Monika Schaefer: Hey, everybody. Greetings. You are listening to The Flipside with Monika. I am your host, Monika Schaefer and this is on the Republic Broadcasting Network at Republicbroadcasting.org. It is the 21st day of December in the year 2024. It is the solstice today. So that’s the shortest day in the northern lands and the longest day in the southern lands. And after this, the sun comes back, or if you’re in the southern hemisphere, I guess the days will get shorter for you!

 

Welcome. It is episode 24 of The Flipside with Monika. I have a few announcements and I guess housekeeping items to take care of and things to tell you about before I bring my guest on. My guest today, I’m very excited about this. I’ve been wanting this to happen for a long time. His name is Anthony Hall. He is a professor. Well, he’s a retired professor now at the University of Lethbridge in Alberta. I know him well. And we are going to present you with an interesting story.

 

But first I would just like to say that I’m going to take a little bit of a different approach to asking you to support the network.

 

So this is always a very uncomfortable part of my task because I feel like I’m asking for money, but I have to remind myself I’m not asking for money for myself. The hosts do not get money out of this. We do this because we know what is at stake and it is just critically important that we get to talk about the truth! I’ll just ask you to mute your mic, Tony, until you come on! No problem. Just some interference there.

 

So, yeah, so the reason, I’m just saying it always makes me a little uncomfortable because I don’t like to ask for money. I don’t want to guilt trip anybody. And again, it’s not for me personally. It is the network. It is a listener supported network.

 

And what I’m going to do is I’m just going to tell you the facts about it and then it’s up to you, [chuckling] dear listener.

 

So it is a network that is 90% listener supported and about 10% from the sponsors. So those would be the advertisers. And they have an operating budget. There’s the commercial internet, there’s telephone services. They have multiple lines. There are the satellite connections, there’s the electric bill, there’s rent. There’s equipment repair and replacement. And I can tell you that the staff do not earn much money. And there is free unlimited archives on the Republic Broadcasting Network and in fact, it obviously is a very, very important host, important messages, important things that are being done with this network because there are on average a quarter of a million downloads per month. Now there is unlimited free downloading on RepublicBroadcasting.org you can go there and download to your heart’s content and share these programs. So that happens a quarter of a million times per month. So that’s pretty big, I would say.

 

So anyway, that’s my little spiel and then it’s up to you. Just letting you know it is listener supported. And they are clean out of cash at the moment. So it is kind of a critical time.

 

Here are the numbers if you’d like to Support the network, 1-800-724-2719 or 512-246-9549 or just go to the website at Republicbroadcasting.org and there is a donate button there. You can also do it the old fashioned way by mail.

 

And by the way, speaking of mail, the postal strike is over in Canada. They were on strike for a whole month, which I think was part of their agenda to make us all go digital and online with banking and all our other needs.

 

But anyway, I am getting sidetracked. The address if you’d like to mail either cash or check, RBN2251 Double Creek Drive, Suite 302, Round Rock, Texas. And the zip code is 78664 in the USA. So that’s that.

 

All right, I’m going to set the stage, so to speak, for before I bring Tony in to tell his story and that we’ll have a little conversation about some of the things that have happened to him. I’m more or less entitling this, “How They Keep the Professors in Line”. As I told you, he’s a university Professor and they have a lot of pressure on them to basically stick with the prescribed narratives on any number of topics. And by now, and I’m sure that most of the listeners listening to this program are aware that we are being lied to on a grand scale.

 

Okay, so if a Professor steps out of line, what happens to him? And Tony will tell us about that in a few minutes.

 

But just a bit of history here. I first met Tony in 2015, so about nine years ago, and he was traveling with Kevin Barrett on a speaking tour after Kevin Barrett had published the book We Are Not Charlie Hebdo. And there were multiple authors to that project.

 

And one of the authors was my friend Tony Hall. And they came, I hosted them in Jasper, Alberta where I lived at the time. And they spoke to do with the Charlie Hebdo incident, you may remember that.

 

And then in 2016 we traveled together to Germany and that was the year that I made my life changing video, Sorry Mom, I Was Wrong About the Holocaust. We also contributed bits like video pieces which then CODOH, which is the Committee on Open Debate on the Holocaust, they edited together a four minute video in which we answered the question “Why Do You Support Open Debate on the Holocaust?” And Germar Rudolf was at that time, he was the one who was heading up the CODOH website, CODOH.com. He’s no longer heading that up now.

 

And by the way, he has been arrested! He is currently in jail and awaits transfer to another jail. And this is all to do with something completely trivial and unrelated to what they really are after him for. And he has done a huge amount of work on Holocaust Revisionism as they call it. I would call it “Correctionism”.

 

But anyway he has published many books, the Holocaust Handbook series and more recently the Holocaust Encyclopedia which is an incredible volume.

 

And so we will talk more about that with Tony because somehow this all ties together. And actually a little bit more history here. Before I met Tony there was this Tehran conference and I’m sure you’ll tell us more about that, Tony, but in 2014, the New Horizons Conference. But I’m just still setting the stage here to give people a bit of background.

 

After that conference there were some smear articles against you and I saw the clip there which you’ve included in your epic article, we’ll talk about that. But this newspaper article in which Ezra Levent was also pictured, but we’re not sure who authored these words. But they talked about you:

 

“Still a madman and poster boy for the end of tenure.”

 

And that was in 2014. And in 2016 after our trip to Germany together, something happened to you, Tony Hall, that indeed that statement two years earlier was a little bit prophetic.

 

And tenure for those who don’t know what that means, it basically gives Professors who have paid their dues and put in a lot of work and time and are full Professors, it gives them academic freedom or that is the theory.

 

Okay, and now one more thing, I’ll just say to set this up, I have a certain relative and his words ring in my ears when I was trying to inform him about the lies. And this was only about 9/11 at the time. I don’t think I’d yet gone down the road of Holocaust, discovering the lies about that. And his words ring in my ears as I was telling him about Bolshevism and how they murdered millions and millions and millions of people and that that was a jewish operation and all those things.

 

And then this relative says to me:

 

“You mean to tell me that all the university Professors were wrong?”

 

And I know I’ve shared that with you, Tony. You said yes, I’ve said it many times. But that sets the stage for today. So welcome, Tony, to the show, first of all, greetings. And why don’t you tell us what happened to you in 2016? Over to you.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Well, thanks, Monika, and congratulations on having a regular show!

 

Monika Schaefer: Thank you.

 

Pro Tony Hall: You deserve it. And your story is very important. You know, just before I get into my own story, this whole phenomena of what happened in World War II, resulting in this production of this narrative which became known as “The Holocaust”. You know that in 1948, there was something called the Genocide Convention at the UN. So “genocide” entered the language, and many genocides have taken place over history. But when does a genocide become a holocaust? And when does “a Holocaust” become “The Holocaust”? Are we seeing a holocaust in Gaza? And how do you get this title of “The Holocaust”?

 

So The Holocaust becomes a narrative with a huge impact. You know, in a way, the winning side of World War II use their political currency to create the UN, to create Israel, to create the Genocide Convention. And this Holocaust story becomes kind of the core narrative of our times. It sort of defines right and wrong, good and bad, and it certainly becomes the political pillar for the state of Israel. And so as we were socialized to sort of feel very guilty and feel that this act of atonement through the creation of Israel was a good thing and a required thing.

 

But then, lo and behold, the people who received this first supposedly primal, defining genocide became deliverers of genocide since 2023. And now they don’t want to face the International Criminal Court, the International Court of Justice. They want to say:

 

“No, no, this is not a genocide. It is not a “Holocaust”.

 

I would say that the suffering we’re seeing imposed on the people of Gaza and it’s expanding from there, it’s beyond anything, even in the most extreme versions of what happened in the Holocaust, what happened at, say, Auschwitz. Meeting a death, let’s say we assume this controversial thesis that people died in gas chambers in Auschwitz. Dying in a gas chamber is nothing like the harshness, the ruthlessness, the cruelty imposed on people in Gaza who are being starved, no water, carpet bombed, just faced with an incredible array of various forms of genocide.

 

So I want to acknowledge the people who stand their ground. And you sort of led me down this pathway to see these things, going to Germany and meeting your brother. I mean, it was a great pleasure and honor for me to be invited by you and I took it, you know, it was a personal matter in a way, meeting Alfred [Monika’s older brother]. I’m sure the audience knows who Alfred is.

 

And then you made Sorry Mom, I was Wrong About the Holocaust, a story that you told me very many times about your mother. And we made together this other video called “Why do you believe in open debate on the holocaust?” Which led me to become a kind of marked man. When I was saying it at the time, it seemed to me it was a no-brainer, this idea that of course we should have open debate on everything.

 

And as a university Professor Guarding the principles of academic freedom as I thought, it was a no-brainer to look in the camera and say that and justify that. And I was astonished by my colleagues in the university who didn’t take that as a given! We can’t allow the precedent to be set that there’s things we can’t talk about and issues we must avoid.

 

So very quickly after we returned to Jasper, you were immediately spurned and blocked from lots of things. The Legion, which was the major musical venue, you couldn’t play there, and then you couldn’t be on the environmental committee, and then you couldn’t be in the fiddle teaching business. And you know, it was just amazing to see all these institutional things shutting you down. And then most everybody, I saw, most every one of your friends turned against you and said:

 

“Well, now you’re a holocaust denier and you really seem to actually support the National Socialists. And I just can’t be friends with such a person.’

 

And I have to say that watching you at the time, you handled it well and strongly. But there were times I saw such sadness in you and it was something to behold. I wrote letters to explain how wrong it was to judge you by your political beliefs, to say whether or not you could teach fiddle. I would say to the fiddle people who run that school:

 

“Well, now you’ve gone into the political business of deciding thought policing. So you’re not really a credible fiddle teaching agency anymore or environmental agency.”

 

All of this thought control stuff came into place and I watch and actually one of your close friends decided it must be me. It couldn’t be dear sweet Monika, who was becoming this horrific Holocaust denier. And they figured I must be leading you [chuckling] astray.

 

Monika Schaefer: You and my evil brother, you know! [chuckling]

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah he’s in there, too!

 

And I have to say, it was one thing to defend open debate on the Holocaust, but then quickly I could see there were other things involved in this.

 

And so, anyway, I started to take the flack for this and be demonized because of it. And lo and behold, that next term, this was shortly before the term started in September of 2016, there was a major assault on my reputation, led by something called B’nai Brith Canada, the extension of the Anti-Defamation League in the United States, who, I imagine most people, if you’re listening to this show, probably know what that is.

 

But basically they see themselves as, they’re going to find the future Nazis and make sure they never get in power, and they’re going to defame and diminish and ruin the reputation of and make them unemployable, people who they think might be going to raise issues that they do not want raised.

 

And so there was a terrible scam that Facebook and B’nai Brith played where they made up a Facebook post on my Facebook wall saying that I was saying:

 

“All the jews should be killed and they should be strung up. And the Holocaust didn’t happen, but it should have happened, and kill all jews!”

 

Was in there.

 

And so this was spread around without me knowing it on the Internet. And then I became aware of it. Oh, my God!

 

And so it turned out that this was the preparatory work to what became my suspension. I was literally kind of dragged out of the classroom in October and told:

 

“You cannot be on campus. You are a trespasser on campus!”

 

So one day I’m a tenured full Professor with my classes going. The next day I’m criminalized without any due process and told, I can’t come back on campus. And then it came out that the technique was to put aside the collective agreement, the rule book, the policy book, and the university went to the Human Rights Tribunal and said:

 

“Hall has violated the Human Rights act of Alberta.”

 

And so this was kind of bizarre, but they didn’t tell anybody. Well, Hall is accused of this by the university itself. All that appears in the paper is:

 

“Hall is under investigation by the Human Rights Tribunal.”

 

And anyway, so then suddenly, there I am, trying to gather myself. At the time, I couldn’t really think of anything like it that I really knew about in Canada. I’d read about Professors in the United States and I started to do a lot of research about them.

 

And of course, this initial statement that Hall, you know, says:

 

“Kill all jews the Holocaust never happened, but it should have.”

 

And intertwined, inter intermingled in all of this was the fact that you and I had been in Germany and that I made this film. And they played clips of this film, me saying there should be open debate on the Holocaust.

 

And so it sort of fit together that somebody who made a film like that might be saying those kind of things. And it was quite expertly woven together, this fiction about my beliefs at the time and everything. I hadn’t, as you know, gone into a lot of study of the Holocaust, ever! You know, I had written some things about the fact that US businesses, British businesses, had funded Hitler and that Auschwitz was actually IG Auschwitz was actually a slave labor camp to produce jet plane fuel and tires. And this new technology, this IG Farben with German technology being applied in a very dirty way, that this was a slave labor camp.

 

And so I’d written about that, but not about transforming, so the story goes, Auschwitz into a death camp, into an industrialized death camp to produce this astonishing number of victims of the Holocaust, this 6 million number. I mean, I wasn’t really in any position to judge that whole story one way or another.

 

But nevertheless, I was suddenly a Holocaust denier, an anti-semite and a conspiracy theorist! Those were the three things that those phrases become the weaponized terms. And so eventually we got, in order to have a court case, my faculty association, the collective body of university Professors, you know, at first they were astonished that this was happening.

 

But then I have to say that that the image of you was kind of exploited in a way.

 

Like I was reading Tadzio Richards on Alberta Views, which is a Left-wing progressive magazine, a kind of place where I might have looked for some support. And I was looking at an abbreviated version of this article, and it’s almost all about you, Monika.

 

And so this story where you stand your ground and say:

 

“Yes, I don’t believe in the Holocaust and yes, I like National Socialists.”

 

I mean, I wasn’t at the point where I could say that, but you were saying it. And that was said because I’m friendly with you and that somehow this is my opinion too. And that seemed like a very shoddy approach. Do you want to get, …

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah, I’ll just interject that smear by association, that is a really common theme. It’s something that is used, it’s weaponized against us. Because I have experienced other people being smeared by association too. And even you know, second degree, third degree associations, people being smeared that, I don’t know, I guess they, the psychology of that is interesting.

 

And I think that those who seek to destroy us as the usual suspects there, they seem to know us better than we know us and they know that that’s something that people are very affected by in general. Like that their general population is very affected by that.

 

And earlier you said that some of my friends or former friends in Jasper, they just couldn’t fathom that I had become this quote, unquote, “evil person” because of course they’ve been raised and indoctrinated and programed to react in Pavlovian style to this term Holocaust scenario. And Monika, who was formerly, you know, pretty well liked and I was very active and wore many hats in my community in culturally and environmentally and I had, you know, politically as well. And I’d been writing lots of letters to the editor and I had lots of friends and all that and:

 

“Oh, how could she become so evil overnight?”

 

So they did blame the that on these men in my life. So that would be my brother Alfred and Tony Hall, [chuckling] like you were alluding to earlier. But yeah, the smear by association.

 

So about that article that you just alluded to. It was actually, you’re saying it was about you but somehow it ended up that they wrote more about me in it. But you are the bad man because suddenly you’re a Holocaust denier too. Or can you explain that a bit?

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah, they into the story on the edges of things, but it, you know, it was an abbreviated version of the article and I want to say Tadzio Richards, a journalist that has a lot to answer for. That was a real scam, dude! If Tadzio Richards ever comes up and you know, obviously Alberta Views is the answer to Alberta Report. You know, my background is like you is as a sort of liberal Left progressive, you know.

 

And so it was Owen Holmes, who was the founder of the University of Lethbridge, he wrote to Alberta Views about what was being done to me and the prosecution and persecution of me and lo and behold, surprise, surprise, it came out with yet more smear. But I just want to, I’m sure there’s going to be a break soon. I Just want to clarify that this situation of me at the university trying to cope with my role in the faculty association and where there are votes and there are assemblies and meetings and various executives that I was hoping to bring those people along. They would have a big say over what would happen.

 

And what did happen, we did get into court. It wasn’t me going into court. It was me in partnership with my faculty association, which had to have the approval of the fellow Professors. And I didn’t. I know a lot of them were having real trouble with the substance of this story and my role in it. Even the little movie, “Why do you believe in open debate on the Holocaust?” And there I was beside you and Alfred, and the three of us were strong on the same page, which in that case we were.

 

So there’s that phase of this story. But I just want to emphasize the point that now I’m Professor emeritus, but I’m retired. I’m not teaching anymore. They got me out of the classroom. But what you’ve done in standing your ground is of global importance!

 

And the fact you were put in jail for a year in Germany of this I’m connected to this, and I’m proud of it. And it’s one of the Summit moments of my career and my life really, to have participated in this basic, fundamental issue is, what is this thing the Holocaust? And how come you can’t debate it? And how come you can’t talk about it freely and openly?

 

Monika Schaefer: That’s a great way to take us into the break and please stay with us. We’ll come back in a few minutes after these messages.

 

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Monika Schaefer: Yeah, I’m going to bring us back in and we have a lot to talk about still. We’re just getting going on a roll.

 

I’m just going to recap a few things here, Tony. You had talked about I had lost all my friends in Jasper. Not all of them, by the way. There were some who stayed very loyal to me.

 

But you know, through all this adventure [chuckling] of discovering that we’ve been lied to and then and then doing some things about it, I gained new friends. And I’m telling you those new friendships I have made are so rich and deep and I never had any regrets. And I and I’m so happy that I did go down this road.

 

Now I do remember you lumping some terms together. They seem to love to do that. And at the time it was these four terms, 9/11 truther, holocaust denier, anti-semitic and conspiracy theorist! So you were all of those things and that wrapped up your career. Right?

 

But just before you come back in, I’ll just tell the listeners that there is no live show next week. So RBN is taking a break from doing live broadcasting. But there will always still be broadcasting. But so since there is no live show that means there’s no call-ins.

 

As far as call-ins today, I’m not sure if we will have time, maybe near the end if somebody had a burning question or comment for the good Professor. And I wanted to also say that on the Chatengo site which I have now, which is this new address, it’s flipsidemo.chatengo.com I did post this epic, epic article that Tony has written recently and it is called “On the Condemnation of Holocaust Denial”. It’s a big essay that it could be a university course.

 

In fact, in our universities after this terrible system that we are under now where they fire Professors for speaking truth. But when that collapses and we have universities that are real and where you really do have academic freedom, that article you wrote, it should be a university course. And I have posted that on the Chitango site. I will also, as soon as the show is over, post the CODOH video.

 

And again, that’s, CODOH.com but they asked the simple question, why do you support open debate on the Holocaust? It’s less than four minutes long. You can also find it on my Odysee channel. So just go to Odysee.com and put in my name, Monika Schaefer and then you can look for that video. Why do you support open debate on the Holocaust? Four minutes. Less than four minutes of your life will be taken up by taking a look at that.

 

One more thing I wanted to tell you, Tony. I talked with Alfred, my brother this morning and he sends you the very warm greetings. He has the utmost highest respect and regards for you.

 

And so I just wanted to pass that message on to you. So back to you, Tony.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah, so when you find yourself being referred to as something called a “Holocaust denier”, to me that is the harshest term they can come up with. To be called an “anti-semite” these days? Well, big deal! To be called a conspiracy theorist. Well, if you’re not looking into theories about conspiracy and you’re trying to be a public intellectual, what the hell are you doing? Obviously, people make theories about conspiracies, and it has to do with the exercise of power.

 

But this “Holocaust denial” phrase, it kind of has a judicial ring about it, a juridical ring about it. Like some judge somewhere has hammered down the gavel and said:

 

“Guilty of Holocaust denial!”

 

Like, what does that mean? So as you know, internalize it, and nothing would be more incentive of internalizing it than when you find yourself called that in hundreds of newspapers. And this smear operation to which I was subjected, I want to emphasize, it’s not like just in a few little sites here and there. It becomes a news story around the world and in Israel, throughout the United States, in Europe.

 

And so that becomes, you know how people who’ve never heard of you, who could care less that you existed and don’t really know what the University of Lethbridge is, let alone Lethbridge itself, and suddenly it’s reported as this major news.

 

So the demeaning character of such a statement, who I now know to associate with a Professor of Holocaust studies, Deborah Lipstadt, who wrote a book called Denying the Holocaust and kind of formalized and publicized this concept of “Holocaust denier” because it hasn’t been around that long. It’s a kind of new phrase. You know, it sort of leads me to believe it’s an approach saying:

 

“Hey, goys, you’re not entitled to talk about this! This is like a religious, sanctified thing that only our selected people can talk about, but you are allowed to say, ‘thumbs up’.”

 

“Yeah, I saw Schindler’s List, and it looks pretty good to me. And I got no problem with that.”

 

Or if you have any questions about any of the vast array the Holocaust is called, like, as if it’s one thing, but it took place in many countries, what they refer to the Holocaust. It’s a complex series of events. It’s World War II. So people were suffering and being punished in all kinds of ways, including, no doubt, some jews. Germans, of course, would get their Holocaust after World War II, when they were punished in different ways.

 

But say you want to debate one aspect of it, one or another aspect of it, and this was generally referred to before Deborah Lipstadt as “Holocaust revisionism”. That you want to improve history. History is all about revisionism. You know, history’s never done. You know, it’s improved attitude. People try new theories, interpretations. Other people say:

 

“No, that’s wrong! This is right.”

 

This is how history evolves. And as the state of the world unfolds, you need to sort of reorganize history a bit to pull out of it from history what you need.

 

Monika Schaefer: I’ll just interject, if I may, Tony. So I’ve taken to using the word “Correctionism”, because we know that we’re being lied to on a whole lot of things. And I mean, I have looked into this Holocaust narrative quite a lot, and no evidence for their story!

 

And that’s why they criminalize people, that they have to use force because they don’t actually have evidence. Because if they had evidence, they would just show us the evidence. But since they don’t have evidence, they can’t use facts and arguments because they don’t have any.

 

But anyway, I like to use the word “Correctionism” because revisionism, when I first heard that term, I didn’t like it because I thought:

 

“Well, wait a minute, they’re the ones who actually changed history.”

 

Like something either happened or it didn’t. Something either happened or it didn’t.

 

And so that word to me, I mean, I’ve had people explain it to me and justify the word “revisionism”. It’s just revising what you know, based on let’s say you find new evidence for this or that or the other thing. And I know that’s what you are saying, that if when you find other evidence that you hadn’t seen before, well then you have to revise your interpretation of what actually happened. So I know that is what you are saying, but I just wanted to interject that it has always kind of bothered me.

 

So now I’ve got this other word, correctionism in my lexicon. And about that term, like you were saying being called a Holocaust denier, it’s like it’s a bomb! It is a weapon, and these labels are weapons and all those other labels are weapons.

 

Pro Tony Hall: So you can go to jail for it. And you did go to jail for it!

 

And so you are a testimony, an embodiment of the punishments attached to this thing called “Holocaust denial” and all the ways it’s expressed in other forms and terms in the legal firmament. So ironically, there is a revisionism in Zionist history. Jabotinsky and the people who created Likud, which Netanyahu is in this very Right-wing extreme version of wanting an expanded Israel, a Greater Israel. They call it Zionist revisionism.

 

Anyway, this is just the starting point into a huge question. And so I’ve written this this year, and it sort of was like a just a gusher coming out of me because I’ve been thinking about this term Holocaust denial and what it can do to you and how it’s being manipulated and how it’s being transformed into a crime, a literal crime for which you can go to jail. What else is what other ideas or what other ethnic groups have this kind of power?

 

And so it obviously, this power to define a Holocaust denier is an expression of a power that is gross! Which is being manipulated, which is out of hand, which is disproportionate.

 

So this article I just went through looking at it from many, many Angles. One thing that was very interesting to me was to look at the literature of jewish communists who see themselves as you know, critics of this word that we could debate. But fascism, World War II had this image of communism versus fascism, although Adolf Hitler himself saw himself as a socialist.

 

Monika Schaefer: National Socialist.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah, National Socialist. But I found in Tony Greenstein’s new book about zionism during the Holocaust, during World War II, and that’s based on largely Lenny Brenner, another jewish communists who were. Both of them went into a great amount of detail about the Transfer Agreement.

 

The fact that the Zionists of Germany and the National Socialist government, with Adolf Eichmann as kind of the chief minister responsible for jewish affairs, they got along very well. And they, very quickly after Hitler came to power, negotiated an agreement that tens of thousands of jews from Germany and later beyond Germany would be helped to emigrate to Palestine, which was then under the British mandate of the League of Nations.

 

And in fact, there was a very thriving group of German jews in Palestine who could not only emigrate there, but they could get at their money and they could use their money to establish farms and such. And I think, actually begin to import products into the Middle East. And there became a market for those products. And it became a very big part in the Genesis of Israel, in the Zionist Genesis. You know, they hadn’t yet, before World War II, achieved creating a jewish state, but they did have the Balfour Declaration from the British saying that Palestine was to be a jewish homeland.

 

And so there was this very concerted movement involving some jews to create Israel as a country. This was their objective. So these jewish Communists wrote about how the Zionists of Germany and the National Socialists got together and then how these Zionists kind of manipulated Hitler into the position. And like Greenstein says they wanted jews to stay in position. If a jew wanted to go to the United States or emigrate, they didn’t want that. The only legitimate thing was to migrate to Palestine.

 

And then he sort of implies that they also wanted to keep a certain amount of jews on hand to be killed in what they now call the Holocaust. Incidentally, Yad Vashem had a Holocaust museum being planned in 1942. Yad Vashem is the main Holocaust museum in Israel and is kind of a center where the official story of the Holocaust is ratified. So imagine that already in 1942 they’re planning Holocaust museums!

 

Monika Schaefer: Kind of reminds me about the fact that the 6 million narrative was tossed around many, many, many times well before World War II, like World War I. And I mean, I’ve seen images of the articles and videos have been made about this, that:

 

“The 6 million lost souls or 6 million jews are under threat, or 6 million, you know, jews are being persecuted.”

 

That was tossed around a long, long time ago already and I think they even used, possibly they even used the word Holocaust in some of those articles.

 

But with this so-called Holocaust, they didn’t actually come out with that word until I think in the 60s. Like if people are saying that if they looked into an encyclopedia in the 50s, they would not find that word “Holocaust” with relation to World War II. Maybe you know something about that, Tony.

 

But yeah, that 6 million number was tossed around long before. And what an interesting fact that you just brought out about Yad Vashem Museum with their Holocaust Museum in 1942, already.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yes. So this, I’m getting this out of the book of Tony Greenstein. And of course he’s a darling in the progressive media and especially Mondo Weiss and Electronic Intifada, which get big audience, but they wouldn’t touch “The Holocaust” with the ten foot pole.

 

But taking the critique developed by Tony Greenstein of zionism during World War II, it’s pretty significant. It overturns a lot of preconceptions and stereotypes that just don’t apply. And there was this boycott of Germany, which I think was conducted in a way to put pressure on Hitler to sit down and negotiate with the Zionists of Germany.

 

Monika Schaefer: Are you talking about, … Sorry, I’ll just interject. You’re talking about 1933, within a few weeks of Adolf Hitler coming to power, that “Judea Declares War on Germany”?

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah. That famous newspaper headline. But Hitler hadn’t even been voted into power. He would soon get a majority vote where he was made sort of worthy of the title that Hindenburg already had given him, which is Chancellor.

 

So he had become the Chancellor. Anyway, just like the snap of a finger this Untermyer and other Zionists in New York organized this boycott. But it seems the boycott is to pressure Germany. It’s very sort of interesting how Zionists can manipulate situations and play both sides and whatnot. So that’s how I’m interpreting it.

 

So in any case, then there is the story of the Toronto trials. And the Toronto trials in 1985 and 1988 were the big moment for Ernst Zundel to take the stage. He was charged with a crime of “spreading false news”. And his response was to say:

 

“Yay! There’s going to be a platform!”

 

And, boy, did he ever make a platform. He brought in Robert Faurisson, who is an amazing analyst of all of this and really has the gas chamber story and the frauds involved in the gas chamber story down cold.

 

So then there was David Irving. He managed to pull in David Irving, who was sort of new to the subject of what was going on. But there were this exhaust system in the gas chamber in the reconstructed, what we’re told is the gas chamber that couldn’t have been there. And I saw he and David Cole doing a tour of Auschwitz. And the exhaust from the gas chamber was right outside the kitchen of the SS! And how practical would that be for scientific engineer Germans to construct it that way?

 

So the Toronto trials were sort of triumph where the chief historian [Raul Hilberg] of the Holocaust, you would remember his name. And these eyewitnesses were sort of humiliated on the stand. There was Doug Christie, the lawyer. And Faurisson gave him the backing, helping him out, gave him the information how to do stunning cross examinations of these people and demonstrate that these foremost authorities on the Holocaust couldn’t come up with evidence and eyewitnesses were proven to be wrong. And ever since then, there have been no eyewitnesses!

 

Monika Schaefer: I’ll just say Ernst Zundel amassed an amazing team now, the “Exterminationists”, so those who made the charges against Ernst Zundel, they thought that:

 

“Oh, they’ll be done within a few days, this will be over. They’ll just wipe their feet on him!”

 

And they actually afterwards conceded:

 

“Oh, my goodness, that was a bit of a victory for the revisionist side.”

 

And they got smeared.

 

And we only have about probably half a minute left, Tony.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah, give me that half minute, if you would.

 

Monika Schaefer: Yeah, you go ahead.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah.

 

So this then results in Deborah Lipstadt entering the picture. And Deborah Lipstadt is a Professor of Holocaust studies, whatever that’s supposed to mean. If she was a real professor, she would have invited Ernst Zundel to speak in her class. But no, instead she writes this book, Denying the Holocaust.

 

Monika Schaefer: Which Germar Rudolf refuted.very word of it!

 

Pro Tony Hall: It’s very popular to refute her. And she is a real disgrace and shame to the academy. That woman is not of a high caliber to be teaching in a university. And so out of that came this Holocaust denial term. David Irving was smeared and there was this big trial resulting in the movie “The Denial”.

 

Monika Schaefer: We’re gonna have to have you back, Tony, I can see. Just a final word, I guess, like Happy Yule. Merry Christmas. Happy Solstice.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Well, Merry Christmas to you, Monika, and to your family.

 

Monika Schaefer: Okay. Thank you, Tony.

 

Pro Tony Hall: Yeah.

 

Monika Schaefer: All right. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you, Mr. Producer. Thank you, dear listeners. And we’ll see you in the new year.

 

All right, everybody, thank you very much. Bye bye.

 

[59:33]

 

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See Also

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Monika Schaefer – The Flipside with Monika – Ep 1 – Intro – Jun 29, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 2 – Jul 6, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 03 with Paul Fromm – Jul 13, 2024 – Transcript

Monika Schaefer – The Flipside with Monika – Ep 04 with Oscar – Jul 20, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 08 with Alfred Schaefer – Aug 17, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 09 with Grace Eki Oyama – Aug 24, 2024 – Transcript

Monika Schaefer – The Flipside with Monika – Ep 15 with Jürgen Neumann on Ernst Zündel – Oct 12, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 18 with Jürgen Neumann – Nov 2, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 20 with Kathleen Dudley – Nov 16, 2024 – Transcript

 

 

Monika Schaefer – The Flipside with Monika – Ep 24 – Prof Tony Hall – Dec 21, 2024 – Transcript

The Flipside with Monika – Ep 27 – Germar Rudolf – Jan 18, 2025 – Transcript

 

 

Joel Davis – WWII Revisionism Re-enters the Mainstream – Sep 6, 2024 – Transcript

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8mBgMaLVPc

Available at BitChute:

https://www.bitchute.com/video/QeuR316F9akA/

Published on Nov 21, 2016