t get any worse, but it doesn’t get any better.

 

Morgoth: Yes. And you’ll sort of just kind of limp along and do your best. Don’t get me wrong, the December of Caesarism can absolutely be a Police State, because if just pragmatic, straightforward solutions demanded that you’ve got all of these ethnic groups on each other’s roots, then, yeah, that’s the way it is. You’re dealing with the sort of the afterbirth of all of the problems which came before I’m not an optimist. You’ve just got to do the best you can. I mean, what was it like in the late stages of Raw? Where were you better off? You were better off being out on the countryside, to be honest, because there’s no saving the metropolis. Because as we’ve discussed for hours now, it’s terminally corrupt. And if you have this brain, this kind of shame in you ideology, they’re going to shit you down like to do. There’s a kind of paradox in in kind of sort of far-Right circles where on the one hand, this is a shitty system, it’s killing our people. We all get it. It’s horrible. We want to replace it. And the root cause of that is liberalism. So we hate liberalism. Liberalism is bad. Liberalism has to go. But the problem is the more extreme that you go from the perspective of liberalism itself, from the perspective of the centre, the more justified liberalism is and shutting you down. But at the same time, the more reliant you are on the rights granted to you through liberalism. So if you’re kind of like the edgiest guy on Telegram, you’re coming up with all this extreme stuff and the Deep State decides to come to your house in the middle of the night and shoot you through the back of the head. Why would they not do that? It happens in other regimes. It would happen in style as Russia, it would happen in Mao was China. So what is it that’s preventing when you do an edgy post in the chat, there only account we’re all announced, well, Moses isn’t what I am as well. When you go super edgy and you think you can get away with it, well, they know who you are. What gives you the Right? What gives you the right to be a racist on the internet at the end of the day? What gives you the right to stand on a street corner with a placard saying Whites are going to be a minority in 2060? Where does that come from? Well, it comes from liberalism. You think you have the right to do these things because liberalism grants you these freedoms, but at the same time you’re also soaring away and criticizing that branch. So what you’re actually doing is presenting yourself as a kind of exception. Because if you’re going to attack the fundamentals while relying on them, the system is going to say, well, no, the reason why nobody is showing up to your house in the middle of the night and shooting you back. Through the back of the head is because there is at least still the AirPods and the width of a kind of standard Western liberal democracy here.

 

Woes: Yeah, I mean, I remember when a certain figure, prominent figure in this movement was on YouTube would have been about 2018, 2019, and he said, do we actually care about free speech or do we believe in freedom of speech? We’ll not say that outlight. And it was sort of joking. I’ve just said it out like kind of thing. But he was admitting that he would censor his opponents, he would imprison his enemies and whatever the trouble is, he’s doing that on a platform that shortly after that banned him because of course it did, but he’s just given them the rationale to ban him. He’s just said, well, freedom of speech isn’t that important. I mean, it is retarded. It is all through the branch that you’re relying on, it’s absolutely retarded.

 

Morgoth: And I ran into trouble on Telegram a year or two back with somebody from Australia because I pointed out that these kind of the national action tape fellas and what they were doing was deliberately antagonizing the liberalism. In the end, it comes down to power, whether you like it or not. Power will grant privileges to people. It will leave people alone if they don’t threaten it. This kind of thing, if you’re literally standing on a street corner saying, I’m going to take look, the people who occupy positions of power are being told by people who are powerless that they will face sort of Gulags, that they will be put on trial for our lives. If their group gains power, then the group who are now dominant will be hung or worse. If you want to go into some of the auggie chats, well, what does that say to them? What does that say to the people in power? What it says to the people in power is that we’ll crush you like ants because if we don’t, you’re going to kill us.

 

Woes: Yeah.

 

Morgoth: This is the essence of politics and you’ve got these people who think they’re clued up. And again, the problem is ideology. It’s like, wow, I don’t care. I’ve got this revealed truth. I’ve got this truth to spread my ideology, my book, my bullet points, my perfect utopia is imminent. And it’s like, well, okay, can we get it off Telegram? Where’s it going to go? Because at the end of the day, the realist perspective on this is that power are just going to crush you like an ant.

 

Woes: Yeah, I think this is a huge problem and you can talk all you like if you don’t have power, that’s it. And I think this is something become very clear to people over the last few years. There were already foreshadowings off it before Covid but it definitely became clear then that if you have power, and I’ve said this a hundred times, I’m sorry to repeat it, but if you have power, you can offer the narrative, if you don’t, you can’t. It’s as simple as that. So having ideology, and I understand what you’ll know as well as I do, that there are young people in our movement who are obsessed with ideology and getting the ideology right. Because once you’ve got the ideology, then you can capture the public or you can capture, movers and shakers. You can persuade them with the idea. Either way, the ideology will recommend you to other people and it will help you, enable you to persuade other people and I just don’t think that’s true.

 

Morgoth: And by the way, just a minor point. The ideology itself isn’t that great. There’s a certain, let’s say, Nativist who would even deny property rights. So that like, my dad worked all his life, he owns his own house, he paid off a mortgage. But that would make him a kind of property owning, individualist Anglo, and he needs to kind of subordinate himself to the new socialist kind of Third World Hegelian Dialectic superstate. And my dad will just say, here, Pump, fuck off, will you take your fucking book of bullshit and shove it up your fucking hoop. I’ve worked all my life for this house and I’m going to hand it over because you’re a fucking ideologue on the internet. You look it. Fuck you.

 

Woes: Yes, well, in the end, it comes back to these tangible things. If you can’t appeal to people’s desire for certain things, a family, freedom, self sufficiency, autonomy, or something more like the nation, the religion that they believe in, et cetera. And this is something that AA said last night, that people are not really animated by values and principles. And I agreed and I said, yeah, I think they’re animated by something tangible that they can protect and defend or pursue, like a goal. And if you can’t do that, then I don’t think it’s going to get off the ground. Now, we hope that people will care about their ethnic group. They obviously shoot, I mean, everyone else does. And the animal kingdom, it goes without saying, but for some reason why people don’t seem to care about their group. They’ll fight flight to their group, but when their group is under political and cultural attack, they will suddenly believe that they don’t have a group, that their group doesn’t exist. And this is a huge problem because it leaves us very vulnerable and naked to what other groups want to do to us. That’s, again, just a fact, as we were saying earlier about wartime vegetable growing and so on. And I think this is a problem for the ideologues because well, you go.

 

Morgoth: I was just going to say one of the things about the sort of the centrist Caesarism concept would be that in a way it would be cringe, but at the same time really edgy. And I’m not saying that I support it, but if you actually enforce their ideals, such as free speech and being reisblind, they would actually be massively destructive to the way that the West is constructed these days. You can see a little bit of a hint of that with Elon Musk and as his kind of interaction with Anti-Defamation League. It would always be about and I mentioned this in the article it would always be about negotiating with the outliers and coming to a kind of Pragmatic solution. But there would be no as they have now, where they just dominate. If you think of something like free speech, you can have free speech except in these certain circumstances, but it will no longer be dedicated or predicated on the Equalities Act or the Civil Rights Act, but more on just the rights of the individual to have free speech. And something like affirmative action would go. The White privilege theory. Shit would go. All of these things would be just tossed out because that isn’t a 1980 decision, that’s like a sort of 2010s kind of vision. It would be like this kind of tragic kind of desperate attempt to take the 2020s back to the 20s, back to when Predator was great, back to when we could watch Alien and not view Ripley as like a feminist icon and all of this kind of thing. But it would be massively disruptive nevertheless, because we’ve drifted so far to the Left that even a return to a kind of centre position where we just stand on normal liberal Western values would be catastrophic for the system that we have to do they believe that there’s this kind of self right potential, which I just don’t think there is, I think, what’s interesting about it would be that it would be hugely disruptive and destructive to the present system. Even just this kind of Gen X kind of return to Ghostbusters.

 

[4:30:45]

 

Woes: People are asking, if this is all true, then what’s the point of even talking about this stuff? Which is a bit of a disgruntled point to make, but it’s valid. What is the point of talking? If basically we are stuck in the stasis now with Caesarism, a stupid dysfunction, as I said earlier, and radical ideas are going to be rejected outright, then what is the point of analyzing it anymore?

 

Morgoth: Well, I’m not saying what I did was post a hypothetical. So in the case of the central season, maybe it won’t happen. What I did was write an article about it, which is analyzing trends and drawing on some sort of influences from the past and saying this is where it could go. I’m not saying that it’s absolutely certain. Maybe it would. Maybe it will just be the outright technocracy. The purpose in talking about all of this is because we’re trying to get a grip of what’s going on in the world around us.

 

Woes: Yeah, I agree. And that’s going to be the case. No matter what turns up, it’s still going to be that we are living in this world and we’re trying to come to grips with it, trying to understand it.

 

So I think it’s still valid. But obviously what the person is pointing towards is the need for a practical direction. And I think you and I are not good at this, frankly. We’re not optimized for this. We’re optimized for analyzing a situation, wondering about ideas and possibilities. Ruminating but people want practical advice and maybe you could say don’t go to the right person for the thing that you want. I think at one point, and this is something that I lament. At one point there was a practical direction. There was what we called the alt right. And I thought that we were a change in culture. I think we were. I think that’s why they had to censor us. That’s why they felt they had to censor us because there was a genuine danger these ideas would become not we would necessarily capture the masses with them, but that the ideas would become so pervasive that they would be impossible to ignore. So better to just shut them down, just nip it in the bud. I think that was why the censorship started. And so at that point there was a sense of direction. But once the censorship kicked in, there’s less of a sense of direction because people individually and collectively don’t know what to do. How can they help themselves? How can they help their group? How can they help their family? How do they raise their kids? I mean, these are very valid and pressing questions. If we are going to be living in a super dysfunction a society that doesn’t really make sense, doesn’t work towards any particular goals except those of the technocrats which might often be hidden. And if society doesn’t work in your favour, then how do you raise a kid to survive and perhaps even thrive in that environment? It’s a very difficult thing. I don’t know what to advise people here.

 

Morgoth: Well, there’s people who know about this because you’re talking about the basics. I mean, the Woodlanders in the chart, he’s watches stuff. He’s more clued up on this. The sort of the basic how to survive offgrid get together network. I mean, I’m doing that in my own life. That’s what we should be doing. And it isn’t to say that there is absolutely no political situation. Maybe there is, but I just don’t see it. But the political situation will be something which is new and kind of doesn’t trigger the alarms or it will be an elite within the current system who goes wrong. And that’s not as outlandish as what you might think. Actually there’s already signs of that happening in recent years. You can see that there is this problem that they’ve got. You’ve got Donald Trump, you got Elon Musk, even to a certain degree, I would say of Vladimir Putin. They don’t have everything locked down, but in terms of sort of dishing out some kind of straightforward advice or there’s parties out there. There are organizations out there already. They do exist. They are there. My own take is to not whack the horn, it’s nest and kind of stay out of touch, don’t trigger the alarm systems and prepare yourself for what’s to come. And somebody like Woodlander does a great job of that. There is also organizations out there who are doing things in the real world. If you think that’s a viable solution, these things are there. My personal view is that things are going to get really bad. And what we already have is this kind of network. And at the end of the day, what me and Melaniel Wood are doing here we are just two blocks talking on the internet. There’s a sizable audience and everything. I can give my take on what’s happening in the world right now and where I think things could go or what this new piece of culture was, what that means in the current side case and whatnot. But at the end of the day, I can’t chop firewood for you or make sure that you’ve got gold when the system collapses. There’s so much of this kind of I watch some of the big conspiracy channels like Max Egan on BitChute sometimes. The stuff he comes up with is much more outlandish than what we’ve discussed here. But he says this again and again. At the end of the day, I can’t do this for you. I’m literally a normal bloke sitting in a flat and bloody North Daims aid. The organizations exist. There’s people out there left, right and centre offering advice. I don’t really understand it.

 

Woes: Yeah. Are there any other articles that you would like to talk about?

 

Morgoth: No.

 

So I think we’re sorting winding it down. We’ve been going for nearly 5 hours here.

 

Woes: Yeah. Okay, then in that case we’ll do the Superchat. Hold on a second. Let me get through these. There are quite a few. All right, I will go through them this way. We started at 08:00 p.m. Seems quite a long time ago now. All right. I hypocrite hello there. Welcome. He said, Keep up the good warrant, gentlemen. Thank you very much. It’s nice to see you. Empty Vessel said, I am not a conspiracy theorist. Things aren’t adding up and it’s pretty bloody obvious. Yeah, the term conspiracy theorist is a stupid term that was designed to discredit the idea that there are conspiracies. But there are conspiracies, there always have been and of course it’s going to continue.

 

Morgoth: It can relate to that sort of the painful question which just came up before, which I understand, look, don’t get as well I understand it, but I don’t have all the answers either. I’m just an all blue, but I remember that sort of Catherine Austin Fitz. She’s in with the sort of anti grade reset. She’s a specialist in economics and her take on this was pretty good. And she said, if you don’t believe in conspiracy theories, you better start believing and you better start getting yourself inside of a conspiracy theory as fast as possible. The way you get through this is to be within a circle of conspiracy. Because the point that she’s making is that if you’re just kind of a mass of atomized individuals, as EA would say, the organized minority will just rule over you time and time again. So get within a circle of conspiracy as fast as possible, or a network is more politely put.

 

Woes: Yeah, okay, orthodoxy. What does Morgoth think the likely outcome will be for Putin in Ukraine? Does he see America’s shambolic exit from Afghanistan as a catalyst which prompted Putin to undertake his operation?

 

Morgoth: It’s possible. I mean, I always wonder what happened to all of that gear in Afghanistan. The American military just seemed to leave, like, $150,000,000,000 worth of the best gear ever you can imagine in Afghanistan, really for nothing. I understand that there’s some cost thing, and I was like, well, this kind of era is over and done with, and we were going to just sort of allow the Taliban to take over. Yeah, I get it. It’s going to destabilize that part of the world. Yeah, okay, I get it. But still, just the sheer amount of equipment that they seem to leave behind, that seems weird. I don’t get that. I wonder if I found it with the Ukraine. I don’t know. I’m not really a geopolitics kind of guy. The long term consequences, I think, are by the looks of it, we are all very close to 2023, and we’re going to be coming onto a year for this war. I don’t think the Russians wanted that. I think the Russians are its not going according to what they wanted. Sooner or later, there’s going to be some kind of peace talks and we’ll see what happens. It’s a problem because either way, you’re going to end up with a need or kind of global home with Ukraine, or which is against what Russia wanted in the first place, or it just grains on and on and on. But my personal thoughts on this, regardless of the politics, is that both Russia and Ukraine, like everywhere else in the White world, have shit birth rates. When you look at World War II, the European nations had, like, high birth rates. We had birth rates which were the equivalent of, like, Afghanistan or something. You’re talking like, three or four children, at least half of them. So each woman may be producing two boys, which will become men who could fight in a war. We don’t have that now. And so when you’re looking at sending the youth of Russia and Ukraine, both of them and hundreds of thousands of prime sort of young men are just being wiped out. This is catastrophically bad for the demographics of those country and the long term health of those countries. Because when you went into this kind of modernity, this particular era of modernity where we are and everybody’s got fucking macro plastic in their ball sacks, everybody’s eating shit all of the time, the fucking women are lesbians, everybody’s determined of a tranny, it’s already bad enough. The last thing that you need is to send in your prime fucking stock to wipe each other out in a war like this because there’s no coming back from it. And the worst of it is that America is such a nihilistic empire that they don’t even give two shits about their own stock. You can at least say that. I don’t believe for a second that Zelensky cares about the Ukrainian people, but at least in theory, I can understand the Russian motivation here, even if it is quite cool in regards to Russian manpower. But, yeah, they’re sacrificing an entire generation of men, which we can’t afford anymore.

 

Woes: Yeah. And even more horrifying is that the solution to that will be mass immigration from Africa and the Middle East.

 

Morgoth: Certainly in the case of Ukraine, yeah.

 

Woes: There is a country murdering itself here. It’s just absolutely fucking dreadful. We didn’t even go into that. The whole stuff about Ukraine being a proxy for America, the Ukrainians themselves having their own interests, their own history or whatever, but it doesn’t matter because they’re basically owned and controlled by America. There’s that whole aspect. It’s been gone into another episode of Millennial. But do you have anything to say about that?

 

Morgoth: Well, what I will say is that I said at the beginning I wasn’t going to get invested, I wasn’t going to get involved in in the inevitable infighting that would happen because of this. And I didn’t to be honest, I didn’t. But it seemed to me that the argument which came down on the side of nationalism for everybody, which was the Ukrainian side all right, let’s just take that on board for a second. The nationalism for everybody argument, as opposed to the other side of it, which was more the Third Positioner’s stance, which was that while NATO is gay, America is gay, the West is gay, and Putin is standing up for himself on a more traditional order, and he was provoking the war. That’s kind of the two stances on it. But it seems to me that the nationalism for everybody argument died with an old stream pipeline. And in fact, if you’re going to talk about this in terms of national sovereignty, like, I’m English and I’m an isolationist. So my point here is that I don’t think we should be involved and I said this at the start in either way, the Ukrainians have absolutely the right to defend their homeland. They do not have the right to demand money from my government or arms, or that my government should intervene on their behalf at all. And the only people doing that are the Deep State of Britain and America, as always, colluding. But even if we take that, even if we take the argument that, well, national sovereignty and the sovereignty of people is what’s most important, but we don’t have that. I don’t have that. We don’t have that in England. We don’t have that in Britain. We are in control of our own destinies as it is if you could put it to a plebiscite for the masses and say, do you free? Barton this is where we get back to the nudge and the applied psychology and the propagandizing of the population. If you could strip all of that bullshit away, they said, Is this any of our businesses? Most of them would say, no, it isn’t, to be honest, and we would stay out of it. So this idea of national self-determination is refuted by the very fact that we are living on our own American empire. I mean, the North Stream pipeline thing is the most extreme example of it. Because all of a sudden, in the name of sovereignty and defending the ideal of people having sovereign power over their land, we’re going to blow up Germany’s main source of energy, reduce the people to poverty, and they’re not going to have a say in it that they’re fucked. Okay? So our energy prices go through the roof and we’ve got our own people freezing the death in their homes and choking on mould. Where is that argument for national sovereignty now? All you’re left with is being a bunch of fucking horse folded American Deep State.

 

Woes: Yeah.

 

Morgoth: You can make that argument in principle, but it dies as soon as the sovereignty of the nation states of Western Europe are done away with. They were done away with after World War II, but now it’s explicit because now it’s like, well, what we’re expecting just freeze and cook and pay £3 for a loaf of bread, but in solidarity for the people of Ukraine. Even though we never had a say in any of this, I don’t see that argument stacking up at all.

 

Woes: Yeah. And even though the people of Ukraine were basically that this war was imposed upon them by America, by continually goading Russia, so they didn’t do this either. So the whole thing has been orchestrated and I agree with you completely, the whole thing about Nord Stream. I did an entire episode of my weekly show The Gram about Nord Stream because it just seemed incredible at the time. It seemed so significant. And it’s still that America fucked one of its own allies in such a way that it’s going to have repercussions long, even if there’s war ended tomorrow. Well, Nordstrom still isn’t there. Germany is fucked, I guess you could say. Well, once the war is over, they’ll just repair the pipeline because it won’t be a problem anymore, Germany trading with Russia. But that’s not really the point. It will still be a problem for America if Germany does that because that strengthens the relationship between Germany and Russia and it also strengthens Germany, which again, America doesn’t want. It wants people buying stuff from America. So this whole thing is disastrous for Europe. And again, it’s not just about the war. The war is the excuse for America to bomb that pipeline. But the offensive of that will go far beyond the war.

 

Morgoth: Yeah. You reach this kind of precipice, you reach this uncomfortable position where if we are going to kind of take the idea of national sovereignty and nationalism seriously, what’s in the best interest for the people of Europe, we have to turn around of the Americans and say, it’s not you are the problem here, because Germany and Russia were doing fine. So it’s a complicated situation. But we reached the point where nationalists in Europe and I know this has been kind of a bit of a running thing without being insulting to the American people or how it all came about. You can blame this entirely on the Deep State and on the State Department and everything, but we’ve reached a place here where we are better off being allies with powers on the Eurasian landmass than you. And in my own opinion, especially when we bring in the toxic rebrand and the trannies and the gay flag and the fucking blacks and worshipping all of this fucking bullshit that America just pisses all over the world, which everybody hates. So it’s like Lenny. America has become like Lenny of Mason men, this kind of giant retard thing which just threatens to break everybody’s skulls. And it’s like, oh, can we do something about this problem? Can we do something about the retard problem, which America has become here?

 

Woes: Yeah, I don’t think there’s anything to say to that. Really. The whole thing about national sovereignty is very interesting. I remember you got into an argument with someone on Telegram who was talking about Ukraine and national sovereignty. It’s important that we defend Ukraine because they are national sovereignty. And you made this point about Nord Stream. Well, what about German national sovereignty? And, of course, what about British national sovereignty and all these countries in Western Europe that are under the thumb of America? The whole thing is and then you ended up with people having to say, well, it probably wasn’t America that bombed the pipe lane, because that rubber sees their whole thing about defending the American line here.

 

Morgoth: But it doesn’t even matter. It wouldn’t surprise me that if it was the British Special Forces, but it.

 

Woes: Doesn’T matter because they were under the control.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, we’re still under the form of Washington. Once again, we’re left with the problem of national sovereignty. If we are willing to go right to the line of a nuclear war with Russia, then I remember Nick Griffin in the BNP back in the day, and he was offered he did an interview when he said this, when the BNP were doing great, the BNP surge. And Nick Griffin was approached behind the scenes, and he spoke about this, and he said, we’ll turn a blind eye, but we don’t want you talking about the money power. We don’t want you talking about the banks and this kind of thing. And then I remember you, Mickey said, in this hypothetical situation where the BNP, they gained power, they gained a lot of power in Britain. To be fair, this is how seriously they took the BNP threat in 2000. Now, of course, they just don’t allow them to register as a party the question what Nick Griffin had to address for the base was that, are we going to start and deport people if the BNP gained power? And I always remember in this speech that I watched of Nick Griffin, which I found was interesting, and he said, we can’t do that because if we did, the Americans would bomb us. They’d flatten Britain if the BNP in power and we begin sending people home on ships, on aircraft carriers, on whatever it happens to be. So forced deportations of the immigrants since the Blair era and whatnot, the Americans were bombers. And I thought that it’s true, isn’t it? If you’re honest about it, and if you think about how that works with the bureaucracy, if you think of the implications on the so-called special relationship he’s right. They would I think I think Britain would become a pariah state, but not because of Europe. Well, now it’s different with the European Union, maybe, but it wouldn’t lead to that. It would be sanctions. It would be all of these problems that would come first. But I think he has a point. I think America would be the first country to kick up a fuss about such a policy. Not Russia, not China, not any of the Islamic countries. It would be the Americans. That would be the American Deep State who said, you do not deport those immigrants.

 

Woes: Yeah, I completely agree. America is the thing that is blocking us from fixing the situation in Europe. Even the political parties, even assuming that they wanted to, it would be a fear of America that stops them from actually doing it, because America, everyone knows the firepower is just enormous, and I think they would not hesitate to use it. I think if they thought that Le Pen is getting into power in France, she’s going to start mass deportations. Well, I guess they would try economic sanctions first. Well, this gets us to the issue of how powerful is America at this stage? They would try the economic sanctions first, for sure, but would they then go farther? And that leads us back to the Afghanistan withdrawal. I don’t know. This is something that’s impossible for me to judge.

 

Morgoth: They’ve got a lot of tools in the box. I mean, whether you want to talk about in terms of the Americans actually dropping bombs on London because we were deporting immigrants, it seems ridiculous, but they can do a lot. They can do a lot with torpedoing. You know, the central banks stepping in. We’ve seen it with Russia. We would get the Russia treatment. What what they have thrown at Russia, we would get. But we couldn’t deal with that because we’re not sufficient the way Russia is.

 

Woes: Yeah, exactly. All right, let’s move on to the next one. Darby said, Loving millennial, can you let Morgoth know that I find myself weeping after watching his and the band played on video? I don’t know how you do it, but I haven’t felt that deeply emotional since my grandfather passed away.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, that was a nice one that we didn’t get a touch on because I’ve been a bit serious tonight. I’m not sure what people want me to get into. I said earlier, the stuff that I like to do the most, heartfelt stuff, it isn’t the kind of if I’m honest, I don’t really give a shit about Kanye West, but it’s kind of like, well, people want to hear my view on it and so I’ll give it. And yet the video and the essay The Band Played On was like something which I was really like, maybe the top three kind of things that I did this year in terms of content the Band Played On would be right up there. Hardly anybody mentions it, nobody cares. They want to know, like, oh, well, if the excess deaths are actually going down and, oh, well, the vaccine wasn’t this bad. I’m kind of dragged into the kind of the hot take culture. But if you actually look like my actual content is a little bit different, it’s a little bit more personal, and the band played on, the whole thing behind it. What I said in the video was all true. I was out in Northumberland walking my dog and I came across this little sort of ceremony memorial thing. And I heard the brass band playing. I heard the vicar giving a sermon about the miners that had died. And I tried to do one of my quick take telephone style videos, but the weather was awful. It was windy and it just wouldn’t work. So I put it away. I thought, I’m going to come back to this. This is a subject I’m going to come back to. And what it was about was just the relationship between the history of the north, especially in England, but the military and the brass band. What really matters about it is that it’s a part of our culture and our heritage which hasn’t been territorialized. The brass band has a certain effect on English people and people say, well, it’s nostalgic. It always was nostalgic. Even in the 1960s, 1980s, the brass band was actually a thing to come out of the Industrial Revolution. And the factory bosses, they didn’t want their workers engaging in politics. So what they did was set up these brass bands, which were instruments which were quite cheap and that would occupy their free time of the night time. And so what happened was that this kind of dripped into British culture especially, and it has a kind of militaristic feel. The military itself adopted it, obviously. Marching the brass band, it was a thing in the unions and the mines and all these things, and I just happened to come across this beautiful little spectacle with a brass band playing, the vicar giving a sermon, and it was all about just the history of this village in Northumberland. What I try to do is try to find little gaps in the way we live now and it’s little gaps of authenticity and ways of thinking and feeling which are just for us and don’t belong to anybody else.

 

So that’s what that video is about. So thanks for that.

 

[5:03:33]

 

Woes: Yeah, it is a thing that sometimes, and I had this quite a few times on YouTube where you would make a video that you really cared about, but it wouldn’t make much of a splash. And then, conversely, you could do something very off the cuff that you didn’t think was really anything special and loads of people would like it and it’s nice when that happens, but it’s damn disappointing when the first thing happens. It’s a shame, but it’s just the plight of the content creator, really. You can’t predict what is going to matter to people. Okay, grief gave smiley face and thank you for that. Oliver said, do you guys think that a form of direct democracy, like the one Switzerland has, using referendums might be a way to stop the walk abuse of power that we experience here in the UK? I can answer that, yes, and I would like it. I think that I have a lot more time for referendums. I have a lot more respect for referendums and again, I can’t remember if it’s referenda, but anyway, than I do for party politics. Party politics is just so corruptible and in our age, so corrupt, it’s just absolutely fucking useless at this point. But I think referendums are a bit harder to twist. I mean, the establishment definitely didn’t want the result from the Brexit referendum that it got.

 

Morgoth: Well, imagine we’ve got all of these little parties to the right of the Tory Party, and imagine if there was a little party in embryonic form, behind the scenes, and their pitch was, in a way, going to be localism. And what I mean is, they would have a system using, ironically, digital technology being up to date, and what their sort of plan would be, would be where each PM MP, sorry, would be held accountable by what they pledged and what they did in Parliament. And what you would have would be a form of localism where let’s just say in somewhere like Brighton on the south coast, they would always vote for shitlibs. And if I’m coughing a bit here, I’m struggling because I’ve been talking for so much, but give us a second.

 

Woes: I’ll try to speak more plentifully when it is a question.

 

Morgoth: If you’ve got a party of shitlibs, you got Brighton on the south coast, they will vote for more work, more immigration, more whatever, more White privilege, more Judge Floyd statues, all of this shite. But you may have, in another part of the country, their local MP will deliver on that and he’ll be held accountable by them to do that. Because, remember, this is supposed to be the system that we actually live under representative democracy. So if you imagine, then you’ve got somewhere typically in British politics, Yorkshire is like reactionary. Yorkshire tends to veer to the Right a lot of the time. And so you may well find that there’s somewhere in Yorkshire who wants to have no more asylum centres, no more immigrants. They don’t want to see any more of the war crop. They don’t want to see any more rainbow flags and all of this shite. So their PM, their MP, is then held accountable by this. And imagine if you could have.

 

Woes: A.

 

Morgoth: System where you can then log on to the party who did this, and you log on to their website and you can see, as if it was based on Uber or something. You can see which politicians in the country are liars and which have actually done what they’re supposed to do. So what you’re talking about here is a decentralization of how we do politics in Britain. This may well be possible. I’ll leave it at that. I’m aware of an organization. I’m aware of something happening. It’s not all doom and gloom, but we will see. That could be a thing. That could be a thing.

 

Woes: One other thing that someone said about referendums is it depends, because I said it’s much less corruptible than party politics. And someone said, it depends who counts the votes. And this, unfortunately, gets to a very passionate issue about The Times we’re living. Would you trust any referendum or any election after America in 2020?

 

Morgoth: Yes. I think our system is okay. America is a special case. Our voters and I’ve seen them counting in our case, and it is like Jenny and Paul from down the road. They’re not political. They’re just putting it in the box. I don’t have a problem with our electoral system. The Americans. That’s their problem. Just in terms of how votes are counted here, it seems okay, except for the rotten boroughs in certain parts of London and whatnot, by and large, we’re okay with that. But this doesn’t account for the population itself being brainwashed. But the system that I was outlined before, of course, wouldn’t be ideological. The ideology would just be the consensus of the local area. So this is happening. It’s not all doom and gloom. All right, I’m going to leave you with a little bit of hope. But what I will say is beggars can’t be choosers. So we’ll bear that in mind as we go forward. But let’s just move on.

 

Woes: Okay. Dabi said the andor Leftist movie reviews remind me of Morgoth. What happened to youthful rebellion video andor yeah, absolutely.

 

Morgoth: Because we always have to place themselves in the rule of the pluto rebels fighting against the evil empire, even when literally Disney produced this. Disney, a multibillion dollar corporation of brainwashing and narrative control, produced a series about Marxist rebellion and living under a tyrannical regime, which was realist and decent enough and the Lefties are like, oh, God. This is literally life under fascism. And I’m thinking, no, fuck you. This is life under you are the empire. You are the bureaucrats that make people’s lives hell. You’re not these idealistic rebels. You are these dead, souled, horrible managerial civil servants who everybody dreads.

 

Woes: Yeah, I agree. All right. Fred Adel, chair, says, I often wonder how a man like Morgoth ended up working in factories when he really would be much better suited to teaching the classic literature or something else highbrow. Much like black pilled. He can make the banal seem interesting. And I could listen to him rambling for hours.

 

Morgoth: Well, I don’t know. I’m not that well schooled on classic literature, to be honest. I’ve read a lot more Victorian novels. I don’t know what you mean by classical. Assume it’s the Greeks. I haven’t read much of that. I’ve read a fair few of the old Victorian novels. I began reading because when I worked in a factory, I crushed me one of my fingers. And it did just, like, kind of splatted. And I was off work for weeks and weeks and weeks. And as I mentioned earlier, my grandfather, I was an influence, and he was very knowledgeable. And I was off work with not much to do. I didn’t want to watch daytime television, so there was books lying around the house. And it began with Treasure Island, I remember, and I really enjoyed it. I would have been, like, in the late teens. And then I discovered Charles Dickens The Pick with papers, which I just thought was wonderful. It was just such good fun. It was Dickens first novel. And then I moved on because there’s a connection between the this is where things get deep. Because I realized when I read the blurb at the front of the introduction that there’s The Pickwick Papers which is the story of Mr. Pickwick having adventures in Victorian England early Victorian England, actually. And then it’s connected and discovered to Don Quixote, which which is an even older novel. Don Quixote is like sort of in the 15 hundreds. And then you get this the idea of Don Quixote is that you get this knight, this Spanish well, he’s a Spanish sort of petty landlord. He’s nothing special, but he is sort of enchanted by the ideas of chivalry and being a knight. And he wants to go out into the world. And he has this idea of a princess. It’s famous because of the windmills that he wants to fight. He thinks they’re dragons. Actually, when you look back at Don Quirodi, it has this kind of magical aura to it. Cervantes, who wrote it, actually fought in the sort of reconquisto of Spain, I think it was. But there’s something a little bit more sinister to Don quoted because what it’s doing is deconstructing romanticism. It’s deconstructing the age of chivalry. And so you get Sensual Pandas as the sidekick. And in it, there are scenes where, like, say, Don Quixote, he is on his horse, waxing lyrical about these high chivalry ideas. And it’s explicit that Sanctuary Panza is taking a big shit and it stinks and it wafts in the dolky with these kind of nostrils. This is all like, what, 4500 years old. What they’re doing is kind of postmodern because they’re already so many centuries ago. There’s already a kind of embryonic form of deconstructing. The idealism of what went before, don quotes. On the one hand, it’s wonderful. On the other hand, it’s deeply subversive. But when you get another novel, the third one, which is connected to this sort of weird trilogy and all of it, the theme is the good man. A good man in a bad world. And the third one, which really blew me away was Doskievsky’s the Idiot. And then it was just raw realism. Then it wasn’t the Whimsy of Don Quiori or Dickens, all the gentle kind of romanticism of Dickens and the Peculiar Papers, the Idiot of Doskievsky. Then you have somebody Prince I forgot his name, Alishkin or something. He comes back from being in a nuthouse in Switzerland, basically. And he’s dropped into the sort of Machiavellian intrigues of Russia and the new ability. And he’s this pure spirit and everybody’s corrupted. So you see that pattern again and again and again. And those three books were really sort of influential. And then I read Crime and Punishment by Doskarvsky, which is similar. And it’s where you have Raskolmakov endeavour. I did a great video on this, by the way, recently, and Raskolnikov adopts the frame of the utilitarian where you’ve got the very old. I think she’s jewish as well. And I think she’s a pawn broker and she’s the landlord of the flat. And Raskolnikov sort of runs this through that for the greater good. Which touches on the sort of running theme of the topic tonight. For the greater good of humanity. It would be better for humanity if he just killed this old hag of a pawnbroker. And he’s correct, actually. This is the thing. His argument is kind of correct that she is a parasite, she is horrible, she is greedy, she doesn’t care about anybody else. And so from a purely utilitarian perspective, it makes sense just to kind of murder the woman. And he does it in the novel, he does it. But he has to live with the consequences. He has to live with the guilt. And it’s straight away, like I say, it’s this scene we’ve touched on. Life isn’t as simple as a spreadsheet. It’s more complicated than that.

 

Woes: Yeah, obviously, this is a huge thing. We could talk about that. We could talk about the classics hours of conversation there. But I’m aware of the time. Incidentally, this is already the longest ever millennial stream we’ve been going for 5 hours, 20 minutes. But we will try to rush through these questions. Okay. Red Line says I’m sure at least one person in that bar, the pub that you’re telling people about I’m sure at least one person in there agreed with Morgoth. We have to normalize truth and we have to dare to be the first to speak truth. Within reason. Yes. In different situations, it is possible to speak the truth.

 

Morgoth: There would have definitely been somebody sitting there who thought, he’s right and these other people are scum. But the authority favoured the scum in that particular instance.

 

Woes: Yeah. Okay. Based Pagan says cracking good stream, lads, as always. What do you think is responsible for the massive decline in fertility throughout Western Europe and Japan? Sperm counts have halved since 73 and we have all noticed the huge increase of effeminate males and gays about these days. Is it by design? I wouldn’t be surprised. I mean, I don’t know how maybe fluoride in the water. I don’t know. Plastics, microplastics. I don’t know. It might be not. It might be have a very practical cause like that and yet not be by on purpose. It might not be by design. Or it could be by design.

 

Morgoth: Yeah.

 

Woes: I mean, it’s highly different. I don’t know.

 

Morgoth: It turns out that a lot of just nylon and plastics and everything damaged sperm counts and fertility in women. So I don’t think it’s by design. I think that’s just that it gets back to efficiency. I think if they can produce these products and mass they weren’t thinking that it would have any effect. Now, there’s other agendas which are specifically designed to reduce. In my view. If you look at the trans agenda people see that as being sort of a bit cringe and a bit kind of well, it’s this cookie out there thing. I actually just load that in with the more general White Genocide project. Because what you’re doing is there are places now in America where it’s like 30% of the schoolchildren are now registering as being transsexual or whatever. So even if they don’t go through, they don’t go through with the surgery, they don’t go on with the block. As what you’re seeing is this kind of disruption of the natural binary male female thing that’s happening regardless. So we can say that some of it is top down is what I’m getting at, and that’s top down. But when you bring in countries like not South Korea or Japan, the thing that they’ve all got in common is high technology. I think when you ask yourself, take it back to the most basic level. What is it that technology actually does? What is its function? What is its purpose? What technology does is make things easier. And we’ve been making things easier for a long, long time. Now. I know this sounds all a bit kind of old fashioned and whatnot, but let’s just say you lived 500 years ago. You’ve got your little house, you chopped down your own lumber. You’re out in the field doing heavy graft for 48 hours a day, or you’re a blacksmith. Whatever it is, you work hard. Physical labour. When you come home of an evening, who is going to be the most virile? That man or the man who has spent his last five years behind the checkout in the supermarket scanning barcodes for that ship? It’s both. Just how we live. Just that we live in a world which has been made too easy, which masculates men. But at the same time, there’s also just the poisons and the toxins that are sleeping into our systems because of all of the plastic and all of the junk.

 

Woes: Yeah, I think another cause might be culture, that it rewards low that behaviour. It even rewards low that attitudes. So I don’t know. But I suspect that there’s something in that. I suspect that does have a physiological effect eventually. Basically, masculinity is just not rewarded. Then also, things that would increase their social competition, for example. Well, nowadays you compete to be the most to be less masculine, if anything. But I think boys in school especially are discouraged from things that probably would have increased their testosterone in generations past. I just wouldn’t be surprised if there are cultural factors in this that eventually have a physiological effect. That’s all I’ll say about that. And I’m certainly not an expert. I just find it plausible. Okay. Tulther says, best millennial ever. Some great guests. Thank you very much. There could have been room for some more and old and new guests. Leather Apron Club, the German Pointer, American Crogan Endeavor. Some of them have already appeared previously. Keep asking for the support. These podcasts are entertaining and important. Well, thank you very much. People can find the link to donate it’s in the description and the video description. We’d appreciate that very much. Super chats. I should have said this at the start of every stream, but I didn’t want to waste people’s time. They can be sent by entropy or the Orthodoxy hyperchats or my own Telegram bot, but anyway, it’s a bit late in the day for that now, so I will get through these others. Empty Vessel says double think is a real thing. That was when we were at the start. We’re talking about that baron of Darth Sonian. Does Woze read this chat or do people send money via entropy? Both. Thank you. Judy says Happy New Year. Thank you. Happy New Year, Judy. Charlie says have this. Thank you, orthodoxy. We’ve done that one. That one. Okay. I think we’ve got through most of these. Oh, Darcinian says I’m going to sit back now, sipping my cozy Johnny Walker. I’ve been waiting for this stream for weeks. Mary yule tide. And Happy New Year to Colin and Morgue. Well, thank you very much and that’s a very generous donation you’ve made there, so that’s much appreciated and I hope you’ve enjoyed the stream. Lady of shalot says many modern men are the products of feminism, bad parenting and government schooling. I got involved in helping a victim of the rape gangs when I lived in Yorkshire. I was horrified to find those with the least empathy were often White English men. They have no in group preference whatsoever. Well, this is a depressing point, but I think it again, I find this plausible. Morgoth, what would you say about this?

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I remember there was somebody that became a bit of a meme, but what was he called? Joe. Joe something. Joe Owens? Yes. And on YouTube. And he was a good guy. He was one of us. But he was warning his point on the grooming gang issue. And he said this repeatedly across videos. And I know that people have like a kind of he became a meme and people like him and whatnot, but he did say repeatedly that at the end of the day, these girls are just White trash and nobody cares about them. And I just don’t accept that at all. I feel that I don’t get to pick and choose which of my people I want to speak out for and which that I don’t is a girl in Rotherham. Because I think that’s what really who I know she’s a lovely person. That’s where that’s coming from. It’s this idea that the English girls it’s also not actually true entirely, but I get it. It’s like they are underclass, they are from broken homes, but look, they are still even the broken homes, even the idea that their families fell apart and they are just wandering the streets to be picked up and prayed upon.

 

Woes: Awful. This is disgusting. Sorry to interrupt. I know you’re in the middle of something there, but this idea that, well, they’re underclass, so they’re in our ethnic group, but they’re underclass, so who cares? I find that fucking disgusting.

 

Morgoth: You won’t get traction if you are going to advance native interests. These girls were White trash. Even the language is wrong. Even the language comes from America. We don’t have White trash in Britain. We have an underclass. We have charged we’ve got our problems with certain parts of the working class White population. That’s true. We don’t call them White trash, and we fucking certainly don’t call the victims of rape gangs White trash.

 

Woes: Absolutely not.

 

[5:30:21]

 

Morgoth: And even even the fact that their families have been dissolved. There’s all of these problems. Maybe it’s a single mother household. They can’t keep ahold of them. They can’t control them. They’re wandering that, you know, you’ve got 15 year old girls wandering these gloomy streets of post industrial England, and they’re being picked up and they’re being abused horribly. I don’t accept that they says, well, certain group of people we can write a fuck that. No, it doesn’t work like that it’s the same sort of thing with the vaccine. The vaccine thing as well. No, the lib Todd took the facts. These are all our group. And what you have to do is stand above it and judge the entire system and all of the little cogs and all the constituent parts which brought this shit show upon us. I absolutely don’t accept that we can conveniently say because the rationale behind it was that this isn’t a vote winner. You won’t win votes because, well, people see them as just being trashy young girls.

 

Woes: Well, see, that the only reason that’s not a vote winner is 50 years of indoctrination. You know, if you’d said to the British public in 1920, these foreigners are raping our women, our girls, what should we do? I mean, do you want to vote in a party that would that would deport these foreigners who are there is no question that the British public would say, absolutely, you’ve got my vote. Do it. The only reason there’s not a fucking vote winner now is that we’ve been so thoroughly subverted, it should be a fucking vote winner.

 

Morgoth: I took so much shit for standing against the vaccine, and it was the exact same principles as what I’ve always spoken out about the grooming gangs. I’ve always spoken out about that. And it was the same core principle. Why I spoke out against the vaccine was because I want to defend my own people, my own group from harm, from elsewhere. And I’m sorry if that doesn’t accord with your ideology of being authority or that it’s some kind of distraction about talking about jews. Well, I’m not sorry. Fuck that it’s a core principle to say, I defend my people. I’ll defend them when it’s the grooming gangs. I’ll defend working class girls when they’re charged. And I’ll look into why are they actually wandering the streets in the middle of the night at 15 year old? What is the social circumstances which brought that about? Is it in the EU liberal system? And I’ll absolutely not throw them under the bus. In the same way, when the government decides to pump my people full of fucking shite with these injections, I’m not going to abandon them then either. And I resent the fuck out of the fact that I was cast as some kind of conspiracy theorist for upholding a core value of what we stand for. I really do.

 

Woes: Yeah, I can tell. And I feel the same way. I mean, if you’re not going to stand up for your people when they’re being threatened, when they’re being harmed, then what the fuck are you doing?

 

Morgoth: Because it’s inconvenient, because it’s distracting. What the fuck is this? What do we stand for if not for the protection of our people?

 

Woes: Yeah, I agree. One other point I would make about this matter, the grooming gangs, the girls are Chabs, a lot of them. First of all, as you said, it’s not actually all of them who are underclass that’s come to light more recently, but also even if they were all the underclass. Well, so far, first of all, there’s the ethnic loyalty thing. They’re my group. I’m going to feel, and I do feel some connection to them, even though I probably have fuck all in common with them. They’re probably very different people from me. They’re still my kind. They’re still my ethnic group. So I’m going to feel attached to them. I’m going to feel responsible for them. That’s the most natural fucking thing in the world that’s on an individual level, on a collective level, it’s still sensible to care about this because, okay, so this foreign ethnic group is harming your ethnic group, but it’s only harming this one section. Well, then but that’s the means by which it begins to corrode your entire ethnic group. First it colonizes that class, then it will move up in the social ladder. And that’s exactly what has happened. As we now know, there are middle class girls getting victimized by this. So you thought that writing them off as Chavez would somehow save you? Well, it doesn’t in the end. And actually, a similar principle is involved with this idea that, well, we should just deport the refugees to France, let French a deal with it, fuck off, because then that just keeps them in Europe. And then you get into this ridiculous situation where different White peoples are.

 

Morgoth: Sort.

 

Woes: Of trading this as like the musical chairs, where you’re going to be the one who ends up with the refugees. Ha. Fucking hell. I mean, this is ridiculous. What I hate about petty nationalism so we’re going to end up with these vast numbers of people in our continent, in our midst, in our gene pool, but at least it’s the French, or at least it’s the Germans, you fucking retard.

 

Morgoth: Yeah.

 

Woes: All right, I’ll calm down and move to the next question. It’s so disgusting. Hold on a second. All right, let’s see. Sorry, I’m going to have to find my place again. Sorry about this. Okay, I might as well play the thing again while people wait. It’ll be about a minute. It’s a difficult thing to do, actually, to make people aware of all of the information that they could be aware of to do with millennial. For example, the NFT people might not know that there is an NFT this year. There was an NFT last year, and I thought, okay, this could become a regular thing, because at that time, NFTs could just become a thing and they were selling for a lot of money. So I thought it’s worth getting it all this work into trying to make it something pleasant and nice. Because I do like the idea that there’s this commemoration, there’s this thing that somebody can own, and it is the NMC of millennial that year, and it’s only one of this sort of undulating same glass animation similar to last year. And it works the same way. You can hover the mouse over it, react. I just think there’s something special about it. The NFT is unique. Only one person can own it. And I think that’s nice.

 

So that’s why I do it. Is Morgoth back yet? I don’t know if he is. Oh, I don’t think he is. Well, I’ll just find my place in this list of superchance and all right, I’m back now. Oh, hi. Hi. How are you doing?

 

Morgoth: I was just thinking that NFT advert is going to be sort of that’ll become known as the Morgoth pissed up.

 

Woes: Well, there are worse ways that could be remembered. All right, let’s see. God almighty, there have been so many. Okay, here’s one. I think I’ve found the place. Lady of shallot asked, has Morgoth ever thought of reviewing the classic 90s drama series our Friends in the north? I remember that it has recently been made available again on the BBC iplayer as part of their anniversary. I watched it back in the rewatched it again recently. I’d love Morgoth taking the series. Many thanks.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I get this a lot. Yeah, it’s one of those things that I always want to do. I did do like, a 20 minutes video on Whatever Happened to the lately lads, and again, it’s one of those things that I’m quite proud of, which you can find on the archive on YouTube. But the problem with Our Friends in the north is like, it’s 10 hours, and I’ve never approached anything of that scale before. I don’t know. It’s one thing if you look at Whatever Happened to the Lakeviews, or I could do, say, get Carter or VDC and Pet, that would be one thing. But Our Friends in the north take multiple characters across three decades from the 1960s to the 1990s, and it encompasses not just the Northeast. If you follow Daniel Creek’s character, his whole arc is, like, down in London and becoming a kind of Gangstand and being involved in the underground and the nightclub scene, and you’ve got the politics of the high rises going up in the northeast and there’s so much to it that I’ve kind of been intimidated just by the scale of the project. Another problem with really big projects is.

 

Woes: That.

 

Morgoth: What happens is if you’re a content creator, I produce a lot of content, but there’s a kind of, say, a thousand word article and I’ll turn it into a video or whatnot. But if you’re actually going to sort of get into something which is really massive, you’re really busy on the back end, but let’s say on the front end, which is, say, what people want to see the audience, it looks as if you’ve just disappeared for, like, three weeks and say, well, what’s he doing? What’s going on here? Is there any content coming? And there’s a fine line. It’s that difficult. It’s a very fine line to get that right. So if I was to embark on our friends in the north, it would probably have to be I would do video. I’ve already tested that. The actual footage I can get away with using on YouTube, like I did with the likely large video. I can use actual footage and it doesn’t get picked up for copyright. I’ve done my test, but just the scale of the project would be massive, and it would mean that I’ve kind of been quiet for a while. For one project, one thing that you.

 

Woes: Could do is approach it as a quick 15 minutes video about each episode.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, that’s true as. Well, I mean, I’ve already got alluded to it from Tablet Tame, but I already actually do have a very big project that I’m working on behind the scenes, which I’ll load with, but I don’t get into details because I don’t want the pressure of actually revealing what it is. But, yeah, there’s things going on behind the scenes in terms of projects and stuff.

 

Woes: Yeah. Okay. Defiant Irishman says Morgoth is the man with the two of you ever consider doing a Collins show in the future? I’ve never done that. Well, I did the Hangouts back in the day. They can be very chaotic, and there’s no way to well, as far as I know, there’s no way to vet someone before they come on. You could get someone who just comes on and splatters fucking nuts, insane stuff. I don’t know. It’s a risky thing to venture into. Morgoth, what do you think?

 

Morgoth: I’m not a big live streamer, so if that kind of thing was to happen, I would kind of just let wars deal with all of this. Kind of its weird because when you look at my content, this is obviously a giant extra super sized live stream tonight. But in the course of my normal content, I don’t do very many live streams. I’m not a big live streamer. I pop up here and there on other people’s. But I do my classic movies with Endeavor. But by and large, it’s not my thing. I tend not to like it. I tend not like spontaneity. Even my YouTube videos are scripted and thought out. And even if it’s an off the cuff thing, they’ll tend to be like some bullet points of what I want to say. That’s my preferred kind of content. It’s not that often that I actually just freewheel it. So if that kind of thing was to happen, I would pass over the managerialism entirely. The wars.

 

Woes: Okay, all right. Orthodoxy says what’s? Morgoth’s favourite pub grub and paint.

 

Morgoth: I tend to just like the fish and chips, to be honest. I mentioned earlier when I was talking about the Lefty, I do have a weakness for Leo and I’m very well aware of the pretentiousness to it. But I do like it. It does taste nice. This is the problem. You can laugh at hipster. They’ve got these ridiculous real ales, but they are nice. They are really nice to drink.

 

Woes: I’ve said this myself about hipster stuff like hipster food, for example. It’s bloody good food. I’m sorry, it just is. And I also like the decor in a lot of places. I remember when I was doing a lot of traveling in Europe, 20, 17, 18, you’d go to these platelet bars and cafes. It was really nice in Amsterdam and that kind of thing. And they really put a lot of effort in. Yes, as much as you can say it’s middle class, pretentiousness and indulgence and whatever. And they’re stupid liberals. Well, of course they are, but they’re doing what White people always do and they’re being innovative and they’re caring about things, especially the women. They put a lot of effort into making a place nice and it’s like, well, why not enjoy that? To some extent, hipsters get a bad rap because, yes, they’re a bunch of wankers and yes, they’re liberals, but in a sense I just see them doing what White people do and doing it really well.

 

So I think it’s kind of a shame.

 

Morgoth: Some of its ridiculous where you get stouts and there’s like marshmallow in because it has special head on items. You’ve got like a basic kind of nutty real ill ruby, real ill. Which you drink it and you just think, my God, that’s a good beer. That’s one hell of a good beer. But yeah, the problem is you get all the wank that comes along with it.

 

Woes: What occurs to me is that if we do enter a period of economic stagnation and people are struggling and all that, the hipster is going to be a thing of the past. I mean, you’re just not going to be able to sustain that it’s a culture that’s very much built upon luxury. There is not going to be the hipster. There’s no place for the hipster in grim, dark nationalism, as you once said.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, that’s true, but I’ve brewed my own beer. One of the reasons why well, yeah.

 

Woes: You could have home brewing stuff, but then it’s not going to be hipster. It’s not going to be that sort of middle class genteel thing. It’s fashioned.

 

Morgoth: You’d be surprised that a lot of the real that you see in these kind of pretentious places, they come from micro breweries, and there’s really not much difference between a micro brewery and real brewing it at home. I’ve made batch after batch at home, not with the actual raw ingredients. I use the tin, but I brewed it in a bin and they all got into it from doing that. It isn’t that much of a leap. The only difference is that they use the wrong gradients. And then what they did was to kind of funny about a bit with what goes with what even. I made the Tom Claxton basic relief and I put in ana seed. I also made keg after keg of stout, and I would put in licorice just so it offset the bitterness a little bit. And that’s all they’ve done, really. It’s a bit more sophisticated. But let’s get on because this is a booking six hour stream here.

 

Woes: Okay, universal sent in this one. Merry Christmas. WOZN, Morgoth. You are the two comfortable content creators on Earth, in my opinion. And I loved the epic Christmas Carol in your latest video. Morgoth, my question for you both is why do you think New York, London and Israel had the most extreme lockdowns and vaccine mandates, given who lives there? New York, London and Israel. And that in New York and Melbourne, the globalist community was directly named and targeted for not following the Covid measures? On a lighter note, would you rather give up paint or rewatching first blood for the rest of your life? Happy yell tie to you all and a good night. Well, thank you very much, Universal. So, first of all, would you rather give up paints or rewatching first blood? Crystal, maybe?

 

Morgoth: Well, I’ll give up paints and switch to whiskey or wine or something, and then at least still watch I’ll cheat and still watch this blood.

 

Woes: Okay, all right. And then the other one is, why do you think New York, London and Israel had the most extreme lockdowns and vaccine mandates? And when that community was named for not following the covered measures in New York and Melbourne, I don’t think I morgoth: Wasn’T aware that New York, London, Israel had the most extreme lockdowns, to be honest. Certainly not compared to places well, New York might have done. New York was pretty extreme. But then was it more extreme than Los Angeles? Canada was extreme.

 

Woes: Australia, Austria, Germany.

 

Morgoth: Really, I was absolutely insane in terms. Of just how draconian the lockdowns were. Britain in general as well as London, it wasn’t that extreme, but there were more extreme places.

 

Woes: Oh yeah.

 

Morgoth: To be fair, New York did seem to be quite draconian, but it isn’t that bad. Israel did seem to be have quite some severe lockdowns and they were also mad on the backs.

 

Woes: Yeah. Weren’t they the first country that suggested the fourth like a second booster?

 

Morgoth: Yeah. This opens up a whole other kind of worms, to be honest.

 

Woes: Oh God, that’s not but I think the guy has answered his own question that that group made a floated rules and thus made it from the point of view of the authority, has made it essential to introduce mandates.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I understand where he’s going there. Israel was draconian. The real question I suppose is why was Israel more draconian than everywhere? But I’m not even sure if that’s the case either because Australia, I mean, lady of Sherlock can testify, was the most insane of anywhere. These kind of discrepancies, they pop up because you’re looking for kind of an outlier, as if that group is somehow getting overly influential or conversely, getting special treatment. But what if they are just in the grid along with the rest of us? And I don’t mean the elites of them, I don’t mean the big hitters, I don’t mean the Deep State, I mean the mass of that people themselves. Because when you actually dig into the history of the technocracy, there is a problem. And then the problem is an AA alluded to this as well is exceptionalism or universalism. Now, we are used to thinking of things in terms of sort of well, they are enforcing universalism on us. What happens if we are actually the universalists and they want exceptional sort of special dispensations? Well, if you then look at a certain if you look at the World Health Organization, do they then give special treatment to people? If the World Health Organization and it’s doing this, by the way, it’s kind of bringing all of these treaties in and it’s trying to formalize where the World Health Organization can just declare a global pandemic, or a local pandemic. And then because the treaties have been saying the power is now in the hands of World Health Organization, they can say, well, okay, this particular part of the world is now on lockdown and everybody has to be vaccinated within 60 days. That’s the policy. And the local government, wherever it happens to be, has no say in this. Nothing. So under that system, where is the special dispensation of that group? Can they get out of that?

 

Woes: Yeah, I mean their own ideology or their own creed has swallowed them up at that point. They’re involved in it as well. There’s no way for them to get out. This is the thing. It also relates to their rates of marrying out as well because they have been preaching a lot of their leading voices have been preaching that everyone should marry out and race mix and whatever. Then how can they stop that happening to the Romeo? I mean, eventually it will become quite difficult. All right, let’s move on. This is orthodoxy. Does Morgoth endorse? Pox populized thought that nationalists should get behind religional and marginal nations Scotland, Wales, Cornwall, Catalonia, et cetera, in the hope that they could become base holdouts against global homo.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I do in theory. But in practice what you see is that Scotland is more global homo than England.

 

Woes: Yes.

 

Morgoth: So in practice what happens is that the small nations like that just become clients of power.

 

Woes: Exactly. Global home gets there first. That’s the thing. It gets there first, takes them over because they’re easy. I mean, look at Ireland. It’s fucked in the space of 1020 years.

 

Morgoth: So in theory, yes, I absolutely do in practice from some of the realist perspective is that when you are a small power, a larger power in this case in regards to Scotland or Ireland, it will be the European Union and then behind that you go back to American Deep State. But in theory, yes, absolutely, that is just localism. Absolutely. But in practice what it means is that you will go cap in hand to the next big power and you also run into problems just in terms of logistics and where your food is coming from and this kind of thing. So once again, the localist argument is valid and it’s sound, but you have to accept that there will be costs, that you will no longer get all of the goodies anymore, which Neoliberalism has to provide. If you look at Northern Ireland, how many lambs, how much actual produce, does Northern Ireland can itself sustain itself? Now in that particular case, quite well, actually. Whether these provinces and the Catalan can and these little breakaway places may well be that all you end up with is wine in this situation if you’re going to go all the way on this. But what I’m saying is that’s actually okay, especially when you’ve got sea, you’ve got seafood and yeah, I’m for that, but I’m very conscious of the fact that so many of these tiny little statelets will just end up being like little pincers, like little kind of claws of global humour. All of power, basically.

 

Woes: Yes, definitely. Base Pagan says bet I’d have left field Morgoth, but being an avid viewer of fellow Jordy, the Jolly Weaver, I was curious as to whether you have ever seen a ghost or other auditing.

 

Morgoth: No, I haven’t. I’ve been spooked a few times, but no, basically I’ve never seen anything supernatural. I could kind of go off on a tangent of about as I can on pretty much everything, but it’s like 6 hours into the stream and I’m.

 

Woes: Just okay, all right. Pebble in the pond. Generous the nation. Thank you very much. Wonderful millennial lineup. I am so happy I was able to catch Morgoth’s appearance live. Happy you and New Year to you both. Well, thank you very much. Pebble in the pond. That’s much appreciated. Okay. Kulu says, do you think the recent economic collapse in Europe will be helpful in slowing these nefarious plans, as they may need more support even from us, to keep it all together? Well, this is kind of related to the idea that they’re importing the Africans in order to be a police force. I think they’ve already got the infrastructure they need. I don’t think they need support from the Africans. I don’t think they need support from us. I think at least they feel that they can sustain this indefinitely, especially with the surveillance technology that we were talking about earlier. Morgoth, do you want to comment on that?

 

[6:01:00]

 

Morgoth: I don’t really understand the Africans are.

 

Woes: Going to no, I brought that into it. The question is, do you think the recent economic collapse in Europe will be helpful in slowing these nefarious plans, as they may need more support even from us, to keep it all together?

 

Morgoth: No, I don’t because they’ve already got the opening call of the grey reset. So the idea is that we transition. And this is a word that you hear a lot these days. Another one of the words, those words is transition. We transition into just a different kind of society. So whether or not it’s because Putin invades Ukraine, or whether or not it’s because climate change agenda and all of the rest of it, the future has already been marked out. They know where we are going. It’s not like they are uncertain and it’s not like the division of the future is kind of a surprise. Oh no, look at this. The civilization has hit these hard rocks and now we’re going to have to like rejig everything. No, that’s already being mapped out. That’s solid. They know what’s coming. They’ve already built in. It’s already baked into the cake what things will be like in the future. The question is a fundamental one, and it’s that we reject the entire premise of this vision. The difficult part is that when you go back because what it is is the utilitarianism, this technocracy, and it’s what is the alternative vision to that? And the alternative vision to that has to be something which is again, you have to go back to sort of localism because at the end of the day, you have to say, well, we want to live an authentic life. We want you away from us. It’s a reactionary frame. But beyond that you get help from people like C. S. Lewis, who instead of the mathematical spreadsheet calculation had on the world. And this actually leads you back to a more religious view, metaphysical view of the world is that the world and the people in it have value in and of themselves and that there’s an intrinsic beauty of things which we don’t have to explain, we can’t experience. It is what it is. And to be fair, it is also universalist. But it is absolutely not this kind of dry utilitarianism what they haven’t made.

 

Woes: Yeah, okay. Lady of Shallot, the online harms Bill will further extend the reach of the state as it will force yet more self censorship. The Bill is being pushed by the dad of Molly Russell, a girl who killed herself after online abuse. Her father is deflecting his own guilt. He gave a child a smartphone, a recipe for disaster. Well, the online harmsville has been brought in under the pretence of protecting children from online abuse, but that’s the least of it. I mean, it’s clearly another instrument by which they will reduce the freedom of speech of the general public. Protecting children I think is I don’t think they really give a shit. I mean, look at again, just look at Rotherham for fuck’s sake.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, I don’t believe that for a second. I think what happened to that girl seems to be horrible. I don’t want to take that away from the family but they are being used by the system in the same way. Just oil or what’s the other one? Extinction, revolution or rebellion? All of these what’s happened is a legitimate problem has been astrotiffed in order to push through what power wants. And what power wants is the ability to sense for things like this stream. And what they’re going to do in reality is fear that Odyssey is a problem because it hosts conversations like this and this is sort of against this and that and that and the other protocol of the online harmless bill. What we have spoken about tonight is an online harm and so honestly has to stump up and give I think it’s a 10% of its revenue for the year to the British government. Or it censors like this conversation. That’s what it’s about.

 

Woes: Yeah, there’s fucking grotesque. Anyway, you can imagine what we would both say about that if we were to continue the rant. So I’ll just move forward to the next one. Henchwood says to all the people asking but what can we do if you can’t cancel your TV licence, you’re part of the problem. That’s a definite. Well, I don’t want to encourage any illegal behaviour certainly, but if you don’t have a TV and if they can’t prove you whatever, then you don’t need to pay your TV licence. I mean it’s very again, I’m certainly not encouraging anyone to break the law, but the TV licensing vans, the detector vans and all that, it’s all bullshit.

 

Morgoth: Yeah, that’s all shit. I got took the court years ago at my worst possible time when I was already living in absolute poverty. I’ve still never paid it. I’ve still never ever paid the licence fee. Well, when I was living with a certain lady and we did then because we were settling down and we wanted everything to be neat and tidy, but since then, I just don’t pay it. And I get letters. I just immediately throw them in the bin. The only thing you’ve got to take care of is that well, to be fair, they don’t even knock on the door anymore. But they did used to. Yeah. I’ve had Or Lanes with it, but for God’s sake, don’t pay the licence fee.

 

Woes: Yeah. And the other thing is, just don’t have a TV. I haven’t had one for nearly six years now, I guess. And even before then, I think it wasn’t really working, the one at home. So I honestly can’t remember that it’s been a long time since I had a TV, and I don’t miss it in the slightest. So, honestly, just get rid of it. Eliminates the vulnerability, and you just don’t need it. It’s shit. It’s fucking poison. All right, Lady Of shallot. Thank you again, lady of Shalt. What does Morgoth think of Andrew Tate? 2022 was a big year for him. He has a huge following amongst young men and makes some valid points about the damage caused by feminism. I am suspicious of his recent conversion to Islam. I’m curious as to what Morgoth makes of him. Happy New Year to you all. Well, thank you very much, lady of shalot.

 

Morgoth: Actually, I don’t know the name popped up this year, but you see this name pop open and everybody it’s the new thing. It’s the new buzz, and I’m just not interested today. I saw the thing that happened with Greta Thunberg, and I just thought he looked like an awesome. Obviously, it goes without saying that we’ve spoken to who all night about this technocracy about Agenda 2030. I absolutely get Greta Thunberg’s position and sort of useful idiot rule in all of that, even if she doesn’t sort of understand herself. So it’s not like I’m on her side. But just when I went off looking at what happened, I thought he did look kind of look like a bit of a dick. I’ve seen other clips where he was on Piers Morgan and he was talking about Covid and things, and it seemed kind of okay. He was against the narrative, and I thought I was okay. But what I dislike is if you look up this idea, I think the idea but now muscularity has become an identity. And it wasn’t it didn’t used to be. People will be surprised at that, but it was just something that you naturally did. It was just like you were just a man and you didn’t have to think about it. You didn’t have to step outside of yourself and think about yourself from that way. And to be honest, I still don’t. But, like, what what’s happened is is that you get this kind of postmodern representation of masculinity. And and what that amounts to is the picture that I put on a Telegram, which lost me another, like, 20 followers or something. Andrew Tate is there and he’s giving his refutation of Greta Thunberg, but he’s got this, like, ridiculously big cigar. He’s wearing a dressing gown. He’s got all these sports cars. That’s not actually a masculine thing. What it is is a sort of postmodern interpretation of what Masculinity is so you enter into this kind of borderline realm of replicas. Of replicas of replicas. So what Andrew Tate is, his idea that the masculine that he’s presenting back to all these young men is sort of a copy of a James Bond villain from the 1970s because that means independence and power. But it’s purely sort of its just if you go back to borderland and you see the replica of a replica of the real. So first you start off with looking. You’ve caught a fish and it’s on the boat. And then the fish gets turned into a factory produce and it’s sort of fish chunks, a could, let’s say. And then it goes from basic could chunks and it gets processed and it becomes fish fingers. And then the fish fingers themselves become a package. And what you see is the package of the fish fingers. And then you see the logo on the logo itself will change. And eventually what you’ve got is something which no longer has anything to do with the actual could, which has been brought in by the fishermen. Instead, what you’ve got is something which is entirely a product. And what they will do is put on the label. They will have a kind of cartoon version of a fish or something. And the point there is that, okay, so you’ve got the could, which is caught, which is real, by the fisherman. The second step is the could is diced, it becomes meat chunks. And then eventually the process goes on until eventually all you’ve got is a little cardboard box with a smiley little kind of face on it. Or like the bird’s eye fisherman with his bushy beard or whatever, I think even to a woman. But, I mean, this is what sort of Andrew Tate’s version of masculinity is. It’s become a kind of product to be commodified and kind of sold back to everybody with a subscription. It’s the package with a smiley face on it rather than the actual could being landed by a fisherman, if, you know what I mean.

 

Woes: Yes, I do, but it’s definitely not the answer that I was expecting. Just a bizarre place to end up after asking you about Andrew Tate. But, yeah, I understand what you’re saying, and it’s a very good answer. All right, Harry asks, I’m a climate refugee. Can I get a free hotel room? It’s fucking raining all the time. Slight introduction of levity there. Thank you for that, Harry Darby. I wish more young men my age were watching Morgoth’s review instead of shit like Andrew Tate. Hope you guys had a Merry Christmas. Thanks for everything you do well, thank you very much, Darby, and I think that Morgoth will agree with you. Irish Rose gives a smiley face. And thank you very much. Very kind. Orthodoxy given Morgoth has spoken about the increasing mask of totalitarianism of our elites. Will democracy be decommissioned at some point or will it remain given that it provides a convenient facade?

 

Morgoth: Well, this is the problem. This is a good question. This is why I talk a lot about self at me, because I want what we have is just power. This is a good question and it’s a shame that it’s too late. But basically they’re going to try and wear that mask for as long as possible because it’s convenient, because they’re never held to account, because they have no ideology. There is not a specific set of ideals. What you have is just oligarchic power, wearing the mask of liberal democracy, but in doing anything they want. I mean, I touched on this earlier. If you got a time machine, you go back 1980, they wouldn’t have a clue what we were living in now, and yet the name is the same. If you think of Putin’s Russia and say Communist Russia, that is a bigger change than what we’ve gone through since 1980. It’s absolutely a completely different system. It’s a completely different way of life. But we call it the same thing. And they won’t own up to it because they don’t have to. Because when you lay your cards on the table and you say, well, actually okay, so this is what it’s about. We are implementing this sort of panopticon utilitarian system of race blindness where you White British just happen to be the natives on this now sort of zone of land that we want to Tara form. You’re just kind of in the way because that’s what they’re doing. Then it becomes difficult because they’ve come out and said it and so they just won’t. And so everybody just thinks we’re still living under a liberal democracy. I mean, if you look at like man of Steel when General Zod brings in the terraforming machines because they want to turn Earth into the planet Krypton, I think there’s like three of them, these giant claw kind of machines, and they just land. They just come down from the orbit and they just plough the Earth and all of a sudden they just start pummeling the Earth. They just bashing it to bits and the gravity gets shot at pieces. The ecology, everything is just being annihilated because they’re terraforming it. They’re turning into something else. That’s where we are now. That’s why it feels weird and disorienting.

 

Woes: Certainly is. All right, as Whitneyard says, as always, Morgoth is the finest end of level boss for this year’s millennial. Thank you to Woes for all your hard work and the guest whom you have hosted this year. Thanks also to Morgoth for doing what he does best for closing the year. Let’s hope 2023 is less gay. Well, thank you very much. Whityard. Okay. Golden AGEman LibGen rs is the best source for books. Can find almost everything on there. I also download and save locally and have paper copies of important ones. Well, this is to do with preserving things in the age when online material can simply get deleted. So, as good advice, there noticer in chief says, you’ve both been extremely helpful to all of us. Thank you. Especially given the added pressures we’ve faced in recent times. Thank you both. That’s a nice comment. Then Irish nationalist media says, thank you both for everything you have done. Our movement has grown and matured so much in the past eight years. We have had bad moments, like the beginning of censorship and Hate Speech laws, but this was a desperate response to our rise, and it is desperation and will not stop us. We will not be replaced. I fucking dearly hope that you’re right, and thank you for the encouraging comments there. Irish nationalist media. All right. Defiant Irishman. Listening to me and my boss talk about the Roma gypsies who moved into our town must be like listening to an episode of TDs. I can believe you. The Irish are surprisingly open and forthright about immigration, but diversity, but especially about the Roma gypsies. It’s a weird thing where the Roman gypsies seem to be the one group that everyone is openly allowed to hate. It’s a strange thing. I don’t really I’m guessing that will be clamped down on, but at the same time, it doesn’t really matter, does it? Because they’re not part of the program, really. All right, Dharma initiate question for Morgoth and Woes. Is there anything you’re looking forward to seeing in the new year? I’m looking forward to summer. I never used to like summer, but I do know I really like the second half of the year from the height of summer. I don’t like spring, but I like the other seasons from the height of the summer to Autumn and then to the darkness of winter. I really like that. So I’m looking forward to that. In the meantime, I’m looking forward to returning to creative writing because I find that very rewarding and a lease of new life for me this year. When I started that, I’ve not done it at all for the last six months. First because I was working on the Gram, then because I was working on Millennial for the last three months. So I’m really looking forward to returning to that. Margolf, is there anything you’re looking forward to in 2023?

 

Morgoth: Yeah, it’s quite a bit. I mean, I’ve got some personal things which I won’t get into, which I’m happy about and the way things are going, but even just more basic. You said, I’m looking for a summer. That’s nice. Yeah, I’m looking for a spring we already passed. It was on the 22nd. The nights are already getting later again, like right now. So when you think about it.

 

Woes: That’s.

 

Morgoth: Actually a good thing. We used to be disconnected entirely. Alistad used to be completely oblivious to these kinds of things, but I do notice them now. And it’s another thing that I write about quite a bit on the substac. I did sort of a recent article about just winter, about the symbolism of winter from the civilizational perspective, but how that kind of intersects with winter itself, where time freezes you’re at the end of a cycle. And when you are at the end of a cycle, it’s related to what we were talking about earlier of the centrist Caesarism where politics has died. There’s no new roots being born anymore. You are in this kind of frost covered, cultivated landscape. It’s funny because I wrote that when it was like literally snow on the ground and frozen, and it didn’t take long until we just went back to being dumped and cooled again. But whatever, the point is well made and it’s already getting late again and I’m looking forward to go fishing, which is what I want to do. I just enjoy being outdoors and I’ve got some projects which I’m working on behind the scenes, which I really want to get finished this year. So, yeah, there’s lots of good stuff. And for the Diehard sort of Morga fans, henry Cavill is going to be in a War Hummer movie.

 

So that’s going to be something to talk about as well. For the nerd escapism, because it’s weird, because the people who like my content and what I can do, they do get this kind of whiplash effect where it’s like, on the one hand, I’m going to do a sort of deep dive into the technography centrist Caesarism and the winter of civilization, but then it would be like, oh, look at this. I’m going to do, like, let’s do a video on Warhammer. But it does actually all kind of mop up. I think War Humbling is good symbolism for chaos. Chaos is the evil. We hate chaos.

 

Woes: Yes, we certainly do. Okay. Privileged lord asks have was or Margot read the aura. Linda book. Well, no, I haven’t, Morgoth.

 

Morgoth: No, I don’t know what it is.

 

Woes: Okay, sorry about that. And it was mentioned in an earlier stream, but I forgot which one it was. It wasn’t the bizarre guys, but it was something related to that. I think it was the Tour stillmag stream.

 

Morgoth: I am aware of the tortill, Mike. I’ve spoken to him in private and I’ve read some of his essays as well. So maybe I have, I don’t know.

 

Woes: Okay. Sorry. Privilege. Shit. Lord, we can’t give a more decisive answer. Orthodoxy. What did Woznborglas think of the film Silent Green, given it was a 70s film which reflects the disillusionment of 60s fetish for technology? Well, I actually haven’t seen it unbelievably enough.

 

Morgoth: Well, I have seen it, and if you go on my own device channel you will discover that we spoke about it for a few hours for a classic movie stream. So I’ve already uncovered Soylent Green in depth on a live stream. I think it’s on endeavours channel. But, yeah, we were very invested in it. The most amazing thing is, of course, that with the new laws in Canada, the idea of giving you a pretty picture as they euthanize you is now here, they’re now doing it again. It is a purely technocratic mindset behind it. Check it out. It’s either on Morgoth endeavours, classic movies. Soy and Green. It’s right there. It’s there.

 

Woes: Thank you. All right. Abel’s candor. Says Dad’s birthday tonight. Can’t make the stream. He’s 82 today. Born 1940. 99% of what we hate in our country has come in since then, all in one lifetime. Morgoth versus Woes is the conversation of the year. You two are the absolute champs. Thank you to both of you for what you do for all of us. Thank you very much. That’s a very kind comment, and it’s nice to know that one’s work is valued. And as you say, it’s an amazing thing to think that if you could go back to 1940, I mean, everything would be radically different in ways that you can’t even guess at, things that you wouldn’t even think of the ways that people talk to each other, the ways that they dress, the rules, the conventions that govern everyday life. It would be incredible. And I dare say that we would struggle to fit in, but that’s a sign of decline. The fact that we would struggle when I think of how the British people were betrayed, when I look at these old photos of London, I just think these crowds of people, I think of the betrayal that was just down the line, just about to happen. It fills me with sadness, not even rage. It fills me with sadness to think of these good people being just utterly screwed over, utterly in the most evil, mendacious way. Horrible. So, yeah, I agree, it’s quite amazing how much change has happened in a single person’s lifetime. But happy birthday to your father nonetheless. Okay. Irish nationalist media, they do not kill us because there are too many of us. There are a lot more of us than you think. If they tried to kill our thought and political leaders, it would be civil war, and they know it. So they try to suppress us without backing us into a corner. Only people with information from within the elite get whacked. Morgoth.

 

[6:30:25]

 

Morgoth: Well, yeah, I don’t understand the point, to be honest. We’re living in a panopticon. They are conscious of where the threat is, and they will utilize the threat when it emerges.

 

Woes: Yes, I agree. Dog reliance.

 

Morgoth: What is it that I’m missing? How many more times do I have to hear the lecture that when there’s enough of us ready, we’re going to overthrow the power system?

 

Woes: Yeah, it’s. A difficult one. I don’t know how they’re going to deal with a large number of people who openly reject the system. If that large number does ever materialize, I don’t know what they’re going to do about it.

 

Morgoth: Right, okay, so define reject the system. What does reject the system actually entail?

 

Woes: Yeah, okay, so protests maybe, I don’t know, who knows what disgruntled population in.

 

Morgoth: The case of Ireland, this is why I know it’s nice and I hear to be a ball breaker, but these are serious times. And so when we hear like airy ferry kind of oh, when we reject the system, okay, what does that mean in practical terms? What does that mean? So let’s drill down into it. In the case of Ireland, let’s just say there’s 5 million people in Ireland. There was Irish nationalist who sent the chat. All right, so let’s just say what is it? How many people are we talking about rejecting the system? I tell you what, what would scale the system if you’ve got 5 million people in Ireland and a million of them decided to just not no longer turn up for work for one day or one week, there you go and when you have that, there has to be a clear and explicit message. We want the government changed or we want this refugee programme to end. We are against Agenda 2030, whatever it is. The Hate Speech laws in Ireland are coming in. So you can say, okay, there’s a million people refuse to go to a million Irish people refuse to turn up for work. They refuse to pay tax until the Hate Speech laws are repealed. Now that’s a populist outlook. It is a populist revolution. It is peaceful and it can happen if you have enough people who are going to wake up. I absolutely support that outcome. Now the pragmatic part is making it happen beyond just saying when enough people are waking up.

 

Woes: Yeah, I agree. It’s a matter of how to get there. I agree. All right. Doggerland Joe. A kind donation. Thank you. I’d like to apologize for repeating this point so often recently, but we absolutely must support each other to the highest of our abilities. To do so, we need not be the saviour or the enemy of all, but we must be the strength of our own. Thank you, gentlemen, for everything you do. Well, I certainly agree with you on that. I think that we should stick together. We should support each other. We should encourage each other. There shouldn’t be infighting or bitching or back biting. It doesn’t help anyone but our enemies. This is a very common refrain in my work. I’ve been trying to encourage that attitude for years. There are people, unfortunately, who aren’t amenable to that attitude, but they are a minority. I think that most people want a successful cohesive community. So I would just echo what Dogland Joe has said there. Margot, do you have anything to say there?

 

Morgoth: No.

 

Woes: Okay. All right. And we’re nearly at the end. I think there are only four more eggs. Benjamin says re Morgoth’s question about the US leaving the gear. I think in Afghanistan the motive is either that the US. Are able to test the effectiveness of next generation weaponry against that which is set to be deprecated and therefore planted, or plausible deniability should another ISIS emerge armed with US weaponry. Okay, that’s good. Thank you. Mr. Minority thoughts on Vagva Kernis? He encouraged people to get as self sufficient and off grid as possible and starve the beast at least ten years ago because the system isn’t fixable. He seems to have been right, in my opinion. Great stream, guys. Adheres to a tolerable New Year. I would agree. Vargarus is a bit of an eccentric. He has his own perspective on things. But I think he is correct about that matter. Morgoth, anything to say about Vargarchanis?

 

Morgoth: No. Really? That seems reasonable.

 

Woes: All right. Orthodoxy. Have WOZN Morgoth seen the Saragosa manuscript? A 1965 Polish film directed by Wauchich Has based on the 1815 novel the manuscript found in Saragosa by Yan Pataki. If not, I’d like to see a review of it sometime in 23. Sort of Don Quixotate territory in terms of the film genre. Something to bear in mind. Thank you for that. Orthodoxy. The Saragosa Manuscript.

 

Morgoth: Right.

 

Woes: Okay. Vingul, shout out to the old Morgoth video and old to Laura Trott. I remember that one very well.

 

Morgoth: By the way, she is leading the charge against tranny’s taking over. She was involved. I was sent something. The lovely Laura. She’s there. She doesn’t want those bulls in a female cycling, so there you go.

 

Woes: Interesting. All right. That’s nice to know. And thank you, Van Gogh, for that generous Superchat. Siemer, thanks for your work. To the both of you. Thank you very much. You’re welcome. Fredera Del chair. I really think about that gremlin in Gremlins too, that drinks the brain enhancement portion. When I listen to Morgoth, at times he’s a working class man, but he has the words to articulate what he’s feeling, unlike most of us. Well, that’s an interesting analogy, Morgoth. I don’t think this person meant any offence by that. I think they meant quite the opposite.

 

Morgoth: No, not at all. The brain portion I think I inherited from my grandfather as a young chap, if I have one. If that’s the case, then yeah, I’ve been all throughout my content and all across the years, I’ve alluded to the influence of my grandfather, who was not an ordinary man.

 

Woes: Okay, I just realized I forgot to read out the rest of that. Vinggold’s question. Shout out to the old Morgoth video and ode to Laura Trott. It hit as hard back then as The Band Played On did this year, and I have followed Morgoth’s work ever since. Also to woes video what is the abyss? Which I found it precisely the right time and which really helped me. Thank you. Well, a lot of people refer to that video.

 

Morgoth: I was going to say the Laura Trott video was actually originally then you can still go back on the original Morgoth Review blog. Blog, blog, which people forget these days, but there’s 500 articles in the early years. The thing is, this year I went back to substance and people came saying, oh, we missed the videos and everything and yeah, I get it. But originally I was a blogger. I have just gone back to blogging like I always did. Even the Lore Trod video was like one of the first that I did with help from Ferbaton, who was a bit more kind of savvy with video making. But the theme of the Laura Chart video, which is caste, was originally a blog post, was just this idea that you watch your own kin sort of emerge from the nondescript biomass of what the Olympic Games, that kind of recognition that there’s a person there that belongs to you, that you have a connection there. What globalism does and what globalism wants is to kind of destroy that. So if you look at the globalist, the Olympic Games is a perfect example of it. But now it’s much worse than what I originally wrote. That video, the script and whatnot because it’s based on the assumption that you don’t have that kind of connection. So if you look at the Olympic Games and it’s just people from everywhere at all times. And then in the case of Laura Trott, I recognized immediately that she is from my group. She is my people, genetically, spiritually, culturally, religiously, historically, of my kin. When I watched the Olympics, this is a good bit back, I think it was like 2015 or something. But still, just to see her emerging through this kind of swamp of otherness and I was like, she just looked so beautiful. It wasn’t just in the kind of something because she is very pretty. It was more than that. It was more like on a deep level, this is my home here. This is the female of my if you want to be purely kind of Darwinian and materialistic mode, this is the female version of my group. This is the female of my genetic phenotype. If you want or if you want to be an idealist about it, this is the form that I recognize, which is just purely perfect, which I view as the form of female, which fits me best amongst all of these people from the Third World and everywhere else. So it was on multiple different levels. There was something happening there. But in every scenario you can imagine, globalism was the enemy because it is incontrovertible. But Laura Trophies kind of a connection there as to somebody watching the TV.

 

Woes: Yeah, of course I understood that. There was a phrase in the article which I can’t remember now, but it says what you’ve just said that you recognize someone of your own kind, someone of the same ingredients. It was a lovely article. Okay, noticer in chief says here’s nearly 8 hours of insightful chat for millennial. Eight. Thank you gentlemen. Well, it’s nearly 7 hours. I doubt very much that we’ll go for 8 hours. I think we’re both beginning to get a bit worse for where but nonetheless, thank you very much for that. There’s something I want to mention earlier when you were talking about Andrew Tate is that while we’ve been talking he has been arrested for human trafficking or something that’s happened. Defiant Irishman Morgoth. Do you do any winter could fishing living in the northeast? Winter could fishing?

 

Morgoth: No, I’m too soft. I did it a couple of years ago. I went out but I actually did a video and I put it on the YouTube channel. But since then like no, I’m too soft. I’m too much of a soft shade. It’s brutal. But I have done it. I have done it in the past. I did a video of it and you can see where I am on that video out there. The era through park and it’s the middle of winter. I think it’s like January and I’m out there fishing and the weather is absolutely savage on the little pier around. The waves are coming over the top and it’s pretty brutal. But mainly winter is our retreat. I go for longer walks in winter, especially when the ground is frozen. But for me the fishing season is like spring to late. Summer wind asks me long kind of rambling because I like the frost, I like the crunchy drone and whatnot. But yeah, I’ve done it before. I didn’t catch anything. I’m too soft. I’m too soft for it. I tell people all the time, they don’t understand that North Sea wind strips the wind from you. The North Sea winds strips the skin from your bones.

 

Woes: We had it tough. It’s just the four Yorkshiremen connecting.

 

Morgoth: I keep telling you where they are and they don’t get it. I went up for a paint last week when we made and I don’t know if it’s a kind of cool because right now it’s actually seven degrees in the northeast. I’m just looking at my computer there and that’s actually not that cool at all. And he was saying like, these people from he always tells a story where all these Canadians came over and they’re used to, like-15, degrees, but they came to the northeast of England and they couldn’t cope because it was like this dampness that just crept into their bruins and it’s worse, even though it’s like five degrees or whatever. It’s worse than having like minus ten in Canada or-15 in Canada. It sounds like a bit of a call, but if I’m honest, I actually do prefer just to have snow or frost than the damp, kind of drizzly kind of shit that we get in north of England and Scotland, where it’s just all purveyors of not freezing, but cold dampness that just seems to crawl at the very marrow of your bones. It’s kind of weird. I get that it’s not name it’s 15, I get that it’s not always I see outside, but there’s something about it where you think, I wish it would just freeze instead of this kind of insipid cooled wetness, which kind of sinks into everything. It’s fucking awful.

 

Woes: Another upbeat monologue from Morgoth. There. Okay. Defiant Irishman responds in a dismissive tone to you saying that you’re too soft to go cold. Winter could fishing. All right. Barther says hello to both of you. Great show. I work in the grains market. I mainly deal with wheat, soybeans and corn. I expect the prices of grains to go a lot higher in 2023. Higher grain prices will lead to higher meat prices. Beef, pork, chicken. I hope you’re preparing for this. God bless you all. Well, this is why the ideal would be to have one’s own farmstead, so that you could be independent from this bullshit to at least a great extent. Yeah, I think that this is good advice. I hope that a good number of my viewers are able to follow this advice. We all need to prepare however we can. It does seem like tough times are ahead. Again, I would refer people to the Andrew Anglin thread that I linked earlier. I’ll link again now. Hold on a second. If he’s correct, then it’s going to be pretty bloody bad. Hold on a second. I’ve got to open the video. All right, here we go. Hold on a second. There that thread. Okay, so, Halenzian, this is the last one. Hellenzian says, what do you think is the idea of moving large numbers of dissidents into one village or town to take it over and show people a different way? The trouble with that idea is that you’re talking about dissidents. So it would be like herding cats, and there are a lot of dissidents that I fucking wouldn’t want to live anywhere near. People who hate me, people who attack me, all the rest of it. So I would pity any sane person who was stuck in the same place with them. Honestly. I’m sorry to say that, but it’s a thing people who are attracted to radical politics, French are often disagreeable people and like herding cats. That’s all I’ll say about that. The other thing is, I tend to think that it’s better to mix with apolitical people because, yes, they’ve got their heads full of a lot of bollocks, but on the other hand, it’s sort of milk toasted. They’re less spiky, they’re less aggressive, they’re less antisocial than a lot of people with fervent political convictions. And that’s more persuadable, perhaps. Morgoth?

 

Morgoth: Well, yeah, you’re going to run into the problem where it depends on how you classify distance. Let’s just take a sole take on this, which would be you always play down your power level, you always act sensibly. You are just normal people and you just happen to be moving into, let’s just say, scunthorpe. So on the surface, nothing is actually happening. You’re just a bunch of people who enjoy scunthorpe and you want to just be normal and you want to be centrists. And by centrist it means this beNAME language of protect, because I know where he’s coming from. Let’s just adopt the full glare kind of methodology here, where it’s like, okay, well, it’s not that we’re opposed to immigration per se. We just want to protect the flavour of the town. And what do the actual people say? Oh, it just turns out the people, they support us as well. It’s got nothing to do with immigration. It’s just not protecting the flavour of the town. And hey, look at this. The majority of the town want to protect the flavour of the town and because they all secretly get it as well. And so the local politics is kind of skewered and walked in a certain direction even though it’s underhanded. And then you get the other and it’s like, well, we’re going to march in and we’re going to call this the Ethanol state of scunthorpe. And we’re going to seize all of the private property, and then we’re going to put it to use and we’re going to turn women where women are now not allowed to work anymore. And we’re going to say, well, if you don’t, we’re going to adopt the Social Credit system because China is based and we’re going to do this all within our little scoop for Socialist Republic of Ethno Purity, which is also based on National Socialist principles. And we’re going to be proud about this. We’re going to have banners and everybody’s going to be based and it’s going to just not happen.

 

Woes: Is it? Yeah. Well, you have to be realistic. As I’ve said before, the kinds of people who make things happen in the real world are currently doing things in the real world, making things happen. They’re not involved in dissident politics, more’s the pity. I wish they were. And this is actually something that Academic Agent mentioned last night as one of the reasons for him pushing sensible centrism, because he wants to attract people exactly the types of people who aren’t attracted to fringe politics. He wants to get people who are accomplished, well balanced, sane, sensible, reasonable, so that we can actually start getting things done in the real world. Now, I think that’s a laudable aim. I voiced some concerns about that approach earlier. I don’t really care. I don’t want to piss on it at all. I think he is correct that we have to if this movement, if you want to call it that, if this community is going to achieve things in the real world, then it has to become less deranged. All this fucking nonsense that goes on on Twitter and Telegram looking for fights, this crabs in the bucket mentality, all of that has to end. And anyone who’s pushing that stuff and engineering it needs to be ejected. So we do need more functional, more reasonable, more worldly people on site before we’ll have practical results. But I also think that that’s probably going to happen because the world is going to get pretty shit and I think people will be looking the worst things get, and I’m not saying, oh, there’s going to reach a certain threshold, critical mass and then ideas will be mainstream. That could happen. But what I’m thinking is more likely is that the worse things get, the more people there will be from the mainstream who are looking for something else, something different that they can get involved with. Because right now it’s still at the stage where they can have their nice job, live in their nice village and just pretend that nothing is really wrong with the world and say that if it is wrong, if there is something wrong with the world, it only happens to the Chad girls and Robin anyway. So it’s not my problem. Well, I think as things spread, as dysfunction spreads, as it surely will, given the way that the government is behaving, I think you’ll get more of those types who simply can’t run away anymore. And when that does happen, I think it’s important that we don’t hold it against them that they took a long time to come around. There are some people now who attack people for not getting covered right at the start. That kind of a mentality is just fucking stupid. Again, it’s another dysfunctional attitude that doesn’t fucking help anyone. So all of this stuff we need to get over. Morgoth. Are you falling asleep?

 

Morgoth: No, it’s just raising. But I mean, I have to call time. It’s like a seven hour stream, I think 03:00 in the morning.

 

Woes: I didn’t think it would go on for 7 hours. I thought maybe similar to last year, four and a half, maybe 5 hours. But we’ve completely destroyed that record, haven’t we?

 

Morgoth: Yeah. It’s not going to happen next year when I’m in the middle of the schedule and it’s like a two hour little kind of normal kind of in and out. Is there any more questions? Because this is like a seven hour stream. It’s enough.

 

Woes: No, there aren’t any other questions. And if I’ve missed any, it will let me know. Now, I don’t think I have. I think I’ve gone through them all quite carefully. Oh, my God.

 

Morgoth: Oh.

 

Woes: Defiant Irishman with a follow up to his fishing question says I remember once top fishing in a 36 foot boat about 5 miles off the North Angle Sea coast in 30 miles per hour wind and being absolutely frozen solid and wet through. This was in June. We caught fish, though bad weather isn’t so bad when you’re catching fish? Well, it’s something I have no experience of, but I can believe you, and I take your word for it, Morgoth. Is bad weather so bad when you’re catching fish?

 

Morgoth: No, but okay, but it is when you’re not catching fish.

 

Woes: All right. Okay. We’re 1 minute away from 7 hours. Okay. Well, this has been a fucking blockbuster stream, I think this is apart from that quino casino one that I did a couple of months ago, this is the longest stream that I’ve done in years.

 

 

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[7:00:58]

 

Millenniyule 2021 – 60 – Mark Collett

 

 

Mark Collett — It’s Okay To Be White — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — Christmas Adverts – Multicultural Propaganda — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — What We Must Do To Win — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — Assad Didn’t Do It – Faked Syrian Gas Attack — TRANSCRIPT

 

 

Mark Collett — It’s Okay To Be White — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — Christmas Adverts – Multicultural Propaganda — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — What We Must Do To Win — TRANSCRIPT

Mark Collett — Assad Didn’t Do It – Faked Syrian Gas Attack — TRANSCRIPT