[Luke from the YouTube channel Lambda, chats with Morgoth on his journey to ethno-nationalism during his stays in Europe.
How I Arrived Here
Apr 16, 2022
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Published on Apr 16, 2022
Morgoth – How I Arrived Here
Apr 16, 2022
Morgoth’s substack: https://morgoth.substack.com/
Check out my other channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj_9…
Luke: Morgoth. Thank you for joining me for Lamster. In this stream I’m hoping that we can chart a bit of the history of how you reached the point you’re at right, now, in terms of your thinking about the world your understanding of things.
What’s a good time to start? How far do we rewind the clocks? Couple of decades? [chuckling]
Morgoth: Yeah actually. I was just saying before I went live, I was gonna do like a solo Morgcast on how I ended up with the opinions that I did in the world. I mean, I’ve kind of mellowed a bit in the last few years, you know, everybody gets older!
If you go back when I opened the blog in 2014, it was like literally, … I mean, I was Daily Stormer tier, what I wrote. My blog articles. I was in the Daily Stormer dashboard just posting me articles there, and trying to get them headlined, and all of that.
But the road that led up to me being writing at the Daily Stormer, which I think is sort of like my peak hardcore days, that’s long one. And most of it’s actually not on the internet at all! It’s in the real world.
I am, like obviously, I’m from the northeast. And then I started to do things like with some friends, cousin, who passed away this week. Maybe we can get into that later. So I’ve been a bit quiet this week, because there’s a lot for the family to deal with.
But I travelled around backpacking and things like that. And once I left the northeast, I started to see, first the south. And then I did backpacking. I went into Europe and we spent months. We’d work like crappy agency jobs. And then we’d just head out, because it didn’t matter. You could just come back and get a different job.
So we all lived at home then. And then we would go off. It was like three of us. And then we’d save up money and go off backpacking and just traveling around like that.
The thing is, when you, especially like in the 90s, growing up in the 90s in the northeast, it was all just English people. So there was hardly anything else. So you kind of assumed that would just be the status quo. And you look back there now in these halcyon days.
But then when I started to move around a bit in Europe. And I started to see places like Paris. And that’s already like say in 1999. And then I actually worked in Holland for a long, long, time. Like 10 years I was over there living and working in Belgium, Holland, over the border.
And then you begin to see things that you’re not really kind of prepared for. And there was things that I was expected to believe which I just couldn’t. And then one of the things that occurred to me was that the kind of label of “racist” was just a weapon. And I didn’t know why that had happened. I wasn’t aware of how that had kind of found it’s way. But I found it to be obvious. Like I just found it nonsensical.
And I used to sit in a like a pub, a little tavern in Belgium. And they had a lot of Turks and things. And I remember I used to try and kind of get out of them of what it means to be Belgium then. Because what it seemed to me was that if somebody just gets a passport. And they were kind of thinking well some of them [word unclear], because it’s a divisive issue. But some people are saying:
“Well, that means they all the Dutch.”
Or that means wherever they’re from, they can come in from the anywhere really. A Turk then will be then a Belgian.
And my issue that I really had a problem with was that, … And I would switch it. I would switch the scenario to the Danes, because they didn’t really have an empire. Because when you bring in all of the history and the baggage that countries like Britain and France have got, and Holland to be honest, it kind of gets more complicated. Because it’s about how they dished out citizenship after the colonial era.
So what I did was, I would bring up Denmark, because I knew they didn’t have a history of colonialism. And I was like. Well, we know that the Danish are, you think of the Danes. They’re these tall kind of handsome, blonde, Scandinavians. So we know what they are. But the problem is if everybody becomes Danish when they get a passport, then that can go on, and on, and on, and the original population will disappear.
And this is way before, … At this point, I didn’t have the internet, or anything. I was just kind of wandering around in Europe noticing these things. And I didn’t know where to turn. I didn’t know what to get for information, or anything like that.
So it was kind of a strange thing, because you’re trying to piece all of this together without the internet, or without knowing which books to buy, or anything. These kinds of questions. It wasn’t that I was walking around as this “hater”. But I just felt like there was something wrong! In the case of France, because that was the first time, I was just horrified by the state of Paris.
And the funny thing is, I thought well they’ve made a mistake, and then somebody’s gonna step in, … It’s been like some political party must have came in and made a huge mistake. And then somebody else is going to come in and set this right.
But then you travel on the bus, the train, and you go to Belgium, and you’re seeing the same thing again! And then you go to Holland and you see the same thing again. And then I would go to London and I was seeing the same thing again! And I thought:
“Well, how can it be happening everywhere?”
And then also like all of these places were using the same kind of terminology to shut people down. And I thought:
“How could all of this be happening at the same time in all of these different countries? It doesn’t make any sense!”
I just started to feel as if there was something deeply, deeply wrong going on in Europe.
So that was what set me off.
Luke: You noticed that there was this kind of unanswerable question, this cognitive dissonance, that I’m being told to believe “A” but I’m seeing “B”, and then simultaneously there’s this rhetoric that you mention around calling people “racist”, that seems to be shutting down the question.
And I can’t help thinking lots of people must notice this on some level, but very few seem to push into it, and investigate, and go further. So was there just something inside you that couldn’t accept living with the dissonance? You’re on a mission.
Morgoth: Yeah, well there was two things. Let’s just say, because we’re on YouTube, let’s just say there was the nature of the diversity itself.
Morgoth: Which it wasn’t great. And then there was the sort of the second part, was the ideological part. Which I wouldn’t have even used that kind of language. But there was a kind of intellectual component which I couldn’t, … Like that was what I had a problem with, because it didn’t make sense.
I mean, an example would be where the place where I worked in Holland, I’d go in, and they’d be two black lads and they both had White Dutch girlfriends. And they were like sharing each other explicit photos on their phone. And I deliberately picked up they had some kind of connection with each other, that was closer than the bond either one of them had with the girlfriends.
And so I began to pick up on this in-group, out-group kind of thing. And the problem that I had was that like say my side of that equation, the White side, was not allowed to have an in-group bias.
In fact, that when you began to talk about that you ran straight into the problem of the intellectual component. So it’s like, then you’re saying:
“Well everybody else is tribal. And not just tribal. But they are viewing us with contempt!”
And then it’s like:
“Well okay, so we need it to be like that.”
And then it’s, we can’t. Because that’s taboo. And I thought:
“Oh, now this gets a bit dark.”
Because we’ve obviously got some serious problems here. We seem to be surrounded on all sides. And then when we try to kind of defend ourselves against it, and ring fence it, and form a cohesive block of our own, we’re not allowed to do that? So we just have to remain, like kind of victims? And it just kind of carried on like that.
I mean, in Holland, in the 2000s, you don’t hear too much about it these days. But there was some quite crazy things that went on. I mean, Pim Fortuyn, he wasn’t even far-Right. He was just a sort of classic liberal gay, who was the Mayor of Rotterdam, I think it was. And an antifa Dutch Lefty shot him dead in the street. I heard that at work when it happened. It was their equivalent of Radio One.
But he was addressing a lot of these issues. Specifically the issue of the Moroccans in Rotterdam, and how it was all one way. And that something needed to change. And here you are, he was shot dead.
And then you had Theo van Gogh, who got more, or less, beheaded on the streets of Amsterdam, because he was vocal. And it wasn’t that they were far-Right. It was that they were these more kind of old-fashioned European liberals. Where the problem they had with them, it wasn’t like “blood and soil”, all that kind of thing. But it was that they weren’t abiding by liberal rights. They saw it as, especially the Islamic kind of contingent of the multicultural society, was just openly flouting liberalism. And the liberal elites in Europe weren’t standing up against it.
So everybody had these speech codes. And all of this. And from their perspective, like it wasn’t like a blood and soil argument. It was an argument in favour of liberalism. And they weren’t getting anywhere. They were getting shut down.
They kind of drifted into the Counter Jihad nonsense, as well. And I got into that, as well for a while, because it was like they were the only people who I had access to. And, you know, read people like Mark Steyn, and this kind of thing.
Luke: Hmm. One of the, at least these days, one of the frequent defenses given to normies for this sort of unique treatment, whereby everyone can be a victim except the groups who clearly are the actual, the biggest victims, is this concept of “privilege”. There’s always a group who’s on top and everybody’s allowed to criticize that group. To the point where if they are widely accepted to be on top, it’s actually beyond the scope of conversation to discuss whether in fact, they are on top.
Were these dynamics all around in the early, like the 2000s? And did you pick up on that?
Morgoth: It was a bit later.
Morgoth: What happened was I ended up becoming friends with a Dutch lesbian. I mean, on a lighter note, like I’m a young young lad. And I just didn’t believe that she was actually a lesbian. I thought like she just she just needed the right encouragement, kind of thing. [Lamda laughs] And I just wouldn’t have it! And we got into this kind of routine, where I’d get drunk, and kind of try me luck. And then it was like I got slapped off all the time. And:
“I really am a lesbian! I’m not just making it up. You’re not gonna like lure me away!”
You know what I mean. But she was great! She actually she was okay, besides that. [chuckling]
But I did notice, because there was a like a gay came in and worked for a while. And he couldn’t do it, because it was heavy work. He was a laughing stock. But what he did straight away was go to the manager and say if anybody makes fun of him for being like a homo, then he wants their jobs. And we all got a kind of speaking to. Like you just don’t talk about it. And I remember talking to the lesbian one day. And I was saying:
“Look the problem is, if you add up, like you all in your own ways think you’re victims. But if you add it all up, if you add you up with the gays.”
I mean, the trans thing wasn’t an issue then. You didn’t hear of it then.:
“And then with all of the different like minority groups, if you add you all up together, that’s one hell of a coalition against what’s normal!”
And then the reply was like:
“Well, what’s normal?”
So either the reply was this kind of post modern mumbo jumbo. And so that was one of those times I thought:
“This is kind of weird. This is really worrying!”
Because, if you do add up all of these groups they’re not minority, they’re going to call the shots!
Luke: Hmm. The coalition of minorities ends up being a majority, together!
Luke: And the people who fall outside of every minority, are actually the minority, at that point. That that gets picked on by everybody else.
Morgoth: Yeah. And so you begin to think:
“Well, if this just goes on, and on, and on, like this is going to be the end of Europe!”
And again I thought, … Well, I just couldn’t understand why it was happening, and why it was happening everywhere at once.
And so eventually there was a lot of unpleasant things happening, like with kebab shops, and rumours, and things like that.
But then eventually I did get the internet. And I remember, … I was seeing a Belgian girl at the time, a Flemish girl. And I discovered a blogger, in the Counter Jihad scene, called Fjordman. It turns out he’s a bit dodgy. [chuckling] And he kind of retired after the Anders Brevik kind of thing. He was getting a little bit too close, … He was seen as being a kind of inspiration for him.
And like, I’ll put it this way. Like Fjordman, when it turned out he wasn’t really Norwegian, he was something else. And he was deeply entrenched in the Counter Jihad.
But leaving that aside, he had a blog where it was all about what was going on. He was from Sweden. He said he was Norwegian, but the point is that he was writing about Sweden. And this is like 2007, or something. And it had never occurred to me.
Like I remember sitting up and my girlfriend bought a laptop, because I didn’t even have a computer, or anything. And we sat up reading the Fjordman’s blog, like all night. And one of the articles what he wrote was called “What is the GDP worth of a gang rape?”, or something like that.
Now, at this point, it had never even occurred to me that Sweden would have mass immigration. Because the first thing is, it’s like this cold country up in the middle of nowhere. So I thought it would be strange that immigrants would even want to go to Sweden. [Luke chuckles] But then, not only were they going there, not only were they going there even more as a percentage than what they were going to other parts of Europe, but the politicians were more politically correct. Which by that time was a phrase I’d kind of picked up on. And I thought:
“My god! What the hell is going on?”
And it was always demographic breakdown. And for me it just seemed like this is the end of the world! This is the end of our world, which has taken place here! And I’ll be kind of get more, and more, …
Eventually then I actually went to Norway physically myself. And I could see like Norway wasn’t that bad. But I could tell, I could see it in Oslo. And then I was like:
“Yeah. I can imagine what Sweden is like.”
And I just thought it was just this kind of profound sense of:
“This is wrong! This is so wrong!”
If you have a look at, there’s like nine million Swedes in the world, out of like seven billion people! And they aren’t allowed their own place in the world? With all like the sort of distinctive Scandinavian blonde hair? Like why is that not being treasured, and protected, for what it is? And I just found the whole thing just repulsive!
Because then everywhere was just going to end up looking like Asia, or North Africa. And then these special ethnic groups are just going to disappear! And bit by bit you can see that I was just getting more, and more, kind of radicalized! But not by the internet, by what I was seeing with me real eyes.
Luke: Hmm. Did you perceive the drive to be kind of globalist in origin? That is everywhere becomes a homogenous mixture of all cultures, or did you perceive it as explicitly anti-Western? You know, an attempt to tear down, for example, Sweden in particular, or Holland?
Morgoth: I saw it that the traditional peoples of Europe were under attack! That it was genocidal in intent.
Luke: But it seemed like it was the politicians within the countries who were like driving it forward.
Morgoth: Yeah. So that a big problem that I had, and this gets you back to say the Counter Jihad. So obviously I had limited access to the internet. So one of the things that they were saying was that this was essentially a “bottom up revolution”. And that the radical Marxists in Sweden had, … And they would go on like the Gramscian thing, long march through the institutions. And that basically cultural Marxists in Sweden had wriggled their way in the positions of power, and it had gone all the way up. And now the problem that I had with that, like I thought:
“Okay I can kind of get that. But then the problem is like, why did the people up on the top will allow that to happen?”
Like presumably you’re gonna have an elite class in your government. And that they are gonna notice what’s going on. And they’re just gonna shut it down! And that obviously hadn’t happened.
So I didn’t understand it for a long time. It just didn’t make sense. Because I was being told that this was a bottom-up revolution.
Another problem that I had, a big problem that I had, was let’s just take that narrative for what it is. But the problem is like the Marxists were themselves White. So why would they do this to their own country? And I began to get the impression that there was something else. [chuckling] There was another element at play. And whatever it was it despised the sort of the Nordic phenotype. The northern European type.
That there was some other force out there which wanted them binned! Wanted them gone! But I didn’t know who, or what that was at that time, of course. [chuckling].
But one of the things with that, it seemed me as well, like if you wanted to kind of decapitate the northern European aesthetically, and ethnically, you would do that to somewhere like Sweden.
And at the same time I’ve been all the way around Spain. So I’m not talking about the internet message boards. I was actually in these places. And one of the things I noticed about Spain was that it was actually relatively untouched. Now in all fairness, it’s kind of hard to tell a difference [chuckling] in a lot of the cases. But Spain just still seemed very Spanish. And it was in the north that seemed to be getting Muhammaded. And I thought:
“Yeah there’s something not right here. Something that I don’t like.”
So I was just constantly like, … And I looked in the early days of YouTube, I was finding videos, especially in America, that’d be blacks gloating about it! About our shrinking percentage in the world.
Luke: That’s one of the curious things that the people, … So even today I’d say this is the case. There’s a lot of sort of intellectualizing, high-minded language. But, there’s clearly also straight-up malicious groups. So that you’ve kind of got both forces in co-operation in some ways, right?
You’ve got the almost the naive liberal perspective. I don’t know if it’s genuine naivety? One way, or another it seems to be a genuine attempt to be above issues of culture and race. And then you have these groups which seem to be allowed to exist, supporting their own interests in a fairly straightforward way. But, because they are perceived as victim classes, therefore it’s kind of palatable and acceptable to the wider society that they’re looking after their own interests.
Yeah, but like I kind of just didn’t want them there in the first place. I didn’t really want to hear any sob stories, or thought structural kind of issues. I didn’t care! I just didn’t think they should be in Europe, because it’s not their place. So all of this kind of stuff about “privilege”, and all of this kind of Lefty structural language I just brushed it aside. I don’t care like!
And to be honest I still feel the same way today. Because I’ve been sidetracked this week I was planning to do, I’m still am, a Morgcast with Daughter of Albion on Jane Austen. Jane Austen’s being cancelled in university, because they’re “decolonizing” the curriculum.
So people tend to get drawn into these kind of arguments about well, Jane Austen is part of the British identity, which is like part of the Empire. And we need to kind of deconstruct all of that. So you get more diverse voices heard. And I just think, I don’t give a shit! I don’t care if you don’t like it! I don’t want you here in the first place!
So I was opposed to the initial kind of immigration. And then, after the fact, I’m also supposed to then engage in this kind of Lefty dialectic about “oppression”, and who fits in, and who has their voice? I don’t care about that, because I was opposed to the first one! I’m not going to be opposed to the second one! Well oh, you know what I mean, I’m not going to get drawn into that’s kind of rubbish in the second act! [Luke chuckles] Now that we’re here, we’ve got all these problems! Well I don’t care! I don’t want them here anyway!
Luke: Yeah. But I was sort of commenting on that this is the only part of the dialogue that’s allowable on mainstream platforms. You’re talking about a feeling that I think, so you had, and was probably shared by an enormous number of people. I mean, you know, who can really tell how many people have what opinions, because there’s always an attempt to sugarcoat it with the Leftist language.
And so whenever it’s talked about in sort of respectable society, the conversation is always in terms of sort of high-minded idealists versus the racists, and sexists, and transphobes, and whatever. But then you kind of see the mask slip from time to time with gloating about.”
Oh! Get excited, because America is going to be minority White by X date!”
Or whatever it is. These kind of news stories pop up from time to time. And you think is that, … That’s an unusual amount of glee from somebody who was supposedly a high-minded idealist, right?
Morgoth: Yeah. I mean, just kind of following the story on. I’m going to skip over some of it, because it’s pretty gruesome. But eventually I had a Facebook account, like a normie Facebook account. And this was around about the time that the BNP was like surging. And I checked out the BNP. They had like a big Facebook page. This is before censorship was a thing on Facebook. So imagine the BNP had like two million followers on Facebook, or whatever it was on there, …
Luke: You can’t imagine it now, can you?
Morgoth: It’s insane really! The stuff that you could get away with, it was like a wild west.
Luke: But do you think pre — 2016 there was a genuine sort of, … I think in Silicon Valley there was an actual belief in this like:
“Sunlight is the best disinfectant! We’re going to let people have their ideas, hash it out in public.”
And they really thought two terms of Obama, all of the signs were kind of saying:
“Yes, actually through freedom of speech we’re heading in a direction that fitted with the Silicon Valley culture.”
And so I think there was a real difference pre — 2016 in the way that a lot of this existed online.
Morgoth: Yeah. I think a lot of those big tech CEOs, they were happy with free speech, because they thought they had the best ideas. They thought they had the best moral arguments. So it was like:
“We can give nationalists a voice, because we know we’ll beat them, because we know that we have better arguments than they do.”
And, of course, this proved out to be wrong. This proved out to be like very wrong! And they ended up having to just resort to outright power. Well, it was like:
“Well, we can’t beat them, because you end up with Brexit! You end up with Trump! You end up with these mass populist movements!”
So he has just come up with that book today which kind of proves a point, where eventually it will just come down to loss of power. And they’re not just going to sit back and lose power, they’ll shut you down instead! So that’s the end of your kind of bottom-up rebellion! You can’t go anywhere.
But I mean one of the things that I did see back, kind of reminiscent on the BNP page, which was another wake-up call, was though it was just absolutely swarming with UAF trolls!
So the kind of people who are on the BNP, they’d be like working class. I always mentioned one. It was like a working-class girl from Carlisle called Becky. Who I got a little bit friendly with. And you could see they weren’t well read. They were typing in text speak in the messages.
And then you had all of these lefties, who’d obviously been like to university. And they had all of these narratives. They basically were these working-class White people on the BNP page. A lot of them were women as well. And they were just being absolutely torn apart by the Lefty trolls as they called them! Like just humiliated! And insulted! Viciously, viciously insulted for being stupid, racist, scum! And all of the kind of White guilt stuff. And they had all of the arguments ready to roll.
And I remember thinking that it was clearly coordinated. And I was thinking:
“Who does that?”
The first thing is, it sounds so naive now. But I was thinking:
“But you are us. Like you are English as well, you are British! Why are you taking the side of the ‘other’, against your own people?”
And I know it sounds naive. But I was absolutely disgusted by it!
And as well as all of the kind of intellectual kind of stuff they were coming out with. And I thought:
“Where’s this coming from? How do they know this?”
Because it’s as if they’ve been like mentally and intellectually tooled up to shut these people down! To have all of the Right talking points, and everything.
And that was a thing where I wanted to know. I want to know where that came from! I wanted to know who was responsible!
One thing that I used to like read Mark Steyn’s blog, every Saturday. And he was like a neocon. He’s actually on GB News now. He’s coming out with some quite based stuff. But he wrote a book called “America Alone”. But the downside of it is he was very much a neocon.
But nevertheless, he gave me, … Like he used to point out how absurd it was that you would have Leftists who tended to be like feminists. And they would come out in support of the burka, or they were coming out in support of like radical Islam, and all this. And for me I thought this is great! Because it was like a little tool that I had! It was a little kind of way, you know, I’d got my first like little weapon to fight back [chuckling] in the war of words, which I was getting more, and more, drawn into on the internet.
And bit by bit I began to build up the armoury and find out where they were coming from. And all of that kind of thing.
Morgoth: And it went on, and on, from there.
Luke: It’s good to dig into that. And I know it’s a well trod idea, at this point. But you have the high-minded publicly put forward ideal of:
“We want to treat everybody equally, and protect everybody. And particular focus on protecting women, and defeating misogyny!”
That’s the kind of self-described, the way that they would talk about themselves. But then, if you look at their actual actions, then they would be extremely, … They’d sort of run rearguard action to defend Islamic culture. Which was unashamedly sort of backwards in their terms.
They would say, surely an honest analysis if they really cared about women’s rights, they would be stridently against lots of the things that the true believer Muslims, the exact sort who would wear the hijabs, and so on, would be saying.
And yet they those people were sort of also held up as sort of unassailable, ever victimized, morally perfect, groups. It’s like the behaviour and the claimed beliefs don’t match. So it’s a little chink in the armour where you can get people to start to think a bit more, right?
Morgoth: Yeah. I mean, the original title that I saw proposed was “Why I Hate”. Now that actually sounds a bit much, but it gets back to some early blogs that I did when I got into what we’re talking about now.
And one of them which kind of just turned me into an outright White nationalist, was – even though like I still didn’t have the materials and all this. But in those days I worked and I was out and about in Europe all the time. And then I was on Facebook on the BNP group. And this was Morgoth germinating.
And one of the things that happened was that I got sent really gruesome pornographic videos off, let’s say Asian males from the Yorkshire area, where they were, … Well, I don’t think I have to go into details. But it was videos of grooming, to be honest. And it was one of the worst things I’ve ever seen in my life.
Morgoth: And by that time I’d kind of got a love-hate relationship with one of the Leftists. And I showed her the video, which was unbelievably grotesque! But it was an out-group being triumphalist over English girls in Yorkshire! Like explicitly triumphalist and demeaning them in the worst possible ways!
So I send this video to the Lefty. And I say:
“This is what you’re doing!”
And it was just brushed away as:
“Well, you know, girls are just like that these days.”
And I was like:
“What the hell! Like, look at it!”
And so then it became where these, for whatever reason they are, these people are just utterly sick! Utterly sick!
Luke: And this is what we in retrospect can now, … Well you saw it perhaps at the time, but certainly it’s increasingly coming to light that these supposedly high minded moral crusaders on the Left were actually, in fact, covering for some of the most reprehensible and hateful behaviour that you could ever hear of! Some of the most evil people perpetuating some of the worst atrocities in your own country.
And yet the people who are aware of it, for reasons of political correctness, are not able to, are actually allowing it to continue, and protecting the perpetrators.
And anybody who hears about this and doesn’t have an immediate moral repulsion towards those groups, I think is in some ways they have to be considered to be also stained by, … These crimes are so horrible that to be in any way not criticizing, not standing up for the true victims in all this, right, the people who were being groomed and trafficked, and so on, … Like it’s not enough to simply see it happening and do nothing. You have to take a stand, regardless of the optics. Sorry, that’s just a, …
Morgoth: Yeah. Because okay, I didn’t expect them. So I gave the Unite Against Fascism that video, that footage. I didn’t expect them to be like me. I didn’t expect them to, by that time, have the views that I’d developed. But I at least expected them to be in a liberal kind of:
“Well, we don’t want anybody being racist. But this is also disgusting. And we are against that, as well.”
And the impression that I got was that these White people just hate White people! And so be it!
And I also realized that I despise them more than the actual perpetrators, because I understand how men think. I understand how men operate. I understand that they will be triumphalist over an out-group if they have the chance. I’ve been around, I’ve seen it! So that side of it wasn’t complicated.
The problem was the Lefties themselves. I just found them absolutely grotesque! Like spiritually rotten! That to me was the real problem. I could understand men, tribes of men, dominating the weaker parts of another group. That’s basic old stuff! But then how the hell do you explain when you’ve got like middle-class British people having such hatred and contempt for their own kind!
Luke: So let’s talk now about what happened in your mind between, so let’s say the last four years, of approaching and coming into “Coofland”.
Morgoth: Well I think, because I was kind of heavily in with the Alt-Right, I suppose. But I’m not an American. So I always had a bit of a distance. And then when that all kind of blew up, you notice how this slips more, and more, under like an online thing [chuckling]. In a way it’s like steadily replacing, …
Me story begins with me wandering Europe with a rucksack. And then, by the time you get into the later stages, it’s like this purely online, changing your opinions and consuming content. Which is what it is.
But basically when the Alt-Right thing blew up I’ve gradually become more, and more, disillusioned with populism. I still held all the same opinions. But it seemed to me that they would just shoot you down! The elites just wouldn’t allow you to have power.
I did an article back in, I think it was like 2016. And it was called something about “The Great Shutdown”. I can’t remember the exact title. It was a blog post that I did at the original Morgoth’s Review blog. I called it “The Meta-politics of the Great Shutdown”. So this is like 2016-2017. And I predicted all of the censorship that was coming in.
And I predicted it, because the point that I made was that if we are right about our analysis of the what the elites are doing, and the power structure, if we are correct, and our tactic is to use the internet to form a kind of mass consciousness which would kind of break the system down and it wouldn’t be able to function, and that we’d have to have some kind of change, … Like if our analysis is correct, they’re going to have to censor us [chuckling]! Because they can’t just sit back and allow us to do it! And then, like quickly, not long after that, all the censorship came in.
And then I realized:
“Yeah. Well, that’s just the way it is.”
And I remember coming across people like Distributist. And I really liked that more, … It was as if I’d gone through a stage of like rage, and just absolutely seething about things. And I like that more nuanced, more thoughtful, … And I was always into reading a lot. And so I began to draw on that more, and more. That’s right now. Like I’ll do movie reviews. But when you go into the back catalog, you’ll see some really spicy stuff.
Luke: [chuckling] What was it then that was appealing, … You were having this kind of rageful experience and you come across Distributist’s channel. What were the new ideas, or the new perspectives, do you think? And how did that sit with you at that time?
Morgoth: Well, I’ll explain. There’s a few videos of his that I came across which were more, it’s more about looking at Western civilization as a whole. And the kind of moral path. The one about Moldbug surprisingly enough, about Cthulhu always swims Left.
Morgoth: So then I was able to get into something else which had always been on my mind and connect it up, which was the technology. And that the technology is affecting us as well. So I began to broaden things out.
And then, in about 2018, I began watching John David Ebert’s like old, really badly recorded, series on Oswald Spengler. And then it was just like that for me was the shit! And it was like all of the questions that I had, it all just kind of like:
“Yeah. This is it! This is what I felt all my life!”
And so I just binged watched the series that he’d done over, and over, again. And then I ordered the books. So then you have a huge framework. And you can put in where you are and like what’s going on in the West, and this kind of thing.
So the old days, when all I had was like Mark Steyn, it was like long gone. You’ve got a much bigger kind of canvas. And you can see where you are on it.
Luke: Yeah. So let’s talk about then, … I feel like one of your takes very early on in the “Coof”, I think you were one of the first people to put forwards this perspective is the idea that there was going to be a drive towards some sort of digital passport, something like that. How did you come to see the world in a way that makes that angle seem like the play? How does that fit in to your understanding of the world?
Morgoth: So that’s a big question! But you can come at it from various different angles. But it was mainly because I’ve been focusing on technology for a while and how intrusive it was coming.
And like just to skip back out into the real world, the job where I was working at the time, driving a forklift in a warehouse, I saw everything being these kind of switch passes. And I saw people having like smart watches which tracked them when they went jogging. Or like people playing with things on their phones. So I saw all of that coming in anyway.
But it was mainly the idea that we could be tracked. I’ve always hated the idea of being tracked. And then it was just a short skip and leap where if all of this starts to be connected up, like that’s not a great thing! Because I was already aware of how toxic all of the big tech companies were.
And you can kind of come in at it with the Spengler angle as well, where this Faustian drive, to never to stop, to always push on further, and further. This obsession with inventing things without really thinking about it.
I watched the video yesterday. I’ve got a YouTube video coming up about Elon Musk. And about why he’s never going to get the Mars. And I’m going to kind of dig into this kind of stuff a bit.
But I saw a painting by William Blake, on a documentary about William Blake, yesterday. And it was his painting of Isaac Newton. I don’t know if you’ve ever seen it?
Luke: Do you want me to bring it up?
Morgoth: Yeah. I should have put it in the chat. I could put it in the chat on Telegram.
Morgoth: So what you’ll find is that, … So William Blake was very much against the Enlightenment. He loved the imagination, he loved God, he was a very spiritual and religious person. And, of course, Isaac Newton is the complete opposite of that.
So Isaac Newton, of course, is like the quintessential British empiricist. And in the painting that he had, you’ve got Isaac Newton. [image is shown] So yeah, that’s great.
So in this image here and I should have saved this for me video. I’m spoiling my thing here. [chuckling] So you’ve got William Blake this very, very religious, very spiritual orientated person, who sees things in terms of metaphysics and a connection to God. And this is his depiction of Isaac Newton, the quintessential British empiricist.
Now, what do we see? Well, what we see is Newton and that he’s actually he’s got his face buried in his calculator.
Luke: He’s looking down.
Morgoth: He’s looking down and his face is buried with his compass, and he’s obsessing over his calculations. But when you look at the rest of the painting, where is he? Well, he’s actually at the bottom of the ocean. And he’s sitting on quite a pretty kind of coral reef, or something, there.
Now this is very clever and deep I think from William Blake. Because in today’s world Isaac Newton and his approach to the world of rationalism and quantifying everything, it’s a technocratic world view. And William Blake is saying here, he’s so buried in his numbers, and then his number crunching, and his data, that he doesn’t actually realize that he’s at the bottom of an ocean. In other words, he doesn’t realize the world that he’s actually in. He doesn’t understand reality!
And today of course, when you look at the various technocrats that you, what’s it called? Yuram Harari, or whatever. And they’re talking about hacking humans. And they’re talking about chips, and the whole drive towards transhumanism.
Well, that comes out of, that is in a way what Isaac Newton’s legacy is, and people like him. And what’s being taken from the world, it’s as if like Isaac Newton, they don’t really understand the world that they’re in, in a kind of deep spiritual sense. They don’t even know where they are. All they understand is these calculations and these numbers. And William Blake, of course, is pointing this out here. Because William Blake is saying:
“Well, I do see this. I see the beauty and the magic of the world, and Newton doesn’t! Newton just sees his dry calculations.”
And the sad thing is that it’s the Newtons who’ve won out. It’s the Newtons who are behind the digital IDs, and the Coof rule outs, and who are all these NGOs.
I mean, to the point where you just can’t make an argument based on the ideals of William Blake at all! But the problem is in the Newtonian frame, that’s probably wrong, but, you know what I mean.
Morgoth: There’s no poetry to it. There’s no beauty to it. And the problem with that, is that it’s completely lacking in spirit!
And so this is a little teaser for me Elon Musk video that I think I’m gonna do. About whether, or not, he can get himself to Mars? I don’t doubt for a second he can get the resources and the technology. But can’t he get the will to do it?
Because you come back to the basic question of, why go to Mars in the first place? Why would anybody sit for eight years on a spaceship, you know however long it would take, for no reason? Like is it for a financial incentive? Well, in the end there’s not really that great of an incentive for some guy to go to Mars, with all of the danger. Something breaks down you’re dead! And it could be a long and painful death.
But the thing is it’s like Elon Musk, all he has to work with is the tools of the compass and the data. But what he’s trying to do relies on a higher reality, a higher drive to have in the world. And he is also at the same time destroying that still further, along with the rest of the technocrats.
Morgoth: So it’s as if they’re going to have to choose. And they can’t have it both ways. They can’t reduce everybody to these widgets, where we’re sitting in our pods eating synthetic meat. And then at the same time expect to have these grandiose kind of ambitious plans to conquer Mars, or whatever.
Luke: It feels like we’ve been put in a position where we’ve been forced into this posture, and told to be Isaac Newton here. Like a net’s been put over us. And you’re not allowed to experience the beauty of the natural world. You must marvel only at man-made creations inside this little sphere within your grasp.
Morgoth: Yeah. Look how small it is that he’s looking at. Now, of course, there’s a kind of hubris to it, where they are thinking:
“Well the human brain, we’ve catalogued all of the molecules. And all of your DNA. All of the your blood cells. We’ve got all of this kind of down. And you with your old superstitious ideas of beauty, this is all mumbo jumbo!”
And yet you can see in William Blake’s kind of vision here, he views them as being the ones who can’t see, or at least they can only see a very small fraction.
Luke: This is the part that’s illuminated the work he’s looking on. Because he’s not bothered to go and explore and illuminate. It’s just a big mystery, the kind of darkness. Like:
“What’s that outside of the human brain? Well, who cares, because you can live in a box and talk to one another on computers!”
And yeah, I feel like the Muskian vision, the kind of heroism of:
“Let’s go to Mars!”
Is admirable, right? The let’s do something not just because it’s, … I mean, sitting in a rocket and putting up with the difficult conditions to get there. It’s like an adventure, a challenging physical thing that’s difficult, but you achieve greatness by confronting those difficulties!
Morgoth: But the problem is the materialist kind of view of man is one where you end up just as being in the pod, with enough to eat, your UBI [Universsal Basic Income], your digital currency, your sustainable fake meat. And all of this kind of thing. Because you don’t need anything more than that. If you’re bored, we’ll hook you up to the Metaverse.
Morgoth: And you can watch porn. And all of this. But this, of course, is to say that there’s no such thing as a human spirit of any kind. You’re just an animal to be fed like a cooped up battery hen. And you can’t then turn around and say:
“Now we need a heart!”
In the old days it would be conquering the northwest passage, or trekking across the mountains. It’s like the thing about, we used to say, because it’s only really Europeans who had a thing about mountain climbing. And they would say like:
“Well, why bother to climb the mountain?”
And then there’s that famous thing.:
“Well, it’s because it’s there! Because it has to be done!”
And implicit in that you’ve got this drive and this spirit to do it. But the technology that people like Elon Musk are developing, the Neural Links, it simultaneously crushes that drive and that spirit.
So they can’t have it both ways. And they’re going to have to decide. They’re going to have to spend their resources on giving us healthy societies back, which can actually achieve wonders again.
But as it stands now they are more interested in, yeah, just enslaving us and having us on a Social Credit grid, like chickens in a battery.
Luke: There’s one last topic I’d like to talk with you about briefly. You mentioned at the beginning of the stream the passing of your, well I don’t know if you’ve wanted to talk about who it was. But you had a recent bereavement and wrote very touchingly on your Substack about the subject of mortality, loss of friends, this kind of thing. Would you like to say a word, or two, about that? And what your thoughts are in that realm?
Morgoth: Well, I thought it was, … I mean, if you sign up to my Substack, it’s just five dollars a month. And that’s my hub. So everything that I do goes on there. If you like what I do.
In the online Right there’s plenty politics, there’s plenty political theory, and philosophising, kind of like what we were just doing there. [chuckling] But there’s this kind of reluctance, I think, to death. And when you get a little bit older, like I am, the amount of people that you’ve known in your life who like die, that increases quite a lot! And I wanted to do that article as if to tell people what they can expect beyond just platitudes.
Because the point that I explored was that when you grew up with your peers you kind of expect that all people will die. But then you among your friends, in my case it was a cousin, and a friend. And he’d been very ill for a long time after a motorbike crash. And he passed away in his sleep this week. And now the thing is at the beginning of the stream I was talking about all of the backpacking and the traveling that I did. That was all with him! And somebody else.
And so what’s weird is that when you begin to look back on your life, kind of reminiscing and memories, that gets to a point when like you’re the only person left alive, who’s actually experienced that. And you’re looking back. And I don’t want to be too kind of maudlin about it. But your history becomes full of ghosts in a way. Or it becomes where, because there’s nobody left to talk to about all the great times that you’ve had, your life experiences get kind of kicked into this abstract face space, which only now exists in your head.
And it’s been a shock to me, because I’m not that old! But the amount of suicides, and premature deaths. And I didn’t expect this many people who I grew up with to die so early.
Luke: Yes. So it’s a tough topic, but one that, I think, it’s a mistake that our culture doesn’t, it just refuses to touch. It’s like it’s not preparing us any better for facing the inevitable challenge of facing mortality by just simply pretending that it doesn’t exist.
Maybe that’s the theme for the whole stream, is the inability that we have in our culture to have difficult conversations, is childish. But it has real consequences where we don’t think things through. And then we’re suddenly slammed in the face by what the world actually consists of.
Morgoth: Yeah. It’s like a hard stop! The people that you talked, because now it’s kind of worse. Because people who are in their early 20s, or whatever. And like what do they call it? Like “permanently online”, or some phrase, the “extremely online”, or something. From what I can gather they live through the iPhone. They live in cyber space. And they are like a disembodied consciousness rubbing up against other disembodied consciousness within the internet.
Now, you know, Elon Musk and the boys have done a great deal with their technology and all this. But at least for the time being that’s still attached to a physical person in the real world. And that person will die one day! Some of them are going to die prematurely.
I mean, I’ve read that Facebook has like 17 million accounts on its site. A huge, huge, millions, and tens of millions of Facebook profiles. And the people have died! There’s like nothing behind it anymore. So they just kind of exist. I’ve got friends, nobody knows what the passwords are, so you still get a notification when it’s their birthday and all this kind of thing. It’s kind of warped! Because it’s not natural.
People in the past they didn’t have to deal with that. This would be completely alien to somebody in the 1990s, or the 1980s. But you just kind of get used to it. But the hard stop is that in meat space it will happen. And it’s important to carry on that it’s important to live in the real world.
Luke: Hmmm. Well, I’m sadly, because of the number of streams I’m doing I’m limited to an hour for each guest. Was there any last thoughts you had that you wanted to share, or things you want to point people to, just as we finish?
Morgoth: Not really. I mean, I just keep showing me Substack. Because if I disappear off YouTube. Like Substack works. When I do something and I post it, you get an email. And so I’ve come back to writing. I like doing that. And there’s tons of stuff up there already about different things that you’ll not find anywhere else. And that’s about it. Really, I’m a fairly simple fella.
Luke: Thank you so much for joining me Morgoth. And I’m finishing each stream in Lambster by reading a few verses from one of the Gospels. And we’re tracing through the Passion narrative, the story of Easter. So I’m going to finish the stream with a few verses.
Morgoth: Thank you very much for having me on.
Luke: And when they had sung a hymn, they went out onto the Mount of Olives. Then saith Jesus unto them:
“All ye shall be offended in me this night. For it is written I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad. But after I am raised up, I will go before you into Galilee.”
But Peter answered and said unto him:
“If all shall be offended in thee, I will never be offended!”
Jesus said unto him:
“Verily, I say unto thee that this night, before the cock crows, thousand shalt deny me thrice.”
Peter saith unto him:
“Even if I must die with thee, yet I will not deny thee.”
[Audio cut out here]
[Readers: If you see any errors (however minor), or ways to improve things, in the transcript, please let me know in the Comment section. Also please share the link to this transcript, so others can benefit. Thanks.]
17 hours ago
Yet to hear a Morgoth interview that isn’t riveting. Kudos to both here 👌🏻
1 day ago (edited)
Just listening back as you finished up. Morgoth lore is very welcome.
22:50 reminds me of Morgoth’s «Hammad» story from years ago.
1 day ago
Morgoth is one of the best in the business.
16 hours ago
One of? Can’t think of any better!
1 day ago
Very high quality interviews here lately. You’ve got yourself a new subscriber.
12 hours ago
Excellent! Especially love the talk about William Blake towards the end. One of my favorite artists. 🙌🏻
United States of Post America
10 hours ago
Interesting he says it was not the Internet but real life that brought him to his current position.
Same as my experience the Internet just explained things I was already witnessing and thinking about.
5 hours ago
Morgoth is the epitome of honesty.
15 hours ago
Great interview Lambda, you’re doing great work mate.
11 hours ago
Newton was a mystic, an alchemist, and a devout Christian. Your description of him doesn’t do him justice.
9 hours ago
This is good. Exactly what I want to here thank you gentlemen
16 hours ago
Hope morgoth doesnt end up doxing himself with these lore reveals, as interesting as they are….
1 day ago
Thank you gents!
That was the perfect accompanist to appreciate while butchering some rabbits. 🍻
7 hours ago
I think we’re all travelling down that same road as Morgoth and ending up in the same place. I’m going to call it Morgoth Square; where all roads meet.
3 hours ago
Thank you, loving the channel, came here for the Morgoth, stayed for both.
My mind’s been full of Peter lately. This is probably a trite observation and risks just being superstitious ‘numerology’, but my gut says no………… it’s this:
Christ fell thrice with His burden. Peter felt it.
It’s no mistake that it’s Peter who welcomes the faithful to paradise: if anyone can empathise with the shock and shame of being saved, it’s him. I imagine him saying “don’t cry, look: if I’m here…………”
It’s a deep part of the mystery of this time of year but part of our submission to God is our spiritual failure itself.
The Cutest Club!
9 hours ago
The part about the grooming gang made me break a knuckle.
10 hours ago
Can confirm that Erbert’s series has exceptionally bad boomer audio—i’m still going to watch it.
1 hour ago
Morgoth is a rare case of someone who takes things seriously, in a world of jokes and irony it is a breath of fresh air to listen to someone who could of stepped out of a time portal from an era when men were men.
Good Lookin’ Out Homie
18 hours ago
Doing the Lord’s work (so to speak) Lambda. Woes must be getting a little nervous 😉
1 day ago
Very good, high quality stuff.
1 day ago
When Europe returns to being dark, starving and freezing after Putin turns off the energy we will see how much fun the immigrants are having.
Hide 2 replies
4 hours ago
Wouldn’t that be a silver lining! One can hope they all pick up and leave. Keep moving.
17 hours ago
Great chat gents keep up the good work .
13 hours ago (edited)
Newton spent more time trying to contact angels than doing science as we would recognise it now. But I suppose magic is the materialist’s spirituality in some ways.
11 hours ago (edited)
… no poetry to it – Morgoth. Poetic spirit hardly exist in America today.
46 minutes ago
Appreciated the Morgoth genesis story!
18 hours ago
why-aye-man!! Love Morgoth’s accent
50 minutes ago
Lucifer, the lightbringer. He can’t help but bring light to himself. His darkness of vision illuminates him, to the initiated.
1 day ago
Patricius vun Kempen
16 hours ago
I refuse to belief that Newton was this jacked
7 hours ago
Make the most of this channel before it gets removed
14 hours ago
Morgoth’s lore is much appreciated but his boneheaded racism really isn’t
Hide 8 replies
14 hours ago
Let us know exactly where in the video he is exhibiting ‘boneheaded racism’…
10 hours ago (edited)
@An Fómhar “l don’t like them here, l don’t want them here”, anything that isn’t white he, seemingly, hates. It’s kind of obscene really
10 hours ago
I didn’t know Lambda’s channel had been hijacked by the hard right
10 hours ago
@Dissident Nomad What’s wrong with wanting a home for your people?
7 hours ago
@Adeimantus Absolutely nothing Adeimantus l just don’t think people should go round using broad brushstrokes and lumping everyone into the same group simply because we aren’t white even though l, for example, share Morgoth’s and presumably your disgust at grooming gangs and even demographic replacement. There is much more nuance to this than a lot of people appreciate l find.
5 hours ago
When mass immigration has ended in Europe we will have the luxury of toleration and benevolence.
Until then xenophobia is simply self preservation for European peoples.
Do you want Europe to survive?
Then support Europe for the Europeans.
1 day ago
16 hours ago
17 hours ago
woah- that cut off abruptly.
11 hours ago
Yes, Lambda is a preacher, not a web site editor 😉
J R Hartley
6 hours ago
Becky from Carlisle and her Brexit brood 😎
Patricius vun Kempen
17 hours ago
Danemark, i think actualy has had some colonys even in the carabean, also norway was under danish domination, and island i think
Hide 2 replies
15 hours ago
Yes, they did have some tiny colonies. This is being used against Norwegians as well, because we were in a «union» (and of course much of the fleet was Norwegian) despite the fact that we were in fact under Danish rule, known as «the 400-year night».
11 hours ago
American Virgin Islands were Danish.
1 day ago
Are you listening Jordan Peterson?
17 hours ago
He’s too busy making his bed.
Morgoths Dutch Lesbian Friend
15 hours ago
16 hours ago
this guy stutters and stumbles too much. very hard to listen to
Hide 4 replies
13 hours ago
You referring to Lambda or Morgoth? Not quite sure where you’re getting this from..
Both are a lot more articulate and confident in their speaking than the average person.
12 hours ago
@An Fómhar lambda
11 hours ago
@festus bojangles He was having a little trouble starting today, i do agree.
10 hours ago (edited)
@festus bojangles perhaps here and there he takes some time to get to the point but remember he doesn’t know exactly where the conversation will go and so has to adapt and readjust on the fly, that’s not easy, most of us would struggle to do it fluently. In the circumstances I think Lambda does a very good job here.
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Version 2: Apr 18, 2022 — Transcript now completed. Added image (Blake’s Newton painting).
Version 1: Apr 17, 2022 — Published post. 36/68 mins of transcript completed.